I think all this parsing of Obama's speech should tell us something.

[LoZoccolo]

I think it should tell us that we're never going to be able to keep up with the creative abilities of some people to cast themselves as victims who are owed something, so maybe we should direct our efforts toward other people.

[LoZoccolo]

1. This thread has at this point 6 recommendations. n/t

[RandomThoughts]

2. Victims is a tough word.

however many are victimized by many free will choices, some their own, some other peoples.


The problem is when people think anyone in a bad spot is where they are suppose to be, by that logic, anything you can get away with, becomes the way things are suppose to be. If you chose to, (or did by lack of free will, as some believe), to do anything, no matter if better or worse, then by that doctrine it would be ok. If a person believes everyone is where they are suppose to be. Some actually think the fact that they are able to steal, means they are suppose to. It is a doctrine to justify any action by using some doctrine of the spiritual as a defense. By that doctrine you have to defend any successful person no matter how bad, and that creates a messed up world.

People that believe that lose the ability to feel or have empathy, the main purpose of that doctrine.

It is a license to do what ever you can get away with, and promotes law of the jungle and anarchy.

[NanceGreggs]

3. Nor can we keep up with ...

... those who work overtime to find a word, a phrase, a moment of body language that can be twisted into something negative - or a "sign" that he doesn't really mean what appears to be positive news.

The Pretzel Brigade - "Twisting Logic on a Daily Basis - and Proud to be Doing So!"

[LoZoccolo]

6. I think it might be viewed as an easy way to get things out of the administration.

And it might have been effective here and there before the same people started overplaying their hand. I think it's why people get so defensive about criticism of the "netroots", because it threatens to defang this strategy and force people to start actually participating in democracy again.

Seriously folks, you can't get a whole lot for nothing, and you can only follow through on your ultimatum once. Find out the other ways that it's done.

[mzmolly]

4. Rec # 6

again. :hi:

[LoZoccolo]

7. Once I had a secret plan to find out if there was a botnet army of unrecommenders.

Then I realized it wouldn't work so well. But I'm still thinking!

[mzmolly]

8. Well you're up to nine

now, so the rec army is leading. ;)

[janx]

5. It should tell us something else, too:

The media--especially internet media-- will do much to create sensation, and for people who don't have the skills to evaluate sources this is particularly damaging. They believe it because they read it. They believe it because it fits into their current assessment of any situation.

I say especially internet media because as the old saying goes, on the internet, nobody knows you're a dog. Anyone can post blogs and gain links, etc. Many times, there is no vetting, no peer review, no payments and so no editors.

Those people who cast themselves as victims believe that they are victims, because they believe what they read. They also believe what they hear on radio and television without questioning where the material is coming from and why.

I blame them much less than I blame the media charlatans who take advantage of them.

[MadHound]

9. Is this another one of your "serious" posts, or is this one of your comedic interludes?

:shrug:

[LoZoccolo]

10. This is "a very special LoZo". n/t

[MadHound]

12. I'm sure,

I've always figured you for "very special".

[LoZoccolo]

14. That's very liberal of you, trying to insult someone by implying that they are

mentally challenged. Did you get offended to Rahm Emanuel when he said "fucking retarded"?

[MadHound]

15. Wow, is that where your mind goes with that phrase?

Your Freudian slip is showing there.

For your edification, there are a number of other connotations of that phrase, some of which denote your societal status, the type of personality you are (as in a diva-ish sense). Perhaps it has to do with the regional culture you're from:shrug:

But no, my reference for "very special" was not implying anything about the developmentally disabled.

There's lots about Rahm that offends me quite frankly.

"If you have to explain the joke. . ."

[USArmyParatrooper]

11. +1 , though I respectfully have a slightly different approach

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules_detailed.html

Democratic Candidates and the Democratic Party

Constructive criticism of Democrats or the Democratic Party is permitted. When doing so, please keep in mind that most of our members come to this website in order to get a break from the constant attacks in the media against our candidates and our values. Highly inflammatory or divisive attacks that echo the tone or substance of our political opponents are not welcome here.

You are not permitted to use this message board to work for the defeat of the Democratic Party nominee for any political office. If you wish to work for the defeat of any Democratic candidate in any General Election, then you are welcome to use someone else's bandwidth on some other website.

Democratic Underground may not be used for political, partisan, or advocacy activity by supporters of any political party or candidate other than the Democratic Party or Democratic candidates. Supporters of certain other political parties may use Democratic Underground for limited partisan activities in political races where there is no Democratic Party candidate.

Do not post broad-brush smears against Democrats or the Democratic Party.

This is one reason why I chose Democratic Underground. The Admin staff has a tough job finding the line between maintaining the intent of the site - and over moderating legitimate criticism. But as a regular member I'm not tied down having to be a neutral referee. In real life I spend enough time challenging anti-Obama and anti-Democratic myths from Conservatives. I come to DU to gather and share information, thoughts and ideas with fellow Democrats. I'll be damned if I'm going to let irrational Dem/Obama smears go unchallenged here.

[LoZoccolo]

13. I have enjoyed your rebuttals.

I agree with your approach too. I guess the way to do it would be to put up a well-thought-out and substantive rebuttal like you've been doing, such that it resolves the challenge rather than gives into it by continuing the back-and-forth.

[ZombieHorde]

16. How should we direct our efforts toward other people? What does that look like? nt

[ibegurpard]

17. unrec

sorry, it's just a reflex