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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 03:32 AM
Original message
NCLB needs killing.
It needs killing badly. Even after all the Healthy Forest (gift to loggers) and Clear Skies (industries self-police for emissions) ironically-named initiatives, NCLB remains the most insidious and damaging.

First, the idea that setting "high expectations" for students (i.e. a rash of "tougher" standardized tests) will result in improvement is ludicrous. Take an inner city youth with three siblings and one parent. Odds are ma or pa has to work an inordinate amount of hours to sustain the family, and that resources for raising children in terms of time and money are incredibly scarce. What does that mean? That such a child cannot be reasonably expected to score as well on future reading or math tests as a child who is raised in a family with wealth and leisure to spare. And starting out behind when the expectation is you equal or better the average is often fatal. With great ability someone may overcome the obstacles, but being unable to read in first grade and reading at a fourth grade level in seventh grade will absolutely nuke most children's chances of passing standardized tests. Students starting behind need extra help, not make-or-break testing.

Second, the punishments for failing to meet the standards are completely wrongheaded. Take two baseball teams: one that has had years of experience with the equipment and rules and has the best coaches, and one that attracts lousy coaches and has never seen a bat, a glove or a baseball diamond in its existence. NCLB essentially asks these teams to play each other, and the team that loses gets less equipment and even lousier coaches.

Third, it's an unfunded mandate. I think last year Bush asked for and Congress provided about a third of the ostensible funding. With state taxes at an all time low, this lack of funds combined with the punitive nature of the bill makes state schools corrupt. Their tests are made easier, their student roster books are cooked to exclude minorities, their bad students swell drop-out lists as they are pushed out to boost scores, and curricula are skewed to the test, focusing on math and reading over art, physical education, etc. All these problems make claims of progress essentially meaningless.

Finally, the idea that a student in a bad school should just switch out to a better one avoids the essential problem. We're back to the baseball teams again--the good team is not likely to readily accept any lousy player from a lousy team, and any good players lost just makes the lousy team that much worse.

NCLB is up for renewal this year, and it wouldn't hurt to talk to your congresspeople and let them know you oppose the bill.
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dave_p Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 03:52 AM
Response to Original message
1. No Child Left Safe
... not to mention providing access to military recruiters and giving them students' details. Screw that: education should be about learning, not supplying IED-fodder for the Administration to waste still more lives in wars that betray Americans.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 03:53 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. That's another problem. Military recruiters are given the same access as higher education reps
Further, students aren't obligated to talk with their parents about any meetings, etc.
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sam sarrha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 03:54 AM
Response to Original message
3. you forgot 'FOOD".. poor kids eat Mac & fake Cheese dinner and cereal for breakfast or none.. cant
score on that... i was in in TX during W's curse on the people there..NCLB was a scam, the rigged the results to make it look good, they had over 40+% dropout rate in a lot of places..WHICH THEY COVERED UP.!!!!! a little tiny article came our on the back page about it later when his replacement thug didn't want to take the blame for it later. the legislature only meets a couple months every 2 years.. so nothing can be done..

every to years for a couple months.. and crooked as a dogs hind leg.... a job made in heaven for poor stupid W.

they found a guy Innocent on DNA evidence the first time in TX so there was no law to let him out, the legislature wasn't in session for another year, W didn't pardon him, and it was an election year when the legislature did meet and no one wanted to look soft on crime letting him go, so he sat in jail for 3 years till they met again. the paper said that within 24 hours of the decision of not guilty on DNA.. over 60%, i heard in another story it was 80%, of the DNA evidence stored by police was destroyed.. what a place
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 04:08 AM
Response to Original message
4. What the US needs is a reform act that hires more teachers and provides more educational resources.
Edited on Wed May-23-07 04:09 AM by Selatius
The problem with many schools is lack of teachers, lack of resources like updated books/school supplies, lack of competent administrators, low pay and high work loads, and lack of adequate capital investments in infrastructure like maintenance and new schools.

The result is overcrowded classrooms and a dilapidated learning environment that sends the message to kids that they're worth more dying in a fucking trench than becoming an educated citizen.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 05:54 AM
Response to Original message
5. Hear, hear! Contact your reps about this, since it is up for renewal this year
NCLB is Bushco's stealth way of getting rid of the public school system and replace it with a more faith based private one.
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Clark2008 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 06:00 AM
Response to Original message
6. While I do agree with your general premise, I take umbrage to
Edited on Wed May-23-07 06:12 AM by Clark2008
something you've said about single parents.

My ex husband is a jerk. He has only supervised visitation and I have complete custody of our son, who is now 8 years old. I was a single parent from the time he was 15 months to the time in which I remarried when he was 6 and 1/2. He is a straight-A student. His verbal, communication and reading skills are in the 90 percentile. His math skills are as high. I had to work long hours and keep up a house, raise him and do everything by myself. It can be done. You just have to place as much importance on teaching your child as you do earning the living. And I did it on a pittance. I don't make tons of money. I still basically live paycheck to paycheck.

I know it's incredibly hard, but it's not a "given" that "such a child cannot be reasonably expected to score as well on future reading or math tests as a child who is raised in a family with wealth and leisure to spare."


P.S. I will be leaving shortly, btw, to watch my son get awards for First Honors for the year and Good Citizenship. He usually gets a couple of other awards, too, but those two are the biggies.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:22 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Of course it's not a given.
I raised my sons by myself, and I know.

I also know, though, this statistical reality:

The largest factor affecting test scores is not something done by a school or a teacher. It's ses/parent ed level.

That's been well-known since well before the testing mandates we're currently facing. It's in the "psychological measurement" text book I kept after my college class 15-20 years ago.

It's not whether or not the parent is single, it's parent ed and income level. Some of the parents with lower ses/ed levels are single, but that's not the deciding factor.

It's also true that single parents who have to work more than one job to keep the wolf from the door have less time to spend with their kids, less time to spend talking to teachers, and are less connected to what is going on in their kids' lives. That's a reality connected to the amount of time they are gone working. I was lucky; I had family members to step in and do a great job covering for me during the years that I raced from the day job to the night job during the school week. Many kids are just on their own. I have some students this year who only see their parent on weekends; the parent is out the door before they get up, and home after they are in bed at night. The parent calls home to make sure they get out the door to the bus on time, to check on them, etc., but it's not the same. These situations can, and do, affect how well a child does in school.



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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:36 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. Your kid is an exception
Sure it can be done by it is not done my many.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. I'm not saying a single parent can't be a good parent
They can provide more love and care in many cases than two parents, but the fact of the matter is a single parent on average will have fewer resources and less time.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:00 AM
Response to Original message
7. I have been telling my reps this for many years.
I hope enough people will join me in '07 to become a voice loud enough that our reps must hear it.
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trotsky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
9. Why, it's an unqualified success!
If your goal is destroying public schools, that is. :mad:
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teamster633 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:31 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Another "Mission Accomplished"
And I'm willing to bet that Little Boots has a lot of friends in the standardized testing industry. That would make it a twofur.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed May-23-07 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
11. You are so right
I do think we have a chance with this issue. Congress is listening. My own Dem congressman is very conservative but he has proposed a bill that says NCLB can be ignored if it is not funded. That is a start but it really needs to be thrown our altogether.

I favor the feds out of our local schools. Return our tax dollars and our control to the states and local districts. That's what I am lobbying for. No more NCLB and no more federal regs - period. No more US Dept of Education.
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