Obama administration blasts California's pot legalization measure. Might sue to overturn Prop 19.

[Better Believe It]

Obama administration blasts state's pot measure
Bob Egelko, Chronicle Staff Writer
October 15, 2010

The Obama administration has denounced Proposition 19, which would legalize personal use of marijuana in California, and promises to "vigorously enforce" the federal ban on possessing, growing or selling the drug if voters approve the ballot measure Nov. 2.

The pledge came Thursday from Attorney General Eric Holder, who oversees the government's anti-narcotics operations. Prop. 19 would "greatly complicate federal drug enforcement efforts to the detriment of our nation," he said in a letter to former chiefs of the Drug Enforcement Administration.

Holder said Thursday that California, by restricting the authority of state and local officers to seize marijuana, would interfere with efforts to "target drug traffickers who frequently distribute marijuana alongside cocaine and other controlled substances."

Read the full article at:

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2010/10/15/BAJS1FTFKC.DTL

[LAGC]

1. Obama, reign your bull-dog in, cause CHANGE is a coming!

Holder can't stop it...

[Retrograde]

50. Better yet, turn the bull-dogs on the people who need it

say, the energy companies who ignore saftey regs, corporations that hire illegal workers at below-minimum wages, health insurance companies who jack up rates by 40% - those guys.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

2. Oh, goddamn those Feds...

What is wrong with them?

This makes me sick. And I have no plans to ever use marijuana in any form. But I stand with those who want to.

I'm with the former San Jose police chief.

[Hawkeye-X]

3. Sue away, you will LOSE, Fed Gov...

You'd be taking away the will of the people.

So, Holder, please turn in your resignation to Obama and get the fuck out of DC now. The resignation reason is FAILURE TO FOLLOW THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE.

Failed:

Let stand the DADT ruling (currently overturned)
Let stand the DOMA ruling (currently overturned)
Prosecute Leura Canary and the fascist judge for the Siegelman case (Recent DOJ memo wanted to INCREASE the sentence of Gov. Siegelman)
Prosecute Karl Rove (currently free)
Prosecute George W. Bush and Dick Cheney for war crimes (currently free)
Threatening to prosecute/sue Californians for their support on Proposition 19. Federal law should be rewritten to remove pot from Schedule II and place it with the same fucking category as alcohol and cigarettes (which both kills, and MJ does not KILL) and taxed appropriately.

To my eyes, you're an incompetent Attorney General, and unworthy of being one as well.

Hawkeye-X

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[EFerrari]

5. What is the Justice Department budgeted for the War on Drugs?

[Hawkeye-X]

8. $40 billion was a recent number

Obama should divert the $40 billion on education, or job creation, or even hire people to start investigating and prosecuting war criminals.

Hawkeye-X

[EFerrari]

12. That's a lot of war on people isn't it? They're not going to want to give that up

very easily.

[TexasObserver]

6. Not for more than 2 years, if they don't lose that attitude.

Unless the president realizes his reelection in 2012 is dependent upon not losing California, they'll both be out of office by early 2013.

The president and his incompetent Attorney General need to take a page from the Kennedy brothers. The job is about WHICH laws will be the focus of enforcement and which will not.

These two guys refused to prosecute the crimes of their predecessors, and have consistently continued to pursue absurd positions the Bush administration took. These two guys don't have any moral high ground. They have completely failed to uphold Democratic values in the running of the Justice Department.

The president needs to go listen to his two year old speeches about this topic, and if that doesn't work, he should talk to some real Democrats for a change.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

9. You have said it exactly right. Bravo!

I am SO pissed off at this administration.

[laughingliberal]

7. You'd think he'd have better things to do with his time. nt

[dflprincess]

10. The can't investigate war crimes, but they can sue California if it legalizes pot

this is not what I voted for.

[XOKCowboy]

27. +1

Sorely misplaced priorities. Our president is looking more like a Republican-Lite than a Democrat every day.

[leftstreet]

32. +1

[readmoreoften]

42. +1

There goes the youth vote.

