Fire departments in rural communities

[dalaigh lllama]

I lived in a rural community for 25 years and we had a volunteer fire department. It was volunteer because any extra monies the city managed to collect went for fire fighting equipment. Everyone who lived within the city limits paid for these services with property taxes. Everyone outside the city limits could not be forced to pay, as they were outside of the city's jurisdiction, but if they wanted the protection, they paid a fee. The city depended on those extra fees along with the city taxes just to maintain the equipment. Now what do you think would happen if they responded to fires of those who hadn't paid their fees? No one would pay anything in the future because they'd know the fire department would come anyway. Anyone who has lived in a rural community knows this -- there just isn't the money for things like you'd have in a urban area.

In this case, it strikes me as analagous to someone who hasn't bothered to buy house insurance and then gets upset with the insurance company when they won't pay for their house getting blown away in a tornado. I understand it's upsetting the guy's house burned down, and it'd be another whole situation if someone had been trapped inside, but I just can't find it in me to be outraged at anyone in this situation except the doofus who was too cheap to pay his annual fee.

[VMI Dem]

1. Unrec.

[itsrobert]

2. Rec, well said

Right on the mark.

[Upton]

3. Exactly..

a lot of folks here have absolutely no idea how it is to live in a rural community.

[hayu_lol]

4. The same fire department was still responsible for the town...

their equipment came from. The uncontrolled fire spread to the neighbor's property and this fire unit put that fire out. The neighbor had paid the fee. They had a responsibility to take care of the neighbor.

Without the offer of providing service from the town in Kentucky, this rural area in Tennessee would not have had any fire service at all.

The town, some miles away, may rethink the program and discontinue it after this episode.

[LiberalArkie]

5. I agree totally. People in the city want to live in the country,

But in the country we don't have a lot of the services that they take for granted. I don't mind paying a little to help the volunteer fire dept at all, it is a small price to pay.

[Romulox]

6. Just an observation - many (not all) "rural" people refuse to pay their own way

My grandparents lived for 30 years in a "rural" part of Livingston County, Michigan. They weren't poor--far from it. But they are precisely the sort of people who would save $75 by not paying for fire protection.

Also, they are precisely the sort of people who would point the finger at their neighbors for not coming to their rescue after they consciously turned their back on any sense of community by refusing to pay the assessment in the first place.

[Stinky The Clown]

7. K&R

[OffWithTheirHeads]

8. If you are not willing to pay to support the commons including

the socialized roads, bridges, police, fire fighters, food inspection services, etc. DON'T USE THEM! Enjoy your life in libertarian world but if you are not willing to support your community, don't expect them to support you.

[Jim__]

9. I disagree with your analogy.

In this case, it's not like the insurance company refused to pay after the house was blown away in a tornado; it's more like the insurance company knew the tornado was going to hit this house, and because these people hadn't paid, refused to notify them. It's still not an exact match. But the issue here is preventing a tragedy that you know is going to happen rather than reimbursing someone for the tragedy that happened.

I'm not saying they should have put the fire out, but that it's a different issue than your analogy indicates.

[Kringle]

10. I just had a car wreck

who offers,
'after the fact' insurance?

[K8-EEE]

11. There were animals who burned in the fire

To me the obvious thing is to put out the fire and then charge the guy an inflated fee -- it's stupid and not cost effective to let it spread to another house and cruel that 3 dogs and a cat had to burn to death because of a $75 fee

[Upton]

18. The animal's welfare is the owner's responsibilty..

if he couldn't be bothered to pay a lousy $75 to protect them from fire, he shouldn't have had the animals to begin with.

[K8-EEE]

19. It's a stupid system because

If my neighbor doesn't pay the fee then hello, fires GROW! I would rather have it put out at their house then wait for it to spread to my house and then put it out....it's not only a cruel policy but stupid as well, IMO. I live in L.A. where we have massive firestorms every year so it's pretty inconceivalbe to me that you're going to let a fire burn and spread for administrative reasons. I guess that's your "real American heartland" values that Sarah's always braggin' on! Whatever! Just glad I don't live in such a god-forsaken place where people don't give a shit about their neighbors.

[MadHound]

12. I worked on a rural, volunteer fire department for a number of years

Yes, we charged a yearly fee to subscribers. However if a non-subscriber's house was burning down, we would fight those fires as well. But we would also bill that non-subscriber for the job that we did. Sometimes their insurance company would pay, sometimes they would pay out of their own pocket, rarely they wouldn't pay unless we took them to court.

But we did not let a single house, building or field simply burn down because they were non-subscribers. That's flat out wrong.

I now live in a rural country, protected by another rural fire department. They used to be a subscription fire department as well, until residents figured out that it was cheaper for their bottom line, due to insurance company ratings and rates, to have everybody pay through their county taxes. It is still a volunteer fire department, but it responds to everybody and everything.

Simply allowing a house to burn down because somebody had lapsed on their fees is unconscionable. You put the fire out first, then worry about the money, it's that simple.

[dalaigh lllama]

14. Everyone paying thru their county taxes is an excellent idea

Maybe that is the route this Tennessee county will go in the future. Sadly, an expensive lesson for all concerned.

[TexasObserver]

17. "Simply allowing a house to burn down because somebody had lapsed on their fees is unconscionable."

Absolutely!

I can't understand the lack of compassion and good sense being evidenced about this matter.

People get old, they get infirm, they get senile, and they just overlook things. Well meaning people can miss making such a payment. First you put out the fire, then you figure out if the homeowners owes any money for that help.

Thanks for speaking up.

[dalaigh lllama]

13. It'd be useful to have some extra information on this guy

If he'd always paid his fee until lately because someone in the home had lost their job, I'd probably be sympathetic to him.
But if he's never paid the fee because he's a cheap bastard, then my sympathy is wholly with the fire department.
I'd guess because this was a small community, they'd know which was the case.

[TexasObserver]

15. We don't do it that way, and ours works just fine.

I have a place on the lake a ways out of Houston. There's a small town and it is surrounded by subdivisions outside the city. The fire department is volunteer. It serves the entire community, and the firemen come from the entire area. All are volunteers. Some are real firemen who serve in Houston or College Station.

The city pays a certain amount each year to support the department. We have two fundraisers a year to supplement that.

There is no requirement that anyone pay anything to support the department. If there's a fire anywhere in the area, inside or outside the city, the department responds. Same for the paramedics, three of whom serve with departments in Houston or College Station. That's the way it should be. Stopping the spread of fires is everyone's business. Tending the emergency medicals needs is everyone's business. Helping less fortunate neighbors is part of being a neighbor.

This notion that everyone pays or they get no fire department support is a very bad one. What about the poor? What about the ignorant? What about the ill? What about the infirm? What about the senile?

Have a heart. It feels good to care about others.

[pipi_k]

16. I live in a rural community and our only ambulance service...

is one town over.

They do send out subscription requests and we've always paid them even though it states in the mailer that NOT paying the subscription will not affect service.

I actually had to call them one time in 1999 for Mr P. While waiting for them to arrive, I put on the scanner. I'm sure they don't run through the records to see if this or that family has paid the subscription fee before they respond to calls.

So even though nobody is required to pay a fee for service, there are still plenty of people who "donate".

But that's just here...

:shrug: