Please Help! Terrified and Single Woman being terrorized by LAPD!

[delilah]

***ADMINS: Please please move this thread if it appears in the wrong forum. Also, if this is not apropos to DU, please delete it, I promise I wont re-post it. My current panic level is defcon 4590349ty Skabillion, so this could be the wrong place to ask for help. I will not be offended, and apologize in advance if I've overstepped what is welcome here.***

Hi, I'm a total stranger. I've been lurking here for years, mostly saying nothing. I'm a social liberal who really only became a Democrat after the first Bush administration. I guess you'd call me a defector from the Republican Party. While I've never participated in these forums in any substantiative way, I've been reading them for several years, sometimes nodding, sometimes frowning, mostly being very glad (and ashamed that I was glad) that at least I'm very unlikely to suffer the same kind of treatment as those poor souls at GiTMO. After all, I'm just a boring white nerd from California.

So, out of the shadows of lurkerdom, I hurl myself on your collective mercy and wisdom. I am without any substantial resources, and the kindness of strangers is likely my best bet. My civil rights have just been completely violated, I've been threatened by the LAPD, and I'm shaking in my boots. Any and all advise as to who (if anyone) can help me would be appreciated. Apologies in advance for the length of this post.

Yesterday evening, at roughly 8PM, I walked with my sons(twins age nine), from my apartment to the store, to purchase school supplies for them. I've recently lost my house key, so I left my door unlocked. As I DO have a pet, I can assure you that the door was firmly closed.

Upon return from the store, I saw an unmarked police car in the parking lot near my apartment, with a police officer standing near it The policeman indicated that he and his fellow officers were there in regards to "something concerning someone from Nevada", and that they needed to speak to me. I blinked rapidly. I don't know anyone in Nevada.

I walked with the officer and my sons to the front door of my apartment. I expected, until I rounded the corner, that this was all some odd mix-up. I have no criminal record to speak of, I've never been arrested. I'm a boring white nerd. Unless D&D has been outlawed and my D20 declared a weapon of mass destruction, I've nothing to fear from the man.

Yeah. Oops.

Upon rounding the corner I notice that my front door is wide open. WTF?! Oh yes, my door is open and these policemen (four more, in addition to the one I met in the parking lot) are milling around my apartment, one of them armed with a video camera.

Alex, I'll take illegal searches for 1000.

I rushed inside, aghast. I asked if they had a warrant, they said no, I IMMEDIATELY informed them that their entry into my home was illegal, that they certainly did not have probable cause to enter my home uninvited and make MOVIES. I was equal parts LIVID and terrified.

Terrified because I do drugs? Nope. Not kidding about that no breaky the law thing. Really seriously, I AM a good girl, not even weed. However...my house was a DISASTER and I knew it. I mean, you can't imagine the mess. I'd recently been ill (cost me my last job as it happens) and my house reflected my inability to clean properly for some time. Why is that so scary?

Because I've got kids.

So I'm standing there, shaking in both anger and fear.

"You have no basis for probable cause to enter my home. The door was closed."

One of the five officers smirked. I swear, I'm not embellishing this. He SMIRKED and said:

"We heard a baby crying."

There are NO babies in my building, people. Theres a toddler upstairs from me, whom I've never ONCE heard cry. He's two and a half, and has vocabulary. One of my sons gaped in shock. Even to a nine year old, this officer was obviously lying.

"There is no baby in my home. You are conducting an illegal search!"

At that point, I out came the threats. The officer with the camera stepped forward:

"Right now, lady, you are THIS close to being arrested and your children placed in foster care. I wouldn't recommend arguing."

Then these men proceeded to take turns berating me for my dirty apartment. They were condescending, cruel and rude. They refused to leave. They pointed out the glass booze bottles in my recycling and accused me, in front of my children, of being an alcoholic (I recycle ALL bottles and cans, my friends bring me their empties, and many of my friends ARE prodigious drinkers). My sons shouted this down, god bless them, because they've SEEN my friends dropping off said glass containers at my apartment. I started to cry at that point, and said in a pleading manner:

"They are glass, I recycle them for the money. I'm POOR. I barely ever drink."

The officer then pointed at the small bottle of vodka and the small bottle of vermouth on top of my fridge. They are so infrequently used, that they have DUST on them. The vermouth is a great marinade for pimento-stuffed olives. Its cheaper to buy the vermouth and soak them yourself, by the way.

