"It's not personal. It's just business." We've become "Godfather nation."

[villager]

My take on the meaning of the Tennessee fire "department" conflagration.

[Fumesucker]

1. What happens to a city resident who actually paid through taxes for the FD?

If the FD is out on a free call in the county and the city resident's home catches on fire?

They are SOL and you know it.

[villager]

2. "It's just business." As I was saying. Nothing more. Right?

n/t

[Fumesucker]

3. Government is now business?

I learn something new on DU every day..

[villager]

6. Evidently. When you advocate letting people in wheelchairs watch their homes burn, due to

potential "schedule conflicts" on the day's agenda.

[Fumesucker]

9. Why do you support the poor subsidizing the wealthy?

That is an essentially wingnut position..

And that's what this case is all about, a small poor city subsidizing a larger and wealthier county that's not even in the same damn state.

[villager]

14. no - you have the wingnut "let it burn if they don't pay" position

Just to be clear.

[Fumesucker]

16. The eventual upshot of providing services to those who refuse to pay..

Is that at some point no one will have the services, even those who are indeed paying, the city will go bankrupt and have to eliminate the FD.

[villager]

18. and the eventual upshot of only having "a la carte" services -- like police and fire

for those who pay individually is....?

[Fumesucker]

19. Pretty much like health care is right now..

You don't have the money you don't get the health care..

[villager]

20. So why do you support that in our "fire departments?"

:shrug:

[Fumesucker]

23. I don't..

I support the people of Olbion county paying taxes for their FD services..

But then I don't live or vote in Olbion county so my opinion on the subject is basically meaningless.

If the entire county does not pay for the FD though how can a much smaller and less wealthy population continue to subsidize them?

[rocktivity]

33. DING DING DING! Fumesucker, you're our grand prize winner!

I support the people of Olbion county paying taxes for their FD services...If the entire county does not pay for the FD, though how can a much smaller and less wealthy population continue to subsidize them?

It's that freaking simple. Since it's in the best interest of a county not to have their residents and property burning to a crisp under ANY circumstances, they should levy a fire or additional property tax to pay the cities that have fire protection services to provide them for the cities that don't. Duh!

:grr:
rocktivity

[WeekendWarrior]

28. Oh, fuck that

This isn't a business issue, it's a fucking HUMAN issue. You don't let a guy's house burn down.

PERIOD.

[Fumesucker]

29. So what happens when the city has to shut down the FD due to lack of funds?

Then all the houses can burn down, even those that belong to the people who were paying the taxes to fund the FD.

[WeekendWarrior]

31. That ISN'T going to happen

That's a slippery slope argument that's just bullshit. We're talking about a MAN AND HIS FAMILY who lost their home because a bunch of heartless assholes were worried about SEVENTY-FIVE DOLLARS.

It never should have happened to a citizen of this country. What if the guy didn't pay BECAUSE HE WAS POOR? Would that change your mind?

Or how about this -- would you feel the same way if he was your father? Your uncle?

It's easy for people to sit back and play games over this, but the BOTTOM LINE is that he is a human being WHOSE HOUSE WAS LEFT TO BURN DOWN.

Hope you sleep well.

[Fumesucker]

34. How do you know it's not going to happen?

Seriously, governments are shutting down services all over the country due to a lack of funds.

[TexasObserver]

4. recommend

[JVS]

5. Maybe we need more of the wisdom of Hyman Roth

"So when the house burned down, I let it go. And I said to myself, this is the level of coverage we've chosen!"

[villager]

7. +1! More wisdom for "Godfather nation!" as the conflation of insurance & fire depts.

...bears out the "just business" structure of society.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

8. Nicely played!

[JVS]

12. Thanks. It's one of my best friends' favorite quotations when stuck in the middle of an...

unpleasant task.

[Odin2005]

10. That amoral mentality PISSES ME OFF.

There is no such thing as "just business", you either do what is right or you are a fuckwad.

