I hate to be a downer - I really do. But seeing that miner being rescued made me think

[CatWoman]

when was the last time we saw something so moving and spectacular in OUR country?

Seems American miners are treated like dirt. They are just left to rot and die.

[no_hypocrisy]

1. Maybe the rescue of Baby Jessica from the well in the Eighties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_McClure

[CatWoman]

23. that was amazing

thanks :)

I had forgotten about that :)

[sandnsea]

69. I think the PA mine rescue in 2002

Although these guys staying alive down there for 80 days puts this particular rescue in a whole other category.

http://www.9for9.org/

[Catherina]

2. I had the same sad thought Rec'd with sadness.

All our workers are treated like dirt.

To make things worse, the Chilean company is dirt broke but they still cared and managed.

[valerief]

3. How come it took so long to get them out? How did they get trapped to begin with? nt

[CBHagman]

15. Here's an article from LiveScience.

Granted, it is some weeks old, but it's one way to start looking at the story.

This whole mine disaster has received plenty of news coverage. Read the rest of the article at the link below and/or go to a newspaper, radio, or TV website for more stories.

http://www.livescience.com/environment/chilean-mine-collapse-rescue-efforts-100826.html

Two days after the roof of the mine collapsed and miners became trapped, rescue efforts hit a snag. Workers had been descending through a ventilation shaft toward a shelter, about 2,200 feet (670 meters) below the surface where the survivors were believed to be, when another cave-in blocked the shaft. The next day, Aug. 8, rescue workers began drilling bore holes, about 6 inches in diameter (15 centimeters), to locate survivors, according to Reuters.

On Aug. 22, more than two weeks after the initial collapse, the first bore hole reached the survivors, all 33 of them, who passed up a note, translated as: "The 33 of us in the shelter are well," according to Reuters. They received emergency rations and lights to stave off the darkness in the 540 square foot (50 square meter) room where they are living.

Rescuers plan to drill a hole, then widen it, so the miners can be pulled, one by one, to the surface, and they have estimated this could take three to four months, according to the BBC.

[valerief]

20. Thanks! So they were trapped due to the company's negligence.

"In 2007, an explosion in the San Jose mine is reported to have killed several workers. Prinera has said the mine should not have been reopened without an escape route, according to media reports."

And it took so long because the only means of escape was to drill rock, because there were no escape routes.

It is exciting for these guys to be finally freed from the bowels of hell. I wonder if the mine owner will be as accountable for this tragedy as BP was for the Gulf disaster. Which is not at all. That this will happen again and again is what's sad.

[gateley]

37. Well the CEO and company officials in Hungary are being charged with the toxic

spill - criminal charges, I think. I would like to see that happen to these company owners as well as the owners of our American coal mines.

[wisteria]

73. And, this mine will be closed and not used again. n/t

[valerief]

102. And they execute 'em in China. nt

[onenote]

4. can you give an example where American miners were "left to rot and die"?

I assume you have several.

[The Wielding Truth]

18. They weren't given a chance to survive. Deregulation at it's Republican finest!

http://ca.reuters.com/article/topNews/idCATRE6362B120100410

[onenote]

21. not what the poster said.

The poster suggested that when US miners are caught in an accident, they are left to rot and die. I'm still waiting for an example.

[CatWoman]

26. sorry, was away from the computer doing a chore

take your fucking pick

http://www.google.com/search?q=american+mining+deaths&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

[onenote]

30. I'll pick any of them. Not one that I see involved leaving surviving miners to "rot and die"

without a rescue attempt. Which is what the poster you seem to be defending said. You believe that? That US miners are left to rot and die when an accident occurs. A lot of brave people who enter damaged, dangerous mines with little to no hope of finding a survivor, probably would have an interesting reaction to that if you had the balls to say it to their face.

[valerief]

32. That a govt would allow workers to work in dangerous mines without

union protection so miners wouldn't face so many risks is pretty criminal.

[onenote]

45. I agree with you. But you're avoiding the topic of this subthread

rather than admit the obvious: the OP's claim that American miners are "left to rot and die" when an accident occurs is a load of crap.

