Biden tells liberal base: 'Stop whining'

[kpete]

Source: The Hill


Biden tells liberal base: 'Stop whining'
By Jordan Fabian - 09/27/10 04:40 PM ET

Vice President Joe Biden on Monday urged Democrats to overcome their differences and support their candidates at the polls by telling them to "stop whining."

During a fundraiser for New Hampshire Democratic candidates for the House and Senate, Biden said that Democrats should "remind our base constituency to stop whining and get out there and look at the alternatives. This president has done an incredible job. He’s kept his promises," according to a pool report.

Democratic leaders have hit the campaign trail hard in anticipation of reductions to their majorities in Congress in the November midterm elections, encouraging their supporters to head to the polls and vote.

Political observers have pointed to poll data showing there is a large enthusiasm gap between Republicans and Democrats over voting in the midterms as a sign that Democrats could be in trouble.

Read more: http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/121147-biden-to-democrats-stop-whining

[ibegurpard]

1. why do they think this is an effective strategy to generate enthusiasm?

or do they really want to lose?

[RBInMaine]

5. No, he's just being real. Adults don't sit and sulk and whine. They see the glass half full & FIGHT!

[ibegurpard]

7. do you berate people when you're out knocking on doors and phone banking?

let me know how that turns out for you

[cliffordu]

123. Where's your phone bank?

Where ya knocking on them doors??

[kenfrequed]

316. I have done both

And telling someone to 'stop whining' would probably top the list of things not to do. If I were on the edge of showing up and voting or staying home I might be tempted to do the later. Of course I always vote, but oddly, democrats seem to do better the higher the the percentage of people turn out to vote. And getting out your base is always crucial to winning elections.

[whathehell]

328. Yes, they're amazingly clueless.....Not to mention arrogant.

They act like we "owe" them something, when in fact it is they who "owe" us.

Having said that, for my own interests,I AM working for candidates in the midterm...That being said, I suspect I'd work much harder had I sensed a little more "grace" and appreciation from these jerks...No, I can't say I like them much -- and why should I?...They clearly don't like us, "retarded" "professional lefties" that we are.


I think they're attitude SUCKS. Period.

[tblue]

362. +1 THEY need to stop whining.

Dear Mr. VP, Stop complaining about us. Complain about the Republicans and the blue dogs.

[whathehell]

373. Agreed...THEY will be "whining" if they lose the midterms and have to work with Repukes.

..Not that I want that to happen as it will screw us too..I AM voting in November.

[SusanaMontana41]

391. I'm voting in November, too

But I think we're screwed either way. I'm tired of being kicked by my own party for doing what the president told us to do: hold him accountable.

[whathehell]

414. Precisely....Cenk's rant today was PERFECT. n/t

[sabrina 1]

375. Yes, that's what Nancy Pelosi and other members of the Dem

Congress told the WH. To 'stop attacking Democrats and focus on Republicans'. I guess Nancy is a whiner also.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

389. Now *THAT* is good advice not only to the VP, but also to a fair amount here on DU(the other way) nt

[EFerrari]

128. Seriously Norman Vincent Peale's work might need an update. n/t

[Hannah Bell]

279. there's always this:

[whathehell]

348. The same thought came into my head, LOL!

[h9socialist]

324. Yeah . . . like being shredded and pulped!!!!!!!

NVP was an idiot.

[Deep13]

8. "Whine" is a tone. Complaints are not whines...

...unless spoken in a high-pitched, half crying tone. Certainly, nothing type-written is whining.

But he can't call them "complaints" because that would acknowledge that there is something to complain about.

[paulkienitz]

172. complaint vs whine

I think it can also legitimately said that what separates a complaint from a whine, besides vocal tone, is that the latter occurs when someone thinks they ought to be entitled to something for nothing, and the world is failing to provide it to them. Such as, for instance, the votes of progressives.

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RKP5637]

71. I've always thought this country needed 3 or more strong political

parties than just 2. IMO it would lead to a better political discourse than this tennis match of us or them and consider the alternatives.

[Le Taz Hot]

297. I'd be grateful if we had 2

The second could actually represent the populace.

[awoke_in_2003]

336. +1 Billion. nt

[defendandprotect]

54. How about telling the T-baggers to stop "whining" .... or Wall Street - or banksters?

How about holding some of these people accountable?

[Beartracks]

77. But THEIR whining is a NOBLE whining...

... because THEY'RE the ones out of POWER. :eyes:

Plus, THEY are REEEEEEEAL Americans! :puke:


:nopity:


No, you're right: they're just whiners.

[girl gone mad]

137. Let's not begrudge Wall Street...

and those teabaggers are some good folks.

(both sentiments straight from the WH)

[Sherman A1]

267. Agreed

[deutsey]

80. Citizens should also be capable of critical thought

and of expressing criticism.

I think the Administration needs to stop whining about critiques from the Left and stamping their feet because everyone isn't skipping down their primrose path.

[JDPriestly]

178. The Obama administration does not seem to understand that when

people are tightening their belts a lot, a lot and worried about their jobs or unemployment or finding a job or Social Security or just how the arcane health care plan is going to work, they really don't feel enthusiastic about the politicians who seem to be doing very little about these problems.

Enthusiasm can't just be summoned up and displayed at will. It has to come naturally. Reminding depressed people to be happy and enthusiastic is not a good idea.

The suicide of Ruelas (I believe that is his name) is indicative of the feelings that some of Obama's policies have caused -- depression, sadness, listlessness. That's the meaning of a national depression -- and we are in one. Obama should listen to a tape of an FDR speech every single day. FDR knew how to inspire enthusiasm in voters.

[creon]

344. no sense of urgency

These are hard times; and, the hardest in memory. people are fearful and angry and in distress.
The Demcrats in washington seem to be detached and cut off. Conress and the WH should have come into Washington much more aware and able to take action.

What went on instead? Dithering. Following the line of least resistance and taking the easy way out.
very sad.

And, the GOP is a blind kitten.

[sabrina 1]

86. So what you are saying is that the Democratic Party

wants people to vote for them and then STFU? This is what the Republicans expect, blind loyalty. That is why I am not a Republican. But now you are telling us that the Democratic Party considers those who vote for them to be 'whiners' if they continue to take an interest in issues that affect the daily lives and well-being of themselves and their families?

Thanks for that information. I am sure it will be very effective in getting people to vote for Democrats :sarcasm:

[Dragonfli]

399. They are just not that into me, I think it's time I faced the fact that the FDR Democrats are gone

The new ones are more like Reagan Republicans in the policies that the pass, some of it even worse.

I will have to wait for them to want to work for us regulars again, until then I have no voice and the party courting me thinks I suck - that is no basis for a relationship, I am better off single.

[tavalon]

97. I'd like to hear your GOTV script

I'm sure it's a real whiner, I mean, winner.

[EFerrari]

119. I was a fool to say I didn't love you, just because you my hurt pride.

It wasn't true, I swear by the stars above you
You said you didn't love me, say you lied!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X9lusQKusOc



:rofl:

(Sorry, we're crazy with the heat up here, lol.)

[Name removed]

122. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ibegurpard]

130. irrelevant

as this strategy isn't going to be successful ANYWHERE.

[mbperrin]

212. You got a GLASS???!!

:fistbump: :rofl:

[G_j]

224. right on

that's it

[girl gone mad]

133. Sounds to me like Biden is sulking and whining.

So I guess you think he's not a "real adult" (whatever that even means)?

:shrug:

[still_one]

154. Except for the mislead headline at thhill, I see no actual quote in the article where he refers to

"the liberal base", as a bunch of whiners

The hill is not only a rag, but also has a right slant, and I suspect now that polls are now showing the election to be very close, instead of the one-sided republican victory they were calling two weeks ago, they are getting concerned that the republicans just might not control both houses, they are starting to panic, and misrepresent things to cause more division in the party

[ibegurpard]

157. should he sue them for quoting him incorrectly?

"Biden said that Democrats should "remind our base constituency to stop whining and get out there and look at the alternatives."

[still_one]

165. there is no case, and base constituency is NOT just liberals. Democrats are from all parts of the

spectrum, less so with republicans today, though that wasn't always the case

[ibegurpard]

177. i pointed the quote out to you

still want to claim it doesn't exist?

[still_one]

192. My point was where did he single out "liberals" verses ALL Democrats. This is a hit piece

to cause discord, to an already divided party

and knowing the hill, it IS intentional

People don't want to vote for Obama or Democrats that is fine, but this is a misrepresentation of what Biden said

[awoke_in_2003]

337. he didn't have to point out the liberals...

because the other dems are waving their pom-poms too wildly to be accused of whining.

[MissDeeds]

162. Yeah, the glass is half full

It's what it's full of that is unacceptable.

[walldude]

171. Funny seems to me like he's... um... WHINING.

Yeah he's a real "grown up". :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Lorien]

251. Are the anti war protestors just "whining"

because the war in Afghanistan has been escalated? Are women just "whining" because abortions won't be covered in Obama's Insurance Care reform? Are ALL our principles supposed to be thrown out the window for a "team win"?

Fuck that. I'll vote for a write in candidate before I vote for Obama or Biden again.

[Forkboy]

270. As soon as someone feels compelled to call themselves an adult I have to question it.

[RaleighNCDUer]

339. Then they should treat us as adults, not give us a half a glass and

tell us to go sit in the corner.

[sabrina 1]

374. Then why is Biden whining?

Apparently he's seeing an empty glass, despite the fact that the very people he's whining about put him in the WH.

Talk about sulking and whining. Makes him sound like a five-year-old who just got the new toy he wanted and then starts bawling because he broke it and his mommy is threatening not to give him another one until he learns how to respect it.

How about not breaking things in the first place?

[HughMoran]

18. He's fed up with the whining

SO am I.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WheelWalker]

49. You don't speak for me. I care.

[ibegurpard]

52. maybe you two can go out and berate potential voters together then

[JuniperLea]

59. Potential voters don't whine...

I'm not sure how they would feel berated.

[JuniperLea]

53. I care... please refrain from using words like "no one"...

When obviously YOU do not speak for EVERYONE.

[Monique1]

105. Thank you

I am tired of the whining also

[Jakes Progress]

210. Then stop it.

I'm not whining. I'm complaining. All the whining I hear is from people crying about how we are hurting their feelings and not agreeing with them. If Joe doesn't want people complaining, then he needs to do his job which includes communicating rather than whining about how misunderstood and unappreciated he feels.

[flyarm]

239. or get a new job..where no one hold you accountable! eom

[Hannah Bell]

278. whiner.

[DainBramaged]

326. I thought expressing opinions was the heart of DU.

To be called a 'whiner' after expressing an opinion is simply adding fuel to the anger fire we feel towards those who think we should accept the pablum our leaders feed us, just like the mindless robots on the Right..

[awoke_in_2003]

338. we have become an echo chamber. nt

[Hannah Bell]

370. i guess you didn't get the joke.

[Autumn]

189. Put everyone on ignore. Your DU experience will

be improved.

[MrsCorleone]

261. Ditto. A GOTV friend is finding nearly half of her registered Dem contacts are not voting

in her region.

Happy days are here again if Republicans take over! :sarcasm: Smooth move by those falling for the RW think tank talking points.

[tomp]

283. ok, so go ahead without us whiners. good luck. nt

[ChiciB1]

335. Oh, I See Someone Already Has A Deleted Message In Reply To Yours...

but then you must know that many of us "liberals" just don't want to roll over and play "follow the leader" as if we we following the Pied Piper! I've always felt that was the agenda for Repukes. It seems now that BOTH Parties feel we should sit down, shut up and VOTE!

Hey, "we got this one" doesn't work for some of us, and having to feel that ANY disagreement needs to be squelched just doesn't fit well in what I learned a DEMOCRACY is all about!

And yet, we start wars so we can spread OUR DEMOCRACY in other countries while this one GOES BROKE!

Welcome to ROME!

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

60. Agree ... this is a long string of comments alienating Dems -- as Pelosi noted twice .....

This is what you do if you want to drive Democrats OUT of the party ---

[corpseratemedia]

150. +1

they want to get rid of any sign of a progressive mandate

[still_one]

203. This article is by jordan fabian, a right wing hack, intentially misrepresenting what Biden said

http://www.thecornellreview.com/The_Cornell_Review/Jordan_Fabian.html

[flyarm]

240. what part of this did you miss????????

