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Mexico's warning for US women. Don't turn health care providers into prosecutors.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 12:27 AM
Original message
Mexico's warning for US women. Don't turn health care providers into prosecutors.
RH Reality Check has a column by a woman who lives in Mexico and provides health care for women there. It's a warning our country needs to heed. It's a slippery slope from what has been done these last years in preventing women from making decisions with their doctors...to actually charging them with a crime.

Turning Health Care Providers into Prosecutors: Mexico’s Warnings for US Women

For the last 30 years, I have been living and working in Mexico. In July a young woman, barely out of her teens, visited the clinic I helped found in the state of Guanajuato. She asked for a pregnancy test and assumed there would be confidentiality. She was wrong. The local justice ministry demanded that the clinic provide the results of her test to them, as she was under investigation for illegal abortion after seeking medical attention at a public hospital for vaginal bleeding and pain.

In early October this same young woman was advised that her case was officially dropped due to insufficient evidence. Her nightmare, which started in an emergency room with a brutal interrogation and included inappropriate questioning about her personal sex life by the General Attorney’s Office, is seemingly over. Both this young woman and the clinic personnel, including me and my husband, faced the real possibility of incarceration – in our case because we did not hand over the confidential information of our patient.


The writer speaks freely about her disappointment with how restrictions are being placed on women's rights here in the US.

As a woman and a public health and human rights activist I am incensed by what is happening in my adopted country. And I am baffled and saddened about what is happening in the United States, my motherland, afraid for my daughter and for my sons, and for all U.S. residents. Soon after the time I first went to the clinic in New York 40 years ago, the landmark 1973 Roe v Wade decision secured my right as a woman to have access to abortion services on demand. Over many decades I felt secure and protected. Not anymore... especially when I see men and women running in U.S. senate races with a platform that includes overriding Roe v Wade. It is more than disturbing to see Attorneys General in the United States dedicating themselves to rewriting hospital regulations with the purported mission of increased safety for women while in fact they are dismantling the already insufficient supply of abortion providers in their states.


She asks a very pertinent question about the role of these doctors.

The current law in Guanajuato, and the barrage of restrictions being enacted against women throughout Mexico and in the United States and elsewhere poses a test first and foremost for the medical community: Do health care providers serve their patients? Or are they supposed to ignore medical ethics, good science and human need to serve as informants for state prosecutors and others?


The writer refers to a New York Times article in September that tells of the new crackdowns on abortions in Mexico.

Many States in Mexico Crack Down on Abortion

Here in the state of Guanajuato, where Roman Catholic conservatives have controlled government for more than 15 years, it is standard procedure to investigate suspected cases of abortion. But Guanajuato is no anomaly, women’s rights advocates and some health officials say, since a broad move to enforce antiabortion laws has gained momentum in other parts of Mexico.

One reason is a backlash against Mexico City’s decision three years ago to permit legal abortion to any woman in the first 12 weeks of pregnancy. After the Supreme Court upheld that law in 2008, 17 states passed constitutional amendments declaring that life begins at conception, even though abortion was already illegal everywhere but Mexico City, except in cases of rape or to save a mother’s life.

“It is a political response,” said Pedro Salazar, a legal scholar at the Institute of Legal Research of the National Autonomous University of Mexico. “This is a well-coordinated initiative. It’s not a spontaneous decision.”


In my mind the constant right moves here in our country to restrict women's choices are indeed a political choice. They are geared to appeal to the far right, and they are geared to help a party win elections.

That is shamelessly playing politics with a woman's rights and choices. There have even been efforts in Mexiceo to charge women who had miscarriages with breaking abortion laws...and they have been sent to jail. It could happen here.

In states where antiabortion laws are strictly enforced, there can also be a fine line between charging a woman with abortion and sentencing her for killing a newborn. In the gulf state of Veracruz, the state women’s institute found this year that eight women serving sentences for homicide — killing their babies after they had been born alive — had either had abortions, which has a much lighter penalty, or had miscarriages or stillbirths. They have since been released, according to the institute’s departing director.

Eight women in Guanajuato have also been jailed on homicide charges in recent years, stirring a debate over whether the authorities have used the crime as a way to pursue tougher sentences against women who had had abortions, or perhaps simply lost a baby during pregnancy.


There have been some cases that are shocking here in our own country. The mixing of religion and medical decisions has increased since neither party really stands up for full reproductive rights for women.