[valerief]

100. Your concern about the OP rather than the miners is interesting, to say the least.

I understand why your name is onenote.

:rofl:

[malaise]

82. You do know that this mine had been closed down

and was 'beyond unsafe'.

[valerief]

101. Which mine? Not sure if you mean the Chilean mine the miners were working in or

a US coal mine.

[blondeatlast]

98. +1. nt

[Zax2me]

52. China has one of world's deadliest records for miners

So, you take YOUR fucking pick.
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/10/12/china.mining

http://www.google.com/#sclient=psy&hl=en&q=chinese+miner+deaths&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=6248f386b3c06fd8

[valerief]

109. In a few years, I'm sure we'll exceed them, thanks to electronic voting and foreign

corporations freedom of speech in elections here.

Cuz if you don't have to prove something is legal, then it might as well be illegal.

[crazyjoe]

111. hahahaha.....thanks man, it's been a long day, I needed a good laugh :-)

[gateley]

40. As AC was comparing this to the Massey tragedy, he commented that this was

transparent from the beginning and help was sought from around the world to rescue the workers. Massey, in contrast, kept information private and let erroneous information be spread. They may have not left them to "rot and die" but the effort - or lack of - expended to save the workers is striking in comparison.

[onenote]

51. Blankenship should be in jail. But to suggest little or no effort was made

to rescue the miners in that disaster is a woefully misinformed statement. Even though it was known immediately that most of the miners were dead and the chances that any of them had survived was slim, rescuers entered that dangerous, unstable mine pretty quickly, only to be forced back out by dangerous gas levels. But the effort continued and within four days, despite the extremely hazardous conditions, all of the bodies had been found. Little or no effort? What bullshit.

[malaise]

81. Excellent points

Mining firms don't get away with that 'privacy' crap in many parts of the world.

[CatWoman]

110. and just so you'll know

I caught Leo Gerard, President of United Steelworkers International, on Big Ed's radio show today.

He said, word for word, what I did in my original post.

He even took it a step further by explaining that he had lost family members in these type tragedies.

But hey, don't take my word for it.

You can listen to the podcast here: http://www.wegoted.com/archive/

Mr. Gerard also had several articles discussing this pubished at The Huffington Post.

[pinboy3niner]

5. Lenny Skutnik

In 1982 he dove into the icy waters of the Potomac when he saw that a passenger from a plane that had crashed in the river was too weak to grab the line that was thrown to her from a rescue chopper.

[Stinky The Clown]

19. I've never seen anyone define "hero" like Lenny Skutnick

I remember that like it was yesterday.

[pinboy3niner]

29. I remember it well, too. He got her to shore, and she survived.

Hundreds of other people were watching form the river banks, but Skutnik was the only one who dared selflessly to plunge into those frigid waters to make a rescue attempt.

[Skittles]

41. lovely man

he just "couldn't stand it", watching that poor gal struggle - she had lost her husband and baby in the crash, was blinded by the jet fuel floating on the water and exhausted from hypothermia - she was going down when Lenny jumped in :thumbsup:

[Cleanelec]

95. Don't forget the true hero that day, Arland D. Williams, Jr.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arland_D._Williams,_Jr.

[pinboy3niner]

96. Good addition

Welcome to DU, Cleanelec! :hi:

[Cleanelec]

106. Thank you

for the welcome.

[myrna minx]

103. I remember him. Thank you for posting this.

:cry:

[Cleanelec]

107. Sara Hickman wrote and performed this song in honor

Last Man in the WaterOnce upon a time, I had a day
Seemed everything was going my way
I was the type who did believe
It couldn't happen to me
Looking back on how it all got started
I never knew I'd be so open-hearted
Here's the part of the story where I have to say
My life will never be the same
Oh oh, oh oh

Here underneath the water
I can see
Here underneath the water
I'm finally free

I was the last man in the water
I was the one who saved your
Sons and daughters
And when they finally sent down
The last shred of rope
I saw my last hope wave goodbye

I barely even had time think
I just sat down and I just got my drink
I heard an awful sound
And the world caught fire
Freezing water swirling all around
I saw it pull a young couple down
My body cold, my fingers numb
Revelations for everyone