During a fundraiser for New Hampshire Democratic candidates for the House and Senate, Biden said that Democrats should "remind our base constituency to stop whining and get out there and look at the alternatives.


It doesn't matter who wrote it ..BIDEN SAID IT!

And many many of the Dems in DC do interviews with the HILL and their reporters..

Biden knew there were reporters there..

stop bashing and "whinning" about the messengers..there are enough of us under the bus! There is no room left under here!

[Iowa]

156. Yep. You nailed it.

[tomp]

285. agree. the dems would rather lose than be progressive.

there is no other explanation.

[defendandprotect]

388. Their corporate SPONSORS would rather Dems lose than be progressive .....

agree -- "there is no other explanation" --- !!

[PatrynXX]

149. think they want to lose

seriously maybe 2 years of hard core right wingism will get rid of the BS. so in 2012 we can get some stuff done instead of Dems who act like Blue Dogs :( Everytime they bitch and tell us to stop whining, the madder I get at them. Obama has done his job. Congress hasn't. Why should we be forced to vote for something they didn't do??

[David Zephyr]

185. +1. Joe Biden throws a wet blanket on the ember rather than giving it fuel.

When I heard he was being sent to New Hampshire, where I had some hope we might win, I nearly became ill. When I heard this "whining" news today, I was robbed of any hope I had and left only with despair.

ibegurpard, you ask the million dollar question: "do they really want to lose?"

Republicans, who are a minority in this nation, worship their base and they win friggin' elections. With the exception of Howard Dean, it seems the Party Establishment, takes great pride in assaulting its base. If it were just this single comment, then it would be nothing. But this has been a consistent drum now from Robert Gibbs, Rahm, Tom Kaine and too many White House spokepersons to excuse. It's either incompetence or total ignorance, and either of those two are inexcusable.

"Do they really want to lose?" I wonder.

[Phlem]

188. You could be on to something.

After all the rich get whatever they want no matter who's in office. Everything's just a lot easier with the R's.

They're certainly not out to win using this kind of strategy.

They could also be trying to push everyone to the right as well.

-p

[ChiciB1]

352. Well, THIS DEMOCRAT Isn't Going To GO RIGHT!! NO WAY!!

If this IS the strategy, then we have NO NEED for two Parties. Just Repukes, Repukes LITE, formerly known as a Democratic Party!

[roguevalley]

193. he truly, really, should terribly shut his fucking mouth. how many

pies in the face do they have to throw before they stand alone?

[Peregrine Took]

208. Because they are insane, isolated elitists and have no idea what is going on

in the real world.

[Hannah Bell]

277. +100. biden's a whiner too. see how easy it is to call people "whiners" when you want to dismiss

them?

[green917]

378. I think you hit the nail on the head

The Obama administration has shown, since the campaign ended and his Presidency began, that they are devoted to the Corporate and Military Industrial Complex's agendas. The only way they can sell that to the American people is by convincing us out here in the hinterland that, their hands were tied by the obstructionists in Congress (which isn't entirely untrue but is secondary to the fact that they aren't pushing for progressive policy). What has been lost in translation for the Cheerleaders here and elsewhere, is the fact that, time and time again, they have gone to bat to support those obstructionist voices in their own party (campaigning for Blance Lincoln, Arlen Spector, and a host of other blue dogs who were up against more progressive candidates). This excuse is starting to wear thin though for many of us out here in the real world dealing with immense unemployment, a housing nightmare the likes of which we've never seen and the rising cost of things like health care making it harder for all of us to get by. They need a new meme to sell the American people on why they can't get more progressive legislation passed...if they lose this fall, however, it gives them the perfect cover. Not only can they keep making their corporate overlords happy but, they can blame it all on the Republicans being in control in the House and/or the Senate.

Notice how he made a point to say that President Obama has kept his promises but didn't site any specifics. This is a play directly out of the Republicans' play book. Put forth a wild proposal without any details ("The Plan for America" is a perfect example) and the media will lap it up and back up your statement. Let's look at the facts though:

"We will end this war (Iraq)!" -VP Candidate Joe Biden, 2008
We have "ended all combat operations in Iraq" (now where have I heard that before?) but we still have 50,000 troops and 180,000 (read that number again) private security forces in Iraq...In other words, we withdrew about 80,000 troops and replaced them all with mercenaries which are far more expensive for the American taxpayer and have no code of ethics or conduct governing them under Iraqi or US law (by our design I may add).

"We will end this failed policy (DADT) by the end of this year!" -President Obama, 2010
VP Biden gave a very telling interview last week on this issue. When asked why the President didn't sign an Executive order suspending the practice of kicking out service members under DADT, while the military review is conducted, VP Biden said that this was the deal they made with Congress (presumably both Rs and Ds) to garner support for allowing the military to end the policy. They got ZERO votes from Republicans, and even had a few members of our own party defected to uphold a filibuster of the Defense Authorization bill (something that used to get you labeled a terrorist sympathizer and un-American). Read that again...they made a deal that the other side of the deal didn't uphold and, not only will there not be any consequences, they didn't even address it to the American people. Remember when the Democrats wanted to filibuster the Defense Authorization Supplemental (the vote that got Pres. Candidate John Kerry labeled a "flip flopper")? Did the Republicans just let it go? Oh yeah, they raised holy hell about it and it contributed to winning their President a 2nd term.

"I will close the Military Prison at Guantanamo Bay"
I don't even know where to start with this one. Not only have they not closed the prison, but they've decided to continue to prosecute prisoners under the military commissions act (which is in direct violation of at least 3 treaties which have been ratified by Congress, making them the law of the land).

I could go on and on and on.
I think they do want to lose this year because they, misguidedly, believe that it will give them something to get us motivated to vote for them again next time around and, as a cute ancillary benefit, allow them to continue to funnel our money upwards to the top 2%. The fact that they aren't going to bring the expiration of Bush's tax cuts for the rich to a vote until after the election just solidifies this for me. It tells me that either they're planning on capitulating and extending the tax cuts for the wealthy or, they've made a deal which the other side probably wont uphold. Regardless, this "whiner" is pissed and will continue to call them on this centrist BS until I have real representation in Washington.

[RBInMaine]

2. EJ Dionne said it best:: "Sulking is no substitute for organizing."

[EFerrari]

106. Maybe he should have sent a telegram directly to Biden.

[Scuba]

3. Get a clue Joe. The center is actually way left of where the MSM says it is.

[defendandprotect]

62. Of course, Biden knows that ....

that is strategy only intended to drive Democrats away from the party !!

And it's "strategy" which Pelosi has been questioning and objecting to, as well -- !!

[RKP5637]

88. It's all very very bizarre for the VP or any dem leader to make comments like

this in hopes of unifying the base.

[Scuba]

99. It sure is!!! Makes me wonder.

[Name removed]

142. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

164. That's what it looks like .... and what Pelosi has been complaining about TWICE now ....

[flyarm]

241. yep..I have been saying that for a long time! eom

[ChiciB1]

333. I've KNOWN For Some Time That Many Democrats Are Really, Really

unhappy about the shift to the right of this administration, but even given the fact that Biden makes "slips of the tongue" from time to time, I NEVER thought he would say what he said.

Biden was a politician I always liked, and felt he tried to stay in touch with "we the people" but now I see he's been given his "marching orders" and I wonder if even he REALLY wanted to say this. HOWEVER, he said it and he will have to LIVE with it. He obviously has found he has "no voice" as a Vice President and is simply going along to get along, or he's CHANGED HIS SPOTS!

Maybe this administration needs to read some books, like maybe one called "How To Win Friends & Influence People!"

Another shot across the bow, another stab to my heart. I'm not sure what to believe in anymore, and I don't know where I fit in.

JMHO!

[Enthusiast]

311. They pretend the M$M is correct

and they pretend they don't know otherwise. But they do know.

[Deep13]

4. Evidently, they don't need us.

[RBInMaine]

6. He's just saying what EF Dionne said: "Sulking is no substitute for organizing." GOOD !

[Deep13]

10. No, he said "stop whining."

I find that extremely insulting.

[cstanleytech]

34. If you and others here have only been complaining and not whining

then should not feel insulted because the comment was not then directed at you.

[flyarm]

22. No he is not ,no matter how hard you try to spin it or bully people! eom

[tavalon]

107. Actually, he said "stop whining", but thanks for the translation, oracle.

[tomp]

286. ej dionne and joe biden can both kiss my ass.

i have principled disagreements with the democratic party leadership, and i won't be dismissed.

[MissDeeds]

166. + 1000

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

9. I wouldn't be wining if Obama didn't throw his support to blue-dog blanche lincoln

and now she will probably be voted out with a repuke.

Looks like Arkansas's getting a bit redder this Fall.

[eilen]

170. Or maybe only slightly redder. Blanche is pretty rosy. nt

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

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[emilyg]

16. Amen.

[flyarm]

24. well, you said it pretty well! eom

[The_Commonist]

43. It was so well said, they deleted it!

Oh well...

[JuniperLea]

64. Personally...

I'd rethink that attitude if I were giving kudos to a deleted post.

[OnyxCollie]

205. Watch what you say.

Got it, Ari.

[Name removed]

211. Deleted message

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[laconicsax]

12. Promises like a repeal of DADT?

Ok...I'll stop whining.

[defendandprotect]

65. Exactly .... and notice has these comments serve to DIVIDE Democrats -- !!!

Quite a recipe for Democratic Party failure this coming November!!

[hendo]

194. +1000 this comment couldnt have come at a worse time.

Okay, I take that back, he could have made it end of October. That would have been worse.

[asdjrocky]

13. It's only whining when it comes from the left.

It's reasonable and bipartisan when it comes from the right. Get with the program people.

[fascisthunter]

31. nail, meet hammer

[GreenPartyVoter]

317. +1000

[disillusioned73]

319. +1

:dem:

[nosmokes]

14. the 1st sign Obama might be a milquetoast liberal: picking you as a running mate

[Alcibiades]

98. He's not a liberal

I'm surprised people still think he ever was any sort of liberal. I knew he was a moderate, but worked to get him elected anyway, because I thought at least he would prosecute the actual crimes and violations of the Constitution that took place under Bush.

[hendo]

195. The most liberal candidate that will win a general election

is a moderate.

[Alcibiades]

238. Yeah, they always used to say that

a black man couldn't win either. Obama was the best choice in the 2008 primaries. One of the things we ought to consider, though, is how the GOP has moved the electorate to the right simply by always moving to the right themselves. The angry old white electorate is aging out of the population. I don't think we will be forced to limit ourselves to moderates in the future.

[avaistheone1]

260. Let's see a few weeks ago Obama was being promoted as a progressive here.

I guess Obama's political orientation on an given day all depends on which way the wind is blowing.

[FiveGoodMen]

15. IOW: "Shut the fuck up. You'll take what you get and like it."

Fuck these guys.

[MissDeeds]

169. Could not agree more

:thumbsup:

[mike_c]

17. I realized a long time ago that democrats aren't talking to me...

...when they talk about "liberals." My politics are effectively to the left of the entire democratic party map. They certainly aren't talking to me when they try to solicit votes-- that requires some minimal representation, first.

[flyarm]

29. ++++++!!!

[stranger81]

255. Can I get an amen, brother?

Ditto what you said.

[flyarm]

19. OH WOW ..that will get me right out to do GOTV for the dems..not!

Are these guys trying to fuck with the base on purpose? I have believed so and now I am pretty sure of so..it seems so by all indications of their behavior..and it is not effective GOTV!!!!!!!

Now with this statement.. along with what has already been said and the constant bullying by people they are sending to web sites all over the internet..they are proving a sure fire way of losing in Nov ..by insult and innuendo!

One thing they are now assured of from me..not another damn dime..this is the first time in 40 years I have not volunteered , and not given a dime!

Keep it up dems..you are fucking up big time!