Well, now that the teachers vote, the union vote, and the gay vote is gone....

[Le Taz Hot]

46. Youth vote hell.

You know how many of us leftover hippies there are still left in California? And we're just as active as we were 40 years ago.

[liberalmuse]

11. And as heinous as this is, if true..

the Republicans are MUCH worse. Get out and vote for your local Dem rep (if he/she isn't Blanche Lincoln or some other putz). Please! Oh, and I'm saving my judgment because I'm expecting a really good explanation for DADT and THIS.

[Catherina]

13. Interesting set of priorities there. Rec'd n/t

[meow mix]

14. crybabies... WA, OR and CO are going next.

to bad losers, and your conduct on this matter will be deciding my 2012 vote.

[Hawkeye-X]

51. I will fiercely defend my rights

and 2011 will show a massive passage of the legalization, and there's nothing that the US can do. If they touch our stuff, we've got an army of lawyers ready to remove assholes from our state.

Hawkeye-X

[Odin2005]

15. hey Obama, WTF happened to the CHANGE you promised?

[Iggo]

16. Fucking idiots.

They think they can win without California?

[JonLP24]

17. There is some fucked up ballot initiatives in Arizona Obama could bash.

This doesn't compare to the shit the Repubs here are trying to get through.

[Mimosa]

18. There are profits in the war on drugs.

State and Fed property seizures, lawyers for the indigent, the prison profiteers are all making money off the criminalisation of marijuana.

[Bobbieo]

19. What is Obama going to do when he is faced with armed confrontation from the border drug cartels

and it is coming. Those guys are getting bolder every day.

[Better Believe It]

20. RAND Study: Prop 19 Would Defund Local Pot Dealers

RAND Study: Prop 19 Would Defund Local Pot Dealers
October 12, 2010 Author
David Downs

Violent Mexican drug cartels might as well go into selling lettuce and carrots if Prop 19 passes, the independent RAND Corporation said today. Cannabis' price drop from passing Prop 19 would make profiting from the drug highly unlikely, RAND researchers said during a conference call, offering more ammo to the Yes on 19 campaign in the closing weeks of the election. “We think would make about as much money as they make from growing carrots and lettuce. It will be much more like convention agricultural products than an expensive illegal drug. There wouldn't be large revenues from growing things that are legal,” said the authors of “Reducing Drug Trafficking Revenues and Violence in Mexico: Would Legalizing Marijuana in California Help?” The study was crafted by RAND drug policy expert Beau Kilmer, along with Jonathan P. Caulkins, Brittany M. Bond, Peter H. Reuter.

Critics of Prop 19 say violent Mexican drug gangs would move into domestic pot production if Prop 19 passes, but the idea is bogus, the researchers found. Cartels wouldn't be able to compete with legitimate producers on quality, cost, distribution, or sales.

“After legalization, will marijuana production be the sort of thing that criminals are unusually good at? It's maybe hard to think about, but the whole logistics and technology and approach to producing a legal plant are not one that criminals have any special skill at," researchers said.

“We're also expecting a pretty dramatic decline in price. The idea that criminals would be able to reap great revenues from growing something that anybody can get into the business of doing and is legal to do - it's hard to tell a story about why they would be able to generate great revenues from that."

A previously RAND study found that the price of a pound of high-grade cannabis would drop from over $4,000 to under $1,000 if Prop 19 passes. Even if foreign cartels started making high-grade pot to compete with California homegrown, RAND found cartels can't compete on price. A pound of pot goes up $450 dollars for every thousand miles it is trafficked.

Read the full article at:

http://yeson19.com/node/218

[Iggo]

22. Home-grown's alright with me.

Home-grown is the way it shoud be.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EHuqGKU-c0

[12string]

44. homegrown

It's all homegrown somewhere.

[nashville_brook]

28. can i rec this post too?

:evilgrin:

this is the really good shit.