Denying women health care based on religious views

"In 1998, the Louisiana State University Medical Center in Shreveport refused to provide an abortion for Michelle Lee, a woman with cardiomyopathy who was on the waiting list for a heart transplant, despite her cardiologist's warning that the pregnancy might kill her. Hospital policy dictated that to qualify for an abortion, a woman's risk of dying had to be greater than 50 percent if her pregnancy was carried to term; a committee of physicians ruled that Lee did not meet this criterion. Since her cardiomyopathy made an outpatient abortion too dangerous, she traveled 100 miles to Texas by ambulance to have her pregnancy terminated."


In another case a woman whose water had broken at 14 weeks could not get proper care without traveling 80 miles due to hospital policy.

She was only 14 weeks pregnant, but her water had broken. Dr. Goldner delivered the bad news: Because there wasn't enough amniotic fluid left and it was too early for the fetus to survive on its own, the pregnancy was hopeless. Hutchins would likely miscarry in a matter of weeks. But in the meanwhile, she stood at risk for serious infection, which could lead to infertility or death. Dr. Goldner says his devastated patient chose to get an abortion at local Elliot Hospital. But there was a problem. Elliot had recently merged with nearby Catholic Medical Center—and as a result, the hospital forbade abortions.

"I was told I could not admit her unless there was a risk to her life," Dr. Goldner remembers. "They said, 'Why don't you wait until she has an infection or she gets a fever?' They were asking me to do something other than the standard of care. They wanted me to put her health in jeopardy." He tried admitting Hutchins elsewhere, only to discover that the nearest abortion provider was nearly 80 miles away in Lebanon, New Hampshire—and that she had no car. Ultimately, Dr. Goldner paid a taxi to drive her the hour and a half to the procedure. (The hospital merger has since dissolved, and Elliot is secular once again.)


There are some things that are worth taking a political risk to support.



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Angry Dragon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 12:47 AM
Response to Original message
1. If catholics want to run a hospital
then they need to abide by the Hippocratic oath and this overrides
any religion. If they can do this then they have no business
running a hospital.

If they want to exist in the secular world than they need to put their
religion aside.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 01:30 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. ....
I agree. :hi:
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ashleyforachange Donating Member (91 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:44 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. +1
This needs to be in the front page news to let people know so people can think about what is really happening to the healthcare. Any hospital that decides to put religion before medical ethics either needs to be shut down or have all federal and state/local money cutoff.
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me b zola Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 12:49 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R
:(
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 04:41 AM
Response to Original message
5. k/r
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Warren DeMontague Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 04:47 AM
Response to Original message
6. Here come the Salvadoran Forensic Vagina Inspectors.
Grrrreat.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 11:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. Exactly right. From the NYT Pro-life Nation article.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/09/magazine/09abortion.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

"In this new movement toward criminalization, El Salvador is in the vanguard. The array of exceptions that tend to exist even in countries where abortion is circumscribed — rape, incest, fetal malformation, life of the mother — don't apply in El Salvador. They were rejected in the late 1990's, in a period after the country's long civil war ended. The country's penal system was revamped and its constitution was amended. Abortion is now absolutely forbidden in every possible circumstance. No exceptions.

There are other countries in the world that, like El Salvador, completely ban abortion, including Malta, Chile and Colombia. El Salvador, however, has not only a total ban on abortion but also an active law-enforcement apparatus — the police, investigators, medical spies, forensic vagina inspectors and a special division of the prosecutor's office responsible for Crimes Against Minors and Women, a unit charged with capturing, trying and incarcerating an unusual kind of criminal. Like the woman I was waiting to meet."
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 06:42 AM
Response to Original message
7. omg--this is so scary...!
thank you for posting, madfloridian. my heart goes out to the woman who wrote this, and all the other women affected by these laws.
:cry::mad::grr::cry:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 11:18 AM
Response to Reply #7
11. It is scary. And it is all too real.
And what angers me is that our own Democratic president signed an executive order that hurt women's rights further.

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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
22. yes...
..i agree, that was a major disappointment. :(

at the time, i was kind of numb, though--and didn't give it much energy or attention.

i've reached a point (sadly) where i don't expect much of anything in regard to this issue. it's horrible, and i sincerely hate to even admit it. but after a lifetime of watching what has happened in this country in regard to women--seeing competitions every election re: "who hates women the most, and will take the most from them?" it's got to the point where i choose to expect little to nothing. that way, when (or if) we make any strides, i'm pleasantly surprised. of course, doing this while continuing to do the work (i.e. staying informed, informing others, fighting, voting, working and helping where i can, etc.).