[tavalon]

110. Kinso of makes you wonder, doesn't it?

[chuckrocks]

20. another gaffe he meant

he meant to say "let's stop winning"

[flyarm]

30. was that before or after the great world blockbuster Chess game? eom

[TK421]

74. I've noticed not many people are talking about that game these days

I wonder why? Odd...very,very odd

[baldguy]

21. I'm surprised he can hear them from all the way under the bus.

[Fumesucker]

32. Where do you want your internets delivered?

You won them with that comment.. :)

:hi:

[Brickbat]

26. Here's the alternative I'm looking at, and has nothing to do with Republicans.

The alternative I'm looking at -- and in fact, the one I voted for -- is a president who remembers who fucking put him there. Believe me, I did not vote in the hopes of getting a fucking pony. I did vote for a president who, I believed, would leave me be to work for my own pony. Instead I get a guy who's holding the keys to the fucking glue factory.

[bahrbearian]

57. Well said .

[Brickbat]

78. I thank you.

[defendandprotect]

83. Unfortunately, "we" don't put them in office .... corporate $$ puts them in office ....

and they know it!!

We have 0 leverage over Obama or Biden -- only corporations do!!

We've been voting for the "lesser of evils" for decades -- and now there are

even fewer options left on what to do!!

[flyarm]

242. so they don't need us to go vote right? eom

[defendandprotect]

245. They may be telling us that they prefer that we don't .... ????

I put up a thread the other day -- see second item in my Journal --

saying I'm looking at this as not voting for Dems but voting AGAINST Repugs ---

if you look at it -- let me know what you think -- what you're doing???

Not voting has never made sense to me -- you don't get rid of any Repugs doing that --

First let's take care of Repugs -- and then corporate Dems!!

I don't have a crystal ball, but looks to me as though Obama/Biden corporate -sponsors

would be a lot more comfortable with FEWER Dems in Congress and more Repugs!!

Or we have two career politicians in Obama/Biden who are very confused about what they're

trying to do!!

:)

[Think82]

129. So ending the Iraq war, healthcare, wall street reform, the stimulus, saving the car industry...

is akin to making glue? I have no idea what your analogy means.

[defendandprotect]

246. A pro-corporate agenda is what you voted for ....? Here: Rahm 'crowing' about it --!!

Rahm "crowing" about how "grateful" business leaders hould be for Obama's assistance!!

Especially for keeping health care "privatized" -- !!!



Here is the quote: ”In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system; the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18...

Another poster posted this at DU last month -- 8/12/10

:eyes:

[xchrom]

27. Oh well -- get whatchya can from the credit card companies, Joe.

Im sure they'll rim you silly.

[Think82]

118. Actually this administration passed stricter credit card regulations.

slap!

[xchrom]

223. Actually go back and look at Bidens voting record. Nt

[fascisthunter]

28. lol... yeah, that'll earn my vote

idiot

[Fumesucker]

33. The tongue lashings will continue until morale improves..

You whining babies..

[stranger81]

257. it puts the lotion in the bucket or it gets the hose [n/t]

[RKP5637]

35. Yeah, it really works well to build enthusiasm when a party starts badmouthing and

devouring their own. Sometimes nothing said is better said when one is trying to build cohesion. I'm I guess what one calls a moderate democrat and crap like this pisses me off too.

[Fumesucker]

37. They don't think of the left as "their own"..

We are the whiners who need to be disciplined..

Strictly for our own good you understand..

[RKP5637]

41. Yeah, that's a real good strategy they've worked out on how to lose the elections. I get

pissed as hell when I hear crap like that from Biden or anyone. Hell, they're using divide and conquer on their own base. WTF. What an asinine comment Biden made. And as I mentioned I'm a moderate, so I can really really see how pissed others would be. Well, I say I'm a moderate, that's what I've been for over half a century, but anymore I guess I'm considered on the left with the new democratic party.

[tavalon]

127. Yeah, I'm far left and I'm voting straight Democratic ticket just to spite them

After seeing them bend themselves into pretzels the last two years to explain why they can't get anything done when they have the majority of both Houses and the White House besides, I'm figuring that if we give them the supermajorities they swear they need, it will be like watching Cirque Du Soleil every fucking day.

[boppers]

234. "like watching Cirque Du Soleil every fucking day."

an INTERNETS FOR YOU!

[Jackpine Radical]

55. The left is useless. They control no corporations,

not even a cable broadcast system. Why should the party give a fuck about useless pieces of shit like that?

[RKP5637]

79. That's a very very interesting point you make about no corporations, not

even a cable broadcast system... no big corp. donations and no mass media influence... so gain points by slamming the left...

[Jackpine Radical]

173. You've got it.

That's how they're playing the game. Go for the "center" (i.e. moderate right) and prove how "centrist" you are by trashing the left while moving in with the right. The stupid leftists (there aren't very many of them, you know) have noplace else to go. Whadda they gonna do, vote Repubican? Hyuk-hyuk. Vote for Nader? Haw.

[RKP5637]

186. Yep, and then they'll be surprised when the independents vote republician... n/t

[Jackpine Radical]

201. Harry Truman was right.

Given the choice between a Republican and someone who acts like a Republican, people will vote for the real Republican all the time.

[RKP5637]

204. Yep, Harry Truman was/is 100% right. I've been saying that about the Blue Dogs, eventually

a real republican will attach more votes. I don't find any of this really hard, nor do many of us, but apparently our strategists do. In my book first thing you want to do is unite the base, and if you don't like part of the base, at least don't badmouth them. These guys give the republicans more and more ammunition with remarks such as Biden's.

[defendandprotect]

100. Think we saw how true that was during the "health care" re-privatization debate ... !!

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[iamtechus]

38. I wish Obama had the courage to stand up to the generals and the repubs in

congress like he does to those whiney liberals.

[Peregrine Took]

209. How many courageous adjunct professors do you know? n/t

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

103. Exactly true .... but voting for Democrats is ONLY way to get rid of Repugs .... !!???

PS: I recently put a thread up on that asking to know what others are thinking ....

think it's time to begin discussing it --

I'd LOVE to have another option!!

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/defendandprotect

[Name removed]

181. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Think82]

42. Are any of you planning on not voting? Then you're a whiner

If you are going to vote, he wasn't referring to you.

A Republican victory will make out problems worse, not better.

[bahrbearian]

63. OK .so should we vote third Party cause this one isn't listening ????

[Think82]

91. I think it's important not to make blanket statements like no Dems are listening. The problem is:

this:

A few Blue Dogs in the Senate and ALL OF THE REPUBLICANS! I mean, we need to give the dems large majorities in order for them to enact the sweeping change you want as long as there's a 60-vote filibuster

I also think that preventing a depression, saving the car insutry, passing the healthcare bill (a net PLUS), Wall street reform, and getting us out of Iraq and at least trying to get out of Afghanastan (if you've read the latest on Woodward's book) is a MUCH better alternative to the Republicans. IF you can't see that, then frankly you are a whiner for not getting every single thing you want, or uninformed about the obstacle obama and the dems have faced siince coming into office.

Or you could be a Republican freeper.

[bahrbearian]

152. Or you could just be a Cheer Leader happy to capitulate. Oh we tried.

[Think82]

159. Those are not insignificant achievements.

[flyarm]

220. Ok so the Dem's are listening ..then calling their base nasty names! wow that is inspiring!

nottttttttttttttttttt

Gotta run out and vote for the name callers and bullies..

They call us names because they LOVE USSSSSSSSSSSS

They call us names so we will all get up and go pound the pavement for them, and answer phones and make calls for them...and get doors slammed in our faces..because people don't likeeeeeeeeee being called names....

Maybe we should go pound the pavements and make the phone calls ..I am having a vision..I can see it clearly now...

We Could recap to those we meet knocking at doors and calls how much they love us and repeat the name calling ..retard..whiners, professional liberals..at their doors and on their phones@!

Hello My Name is ---..I am here for the Democratic Party that thinks you are a Professional Left, Retard who is nothing but a lowlife Whiner..we demand you show up to vote for us ,Or we will sic nasty bullies on you or you will be beat down more with every nasty name we can drum up...and accusations!
Have a lovely day.

And do not forget to Vote in Nov..or we will send the crooks after you, that already have your tax money and fucked you over ..they will be back to fuck you out of what little you have left! And if that doesn't work,we will fuck you out of YOUR Social Security..then we will send the FBI after you, and accuse you of being an enemy combatant..even though you are anti war and a lifelong contributing Democrat! Don't worry we know where you are and what you do , because we tap your phones and read your email. We are witholding Birth control from you, so do not think you can have any freedom! We own you!!..And if you think you can run and get out of this country..we will hunt you down because we have a signing statement that says we can shoot to kill you with no justice system to protect you!

Again..(sweetly) let me tell you, it was so nice getting to meet you and share with you Democratic principles and values.. Have a lovely day!

yeah thats the ticket!!

Dream over...

..Biden finished the dream ! Did I really awake to this????????

wow that sure is a time tested way of winning! ..notttttttttttt

[PVnRT]

292. ....and yet we're told that we HAVE to support those Blue Dogs

Even in the primaries, we HAVE to support asshats like Blanche Lincoln, because everyone else is "unelectable." But, oops, there I go "whining" again.

And if you really think Joe is just talking about people not voting, you haven't been paying attention. This administration is just as nasty and vile to critics on the left as Bush ever was.

[defendandprotect]

114. Agree ... I'm not voting FOR Democrats ... I'm voting AGAINST Republicans ... BUT ....

The more Repugs we get rid of the better --

Not voting or voting third party will not get rid of even one Repug --

But ....

we also have to TARGET and rid ourselves of the DLC and other corporate-Dems

as quickly as possible!!

And we need a new president candidate in 2012 -- a liberal/progressive Democrat -- !!!

[Think82]

148. Well, Sestak won his primary, but so did Lincoln-- BARELY. It requires sustained effort.

Plus these candidates also need to win the general election in some red states/districts.

Let's not be like the tea party and demand ideological purity on every issue.

[defendandprotect]

161. The Republican Party obviously DOES REQUIRE "ideological purity" when voting .... !!!

How could anyone miss that fact -- ????

[tavalon]

132. But it isn't going to be worth anything because Joe, et al just drove away

the undecideds and any people who might have just kept whining and not voting might just be motivated to vote but not for the team castigating them. It's just a stupid, stupid, "strategy".

[ElsewheresDaughter]

44. ....

[MissDeeds]

187. OMG

:loveya:

[whatchamacallit]

45. Weird, I really don't get it

Is this some proven psychological technique, or are they just that fucking lame?

:banghead: :shrug: :banghead:

[RKP5637]

82. I wish it were, but I think it's just fucking lame. Now it's time for Gibbs to pick it

up and start echoing, yeah, that should really build party cohesion.

[dflprincess]

143. Rather than admit that many of the people who had never been involved in politics before

but got out and tirelessly worked for the Obama/Biden ticket in 2008 are disillusioned/depressed/disgusted and won't vote this year - they're setting up those of us on the left to take the blame for the Democrats failings.

[whatchamacallit]

219. Hmm...

Interesting notion...

[flyarm]

225. You got it!!!! 100% and ya know what..I don;t give a fuck who they try to blame this on..

it has their names all over it!

The days of excuses are over! and everyone knows it!

it no longer passes the sniff test!

and do not be mistaken..it all began with their little online thugs!

eom

[Mnemosyne]

390. Five people I got to vote in 2008 will not vote again because they feel duped.

I feel that myself, but will vote with my nose held, once again, against the pukes.

[valerief]

46. Stop wanting justice, kiddies. Just shut up or I'll give you something to cry about. nt

[LonePirate]

47. When he or his boss say something like "Stop whining" even more of the base decide to stop voting

Republicans never demean their boss but evidently the Dems can't do it enough. I wonder if they will regret those words on November 3rd.

[defendandprotect]

87. Did Bush/Cheney ever try to "demean" and "demoralize" their base ... don't recall it?

When their base complained, Bush used those complaints AGAINST DEMOCRATS !!

And to move the Republican Party and national politics to the RIGHT.

Seems Democratic Party just can't stand winning???!!!

'Cause even when they win by a landslide they turn Congress over to Repugs!!

[flyarm]

227. Nope..it is why even those who knew they were lying pieces of shit ..stuck around! eom

[tomp]

287. they didn't have to.

the right wing base thinks they are represented by the likes of bush and cheney, even though their children die in the wars, and are economically strapped, too. the right wing has managed to fool their base.

the democrats, on the other hand, have a problem. a large section of their base (the "whiners") actually know what's going on.