[musicblind]

21. I think Obama needs to start watching Boardwalk Empire... n/t

[Better Believe It]

23. Holder says he'll enforce federal drug law in Calif. even if Proposition 19 passes

Holder says he'll enforce federal drug law in Calif. even if Proposition 19 passes
By JOHN HOEFFEL
Los Angeles Times
October 16, 2010

Stepping up the Obama administration's opposition to Proposition 19, the nation's top law enforcement official promised to "vigorously enforce" federal drug laws against Californians who grow or sell marijuana for recreational use even if voters pass the legalization measure.

In a letter sent Wednesday to the former DEA administrators, Holder wrote, "Let me state clearly that the Department of Justice strongly opposes Proposition 19. If passed, this legislation will greatly complicate federal drug enforcement efforts to the detriment of our citizens."

Holder's letter underscores that a period of turmoil, pitting the federal government against pot legalization backers, will ensue if voters approve Proposition 19. After California legalized medical marijuana in 1996 the DEA launched numerous raids against dispensaries and growers.

Baca, Los Angeles County Dist. Atty. Steve Cooley and the other law enforcement officials insisted the initiative is unconstitutional because it conflicts with federal law. Baca also said he would not uphold the measure, if it passes, and would arrest anyone with a 25-square-foot plot.

Cooley predicted that the federal government would sue and a court would issue an injunction. "He didn't quite come out and say, 'We're going to sue you, California,' but it was close enough," said Cooley, who is also the Republican candidate for attorney general.

Read the full article at:

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-marijuana-holder-20101016,0,5547626.story

[krabigirl]

24. If he does, he will not be re-elected. He cannot win without California.

[Xicano]

25. What Obama is actually saying is: "Fuck Democracy!"

Obama just stuck his middle finger up at a fundamental American principle. Bush might have been reported as saying the constitution is just a gawd damned piece of paper, but, Obama is basically openly saying things that are just as bad.


:banghead:

[Better Believe It]

26. Obama Administration could bring a federal lawsuit against California for violation of federal law

Feds: Marijuana laws will be enforced, state law or not
By Kyle Sporleder and Carl Foster - California News Service
October 15, 2010


Holder's letter is the strongest indication yet that the federal government does not plan to let marijuana be completely free and legal in California even if the ballot measure passes. However, the federal government's reluctance to elaborate on how it will enforce anti-drug laws creates a muddled picture for what legal marijuana under state law would mean.

There are a number of options federal law enforcement officials could still take with California pot smokers including:

Selectively enforce the federal laws on major drug traffickers.

Withhold federal funds in an attempt to pressure California to conform to federal law.

Preemptively sue the state to block implementation.

Aside from enforcing federal law, Congress could also withhold federal funds from the state in an attempt to pressure California to defer to the federal government. However, the feasibility of this course of action is uncertain as an initiative approved by the voters cannot simply be overturned by the governor or the state legislature.

There is also speculation that the Obama administration could bring a federal suit against the state of California for violation of federal law, much in the same way that Obama has done with Arizona against the state's controversial immigration law.

Read the full article at:

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_16349224?nclick_check=1

[smoochpooch]

29. The most likely outcome is Congress witholding fed funds; that's why the drinking age is 21 in every...

If prop 19 passes, there won't be criminal statute for pot in California like there is now. California cops can't arrest anyone for using it because it isn't against California law. Federal agents could still bust people for violating federal statutes, but they won't be able to bust the regular Joe-Six-Blunt on the street because I don't think there is a federal statute for minor things like possession.

But in South Dakota v Dole, the Supreme Court held that Congress can attach strings to federal funds to entice (but in actuality, coerce) states. Facing pressure from MADD, Congress passed the highway bill with a requirement that no state could receive federal highway funds unless the state's drinking age was at least 21. South Dakota (whose age was 18?) sued, but the court found that if they didn't like it, the state could simply choose not to accept the funds. Of course, no state could turn down that kind of money, the state's roads would fall apart.

So basically, Congress will eventually do the same thing to California by attaching strings to funds. It's messed up, but probable.