....but please do forgive me madfloridian, for being so bleak. we (as women, and progressives) should be able to hope for more--particularly from progressive administrations. (sigh)

p.s. i admire the work and posts here on du. your efforts in regard to public education have been pretty awesome. i don't always comment, but when i catch it early enough--i recommend. ;) :hi:

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Fumesucker Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 06:46 AM
Response to Original message
8. K&R, thanks for posting..
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WinkyDink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 06:47 AM
Response to Original message
9. Restricting women's rights is just another stop on the Third-World train the U.S. is on.
Edited on Sun Oct-31-10 06:47 AM by WinkyDink
Check other nations if you doubt the correlation.

And who here doubts that a pervert such as Ken Starr would love to be the Inquisitor?
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
10. Remember that in Kansas they were trying to get abortion records
several years ago, apparently to prosecute women that had abortions. My recollection may be faulty though, but close I believe.

If the pukes steal it next week, I expect that sooner or later 'A Handmaid's Tale' will stop being fiction.

This country becomes more frightening each week.

Thanks for the post, mad! :hi:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 12:58 PM
Response to Reply #10
15. I remember that. Were they given the records?
I can't remember the resolution of that.
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-01-10 06:53 AM
Response to Reply #15
28. Madfloridian replied below, it's still ongoing! Unfreaken believable.
Edited on Mon Nov-01-10 06:57 AM by Mnemosyne
"A Handmaid's Tale" may soon be reality, if the pukes take over again. :nuke:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 02:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. It appears the KS case is ongoing. State Supreme Court ruling last week.
http://www.courthousenews.com/2010/10/27/31412.htm

Wednesday, October 27, 2010Last Update: 11:16 AM

" (CN) - Kansas health employees are not required to hand over abortion records to former state Attorney General Phill Kline or testify about the contents of those reports, the Kansas Supreme Court ruled.
In 2004, Kline subpoenaed Shawnee County District Judge Richard D. Anderson, attorney Stephen W. Cavanaugh, and employees of the Kansas Department of Health and Environment for records on abortions performed in the state the previous year."

I guess I thought it had long been settled. :shrug:
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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-01-10 06:54 AM
Response to Reply #18
29. Wow, thought it was settled too! Thanks for the update, mad. n/t
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Starry Messenger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
13. k & r
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riderinthestorm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. Too important to drop. K and R. nt
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
16. Glad I don't have to worry about this anymore.
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xxqqqzme Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. I don't either but that doesn't stop me
Edited on Sun Oct-31-10 03:18 PM by xxqqqzme
from fighting those who would deny pregnancy termination to others. The rabid religious rong tried to get parental notification on the California ballot for the fourth time since 2004. This particular effort criminalizes doctors, with fines and jail, for not notifying parents if a minor seeks a termination.

There was also the push to get the horrid 'fertilized egg has civil rights' on the ballot. Thankfully both failed to gather the required signatures.
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bobbolink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:28 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Please notify me when others who aren't homeless are willing to take action
on homelessness, OK?
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bliss_eternal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. amen, sister...
Edited on Sun Oct-31-10 03:43 PM by bliss_eternal
...it seems we vote on nothing else, but parental notification and abortion in california. it's really sickening (and sneaky) the way they constantly re-word it, to try to get it on the ballot yet, again. :grr::mad: well, that and glbt's rights. it's like it's not enough for us to say what we want, once.

the lousy sexist, racist, back-stabbing, liar of a governor claimed he would protect women's right to choose--yet, has supported that parental notification shit, time and again. he also betrayed glbt's, AFTER saying he'd support their rights. creep.
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RainDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 01:02 PM
Response to Original message
17. K&R n/t
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felix_numinous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
19. K + R
Edited on Sun Oct-31-10 03:10 PM by felix_numinous
I see this as part of the class war against poor women, because for the right price this procedure will always be available.

Abortion issue is not about morals, it is about social privilege.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #19
26. I agree with you on that.
Trouble is that as the laws become more restrictive, it will be harder and harder for any woman. But you are right in that poor women will suffer more.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
24. K & R nt
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GreenPartyVoter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 06:50 PM
Response to Original message
25. Kick
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MsPithy Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Oct-31-10 10:21 PM
Response to Original message
27. In the past when Republicans used abortion as a fund raiser or a election wedge issue
only, having no intention of actually implementing any national legislation that would affect middle class or rich women, we were lulled into not really believing they would act. I think anyone who is not old enough to remember what it was like before Roe v Wade, takes a lot for granted. As soon as Republican candidates started saying "No exceptions for rape, incest or health of the mother," WHY DIDN'T THEIR POLL NUMBERS DROP INTO THE 20's!!!!

This current crop of Republican wackjobs is a different story. If they take over congress, it will be a very difficult two years. They have no fear of ripping the Republican party apart or enacting jail time for women who commit premeditated murder- having an abortion. The Democrats, of course, will bend over, like they always do.
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