[cyr330]

48. If I were in Obama's or Biden's shoes. . .

I wouldn't be making cracks about their base not needing to "whine." They're going to end up alienating their base where NOBODY will want or care to show up & vote. When voters do not feel appreciated, they don't show up. Obama already has one big strike against him with his staffer's statement that liberals "need to be drug tested." Now, I'm not stupid enough to vote Republican just because I'm pissed & don't feel appreciated, but there are a LOT of voters out there who are not particularly political (UNLIKE the rest of US here on DemocraticUnderground!) and who are feeling resentful. Biden is just going to get them worked up & pissed off, and they're going to blame the Dems. It's that simple.

[defendandprotect]

51. Like Obama and Biden are too stupid to know that . . . . ????

[w4rma]

66. If they know that they are demotivating the base then what is their agenda for doing it? (nt)

[Name removed]

180. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lorien]

253. Bingo: with more repugs in office their corporate agenda can easily sail through

the worst thing that could happen to Obama/ Biden is an even greater Democratic majority. They even did away with the 51 votes rule to ensure Progressive defeat.

[truedelphi]

265. You have to hand it to our two Corporate Owned Parties

They have never met legislation helpful to the Middle Incomed that they haven't despised, derailed
and/or declared unimportant.

I am really hoping there are several tiers of "support" for thee odious monsters in hell.

[cyr330]

70. Motivation?

I doubt their motivation is stupidity, but I must say that they're sorely misled. I don't know who's dishing out the shitty advice-- maybe Rahm Emmanuel????

[defendandprotect]

90. How about they understand that voters have no leverage over them -- only corporations do--!!

[gkhouston]

112. Then the corporations had better start hiring some phonebankers and doorknockers.

That must be what they want; otherwise, why verbally berate us every five minutes?

[defendandprotect]

120. I've sure they will. . . . they BUY everything else they need ... including T-baggers,

Christian Coalition, our press, publishing houses --

[flyarm]

230. and posters on Democratic internet web sites! With the same MO they hired for Bush! eom

[Lorien]

254. And the Diebold machines. nt

[flyarm]

229. oh it's already there..people have already bailed..in both states I live in and am

member of numerous Dem clubs and in one state a member of the DEC..

There has been no one left behind..

Teachers are pissed

Gays are pissed

Women are pissed

Union members are pissed

Baby boomers are pissed..

Seniors are pissed..

the Youth that can't get jobs are pissed..

Anti -war activists are pissed

environmental activists are really pissed off on the Gulf where I live..and all over the Gulf states!

Health Care Reformers are pissed..

xxxxxxxxxxx

the Dem's took over Bush's school policy..only with adults..

it is now..

Leave No Adult Behind..and we all know how well Leave No Child Behind worked out ..don't we???

[defendandprotect]

248. That's a large liberal/progressive voting bloc that I think we have to keep together ....

and where are we going????

[flyarm]

274. I know many many who are saying they will sit it out! I was trying to talk them out of that plan..

but personally..I don't give a damn any more..I will expend no more time trying to convice people to vote.

Because I am no longer convinced I give a damn enough to do so myself!

This is like trying to swim upstream when the damn was opened up against you!

[defendandprotect]

369. Exactly . . . .

My son won't vote after the Howard Dean attack --

but, I did write this last week

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/defendandprotect

Think getting rid of as many Repugs as we can might help --

and then we'd have a better opportunity to deal with "the devil we know"???

I think that by now EVERY family has to have had someone in the family hit

by joblessness, loss of homes, unemployment insurance running out --

medical care that is either too costly or unavailable to them.

At this moment, at least, Dems are renewing unemployment benefits.

It would also make total rejection of Republicans and corporatism very clear.

Iow, I'm kind of arguing that we can't get from where we are to where we really

want to be -- LEFT, LEFT, LEFT. But maybe getting rid of GOP would bring us closer

to doing that???

Stay in touch on what you're thinking --

:)

[Name removed]

385. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[defendandprotect]

387. Wow . . . !! I'm in NJ and I just first realized that ....

our Senator Robt. Menendez is DLC!!

I think most here indicate they don't give to DNC anymore -- only directly to candidates

they actually support. I did that long, long ago!

Obviously, we have to either get rid of the DLC or recreate the Dem party outside of the

Dem party???

So -- you're saying you're a NO vote?

I'm hoping to find some way to see the huge liberal/progressive voting bloc come together

with some new ideas? What are you saying? Just give up on Dem Party?

Or are you hoping that the NO vote will send some kind of a message?

I also have my suspicions -- but it does seem worthwhile to me to try to completely smash

the GOP.

Less excuses that way!?


9/11 -- are you in NYC?

[flyarm]

394. I am not saying I am doing anything right now.I am due to get my vote by mail ballot any day , many

have already gotten them. I do not tell anyone who I vote for , that is between me and my ballot. I don't tell my husband who I vote for , as I have been a Poll watcher at large and poll worker at large for many many years. I t has been my job to protect people's right to vote and their right to privacy to vote. I hold those ideals close to my heart.I have walked minorities into vote past BUBBA and kept people from intimidation and harrassment for a very long time. So who I vote for is between me , my conscience and my ballot.


I also live in two states, I am a snow bird as we are called in Fla.and I know Menendez well, and have given him support and money. What I will say, and feel free to say, No one from the DLC will ever see another dime of my money, or another moment of my time or efforts, Until my principles and values.. that are very long held as a proud democrat, and prized by me as a democrat, are respected!

Until *they* who are in office begin to represent Democratic principles and values of who brung them..they will no longer get my support in GOTV or any of the work I have for many years done for them! Or my money!

[defendandprotect]

407. Didn't mean to upset you ....

nor invade your privacy --

What I meant was, the general situation --- as others are expressing their feelings here

at DU.

I'm quite sure that something could change my mind about what I'm doing before Election Day --

Obama/Biden seem to be working to create FEWER votes for Dems -- !!


Agree re the DLC!!

:)

[flyarm]

411. no no no , you did not upset me..not at all..

I was just explaining why I don't tell anyone who I vote for , or would i ever to presume to tell anyone else who to vote for..I just wanted you to understand why I don't go there about VOTES.

I believe our vote is our most precious possession, and extremely private. That is simply why I answered you, with my reasons..

but noooo, you did not upset me at all...quite the contrary, I enjoy discussing it all with you!

[defendandprotect]

413. Think everyone is trying to state GENERALLY how they are thinking about

this upcoming election -- that's all --

Glad to know you didn't think I was prying!

What I've been saying .... IN GENERAL . . . is pretty much that I'm just planning to

vote against Republicans -- as many as I can help knock out the better ---

and then backtrack and try to deal with the Democrats .. i.e., the devil we know!

And -- yes -- we have to kick out the corporate Dems -- DLC -- New Dems -- whatever

they want to call themselves right now!

And -- even further, I think we need to be looking for a liberal/progressive Democrat

to run in 2012!! I don't see any evidence that Obama will give up his pro-corporate

agenda.

:)

[Mnemosyne]

392. Former pukes and cross-filers have made the meme, "Both parties are the same." into truth.

Most voters do little or no research and decide when they get into the booth, thus many D's vote for R's without their knowledge.

I know this because that is how I used to vote, many years ago.

Ignorance is bliss, until it isn't.

[defendandprotect]

406. Unfortunately, that argument is dead ... as Obama/Biden

and the smashing of our best chance at MEDICARE FOR ALL has proven!*

Ralph Nader is a "cross-flier" .... or a "former puke" -- ???

Corporations have been buying government and our candidates and elected officials --

often with checks being distributed on floor of the HOUSE -- for at least 40 years now!

Corporate ownership of both parties -- with DLC-corporate wing residing in the White House

now -- makes any denial of this reality simply "ignorance."

And Ralph Nader has been telling Americans about this threat for more than 40 years!

We've had more than 40 years of voting for the "lesser of evils" -- and there is sad to say,

very little difference between the parties -- and certainly NOT THE DIFFERENCES there should

be!!



* Notice DLC/Rahm "crowing" here about having saved the PRIVATIZED HEALTH CARE industry

for business!!


Here is the quote: ”In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the

overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system;

the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18...


This article was posted at DU on 8/12/10 by another poster --

[Name removed]

252. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[apocalypsehow]

272. "I have no intention of ever voting for anyone in this Whitehouse (Sic) again" - telling, that.

So, you're going to vote for the GOP nominee in 2012? :shrug:

"I've got over 570 people on my Facebook friends list-nearly all of them Liberal-and only THREE really like this administration-and even they have reservations"

LOL - Facebook? You're adjusting your political opinions/options based on what you see posted on Facebook?

Laughable as it is pitiful - :eyes:

[defendandprotect]

50. Too bad Biden didn't suggest that to CLARENCE THOMAS.... instead of putting

a pervert on our Supreme Court -- !!

[Gman]

56. Great advice. They need to stop whining like spoiled children.

They're adults now.

[harun]

145. Spoiled would imply at some point we actually got a Progressive piece of change,

even a little one. No, we are whining because we ain't got shit.

[Gman]

202. Most wouldn't know a progressive piece of change

if it bit them in the ass anyway.

[flyarm]

231. You are dead wrong! You are so far off base..you are in the cellar!

You think you are still talking to young people who don't know what the fuck is going on..don't you??

Perhaps you need to read down this board one more time..you are in a very very small minority! Getting smaller by the day!..and by the nasty names flung out at the base of the Democratic party! And can't shit on us enough!

Oh we get it..we get it big time..

signed a Professional Liberal Retard whiner..

Who was a former elected Delegate of my state!!

Who for the first time in 40 years refuses to volunteer for GOTV...or anything...or to donate a damn dime!

I don't need shit rubbed in my face more than once to get it!

[BzaDem]

258. You are in the small minority. 85% of liberal Democrats approve of Obama, and similar percentages

among Democrats approve of his policies.

There is a small minority here, but what you don't realize is that YOU are the one in that minority.

"You think you are still talking to young people who don't know what the fuck is going on..don't you??"

I don't know about young. But I don't think I'm talking to someone who doesn't know what the fuck is going on. I know I'm talking to someone who doesn't know what the fuck is going on.

[XemaSab]

290. There's what you tell the pollster and then there's what you tell your friends

If Fox News calls my house, I'm going to say that Obama and Biden shit rainbows and pixie dust.

[w4rma]

58. Screw Biden. Biden needs to quit whining, himself. (nt)

[travelingtypist]

61. Biden's Foot-in-Mouth strikes again.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, he's right, technically, that the base needs to show up. But it just seems like more of Rahm's liberals are morons and Gibbs' derision of the professional left.

I mean, was it really necessary to say something that will be so easily misinterpreted? Oh, right, wait. It's Biden we're talking about.

:banghead:

[Major Hogwash]

67. What does he expect from a bunch of fucking retards? Hey, kids, that's not yellow rain!!!

First Rahm wants us to endorse the Blue Dawgs that have compromised our values and now Joe wants us to stop whining about it.

Hey, I've got an idea, start running real liberals for the Democratic seats in Congress and we will.

Go shake Representative Walt Minnick's hand, Joe.
He's running as a Democrat for Idaho again.

And his voting record was aligned with the GOP 87% of the time last session!!!

Man, and they wonder how that dickhead got into office -- he used to work for Nixon!!!

[Name removed]

68. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Politicub]

69. Some people are happy being miserable

There are a lot of those people on DU.

While it frustrates me when Dems berate the liberal base, I do appreciate the difference between constructive criticism and whining. People often get the two confused.

FWIW, my definition of whining is complaining about everything and throwing all babies out with the bathwater.

I tend to whine quite often myself, but I'm (trying!) to put that aside until after the election. I aspire to be constructive, but fall short way too many times.

The best antidote that I have (for myself at least) is getting involved local races. And remembering what hell we lived through under Bush.

[Nevernose]

72. Wow. He's kind of like an abusive spouse.

Not so much for the whkning comment, but the part after that. The part where he says "look at the alternatives." It's like some asshole saying "you won't leave me, no one else will ever love you!"

I'm not going to start voting Republican, and I'll vote in November, but "STFU whiners, at least we're not the other guys" is hardly going to get me to talk to my neighbors or contribute any cash.

[pgodbold]

73. Well isn't that just great? Another one of captain bipartisan’s troops telling us to STFU. nt

[ExitAsARat]

75. I am tired

I wish all the congressmen would fight in a cage match and whatever party has the most survivors after 3 days of vicious melee will retain control of the house. Control for the senate must be settled with gladitorial combat.