Here underneath the water
I can see
Here underneath the water
Life's bigger than me

I was the last man in the water
I was the one who saved your
Sons and daughters
And when they finally sent down
The last shred of rope
I saw my last hope wave goodbye

What would you do in shoes?
When you've got everything to lose?
I gave away my sweet, sweet right to life
But I don't regret this final sacrifice

There was maybe four or five of us
Three began to pray, one began to cuss
Who knew who'd be saved, and who was through?
And time was ticking, man, it sure can fly
When life is passing before your eyes
You realize what you have got to do

So you become the last man in the water
Yeah, youre the one who saves the
Sons and daughters
And when they finally send down
The last shred of rope
You'll see your last hope wave goodbye

Last man in the water
I was the one who saved your
Sons and daughters
And when they finally sent down
The last shred of rope
I saw my last hope wave goodbye

[nonconformist]

6. Quecreek mine rescue in Pennsylvania, 2002. All 9 miners rescued.

[CBHagman]

16. How fast people forget!

Thanks for mentioning that one.

[wisteria]

74. I remember this rescue-it was also a joy to see the miners rescued.

Unfortunately, it was on of the few events in America that ended happily. Remember the miners in I think was West Virginia who were first all reported alive and then it had to be reported that only one survived and he wasn't in great shape?

[CBR]

88. Thanks for the reminder. nt

[tridim]

7. It's a World-wide effort. Good karma for ALL human kind.

[tnlefty]

8. Miners here are treated like less than dirt...

but you knew that. I'll try to watch some of it. :hi:

[valerief]

9. The brave 9-11 rescue workers who got shit on by our govt. nt

[demmiblue]

27. Absolutely. n/t

[tularetom]

10. Remember that fat bastard who owned the mine in Utah I think it was

There was a cave in and a bunch of miners trapped in there and all this guy did was stand in front of the cameras and insist that the whole thing wasn't his fault.

And nobody in our liberal media, or the government regulatory agencies, even questioned the asshole.

[Radical Activist]

13. Blankenship.

He should be in prison.

[onenote]

25. not sure if you're talking about the Crandall mine disaster in Utah in 2007

or the Upper Big Branch mine disaster in West Virginia earlier this year. While the actions of the owners of those mines were indefensible in allowing conditions to exist where the disaster could occur, suggesting that no one tried to rescue the miners in that case is crap. In both instances, it was pretty clear from the outset that no one had survived; yet rescue/recovery efforts were undertaken by some very brave people who put themselves at risk notwithstanding the virtual certainty that there were no survivors. And in the Crandall mine case, three of those rescuers ended up dying.

THe claim that efforts aren't made to rescue trapped miners in the US is crap.

[tularetom]

65. I don't think I suggested that nobody tried to rescue those miners

What I said was the mine OWNER stood in front of the cameras day after day denying that he had anything to do with the incident.

Reading things into a post that aren't there is crap.

[onenote]

78. I was merely reasserting what I had said in my original post.

[tridim]

11. Sully's landing was pretty spectacular.

[wisteria]

75. Yes, that was wonderful too. n/t

[ecstatic]

86. That's what I was thinking nt

[CBR]

91. That was amazing. Thanks. nt

[Radical Activist]

12. Coal mining is obsolete.

We have better ways to make most of our energy now.

[alphafemale]

14. We just cut the tops off mountains now. nt

[babylonsister]

17. No. These guys found a place to stay alive. So many times

that doesn't happen, in Chile and the US, I'm thinking. That's why this is so impressive, not because we don't try.

[HEyHEY]

22. Uh, talk to a Chinese miner

[proteus_lives]

34. Hey, stop trying to mess-up a "America sucks" thread.

It's tradition around some parts.

[CatWoman]

42. I'm sorry if I gave you that impression

let me rephrase that - that was not my intention.

After watching the contrast between the recent mine fatalities here and the rescue in Chile, I formed an opinion.

That's just what this is -- "MY" opinion.

