Use of false Social Security number not impersonation, justices rule Read more: Use of false Social

[The Northerner]

The Colorado Supreme Court has ruled that a man who used a stranger's Social Security number when he applied for an automobile loan did not commit criminal impersonation.

In a divided 4-3 decision published on Monday, the court tossed out Felix Montes-Rodriguez's conviction for using the Social Security number of a woman he didn't know.

"He gave his correct address, birth date and place of employment," wrote Justice Michael Bender. "Most importantly, he gave his correct name. In the face of so much accurate identifying information, we cannot conclude that Montes-Rodriguez pretended to be another person in his loan application simply because he supplied a false Social Security number. Hence, we conclude that Montes-Rodriguez did not assume a false identity."

Bender was joined in the majority opinion by Chief Justice Mary Mullarkey and Justices Alex Martinez and Gregory Hobbs.

The court's decision was first reported by Law Week Colorado.

Justices Nathan Coats, Nancy Rice and Allison Eid dissented.

Read more: Use of false Social Security number not impersonation, justices rule - The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_16451993#ixzz13fa5LYF3

[dixiegrrrrl]

1. WTF???

[Towlie]

2. My original S. S. card says "FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION."

My original Social Security card says "FOR SOCIAL SECURITY AND TAX PURPOSES - NOT FOR IDENTIFICATION."

It's printed along the bottom of the card exactly like that, upper-case letters and all.

[HereSince1628]

9. I think that for all practical purposes that notion ended in the 60's

And if Americans had really disliked it, I am sure that we would have heard about THAT.

:sarcasm:

[HereSince1628]

3. Sounds a lot like a Mullarkey

just wondering how many other decisions were Mullarkey?

[Gold Metal Flake]

4. But it would still be a form of fraud, right?

So the lender could revoke the loan and seize the car?

[lumberjack_jeff]

5. Tell that to the lady whose credit he trashed. n/t

[Kali]

7. slow dial up here, news sites take forever to load, but

did he trash her credit? Maybe he made the payments and the effect was neutral or even positive???

there is a hell of a lot of money flowing into SS by the use of fake or stolen SS numbers - I imagine there is a certain incentive to not crack down on the crime of using them for ID purposes (and as mentioned above the number was never intended to be used for the purpose anyway so just who is committing the crimes? Why don't banks and other lenders get in trouble? hell you can't even get utilities without giving it out anymore!

[ecstatic]

10. Does that matter? I don't want my SSN used by anyone

else, for any reason.

[Kali]

13. well sure the truth always matters, doesn't it?

the article seems to indicate it was used on an application and there was no mention whatsoever of any credit being trashed.

I don't want my SS number used either, but the fact is you can't do much of any financial transactions anymore without it being used, so getting hysterical about the use by presumably "illegal" immigrants smacks of a different issue. Scary Mexicans stealing our jobs and identities while paying little to no attention to how the use of this number has crept into the status of a defacto national ID number.

[lumberjack_jeff]

18. I can imagine no other reason that he's in court. n/t

[Kali]

19. did you read the article?

seems she found out somehow by the fact of the application, I didn't see any any info that he "trashed" her credit. It sounded like to me he never got to the point of affecting her credit at all - she called the police when she found out about the application...:shrug:

[lumberjack_jeff]

20. She found out about it because it was on her credit record.

"Trashed?" YMMV.

Most people who borrow a stranger's SSN aren't planning to improve the stranger's credit rating.

[Ex Lurker]

22. it's unbelievable to me that some DU'ers think there's nothing wrong with what he did nt

[Kali]

23. where do you get that?

I don't see anybody saying any such thing.

[Towlie]

25. What if you despise the inherent injustice of the virtually unregulated credit reporting industry?

The purpose of asking for your Social Security number is to access information on you that's compiled by a very arrogant, unsympathetic, and cold-blooded industry that has no interest whatsoever in fairness or justice. They only care about making a profit on your personal information. That information is often one-sided and questionable, and it's often sold without your permission. And if you learn that it's erroneous, you have little recourse but to beg them to correct it.

Imagine the king's food taster. Even if he never encounters any poison in the king's food, he may still occasionally spit out a bite and yell "poison", just so the king will appreciate his valuable service. He risks nothing because the king will never know that the food was actually okay. Similarly, credit reporting companies lose nothing when they give bad reports on people who might deserve good reports. The only worry they have is to be sure they don't give good reports on people who deserve bad reports, because that's the only time their customers will blame them.

It's an inherently crooked business, and I'm not especially bothered to hear about people who don't eagerly play along with it.

[Kali]

24. most people who use a SS number not their own are people who don't have one

they are usually here without papers and use the number for such things as getting work or as in this case a loan. I would guess most actually pay their bills if at all possible like most of us and many pay a LOT of taxes and SS without a chance of ever seeing that money come back to them. As this case pointed out: this was NOT a case of actual IDENTITY theft as the "perpetrator" was only using the number as anybody would - not for stealing or "trashing" anybody's credit as you claimed.

The cases I know of personally where someone is here without papers have been hardworking people that normally would have had EXCELLENT credit - working two and three jobs, paying bills, purchasing cars and homes and trying like anybody to give a better life to their families.

This is a whole other scenario from scammers stealing your identity (using not only a SS number, but also name and actual banking info etc) to commit real thefts and fraud. This guy gave his own name and address.

[dkf]

6. This needs to be appealed.

It opens the door to rampant fraud

[ecstatic]

8. Great victory for credit thieves!

:eyes:

[MousePlayingDaffodil]

11. Not really . . . .

This result is probably much ado about nothing, in the end. What the Colorado Supreme Court held here is that the wrongful use of a Social Security number in these circumstances (i.e., in order to obtain a loan) did not constitute "criminal impersonation" within the specific terms of the pertinent Colorado "criminal impersonation" statute. One could quibble with the majority's reasoning (as the dissent here did) in applying the relevant statutory language, but the fact remains that what the defendant did in this case is today a crime under a different provision of Colorado law (i.e., regarding "identity theft").

[Kali]

15. stop trying to be logical

fear is more fun

[Poll_Blind]

17. +1

Rulings like this are often misinterpreted.

PB

[cbdo2007]

12. He wasn't pretending to be her, he was just using her SSN. He even put his own name down.

Why are people here even arguing this??

[Kali]

14. the usual

FEAR

[lumberjack_jeff]

16. He was pretending to be creditworthy.

He absolutely was attempting to defraud the lender, and had he decided not to make payments on the new car, it wasn't his credit which was at risk.

[Lance_Boyle]

21. OK - *WHY* was he using someone else's SSN?

If he's an illegal, why is he still in this country?