Good ol' violence. Hey, it's only slightly worse than politics.

[Fumesucker]

81. Gladiator-at-law..

I like it..

Welcome to DU, BTW.. :hi:

[tavalon]

135. Sounds like a pretty fair idea to me

[depakid]

76. There they go again!

If there was ever a more tone deaf administration I can't recall it- or even look back into history and find it. Maybe Hoover.

At a time when they ought to be throwing out the red meat and talking about substantive plans to further their constituencies' interests- they're channeling Phil Gramm!

Well, I guess in another 36 days we'll see if their "harangue the base" strategy is successful or not.

[Go2Peace]

89. Democrats are going to hold power because the alternative is a shambles

and so screwed up that in the end people will still vote for many democrats. Though we will likely end up with smaller majorities.

I predict the (leadership) and the hard core "assault everyone they don't agree with" folks on this site will think the election was a show of incredible strategy and will take credit; the awful politics toward the base will unfortunately likely continue.

We will keep the majority *despite* the poor tactics of party leadership, not because of.

[depakid]

102. While I hope you're correct, Nate Silver doesn't see it that way at the moment

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/

And in any traditional analysis, this sort of "strategy" is a recipe for electoral disaster.

[Autumn]

198. I hope to hell you are right.

but damn it gets harder all the time.

[Name removed]

84. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Fumesucker]

96. Well I'm going down to smother a dirty hippie..

Cause I caught her whining about broken promises..

:evilgrin:

[XemaSab]

291. Is that what the kids are calling it these days?

:shrug:

[diane in sf]

85. I'll stop complaining when they stop compromising with criminals/Repugs who aren't going to

compromise with them. I also am donating money and working to elect Democrats. I'm offended by this whining statement, and all the other insults.

[Think82]

93. If you are donating and working for Dems, the statement wasn't directed at you.

[gkhouston]

115. Hey, thanks. Glad I got my papers so I can pass through the checkpoint.

:eyes:

[Think82]

I have no idea what that means.

[gkhouston]

140. It means it's ludicrous that a lot of Dems are being blamed for their lack of enthusiasm,

as if our loyalty (and we ourselves) are somehow suspect when we point out that the Administration's accomplishments leave a lot to be desired.

And it doesn't matter whether or not the VP's remarks were directed at us personally; it's fucking stupid for him to have said what he did because such a remark will do nothing, zero, zip to motivate anyone to actually participate but it's great fodder for alienating folks.

If you have a base lacking in enthusiasm and you know it's because they perceive (rightly or wrongly) that a lot of promises have not been kept, you don't call them whiners and say you're incredible. You say it's a tough election year, the economy's in the crapper, we need everybody's help, and we'll address issues X, Y, and Z in the new Congress.

[Think82]

147. I understand, but the administration has made admirable achievements in the face of strong obstacles

so to have the very people they are trying to fight for sit out or not vote has got to be frustrating.

It was an off-the-cuff remark, not a prepared statement.

[diane in sf]

138. I only donate to Dems who are really liberals. I won't donate thru the national orgs

as they are way too corporatist for my taste. I tend to take suggestions from Act Blue. If they put Howard Dean or someone with his qualities in charge of the national Democratic organizations I will donate nationally again.

[Think82]

144. As long as you vote dem, then great. there's a big difference between dems and repubs, though.

Compare the last two years to the previous eight. Seriously.

[frylock]

190. bullshit..

what made you come to that conclusion?

[eridani]

268. LIke hell it wasn't

Obama betrayed every campaign promise he made on health care. He campaigned for a public option, he campaigned against Clinton on a mandate, and he campaigned against McCain on taxing benefits. Still, I'm canvassing for, donating to and voting for Democrats. I'e have a lot more time for that if I didn't have to spend so much time on organizing against the Death Panel Deficit Commission.

[tavalon]

92. Wow, et tu?

This abusive spouse crap has to stop.

[avaistheone1]

94. Thanks for pumping me up Joe.

:puke:

[pattmarty]

95. That's sure to help that "enthusiasm gap". And they will wonder..........

.............why their base stayed home.

[bvar22]

101. It would be more productive to stop splitting the Party before an election...

but thats just me.


"If we don't fight hard enough for the things we stand for,
at some point we have to recognize that we don't really stand for them."
--- Paul Wellstone


"By their works you will know them."

[defendandprotect]

126. Not just you; Pelosi has complained about it to Obama at least TWICE .....

and look at how effective it is here at DU in splitting Democrats and support --

All of this happens by accident?

[PVnRT]

294. Just remember the rule

Those one the left must fight the real enemy, the GOP, while the rest of the Democratic party fights the real enemy, the left.

[mistertrickster]

104. Biden, "the beatings will continue until morale improves." Gee, thanks. nt.

[Demeter]

108. "Incredible" but not in the way he thinks

[totodeinhere]

109. I object to the use of the term "whining."

It is not whining when you are advocating what you sincerely believe is best for the country and the American people.

[defendandprotect]

136. "Whining" over no MEDICARE FOR ALL... our best chance for it smashed by Obama/Baucus....

and health care industry?

I'd say this is a ton of corporate arrogance that keeps seeping out of the

White House ---

and that we need a new liberal/progressive Pres/VP in 2012 -- !!!

[woo me with science]

111. This makes me

really, really sad. :puke:

[Monique1]

113. I agree with Biden

[Name removed]

116. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SargeUNN]

117. I agree with Biden because we have to vote or else

we are asking for a move backwards. Do you think the Republicans didn't mean it when they said they aren't changing? Come on they mean it and even though we are upset with the Democrats in some ways the truth is we are better off voting for them. That is reality and if you don't like it sorry. You refuse to vote for Democrats then you vote Republican by default and you are as much a part of putting these thugs in. Sorry but that folks is the reality.

[EFerrari]

124. There is no reality that demands you drive your vote to the polls

by browbeating them. Sorry. This White House needs to go back and get trained on how to motivate people because that's their job.

[defendandprotect]

131. What we have to do is get rid of more Repugs... then we can work on the corporate-Dems ....

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/defendandprotect

I'd LOVE to have another option --

Let me know what you think!!

[Name removed]

151. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[katandmoon]

228. Your post is a thing of beauty!!!

[ChiciB1]

356. Well, Have My TV On... Obama Is About To Speak In NM! Turning It OFF! N/T

[Dr.Phool]

358. !

:rofl:

[Lorien]

256. +1. nt

[Iowa]

197. Nonsense...

"You refuse to vote for Democrats then you vote Republican by default"

This is utter bullshit. In fact, the opposite is often true.

You should be voting for the candidate that will uphold historic Democratic ideals. If a candidate is a corporatist, anti-civil-liberties, war mongering, sell-out, you shouldn't be voting for him no matter what brand-name he wears. You have no obligation to support a Republican - even if that Republican pretends to be a Democrat.

I will be voting for Roxanne Conlin (who's running against Chuck Grassley), but there's no way in hell I'd be voting for Ben Nelson if I lived in Nebraska. No way. I'd either vote third party, if that was a viable option, or leave it blank. I don't vote for Republicans... never have and never will. It's a matter of principle. If there are two Republicans to choose from, I refuse to support either one of them.

[AnOhioan]

121. Hey Joe....if that is your attitude...stick it

[t0dd]

125. Alienate and belittle your base..

what an excellent way to generate voter enthusiasm :rofl: yet this Administration does it constantly. They really must want to lose

[Patriot 76]

134. Joe should know that whiners hate being told to stop whining.

It makes them go crazy.

[Name removed]

139. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Kall]

141. Democratic base to Joe Biden: Start fighting.

You've got to sit in wonder at the nerve (and brains) of these guys. They spend 2 years giving Wall Street the same wet kisses as the Republicans, and serve up Mitt Romney and Bob Dole's health care plan, then say that Democrats can win if they "draw a clear distinction between them and the Republicans."

Well Joe, you've had 2 years. Better get started.

[Think82]

155. The health care plan saves $ and saves lives. The repubs wanted no plan.

There is a huge difference. You make it seem as if passing these things is easy?

[t0dd]

163. Not easy. But Obama brokering backroom deals with the pharmaceutical and insurance

companies at the start of the debate has never sat well with some of us. He also never fought for a public option.

[XemaSab]

293. Even more fundamental than that

he's not the big picture, big message dude I voted for.

He let the right wing control the discussion on health care, until it turned into a "We're going to confiscate your child's piggy bank to pay administrative salaries to the death panels who want to kill grandma" sort of discussion with weak protests from the left that it wasn't true.

I know the exact moment he lost me: that speech he gave after the oil spill. It was THE MOMENT to go big and really spell out a vision, but instead it was about as inspiring as a monday morning group meeting at work, ya know? Only without any promise of getting paid on friday. :P

[defendandprotect]

410. MEDICARE FOR ALL would be a huge difference.. preserving PRIVATIZED H/C industry is NOT ...!!!

And here's Rahm "crowing" about that --

Here is the quote: ”In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the

overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system;

the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18...

posted by another poster at DU on 8/12/10


At least let's be honest about what is actually going on --

I'm willing to be moved to continuing to vote AGAINST Republicans ....

but there is no way in hell that I'm going to look at that as voting FOR Democrats!

The alibis and excuses have to stop!!

[KoKo]

215. +1

Darned Right!

[JoeyTrib]

146. They want to lose seats.

That's the only thing that makes sense.

[still_one]

153. Nice inaccurate headline. Nothing wrong with telling Democrats to overcome their differeneces

and stop whinning, that sure implies he is telling ALL Democrats. By the way, the Democratic base is made up of liberals, moderates, and yes, even conservative Democrats. The headline is "the hills", and I didn't see where Biden specifically singled out the "liberal base"

The hill is another rag just trying to build discord among Democrats.

For those that feel offended with the remark to "stop whinning", you can do what you want. Biden is giving his view, you can give your view. If you don't want to vote for the Democrat in the upcoming election, that is your right, don't vote.

These "political" observers two weeks ago called the demise of the Democrats in November. The actually numbers are much closer, and uncertain

I will be voting Democratic, because that is my right, and I personally believe there is a difference between the Democrats and repukes. If someone decides to vote another way or not vote, because they don't believe there is a difference, that is their right

After 8 years of bush, an entrenchment of right wing thugs in our judicial system, the involvement of two wars, and the financial collapse, along with a Congress that was NEVER truely a majority, i.e. LIEberman, Bayh, both Nelsons, etc. etc. etc. I never had any illusions that change would happen quickly

[MissDeeds]

158. Interesting

how this administration punches their base in the face and then expects their support at the polls. Pathetic.

[L0oniX]

160. Tell the fucking sociopath rich to quit whining. Tell Sara to STFU too while yer at it.

[JDPriestly]

167. Well, there are a couple of things I am happy about -- the appointment of

Elizabeth Warren for one, the legislation regarding small businesses for another and then of course the changes on student loans. But there are a lot of problems which I will not list here because everyone can recite my list from memory already.

I do think that there have been a couple of gestures in our direction -- and in the direction of positive, good government -- in the past couple of weeks.

The death of Ruelas is really a very serious problem for Obama and his education team. I don't know whether they have understood how utterly damaging their education policies are to the teaching profession and to the rights of students, parents and all others involved in and interested in education. Privatizing the schools means that in the end the constitutional rights of parents and students and the public in general with regard to the schools will be lessened. That is a loss they probably have not thought about.

[Jakes Progress]

168. Biden's the whiner.

The wh keeps whining that people don't love them. The whine and cry about not being understood and about how hard their job is.

Gut it up. You wanted the job. Now stop acting like a bunch of whiney babies and do your job. We'll quit complaining when you get it right. You work for me you candy ass. Now get it right or get out.

[still_one]

174. No, that is the media who represents it that way, because it serves their interest

I want to know exactly what Biden said, because the bits and pieces inside the article DID NOT refer to liberal base when they quoted him, it referred to ALL Democrats to settle their differences among themselves

The way it is presented, I am not sure if the "Headline" from the hill is a quote or not. I wonder if they did the ambiguity intentially so conclusions could be based on information without the correct quote

I don't need any rag journal to tell me how to interpret a quote, give me the full context, then I will make a decision

[walldude]

175. Yep... funny, if they were attacking the crap out of

Republicans instead of their base they'd probably hear a lot less whining. I keep waiting for one of these geniuses to use the Republican vote against health care for 9/11 workers in an attack ad. I guess they are too busy whining about their base to worry about WINNING FUCKING ELECTIONS.