[proteus_lives]

47. I'm sorry if I'm too sensitive sometimes.

But I see so much pointless bashing around here. Sometimes it gets to me.

[CatWoman]

57. which is why these days I severly limit my time here

[proteus_lives]

60. I can see the wisdom of that.

DU is like a drug for me. I work from home a lot and it's hard not to keep a DU window open.

[flamingdem]

24. You can credit two Americans with making it happen, one broke through the last part

They were in Afganistan drilling for water and went to Chile. We can be happy about that.

[The Wielding Truth]

105. I was wondering if any US help was there. I am so glad we did our part.

[demmiblue]

28. The countless individuals and countries that TRIED to help in the immediate Katrina aftermath,

but were turned away by our dipshit government.

[OHdem10]

31. Only a few years back in Pa we had a similar circumstance in which

they brought our miners to safety.

It was an American(USA) who was drilling the opening
that was used to bring them out.

People from NASA went down to work with them on working
with people confined for long periods of time.

Yes, we have had successful rescues. You have to have
reason to believe they are alive.

[gateley]

44. The NASA folks are instrumental in this rescue as well. Very proud of them. nt

[proteus_lives]

33. Sully landing the plane.

[proteus_lives]

35. BTW:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9304386#9305540

[CatWoman]

38. ty Proteus

I didn't know that :)

[FrenchieCat]

36. Because it is only when something is happening outside of the US

that it isn't politicized.

If it would have taken American Miners 63 days to be rescued,
it would have been Obama's fault, and his approval rating
would have lost a point for each day they were down there.

That's the problem that we have here......
Americans rarely come together for anything now,
beyond carnarge and war. :(

[CatWoman]

39. right again Frenchie

takes me back to the Gulf Oil spill.

The right practically had Obama opening the gusher himself :(

[Greyhound]

43. You could have left out the word miner.

How many times and in how many ways do these assholes have to tell us that we don't matter to them before it finally sinks in?

[Crabby Appleton]

46. Jeff Hart of Denver and other US drillers from

Kansas City-based Layne Christensen Co using a US made Schramm T130 tophead drill rig and US made Center Rock drill bits drilled the hole they are rescuing the miners through.

[Abq_Sarah]

71. Shhhh..

You're not supposed to mention anything positive done by Americans.

[rtw]

85. Sorry, couldn't help adding this.

NASA designed the rescue capsule.

http://www.aolnews.com/world/article/to-design-miners-escape-pod-nasa-thought-small/19667140

Just seems like we could take 24 hours to enjoy and celebrate, or at least let all of the miners be rescued first.

[flvegan]

48. Morgan Spurlock did an excellent "30 Days" on coal mining.

I'll never view it the same way ever again.

And yeah, it's streaming live on Netflix if you've got it.

[proteus_lives]

62. Spurlock is great.

Love his stuff.

[boppers]

49. If you hate it, why do you do it? eom

[CatWoman]

58. perhaps because I felt like it

anything else?

[boppers]

64. Nah.

I guess you do things that you "hate", because you "felt like it".

:shrug:

[Renew Deal]

50. You're rooting for a mine disaster?

Your comment is uncharacteristically bizarre.

[demmiblue]

54. Talk about bizarre.

:wtf:

[treestar]

89. I think I get it

There's this concept that there is only heroism out of bad things - the post does come off as saying they are lucky they had a mine disaster, so that they got to prove how good they are. It being a disaster they are there in the first place is overlooked.

[CatWoman]

59. that's just silly

how in the world am I "rooting" for a mine disaster?

If anything, I was rooting for those who made it out alive.

In your effort to paint me and my comments as "bizarre", you've done exactly that to yourself.

[Dreamer Tatum]

53. Where are all of our trapped miners? If you have knowledge, PLEASE say something!

LIVES are on the line!

Oh, wait. You're desperate to run down your own country to make a point, and there isn't a single soul waiting to be rescued in the US.

Carry on.

:eyes:

[demmiblue]

55. Another bizarre response.

:wtf:

[Zax2me]

63. Not at all bizarre

The OP is very inflammatory and quite offensive to fire fighters, rescue workers and volunteers that risk their lives and work endless hours during mining emergency situations.
Some that likely are members here.
Yes, of course we can do better. No need to belittle, though.