[CommonSensePLZ]

30. It's depresses me how attached people are to that damn plant

And the same people say it's not addictive, yet they're going to fight the law to smoke/eat/vaporize it.

[Bobbieo]

33. I have never smoked pot in my life but I am a border resident and am scared to death of the

drug cartels and will do anything to stop them. Legalizng pot is a start, as pot is their biggest export to the US.

[CommonSensePLZ]

37. ...And when they switch to selling a different drug? nt

[Occulus]

47. All the other ones can kill you n/t

[Better Believe It]

48. Do you think all or even most pot users will switch over to heroin, crack or something else?

They already sell those different drugs!

[CommonSensePLZ]

49. I was talking about the drug cartels

And BTW they get guns from this country, so the crime's not just from south of the border, and guns are already legal.

[Warren DeMontague]

36. I haven't smoked it in over a decade. But we spend $40 Billion a year "fighting" it.

it's FUCKING IDIOTIC.

Now, finally, some sanity enters into the debate, and all you hear is screaming, wailing, gnashing of teeth and out-and-out panic.. that... what?

A relatively benign substance that millions of people use recreationally, might not be against the law anymore?

People need to grow the fuck up, and stop worrying about how their neighbors get their jollies.

[kenny blankenship]

31. Rushing headlong into irrelevance and ignominy

[RainDog]

34. hopefully Holder is blowing smoke up the asses of the right wing n/t

[Warren DeMontague]

35. Someone is panicking.

Gee, whiz. If it really "wouldn't change anything", why are they freaking all the fuck out about it?

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JTFrog]

40. Fuck off. n/t

[meow mix]

39. attack your liberal base some more, good idea

this guy is a fucking disaster

[Pushed To The Left]

41. We have LOTS of electoral votes here in California. Holder is making a big mistake

Democratic candidates can usually count on California's electoral votes, but strong-arming us in the name of the drug war is NOT a smart move for the Obama administration to be making, especially considering how tough the 2012 election could be for Pres. Obama. How is it going to look to young California voters when they see some tea partiers supporting Prop 19 (yes, there are tea partiers working on the campaign along with progressives) and the Democratic administration dismissing California's wishes and continuing to enforce an unjust drug policy that we don't want? If Pres. Obama values California's electoral votes, he needs to tell Holder and the other drug warriors to back the hell off!

[readmoreoften]

43. They'll replace you with disenfranchised Republicans and Independents, don't you get it?

They don't want you, hippie! They don't want gays, or teachers, or union workers. Apparently they don't want young people or Californians. And they sure as hell don't want "progressives" AKA "professional leftists."

What they want is the coveted "independent" vote and the disenfranchised Republicans. Remember all those pissed off Bush voters who defected around 2006? That's who they want. And they figure the rest of America will vote for them because they can be scared into a "President Palin" fear-based vote.

"They don't care about you. At all. At all. At all..." G. Carlin

[Le Taz Hot]

45. I hope he's ready for California being in play

in 2012 because with that announcement, it is. I hope the apologists have enough states to make up 55 electoral college votes. Good luck with that one.

[Better Believe It]

52. Did Eric Holder just elect Carly Fiorina (and Meg Whitman)?

by Mickey Kaus
October 17, 2010

Did Eric Holder just elect Carly Fiorina (and Meg Whitman)?

California Dems, faced with two close races, have been counting on a big turnout of young, largely Democratic, voters drawn by Proposition 19, the legalize-marijuana initiative on the Nov. 2 ballot. But now Obama's Attorney General Eric Holder has declared that, in effect, Prop 19 won't matter because the Feds will "vigorously enforce" anti--marijuana laws anyway. Prop 19 is "null and void and dead on arrival" declared L.A. County Sheriff Lee Baca. Doesn't that kind of undermine the motivation of youthful Prop 19 supporters? . . . Maybe I'm missing something, but it seems hard to argue that Holder's statement is motivated by politics. At least California politics.

http://www.newsweek.com/blogs/kausfiles/2010/10/17/rove-brown-pot-special-foot-shootin-edition.html