[muffin1]

302. Exactly.

WE'RE 'fucking retards' and the right-wing is 'acting in good faith'. Got it.


:wtf: is wrong with these people?

[zipplewrath]

183. Exactly

They asked for the damn job. Now just do it.

[rateyes]

176. I haven't whined. I have complained, and for good reason. And, I'm not going to the polls.

Now, YOU suck it up, Joe!

[jtuck004]

179. Dale Carnegie is gonna be jealous.

With comments like this, and "there's no possibility to restore 8 million jobs lost in the Great Recession.", this guy is
just motivating people like crazy.

Hey Joe, I'll make you a deal. If I am one of those, I will quit "whining" when you push for a jobs program. Get out and try to sell it, just like 30 million people unemployed and underemployed people are trying to sell themselves to just 4 million employers offering jobs. Will you suffer rejection? Probably. But you still get a salary in excess of $200,000 a year, free housing, food that you only have to pay for when you want to, unlike many of our neighbors who have to go home to a partner or spouse, or their kid, and try to look at them while knowing that they won't be able to pay the mortgage. Again. Or that the kid only gets to eat when they get to the school lunch program.

Those 30 million are your constituency, not the people on Wall Street your administration rewarded with trillions of dollars after they caused massive unemployement and foreclosures of homes.

All your constituents want is a job they can work at with some self-respect, and a place to live. That's whining?

[Autumn]

182. Joe, I never whine. I do complain

and bitch. I think I have reason. Pull up your big boy panties and deal with it.

[Canuckistanian]

184. NOW, I'm starting to wonder about the midterms

Deliberately pissing off the progressive base AGAIN.

Not exactly a winning strategy, Joe.

[RKP5637]

191. Yeah, this is all we need is for Biden to reopen the wounds again. I have no

idea where these guys get their strategies from, but they need to go rethink what they are trying to do. I hope Gibbs keeps his mouth shut on this one.

[Canuckistanian]

207. Do they listen to feedback?

You'd think they would have learned a few things after Gibbs' or Rahm's comments.

Are they clueless? Dense?

I'm really hoping this is some "Biden puts his foot in his mouth AGAIN" kind of thing.

But I fear it isn't.

[RKP5637]

221. I'm sure someone will ask Gibbs about it during the WH press briefing, and who

knows what Gibbs will say... hopefully he has learned...

[Amonester]

269. They R dense, but they love the Money...

not their base (it's so obvious).

[pmorlan1]

196. Good technique there Joe

More name calling. Gee, that sure makes me want to support you guys. Good grief. It's like you are going out of your way to make us stay home.

[wookie72]

199. Stay classy, Joe

"Suck it up and vote for us, dummies!"

[still_one]

200. Jordan Fabian is a right wing thug whose intention is to mislead

http://www.thecornellreview.com/The_Cornell_Review/Jordan_Fabian.html

You want to argue a complain about Obama and Democrats fine, but the quote from Biden has NOTHING to do with "liberals", it is telling ALL Democrats to cool it

This asshole fabian does NOT want Democrats to win, and there are plenty of thing to jump on the administration on along with Democrats, but some right wing hack mis-quoting Biden doesn't cut it

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

206. GO JOE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! n/t

[Zenlitened]

213. Hey thanks for the help, Joe. It was getting to be too easy here in Massachhusetts.

:eyes:

[wundermaus]

214. oh, ok. Thanks for the advice.

Bye-bye, now.

[unkachuck]

216. maybe, Joe 'stop whining' Biden....

....and Rahm 'fuck the UAW' Emanuel are trying to convince Progressives that they are perceived as the real 'enemy'....

....I've never heard the Prez use that tone regarding Republicans....

[krispos42]

217. START PERFORMING

liberal base tells Biden

[craigmatic]

218. He's right we need to go vote. I hate repubs more than I disagree with Obama.

[liberation]

266. If the DLC were also targeting their "STFU and vote bitches"

as their only electoral value proposition for the center... I am willing to bet the level of enthusiasm from many posters would be distinctly reduced.

[Dinger]

222. Liberal Base to Biden: Back At Ya

That is all.

[mikelgb]

226. Joe Biden Whines in a slight Indian accent.

this is LOL on so many levels

By telling the audience to "remind our base constituency to stop whining and get out there and look at the alternatives." he is: Admitting neither himself nor his audience is part of "the base" of the party.

The Base has looked at the "alternatives", we want their ideas rejected and repealed and their crimes investigated.

The only whine I hear is this constant refrain from the non-base about the base.

Yes, we will still vote for you arrogant assholes, but lay off and focus on the fucking blue dogs or something.

[wisteria]

232. Maybe he is trying to tell us we are behaving like Republicans when we whine and complain. n/t

[muffin1]

303. Yeah...

that context makes it sound better. :eyes:

[emsimon33]

233. Once again, I am sure energized...NOT!!!

I guess if you have sold your base out, the best tactic is to blame them. It's not working. They can't have the cake (whores for the top .001% and corporations) and eat it (have us dedicate our time and limited financial resources to canvass, hold house parties, phone bank, and show up to vote). Gosh, maybe those independents and the Tea Party members will get out the vote for them.

[bitchkitty]

235. Where does this guy live, for God's sake?

Not in the same universe as the rest of us. None of them do. I'm so sick of these fucking assholes. They know that the alternative that we have are limited. Who else is there to vote for? So they do and say what they want, or what their corporate sponsors want.

I wonder how many who would have voted, won't be voting now because of this statement and similar assholery from this Administration.

[webDude]

236. Whether you are with him on this or not, it is downright stupid.

[breadandwine]