[pnwmom]

68. No. When have we left miners to rot?

When we had the technology to get them out?

You do realize that a team of American engineers was down there with American technology, drilling the hole that made this rescue possible?

[CatWoman]

61. I'll light a candle for you

[Zax2me]

56. I think you missed a few simple facts -

Primarily, this one
China has one of world's deadliest records for miners
http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/asiapcf/10/12/china.mining

Our record may not be perfect, and needs to be improved - but you held up the worst possible example to compare to us.

[stevedeshazer]

66. CatWoman, you are 100% correct.

I'll stick up for you!

The Chilean people and their government deserve a lot of credit.

Good point.

[onenote]

79. so you believe that we make no effort to rescue miners?

you agree 100 percent that we leave our miners "to rot and die"?

Please provide an example.

[stevedeshazer]

92. Oh, fer cryin' out loud.

:spank:

Get a life.

[onenote]

97. I'll take that as a retraction of your support for the ridiculous statement by the OP

[awoke_in_2003]

67. People say a man is made out of mud...

a poor man's made out of muscle and blood, muscle and blood and skin and bones, a mind that's weak and a back that's strong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Joo90ZWrUkU

on edit: K&R

[MilesColtrane]

70. The Texas Rangers winning a post season series?

Well, it was moving and spectacular for me at least.

[wisteria]

72. I was thinking the same thing. Our country is to preoccupied with making profits rather than saving

lives. MSNBC had two of the miners on from the Quecreek rescue in 2002 and they seemed stunned the minors seemed so well,healthy and prepared for their ordeal. From what I have heard, mining is a big business in Chile and mining is considers a safe and good job. They get paid well. I can't say the same for our miners.

[B Calm]

76. A lot of the coal mine tragedies in this country are non union. You

would think the media could pick up on that fact!

[Obamanaut]

77. Instead of a downer, seeing the rescue made me think "How happy

the friends and family must be."

It's the glass thing - half empty/half full. One gets to choose how to react.

[malaise]

80. Interesting - we were discussing this early this morning

Firstly the political culture is very different - you'd never see the US President or the various Ministers as the most visual figures during the rescue.

Secondly safety conditions in most South American mines are even worse than those in the US. I lot of this theater is designed to obfuscate from the harsh reality that this mine should have remained closed.

Private companies in the US wouldn't allow the media so close to the operation and wouldn't spend this kind of money.

Don't forget though that the thousands of media covering this failed to show during the earthquake in Chile earlier this year because the then President represented the 'left' of Chile and now they have their millionaire right wing President.

This is wonderful to watch mostly because of the solidarity on behalf of the working class - now that is rare everywhere.

[blondeatlast]

93. +1 to all you say. Crandall Canyon in Utah is all too fresh in my memory. OTOH,

they were all dust "illegulz," so why should anyone care? :mad:

And if anyone thinks I'm not crazy happy seeing these miners get rescued, think again. I've been up most of the night sobbing up each time I see that capsule emerge!

[adamuu]

83. D-Day.

[MineralMan]

84. You have a very short memory, it seems.

[treestar]

87. You've got a short memory. What about the heroism after 911?

It's not a good thing that these miners were trapped in the first place, to make it into something wonderful they were rescued.

What of the people who did good things during Katrina? Whenever there is a problem in this country, good people show up, too.

Further we helped others, such as after the Earthquake in Haiti, which is just one example of that.

[seabeyond]

90. wow... du. dsigusting. nt

[JVS]

94. 2002

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quecreek_Mine_Rescue

[swilton]

99. I have thought the same thing

If they can do this in Chile - why can't they do it here?

[DainBramaged]

104. If they were Satan worshipers, they would be praised here.

[Brickbat]

108. While I understand mining is never predictable, much more prevention could have gone into this, and

many other industrial accidents. If this much money was put into operations and safety BEFORE a catastrophe happens, we wouldn't have to worry about crap like this -- the miners would be a lot better off, and the company would still make money.