[Fumesucker]

11. The amoral mentality is the one that supports the poor subsidizing services for the wealthy..

And that's what this case is about when you get right down to brass tacks.

A small poor city and a much larger and wealthier county but the city is expected to provide fire protection through their taxes.

[Amonester]

13. If so, why would the wealthier county not be forced to pay taxes

(that should then be used to pay for a universal FD for all)

Even if they didn't want to? Or even if they would vote for not paying taxes?

Really?

On edit: forgot the 'why' word.
On second edit: 'why would the wealthier county not be forced to pay taxes

(tired of the inhumanity of that wacky-becky justifications fest on DU)

[Fumesucker]

15. There is no mechanism for that..

The city and the county aren't even in the same damn state.

How does a city in one state force residents in an entirely different state to pay taxes?

[Johonny]

17. well it was personal to me

[whistler162]

21. Yes on the part of the home owner and county

[asdjrocky]

22. Fuck you. Pay me.

Welcome to the new normal.

[Fumesucker]

24. Fuck you, I ain't paying shit, give me what I want anyway..

Welcome to the new normal.

[asdjrocky]

36. Really?

Hey, your house just burned down. I don't make the rules ya know.

[JVS]

25. Wait, isn't that from "Goodfellas"?

[asdjrocky]

35. Yes it is.

This is the new, improved Goodfellas America. I'm telling you, we should have never went into business with these guys.

[Whisp]

26. haha. Did you see You Got Mail last night too?

:)

[fishwax]

27. the republican idea that lower taxes are more important than public welfare is a sham

that's my take on the meaning of this particular event.

[JDPriestly]

30. Benjamin Franklin must be turning over in his grave thanks to the Tennesse fire department

Fire Department: In 1736, Benjamin Franklin started the first fire department ever. Located in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, it was called the Union Fire Company

http://library.thinkquest.org/22254/inventions.htm

http://www.vrml.k12.la.us/cc/vp_gle/4th/ela/firedept/benfire1.asp

n the 1884 book History of Philadelphia, 1609-1884, John Thomas Scharf and Thompson Westcott described the organization of the company:<3>

The Union Fire Company was an association for mutual assistance. Each member agreed to furnish, at his own expense, six leather buckets and two stout linen bags, each marked with his name and the name of the company, which he was to bring to every fire. The buckets were for carrying water to extinguish the flames, and the bags were to receive and hold property which was in danger, to save it from risk of theft. The members pledged themselves to repair to any place in danger upon an alarm of fire with their apparatus. Some were to superintend the use of the water, others were to stand at the doors of houses in danger, and to protect the property from theft. On an alarm of fire at night it was agreed that lights should be placed in the windows of houses of members near the fire "in order to prevent confusion, and to enable their friends to give them more speedy and effectual assistance.'

According to Scharf and Westcott, the company was limited to 30 members who met eight times a year and were fined if they were late to or missed a meeting. The company had no president, but a treasurer and a clerk, take in turns from the general membership, who not only managed communications with other members but also inspected the gear. Scharf and Westcott note that this structure was the basis for all fire companies in Philadelphia until the Revolutionary War. The early members of the Company included Isaac Paschal, Samuel Powell, William Rawle, and Samuel Syme.<3>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Union_Fire_Company

The Union Fire Company provided a free service to the community thanks to Benjamin Franklin's inspiration and guidance.

Of course, it is my understanding that Benjamin Franklin's famous experiments with a kite and lightening and his work with lightening rods were intended in part to put to rest the religious superstition that God struck houses with lightening in order to punish their owners/inhabitants. Before Franklin, they sometimes just let houses burn because they did not want to interfere with God's punishment.

I don't have a link for this last bit of information. I think I learned it from a documentary on Benjamin Franklin, one of my heroes.

[rocktivity]

32. The county should step in, levy a fire/extra property tax on everyone

and pay the cities for fire protection that way.

If this is what the Rethugs and teabaggers mean by a smaller government, Gene the Fire Department Victim may become our Joe The Plumber!

:headbang:
rocktivity