237. ••• FLASH BULLETIN: DEMOCRATIC ESTABLISHMENT JOINS SUICIDE CULT •••

~~~ Suicide poison eagerly supplied by GOP. ~~~





And in a not ENTIRELY unrelated development, this just in:


MISSING ADULTERER RETURNS FROM TRIP WITH MISTRESS TO ARUBA ---

TELLS WIFE TO STOP WHINING...

[Bluebear]

243. What's his DU name?

[muffin1]

308. +1,000,000

:rofl:

[Catherina]

355. Something with a circle D. n/t

[johnaries]

244. I stand with Joe Biden. The glass is not half empty. Actually, it's 3/4 full.

And I'm truly sorry about that 1/4 that didn't happen. But I'm very proud of the 3/4 that did happen.

[ibegurpard]

250. i think you're wearing beer goggles

[Techn0Girl]

262. I want what he's drinking!

Because after the last two years I could use it - make it a double!

[flyarm]

273. beer pong game..play at your own risk! or hold your nose!

I'll Hold out for Champagne...

[Name removed]

247. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Rex]

249. I'll stop whining when you get a spine.

:eyes:

[jtuck004]

259. Given a chance to re-word it, he made up for it, mostly, on Last Word.

here...

And as keith said later, hold on to your anger and take it out on your opponents, not your supporters - (more or less)

[RandomThoughts]

264. Thats interesting.

I have no supporters, so theoretically if I wanted to, I could take out anger on anyone. Although I am not angry. And spend much of my time finding things I think are really nice.

If I had supporters, I would have beer and travel money and many good times.

That is a logic problem.

By no people having corrected my issue, and what is due. It can be said that what I post is thought to not have value to those that read it, since if it has value, then people would see that the smears were unjust. So either people are not reading it, and then they would not be 'injured' if I was angry, or they are seeing it and not doing the simple correction that is needed. Of coarse that would only be for those with more then they need.

That is also because I do not believe in separate realities, even though systems could be constructed that way, I don't accept that reality, and if that was the case those that construct that reality, or block thought from being heard, and from that construct also block correction, would be specifically to blame for any action of 'injury' or anger, from a thought.

So it isn't whining is it :) Funny thought, horses whine

Although I have no issues with Joe Biden, unless he has read my posts, and not corrected issues I mentioned regarding what is due, or if he does not have access to means of that correction, or I have no issue with him if he uses what skills he has to correct other important issues.

[Techn0Girl]

263. So I'm guessing that "Biden in '16" ... probably not looking too great right now.

Yah.

[on point]

271. So they hear us, but just don't get the message

Dems:

Get a backbone
Stop compromising with lousy repuke policies and moving ever more to the right
Start representing people instead of corps
Do the hard work that is needed to save this country from disaster


Healthcare was a failure because there was no public option
Climate change will be a failure if it doesn't include at a minimum cap and trade (the market based compromise solution to outright regulation or Carbon taxes)
Restore fiscal balance by going back to at least clinton era tax rates for th wealthy, especially raise restore same rates to capital gains, dividends and income
Restore regulations on financial industries

and a host of other things.

That's not a whine you hear. That is wheels coming off the bus if you don't get your act in gear

[Name removed]

275. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

276. Sen. Biden (Citibank - Del.)

[Skidmore]

280. He's absolutely right.

[WVRICK13]

281. What He Really Means

is stop thinking or we will be pissed off. He is the one whining.

[florida08]

282. if they want lockstep

loyalty they should become republicans..but who they should be castigating are the democrats who are not owning health care and actually running ads against it. How does this administration expect unwavering support from it's constituency when they can't even get it from their own representatives? Get the bluedogs in line then come talk to us.

[cstanleytech]

295. I do not believe that is what is asking for but rather

he is saying in essence they need people to realize that the complaining, whining or whatever you want to call it is not helping the president but rather its weakening him further.
Its just to bad he didnt phrase it better like for example by saying "Look, we have been in office barely 2 years and the president and myself have found that we cannot undo all the damage the past administration caused as fast as we hoped (mostly due to the obstruction from the republicans) so please remain calm, stay strong and show up to vote so we can be given the time and resources we need in order to fix these problems."

[Zenlitened]

345. "Get the bluedogs in line then come talk to us. "

Bam! :thumbsup:

[W_HAMILTON]

284. Can you image a Republican talking down to their base like this?

It's ridiculous.

If Democrats went after Republicans like they do their own fucking base, they might not be in such a precarious spot right now.

[DailyGrind51]

288. "If you think,WE are lousy, just look at THOSE guys!" Winning strategy?

[druidity33]

289. He-e-ey Joe...

"Where you goin' with that gun in your hand..."

:(

[DainBramaged]

296. Bullshit

Fuck this.

[Vinca]

298. And I t hought I was pissed off yesterday.

As a person suffering chronic pain who cannot afford the pre-existing pool, I'm going to whine nonstop if I feel like it. The only saving grace for Democrats this year is that they're not Republicans.

[myrna minx]

299. Wow. Nice GOTV strategy : Fuck you. Vote for us.

[bobburgster]

300. "Whine" wording takes away from Biden's message.

What is the headline now......."Biden tells liberal base: 'Stop whining'" which takes away from the important parts of his speech:

Biden said he understands the frustration among the electorate over the struggling economy, but Republican majorities in Congress would make matters even worse.

He ridiculed the House GOP's agenda as articulated in its "Pledge to America" released last week, saying it "calls for the elimination of everything from the FBI to child care and everything in between, literally,"

[AngryOldDem]

301. Then give us viable alternatives -- in other words, Democratic candidates!

As I've said here repeatedly, the Democratic Senatorial candidate in my state is a DINO of first order, especially as it comes to choice and gay rights.

Joe, I am DONE with holding my nose while voting. No more.

[TBF]

304. Biden's not only a whiner, he's dangerous -

as far as I'm concerned he can take his internet kill switch and crawl back under his rock.

[SHRED]

305. Pretty remarkable really

With corporatism running rampant in the Democratic Party, Biden once again says, "Go to Hell and vote for us".

We will stop "whining" when we have a political system that isn't run by big monied interests.

---

[SidDithers]

306. He's right...

Well said, Joe.

Sid

[Lost4words]

310. patsy dems & MBNA Joe,

gotta love them cause nobody else will

[LWolf]

307. Now THAT'S a strategy likely to inspire.

:sarcasm:

[Roland99]

309. "Stop whining" translates into a lot of "Stop voting" on our end

fucking idiots in charge.

[The Uncola]

312. Yeah.. sure.. insult me some more..

... that's a wonderful way to garner MY support.

Way to blow a movement out of water, Dems.

Epic.

[bc3000]

313. The Democratic Party, We Suck Slightly Less

Handing our nation's wealth over to corporations at a somewhat slower rate.

[LiberalEsto]

314. You nailed it!

My congressperson, Chris Van Hollen, ignored my letters asking that Democrats do something about unemployment. Yesterday I got a mailing from him inviting me to a $50-a-head fund-raising picnic.

As if I HAD $50 apiece for myself and my husband.

I've been out of work for a year and 11 months, and this type of "Let them eat cake" attitude I perceive in the Democratic Party is making me furious.

[The Uncola]

327. There ya go...

... ain't that the truth? I finally had to write back to the Tarryl Clark campaign to either stop hitting me up for donations I don't have, and quite likely will never have again, in every GD "update" they sent me, or be put into the spam list. And I REALLY LIKE Tarryl Clark and despise Bat**** Crazy Michelle Bachmann. I spoken with personally her and even Senator Franken, written more letters to Barack Obama than I can count, got involved in the Dem Caucuses all the way to the State Convention... and yet...

... my last Unemployment check came in February and job prospects for us in our mid 50s are, to put it mildly, bleak.

And from "my" political party? A view from under the bus and a hat in hand plea...

... and another "promise" that "This time, We REALLY mean it! We're gonna work for YOU!"

:puke:

[rainlillie]

315. If the thought of people like Paul , O'Donnell and Angle getting elected

Doesn't motivate you, I don't know what will. The republican-teabaggers are counting on us to sit this one out. We have to be smart about this.

[DirkGently]

318. Perhaps all the people telling other people to stop whining, could stop whining.

[RobertBlue]

321. Lol!

Very true.

[DirkGently]

334. Welcome to DU, Robert. Fairly new here myself. 8)

[Lucian]

320. We'll stop whining if they stopped acting like the goddamn Bush Administration.

[Cronus Protagonist]

322. He sounds like Steve Jobs

"Hold it right"

[h9socialist]

323. There's nothing wrong with self-criticism!

And going into THIS election it may end up being the saving grace.

[ThomThom]

325. He may call it whining and I may call it looking at the alternatives

I think we have improvement since the '04 election but some of us want to see more. This is not a time to give up and not vote, progressives need to keep moving forward. Even though the DLC people don't want to hear it, progressives need to hang in there. The worst alternative would be republicans back in charge but progressives need to realize that we still have work to do to move the Democrats to the left. Getting a Democratic majority was only a start, there is more work to be done. The media is pushing these ideas that republicans are going to gain control with their poll numbers. I think that is to cover up the election fraud that will take place again this election, so like last time we need to call them on it, be ready for it and vote in numbers too big to steal. But not being sensitive and calling us whiners is not helpful Mr Biden, you need our support so act like it.

[Javaman]

329. Telling people to "stop whining" usually doesn't win you friends.

try again, Joe.

[meow mix]

330. whining must be a popular write-in candidate.

no representation after all our work. whats he expect

[tavalon]

331. I'm very relieved to see this on the front page

The thread I was posting in last night got locked and I got nervous. But it was obviously that thread and not open discussion that was deleted.

Now a note to VP Biden. You are our lovable VP who says things without thinking. Mostly, don't stop that. Except now.

[Raffi Ella]

332. I agree with him.

Republicans fight and fight and then fight some more, No.Matter.What. Doesn't matter what their leaders do, just so they're in power.

They're relentless. They're also criminals. They want us to be beaten down and demoralized and the ultimate victory for them is Democrats staying home on November 2nd.

Sorry, but I am not handing them that victory, fuck that, FUCK THEM. My ass will be at the polls November 2nd. You can bet your last dollar on that.


If for nothing else other than that VOTE on November 2nd.

[flyarm]

340. hey Joe, about your Blue Dogs..why were you in BOSTON raising money for Blanche Lincoln?

I was just in Boston and I heard this in a Cab on the radio news..and I didn't believe it, so when I got home I looked it up and ..this is what Google showed me.........


Biden to help Democrat in need of assistance – CNN Political ...
Sep 22, 2010 ... Blanche Lincoln. Washington (CNN) - Vice President Joe Biden ... Why are they having a fund raiser for the Senate candidate for Arkansas in Boston? ... Leave it to Biden to go to Massachusetts to "help out" (snicker) a ...

politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/09/22/biden-to-hel... - Similar
Joe Biden brings in big bucks for Democrats - BostonHerald.com
Sep 23, 2010 ... Vice President Joe Biden blew into town yesterday to help raise roughly ... show of fund-raising might by the Bay State's Democratic elite. ... Blanche Lincoln, a two-term Arkansas Democrat facing a bitter re-election fight. ... But even here (in Massachusetts) we are seeing that trend could fade,” ...

news.bostonherald.com/news/politics/view/20100923joe_biden... - Similar


Hey Joe , if we dems knew Blanche was bad for Arkansas, but you and this administration thought it was so important for her to win the primary..so much so, that you called Dems Retards..like Move-on and the Unions because they tried to replace this blue dog..through the Primary system and process, why did you have to take Blanche Lincoln to Boston Mass to fund raise???????????? Why Joe, are you bleeding money from NE candidates for Blanche Lincoln???????? What's the problem Joe..Blanche can't get money from her own state?????????

Hey Joe, I remember very vividly when you and the Dem's fucked with my state's Primary as well..we Dem's IN Fla will not forget what you did to our Primary votes in 2008..over 2 million of those votes.

Now you want to call us Whiners????????

You have a hell of alot of nerve!

The blame for any losses in NOV will be at your and this Congress and this administrations feet!

Stop blaming and start ACTING like what Dem's have a history of doing..working for the people!!!!!!!

And shit can this NEW DEMOCRATIC PARTY /DLC bullshit.

Or you will be responsibile for and have minorities for a very very long time!

[Dr.Phool]

359. Just in time for my absentee ballot that arrived yesterday.

Hey Joe!

That member of The New Democrat Coalition, that you were down here fundraising for last week? He didn't get my vote. Everything else was a straight Dem ticket.

[flyarm]

366. I await mine! ..that is all I will say about it. But I can assure you and anyone who knows me..

I owe no one anything! Except my family and loved ones.

I have never felt like that before..I have always worked within the Dem party for others not as lucky as my family..I have worked to bring others up to a higher standard of living and security.

That makes me sad.

But when my Party OF THE PEOPLE , continue to crush the middle class and then sic bullies on those of us who have worked hard for the betterment of others and demonetize those who have spent a lifetime working for others..I am done!

When I see people in my own party say the despicable words..with us or against us..they can go royally fuck themselves!

Or call those with concerns for the people... retards..or a litany of names..when My party for "the people" has bailed out no one but the crooks who robbed the people..they can go fuck themselves!

...and now we are whiners...well they better damn well get used to it..stay the fuck out of the kitchen..if you don't want to feel the heat ..when you are fucking we the people!

I am damn sick and tired of the people being held accountable and losing homes and security and retirements, and can't take their kids to doctors, and can't buy their meds....when I see neighbors who are CEO's and Wall Street'ers who have been lifelong republicans..lifelong avid sickening republicans give money to Obama and helped put Obama into office ..get the bailouts! And now they have turned their Back on Obama.

Lifelong rabid republican Wall Street guys and Ceo's don't become democrats and donate to democrats, unless they expect a big damn payout! and pay off!

But now we the people are being called Whiners????????

Fuck off Joe Biden..go after the credit card companies and corporations and Bankers you shielded in your state of Delaware JOE!!!!!!!!!!!! Or the Wall street boys and Bankers you bailed out and have now turned on you!

[creon]

341. it ain't easy

Most presidents end up disappointing their suppoters, with a few exceptions. Obama is no different. The Democratic party is divided between blue dogs and progressives. Where I live, any Democrat who is elected will be a blue dog Democrat. A few of the progressive persuasion may be elected from a Houston or San Antonio. But that is about all. The Democratic party cannot get a majority without Blue Dog Democrats. These two wings will have to learn to work together. It is not necessary that they do so. If they decide not to work together, the country will survive.


Obama has to work with the Democratic Party majority in Congress that he has; and if progressives want progressive legislation passed, progressives will have to see to it that progressives are a majority in Congress.

[Zenlitened]

350. Many progressives have worked hard to create a progressive majority...

... but feel they have been stymied by the Obama Admin itself this year.

[creon]

405. I know it.

In my district - which is safe GOP - a progressive could not be elected. If a Democrat is ever elected, it will be a blue dog Democrat.

If I read Obama accurately, he does not believe in radical reform. He wants to work within the system and make deals, thus taking what he can get. To use a word from the sixties, he is part of "the establishment".

So, yes, he does stymie the progressives. He is not about to push the limits.

[Uncle Joe]

342. That's how you sell a house.

If a potentiial buyer complains because there are only two bedrooms instead of three or there are too many stairs, or the house is next to a dump, you just tell those buyers to stop their whining and sign the damned contract.

It works every time.

Thanks for the thread, kpete.

[Fumesucker]

347. It works selling cars too..

If the customer complains that the paint is faded and scratched you tell them to quit whining.

If they complain that the engine smokes and has a loud knock you tell them to quit whining and pull out the checkbook.

If they complain that the interior smells and looks like a family of opossums have been nesting in it you tell them to quit whining and buy the fucking car already.

[Pisces]

343. I agree with his sentiment. It grates on the nerves when people act like children

who didn't get all of the cake and candy they wanted. Real legislation is a boring, long, hard slog. So many on this board are all about instant gratification it boggles the mind. It is almost like we wish the Repukes would win, so that we could have a common bad guy to berate.

[Desertrose]

346. So, those of us who want more are whining children?

Didn't get their "cake & candy"?

"Instant gratification"?

Really?

Wow.

[flyarm]

354. and who is acting like children? Children through history have had to deal with bullies..

bullies who call them names ...bullies who attempt to corner the weaker child..

Bullies who berate the weaker child..

Until the weaker child stands up to the Bully, the Bullies tactics get stupider and more vocal and nastier


Until the weaker child lets the bully have it with all the weaker child has..and lashes back..

Making the Bully impotent!!!!!!!!

The only people I see being childish are those who are running This Administration and This Congress and This Senate and those who are working for them and that they have surrounded themselves with , and those working for them on the internet. And they are bullies.

No one likes bullies and no one has sympathy for Bullies..and people behaving like bullies are the most childish of all!

[Zenlitened]

357. Hmmm... how many instants are there in, say, three decades? In four? In five?

You seem to forget that many people here have been actively participating Democrats for most of their lives.

They have many, many years under their belts, promoting liberal ideals and pushing for progressive legislation.

Not to mention putting Democrats into office.

They know "boring, long slog" as well as anybody.

Unfortunately, from what I can see here in Massachusetts, many of them are just bone-weary tired of fighting.

When they discover that the fight is with their own party now, it's demoralizing.

And calling them whiners, or spoiled or petulant or childish or any of the other put-downs implied by the term... well, that's not helping, either.

[flyarm]

360. cake and candy ??? how about lifelong jobs and security, and losing homes and losing everything

people have worked lifetimes for , like pensions and retirement investments and 401 K's that aren't worth shit now. And not being able to send one's kids to college because you have lost all the investments you made, RESPONSIBILY to put your kids through school or for a safety net and security for your family!!!. Or how about living on the Gulf and seeing BP running our lives and our FAA and our Coast Guard, and our government MIA when you see eveything you worked for going to hell in a hand basket!

If you are young , which I believe you to be by your post..You have much growing up to do ..and you need a serious class in empathy for your fellow Americans!

Maybe you and Joe can go to a class together to learn empathy and tact and adult behavior and a little sympathy for those who have lost everything they have worked responsibily for lifetimes for!
Perhaps you could make a trip to Detroit...it would be extremely eyes opening for you and perhaps a little growing up would do you good!

People are suffering in this nation..seriously suffering..they don't want "CAKE AND CANDY"..THEY WANT SOLUTIONS AND THEY WANT ACCOUNTABILITY OF THOSE WHO DID THIS BULLSHIT TO THEM..NOT BAILOUTS FOR THE CROOKS!And they do not want to see any administration turn over our security and our services to a Foreign Oil Corporation, that is fucking them at turn..and the people are fucking sick and tired of the damn cover ups of these corporations and politicians! People want consequences for the crooks..but all they see is themselves getting fucked and the crooks getting bailouts!

If you don't understand that..then again I say , you have alot of growing up to do!

[The Uncola]

364. Ya know what ...

..."grates on the nerves" for me. Having my supposed allies call me a whiner because I'm tired of being lied to, condescended to, and left without even a bit of hope that they actually give a flying fuck about me and mine. (Well, 'cept when it comes to pass the collection plate around, that is.)

[defendandprotect]

372. Americans who want MEDICARE FOR ALL are "acting like childrern" ....

-- Medical care is "cake and candy" -- ???

Real legislaton depends upon separating the corporates from the non-corporates!!

Rather it looks like Obama/Biden are working for the Repukes to win -- !!

Then they wouldn't have to be searching for alibis and excuses as to why they are

only pushing thru pro-corporate solutions!!

We need a new Democratic presidential candidate in 2012 -- a liberal/progressive

who doesn't see the public wanting MEDICARE FOR ALL as a threat to corporate-welfare --

and a threat to PRIVATIZED medicine in America!

Here's Rahm "crowing" about having kept a PRIVATIZED health care system in place for

the benefit of business . . . !!!



Here ya go --

Rahm CROWING about keeping "privatized health care system in place" --


Here is the quote: ”In a Thursday interview, White House chief of staff Rahm Emanuel argued that rather than recoiling against Obama, business leaders should be grateful for his support on at least a half-dozen counts: his advocacy of greater international trade and education reform open markets despite union skepticism; his rejection of calls from some quarters to nationalize banks during the financial meltdown; the rescue of the automobile industry; the fact that the overhaul of health care preserved the private delivery system; the fact that billions in the stimulus package benefited business with lucrative new contracts, and that financial regulation reform will take away the uncertainty that existed with a broken, pre-crash regulatory apparatus.

http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=B2F85DDF-18...

and other corporate favors carried out by Obama --


Is this really what you voted for?

It certainly isn't what I voted for -- !!

[flyarm]

379. It is CHILDREN that equate losing ones home, and job and security to "Cake and Candy"!

or very irresponsible people who have a sick agenda, or a very misplaced high opinion of themselves..since they only give a shit about themselves.

That is not What Democrats have stood for, for the 40 years I have been a member of this party! We used to be a party for the People!

Not so much anymore..or even at all anymore!

When i see comments like this , and these comments are allowed to stay on a Democratic message board, when real great comments are deleted, I just wonder ..who are these people?? They are not people I have stood side by side with for 40 years trying desperately help other Democrats better themselves and lend helping hands to others that needed those hands.

These are not democrats I walked into Voting places with, to protect their voting rights and votes. They are not from neighborhoods of people, with so little, that opened Piggy Banks, to give what they could, to get Democrats into office. They are not little grandmas who held my face with tears in their eyes in Iowa and could only offer hot coco.. but wanted me in their home to tell me why they needed Democrats and what hopes they had..they weren't hopes of "CAKE OR CANDY"... or people of South Carolina, or Florida who were so hurting and so hopeful to see democrats get into office they gave pennies..but the last pennies they had to try to get the help they needed..from Democrats.

They did not want "CAKE OR CANDY"! They wanted to save their Democracy from the very crooks we have now been sold out to!

They wanted Health Care, they wanted the medicines, that they need, but can not afford, they wanted a better life for their children, they wanted fairness..they wanted to keep their homes that are now being taken from them...from the very people their tax dollars bailed out!

I never forget those people..people who wanted so little..but cared so much about their democracy..people who need so much, but cared about others more than themselves!

That is what being a Democrat is to me. Not calling others names, and acting like children telling those hurting ..all they want is Cake and Candy.

[Hekate]

349. Truth-teller Biden, as always. I love the guy.

[snooper2]

351. stop whining? But then you would have 100's of DU'ers with nothing to do

Oh Noes! :rofl:







It would be a tramagedy



:rofl:

[krabigirl]

353. The democratic party is a conservative party..the republican party is batshit insane. :(

[hulka38]

361. The party leadership is demanding fealty

from the liberal/progressive base while simultaneously shifting the blame for an election day disaster onto those very same people. This administration has had ample time to demonstrate what they stand for and they need to understand, I owe nothing to people who protect the establishment that is doing America harm.

[flyarm]

363. +++++++++++++++!!

[librechik]

365. So, are you going to punish Biden by letting Republicans win?

Don't you think if we came back with 65 Dems in the Senate that might be a more effective solution? (hypothetically) But I would try for that one rather than get my feelings hurt by Biden's poor choice of words and let the country go to hell. Just me.

[hulka38]

382. "...letting Republicans win"

What the VP, the P, and the feckless senate have done or not done has more to do with letting the Republicans win than anything I could do.

[Joey Liberal]

367. This is what I get for defending Obama?

Hey Biden, you guys have failed, not us. I guess I won't be voting at all this November and in 2012....

[defendandprotect]

371. Agree with your feelings ... but "not voting" won't get rid of even one Republican....

and it almost looks as though Obama/Biden are working to elect Repugs!!???

We have a huge liberal/progressive voting bloc -- let's use it!!

If we knock out the GOP this round we'd only then have the devil we know to

deal with!

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/defendandprotect

[sonomak]

368. Kick the hippies harder, maybe they'll vote

----- NOT ----

[Name removed]

376. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[flyarm]

377. Howard Dean is speaking out as you have ...

but he who brought Obama to office and a Democratic majority ..gets his cajones cut off here now too!

Howard Dean:

Addressing a telling moment in the health care debate, when White House Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel (a frequent Dean critic) called out progressive activists for running ads against conservative Democrats, Berman asked the former DNC Chair for his reaction.



"I'm not looking to pick another fight with Rahm Emanuel, but the contempt with which he held the progressive wing of the party was devastating and incredibly demoralizing," Dean said. "That's basically saying to your own people -- you got us here, now FU."



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/09/28/dean-called-ra...

[CoffeeCat]

380. Republicans would never talk this way to their base...

The only logical solution is that they are trying to further alienate us.

They don't want or need our votes, obviously.

The corporatocracy wants a Republican Congress and a Democratic President--so they
have a reason to blame each other when the will of the people is disregarded.

When corporate greed rules the day, Republicans can point to the big, bad, evil
Democratic President; and the Democrats can point to the big, bad, evil Republican
Congress.

[The Uncola]

383. Sadly...

... that looks more like the reality of why, each and every day. Problem for me is, I don't see how as I can do a damn thing about it. I'm left to choose between those that lie and say they'll help me and those that make it clear that they don't give a shit if I starve. (or a third party that stands zero chance) I guess it'll take having the crazies take over the asylum for a while, before it will get through to some people.

[GOTV]

381. "Stop whining" Biden whined

Maybe the Obama admin should do something to actually win their base rather than whining about the lack of enthusiasm from their base.

[OZark Dem]

384. Dear Joe

Sober up and look around.

[caraher]

386. Whining or not, it's just dumb to call it that

You want people to act, right? Why not simply say,

Democrats should "remind our base constituency look at the alternatives. This president has done an incredible job."

Talking about "whining" is simply counterproductive and pisses off some of the people you're trying to energize.

[h9socialist]

393. Biden is correct . . .

Here are three truths:

1. Obama has come up short on some key issues near and dear to the American Left.

2. The Right Wing is still out there and relishes this sort of division in the Left.

3. If we don't stop the in-fighting, we're going to have a much bigger problem than we have now.

Having said that I agree that Obama needs to produce more, and that the Left (which I have been a loyalist of for the past 40+ years) needs to stop whining and get back in the game. Believe it or not, there's a reason for not wanting the Republicans back in power on Capitol Hill. Unless anyone has a brilliant idea for creating a social democratic majority in Washington REALLY FAST, we're best advised to actually consider the alternative. At least that far I agree with Biden.

[kath]

395. Hey, Joe - BITE ME.

[liberation]

396. Technically, isn't Mr. Biden the one "whining" in this case?

I take this administration feels they have a monopoly on whining and only they can do it?

BTW, doesn't anyone find it ironic this administration keeps begging that the gun powder be kept dry when it comes to the GOP, but has no issues whatsoever shooting warning shots against their own base? It would be funny if it weren't for all that "dreamy" and now obviously bullshit rhetoric a certain Mr. Obama kept parroting about welcoming criticism. Given the thin skin nature of this administration regarding criticism from the left, it is obvious... that at least when it comes to progressive issues there is a clear divide between this administration's rhetoric and their actions.


I am fed up that the only time these idiots grow a spine is when it comes to preserve their own jobs come election time. then the tough talk emerges all of the sudden. But when it comes to actually fight for the people, spina bifida all the way.... Whatever.

[MrMickeysMom]

397. This president maybe has done an incredible job, but -

...when you read Bob Woodwards' new book, it appears you'll hear how this administration was intimidated into allowing the "only" options as to how to deploy troops for the Afghanistan "strategy".

IOW, he was lied to and he was intimidated and in the interim, we've been lied to and been accused of being "wimps".

Mr. VP, STFU.

Thank you.

[TNLib]

398. Way to Energize the Base!!

Because I love it when the administration calls me whinny, Retarded ect.. I want to run out right now and vote (D)
:sarcasm:

[Fearless]

400. Then the Dems can stop whining when the election doesn't go the way they want.

[EndElectoral]

401. I've voted Dem since JFK, but this kind of insult toward the base is offensive.

If only they lambasted Republicans with the same fervor they seem to relish bashing the Progressive base.

I've looked at this long and hard, and I just cannot vote for this adminstration any longer. I will support true Democrats like Grayson or Feingold, but I have to ask myself are these people really representing what I voted for, and the answer is no.

So this brings up the next ultimatum I am presented..."yes, yes, but look at the alternative, stop whining, the Repubs are much worse than us."

I just can't swallow that stuff anymore. I want to vote FOR someone, NOT against someone. I will march, I will support true Democrats, but I cannot and will not support an administration that continually insults me while catering to corporations and Republicans. Doesn't mean I won't vote Democratic, just sick of having my vote taken for granted. I'll vote the person, not the party going forward, and if there is no person on the ballot I can honestly vote for, I'll write one in.

What the hell is the matter with Biden? Why doesn't he launch into this unswerving Republican Congress that has stymied any progressive change almost unanimously? Why doesn't he lambast the hate speech of the right wing groups that this Republican congress embraces? Why doesn't he keep reminding people it is not the progressive left that got us into this mess, but the Republican nutcases supported by the Chamber of Commerce and most of Wall Street?

I'm sorry to be ranting, but I get this pit in my stomach when I read this stuff every week or so. At some point enough is enough.

[MissDeeds]

403. Excellent post

This should be an OP and have its own thread. I agree with every word you wrote and feel your frustration. In the last election, I voted against McCain-Palin more than for Obama. I had huge misgivings about Obama, and never in my life have I been so sorry to be proven right. This administration is not what the party or the country needs. True, it's better than the alternative, but better than the worst case scenario is not good enough. We used to set the bar higher than that. 'Better than' is simply not good enough.

I will vote Dem in the next election, as I have all my life, but this time I will likely write in the name of a Democrat that exemplifies the true, time honored ideals of the party. This dem-lite, conserva-dem party is not going to win my vote. Never again will I settle for 'better than'. I want the real deal.

[defendandprotect]

408. Great post .... but ....

sadly -- as we've seen for 40 years or more now -- our only choice remains again

voting AGAINST Republicans!! I'm certainly not looking at it as voting FOR Democrats!!

I'm as disgusted as you are --

But we began this push to the LEFT in '06 -- and I don't see abandoning it now ...

Otoh, if someone wants to tell me that a huge bloc of liberals/progressives are coming

together to IN UNISON move in a particular direction, I'd be with them. I'd love to hear it!!


We need more rants like yours!!

And much more discussion of this cause I don't see how NOT voting against Republicans

moves us to the LEFT in any way?

Let's keep talking!!

:)

[gkhouston]

409. I agree, your post *should* be an OP. n/t

[flyarm]

412. Excellent post! Thank you . n/t

[Shell Beau]

402. So basically shut up? Nope. Not gonna happen.

I can still support who is the best of the choices I have offered and NOT shut up.

[ncteechur]

404. HELL YES!

VP is absolutely correct.

[DailyGrind51]

415. "We are becoming a nation of whiners!" Phil Graham

And THEY lost, Joe!