"Thats mostly for cooking, I hardly ever drink. Can't you see the DUST on those?"

He glares at me.

"I told you not to argue, lady!"

"But its the truth!"

"Well what about all this trash?!"

He gestures around my dining room. Admittedly, its a mess. ALOT of half-broken down boxes, stacked up, and groceries I haven't put away yet. Non-perishable things, pasta, canned goods, etc. I reached down and picked up a bottle of cooking oil.

"This isn't trash. It's groceries that are not going to go bad. I just haven't put them away."

"Is it that hard to put things away??!" Sneering, glaring..

"Hey (forgot name), shes arguing with me!"

Thats when I noticed that the one of the other officers had taken my sons in their bedroom.

The sonovabitch is questioning my sons without me. >.<

About that time, panic won. This guy is angry, he's going to take my kids. He's filmed my apartment, which is totally a mess, and he's puffing his chest out. I know whats going to happen if I threaten the man with the presumptively tiny penis anymore, by daring to be female, educated and undaunted. So I caved in.

Every time they tell me that I'm a horrible parent, I nod.

Every time they tell me that I "must have some serious issues", I nod.

I meet every insult, attack, accusation and abusive statement with this:

"Whatever you want me to do, officers."

They threaten me for another hour or so, all the while milling around my house. They take turns expressing their disgust with me, and alternately threatening to arrest me and take my sons. Then...finally...

I find out why they are there.

Apparently, someone who IS an ACTUAL CRIMINAL used to have my phone number. About, oh, six months ago, I'd guess. These five strapping policemen came to my apartment looking for some fella who's got a record. A very large angry looking Hispanic fellow, if the photograph is true to life. They briefly flash some paperwork at me, asking if I know him. I shake my head.

More abuse after that, more bad woman, bad mother, bad environment to have children in, etc.

As they make it clear that they are leaving, and leaving without arresting me, I ask them for the person's name again. I DO get phone calls for someone who's name I don't recognize, all the time. As my panic recedes, I remember this. The officer evades this question. It is the same officer who showed me the photo, and the same officer who alleged that he heard a baby crying, when confronted with this illegal search.

As they leave, the officer with the video camera tells he that he will be coming back in 3-4 days to see if my apartment is clean. He also says he's going to keep "checking up on me" after that, to make sure it stays clean. He tells me he'll arrest me on the spot if I do not meet his standards.

I nod, shaking head to toe.

Now, I'm certainly cleaning my apartment, and deeply embarrassed that anyone saw it that way. I'm all over it, like flies on Rove. However, I have no idea what will happen with any of this from here out. The very idea of a policeman stopping by my home at will, expecting to (as he's already done) execute an illegal search of said apartment, for an undetermined period of time, is totally insane.

I need a lawyer, I need one who'll take me on for free, and I need one in the quickest manner possible. They know I'm poor, they know I cannot afford legal counsel, and they will continue to harass me, knowing that they face little chance of being caught.

Please, someone tell me who to call. The ACLU doesn't even have a phone line in Los Angeles County, and legal aid can't help me with anything other than an eviction.

[Demeter]

1. Get Out of LA

Do not pass go, sell whatever you can and just leave. There is no future there, nothing to stay for.

Stay, and you die. It's that basic.

[localroger]

35. I have to regretfully agree with this

Please read this.

Short version: Kim Groves was a mother of three who filed a police brutality complaint against New Orleans police officer Len Davis. (This was long before Katrina.) She had no connection with him except that she witnessed him beating the crap out of one of her neighbors. Davis got ticked at her and hired a hit man to have her killed. The FBI were investigating him on other instances of corruption and recorded the phone call where he ordered the hit but did not act in time to save her. The hit took place, and Davis is now on Death Row.

I do not know if the officers who assaulted you are in fact as corrupt as Davis. There is no doubt that they are at least somewhat corrupt; they committed multiple crimes against you with obvious confidence that there would be no repercussions. This suggests that at the very least they are confident Internal Affairs will do nothing to them no matter what you do. There are several possible reasons for that confidence, none of which bode well for you.

If you were a wealthy person with a stake in the community, equity in a house, well-paying career, and so on I would advise you to proceed cautiously if you insisted on keeping those things. Since you are poor, well, it will be hard to suddenly relocate and rebuild your life from scratch in a strange place, but it will be much harder to deal with these cops if they decide to turn your life into a living hell. They can do that very easily and without plenty of money, time, and luck there's not much you can do back to dissuade them.

[depakid]

56. Having left LA myself, I also agree

There's no future there- and the LAPD (like other aspects of the city- the LAUSD, for instance) is NEVER going to change. Ever. No matter what happens. Rodney King was not an aberration- it's commonplace.

As gas prices inexorably rise, I see LA as one of the places I definitely wouldn't want to be.

[huskerlaw]

89. Oh good lord

Are you serious?

Take a deep breath, then give me a huge freakin' break.

:eyes:

[LostinVA]

94. Uh oh -- better look for another job -- I bet Oklahoma State is hiring

}(

[ellisonz]

113. Umm...no.

L.A. is a nightmare and it always has been.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_of_Quartz

That's the masterpiece, but I can assure you that the historical facts are all there in regards to the "excesses" of capitalism in SoCal.

:eyes:

P.S. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=2858293&mesg_id=2858293

[huskerlaw]

118. First of all,

anyone who uses Wikipedia as "proof" of anything...well, laughable really.

And..you're using the MTA price hike as proof that LA is a horrid place to live? Also laughable. We had one of the cheapest rate schedules among large cities in the US. This actually brings it more into line.


Before you ask, yes, they do affect me...I ride the bus and the subway daily.

[ellisonz]

127. But you can afford to pay the fare...

I only linked to wikipedia because it was a good short rundown on Mike Davis who is a popular writer and a professor at UCLA. I was hoping you being a law school graduate and all would be interested enough to do your own homework.

How long have you lived in LA? If you didn't grow up here (or went to private schools), the error in your perspective is understandable, because in America don't you know there is no racial division of labor and the elite certainly never wage class warfare through public policy on the poor. I'm willing to accept that Los Angeles isn't bad if you're wealthy, educated, and inexpierenced in the ways of racism. God forbid we bring race, much less socio-economic status into the debate, how will we ever live? :sarcasm:

If you are white you are the exception rather than the rule in this regard and I say that as a white LA resident in regards to the use of public transportation. Many big cities have tollbooths, why wasn't that considered a viable option? For some reason I find it hard to believe that the "Golden State" doesn't have the dough to fix the transportation system given Beamers and McMansions :silly:

[huskerlaw]

130. My, my...aren't you just chock full of assumptions?

Just because I didn't grow up in LA I couldn't possibly understand racial division? Surely you're joking. LA isn't the only city in the world with race issues. Far from it, actually.

And what makes you think that I'm wealthy? Educated, yes...but wealthy? Hardly. And I'm not even commenting on the "white" thing...totally irrelevant.

How do tollbooths make transportation any more affordable for poor people? Your logic fails to make sense.

[ellisonz]

132. Oh please...

I'm just saying that racism in Southern California has a distinct flavor in comparison to the traditional conception of racial prejudice.

Whiteness is everything: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiteness_studies

"Roger Christensen, chairman of the MTA's Citizens' Advisory Council and an appointee of MTA board member Richard Katz, dismissed the idea that the fare hikes were racist, denouncing such claims as "vile and disgusting.""

This might be a good place to start: http://www.amazon.com/Heart-Whiteness-Confronting-Racism-Privilege/dp/0872864499/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2/002-2970744-5260008?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1180131878&sr=8-2

Also, if you want to get into the historical development of capitalism in Southern California and the accompanying racial division of labor may I suggest the following books:

Rebirth: Mexican Los Angeles from the Great Migration to the Great Depression, Douglas Monroy
Southern California: An Island on the Land, Carey McWilliams
Factories in the Field: The Story of Migratory Farm Labor in California, Carey McWilliams
The History of Forgetting: Los Angeles and the Erasure of Memory, Norman Klein
Popular Culture in the Age of White Flight: Fear and Fantasy in Suburban Los Angeles, Eric Avila
The Conspiracy of the Good: Civil Rights and the Struggle for Community in Two American Cities, 1875-2000, Michael James
Henry E. Huntington and the Creation of Southern California, William B. Friedricks
Crabgrass Frontier: The Suburbanization of the United States, Kenneth T. Jackson, Los Angeles is the "premier example."
Plus the indispensible Mike Davis.

Check your local public library.

Tollbooths would be one way to redistribute wealth and socio-economic opportunity in SoCal, the point is that we should be increasing taxation on the rich and not the poor.

Check full of assumptions? More like free of the mythos of sunny Southern California...

:nuke:

[girl gone mad]

107. 100% agree.

LAPD is corrupt to the core. You couldn't pay me to live in that town.

[mnhtnbb]

124. For the sake of your kids, get OUT of L.A. NOW!!

The schools are crummy, LAPD is notoriously crooked and has been for 50-60 years, traffic is unbearable, housing prices/rents are astronomical. What more reason do you need? Maybe big earthquakes?

We left in 1988 and have never looked back. You couldn't pay me to live
in L.A. again.

Seriously, you need to make a plan to get out and then do it.

[Ron Green]

2. Call all the news media you can think of with your story.

If you don't mind being outed for your sloppy housekeeping, you could make a real cause celebre out of this incident, get lawyers calling you and put some more heat on the LAPD (remember, they already have a bunch of strikes against them in the the public mind.)

[eShirl]

3. ACLU of Southern California (LA) phone # [phone]

their website: http://www.aclu-sc.org/

[Critters2]

46. Yes, yes, and yes!!! Call the ACLU!!! nt

[OneBlueSky]

73. call the ACLU for sure . . . also e-mail them what you posted here, verbatim . . .

maybe someone on their staff will read it and take an immediate interest . . . quicker than they otherwise might . . . good luck! . . .

p.s. the idea of getting the hell out of LA is not a bad one, either . . .

[LostinVA]

4. I'm confused about some things

1.) The phone company usually "shelves" phone numbers for quite a while before reusing them -- you need to tell the phone company about that and have them do something.

2.) Phone numbers aren't linked to addresses -- WTF did the phone company do?

3.) Cops have nothing to do with cleanliness and can't arrest you for that, nor cite you in anyway.

4.) The LA-area ACLU is quite large.


God, bounce.

[Warpy]

7. 1. it depends on how "crowded" the area code is. My last number

was given out two weeks after I'd changed it.

2. there's a directory called a "criss cross" that has phone numbers in order with their addresses.

3. Cops do threaten women they want to harass for uncleanliness if there are children around. It has to be dangerous uncleanliness, like rotten food, bacteria, lots of flies, rodents and roaches, before it's really actionable.

[LostinVA]

10. 2. That's not what I meant

Numbers aren't linked to addresses. When I move, my number isn't "saved" for the next person residing there.

[Warpy]

18. No, but the number has a new address six months later

and that's how long it supposedly took the cops to look it up.

[Pacifist Patriot]

21. I wouldn't have thought so except it happened to me in 1987.

I moved into a new apartment at the start of fall term in college. From the beginning I received the weirdest phone calls at all hours of the day and night. It took a few weeks until I finally figured out the phone company just re-activated the phone number to the same address after I moved in rather than rotate.

In 1992 (in another state by the way) I got a knock on my door from the police looking for someone who had previously had my phone number. All they had was the phone number and not an address. Turned out the person they were looking for had lived across town, but because all they had was a number they didn't know that until they investigated.

None of this excuses these officer's behavior, but I find nothing particular suspicious about them showing up at this woman's house based on a suspect's phone number.

[boobooday]

77. It's true that you can be assigned someone else's phone number

When I lived in the San Fernando valley I was assigned Cybil Shepherd's old phone number. One day I got a call from a couple of disc jockeys in Tennessee looking for her. When I told them I had her old number they said, "do you live in her old house?" I looked around my ghetto-ish apartment and laughed my ass off.

But the cops are disgustingly out of line here, and it is, sadly, not surprising. They most likely won't be back, but this story is appalling. I could see KNOCKING on your door and asking if you knew the gentleman in question, but walking in, conducting an illegal search and then berating this poor woman, apparently for recreation, is just beyond the pale.

I'm glad to be out of LA.

[Lasher]

116. Phone companies do that to deal with high turnover at colleges.

Every year everybody moves out all at once and different people move back in a few months later. Phone companies often leave phone lines set up the same and suspend service. Then in the fall they change names on the accounts and reactivate. As far as I know this tactic is uniquely employed to address the 100% turnover at college campuses. Elsewhere phone numbers do not usually stay with the addresses when subscribers change.

[Pacifist Patriot]

133. I wasn't living on campus.

The previous tenants were a family unaffiliated with the university. From what I can tell they must have skipped town without paying bills or cancelling dentist appointments. Also had a VERY popular teenage son.

[huskerlaw]

90. That's a good point

Even if the number is used again immediately, it's not given to the same address.

[Pacifist Patriot]

99. See post 21. It happened to me.

Not in California mind you.

[tblue37]

29. It doesn't matter. If they want to do something to her, they will,

whether they have any right or jurisdiction or not. Remmeber this line: ""I told you not to argue, lady!"? If they want to demonstrate their big bad power, they will, even if it takes planting something on her to give them a reason to arrest her. They really are criminals with power to do anything they want.

[Critters2]

51. I have the former phone number of someone else

In fact, just this morning I told the Chicagp Symphony fundraising people AGAIN that those people don't live here anymore and NO I DON'T WANT A SEASON TICKET TO THE SYMPHONY!! AGAIN!!

In Iowa, I had the number of someone with credit trouble, apparently, and collections agencies were always trying to reach this guy--and never believed I wasn't his wife, partner, mother, something. In fact, I would occasionally check with the credit bureaus to make sure his info and mine weren't getting confused or conflated.

So, it is possible to have someone else's old number.

Also, some states do have a law against a really messy house. Iowa does. I can't remember what the charge is, but every once in a while, the local police blotter would show someone arrested for it. Which scared the hell out of me!!

[KurtNYC]

79. The LAPD has a system in their cars and helicopters which shows them

your calling circle -- basically whoever you call and whoever calls you. They attach this data to any other info they have.

And the LAPD does many things that they "can't do" -- they are accountable to no one. The police chief is chief for life.

edit to add: http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/12/la.cops.ap/index.html

Many here are offering advice that would be good in other cities but L.A. is different.

[uppityperson]

108. phone numbers can be recycled quickly, it depends.

They got the address for the phone number from the phone co. It doesn't matter where the previous owner of phone # lived, cops thought it was there.

I got my phone # a month after the last people gave it up. They were lawyers and I got tired of getting messages on my answ machine (even though I said my name and my kid's name, they would leave messages "attny X, call me back, quick!" and no #. Someone finally left a # and I called them to pass on no lawyers there.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

5. There is likely...

A local lawyer's referral service or women's legal service or service organization. Seek them out.

I know you are panicked right now. Your home and castle has been violated and you have been threatened. They entered without permission or warrant. They know they were in the wrong, which is why the threats were made. You, however, need to do two things:

1. Get centered. You might want to call a local crisis line. Why? Because they can help with referrals. They can also help you cope. I am sure that LA County is rich with resources for you. You just have to find them.

2. Get righteously indignant. Going into "combat", anger is a bad thing. It makes you act in an unwise manner. On the other hand, righteous indignation, a "How Dare You??!!" attitude is a great attitude to foster, no matter the type of "combat".

Don't give into fear. That is what they want, because they want you to be afraid and acquiescient. Be vigilant. Get names and badge numbers. Speak to an attorney skilled in these areas.

If I can help you anymore, I will. Please note: I am 3500 miles to the east. Give or take.

Oh: Kick

For other wise counsel.

[elehhhhna]

38. tandaleyo's advice is spot-on...

may I suggest a few other future possibilities?

You may be depressed. A doc might be able to help you there.

Get the boys (sweethearts, obviously -- defending Mom to the big bad authority figures!) to help you clean the place up. You'll all benefit from it -- and it'll make y'all feel better.

Some cops are jerks. They hit the wrong address, evidently w/o a warrant (although if they'd had one w/ the guys name on it would they have admitted it? LOL.) Lots of asscovering once you arrived, huh?

Good news: the sexist, bullying tactic about housekeeping only works on Moms who DO care. That's why it worked on you.

Just for fun -- can one file a FOIA request for a copy of that video?

hugs,
Elena

[kerry-is-my-prez]

42. I have OCD - which she may have too. You hoard things....

n/t

[sinkingfeeling]

6. ACLU does have legal services there.

ACLU/SC
1616 Beverly Blvd.
Los Angeles, CA 90026

Download printable map
213 977 9500 Phone
213 250 3919 Fax

If you want to request legal assistance:
Please read INFORMATION ABOUT HOW THE ACLU ACCEPTS CASES where you will get information on how to contact our legal department.

http://www.aclu-sc.org/About/Contact/

[Th1onein]

8. Get some good security. And, also, do this.......

By good security, I mean, put locks on your doors that they have to really work at, to break open. This way, they can't say that the door was unlocked, etc., if they come back.

I doubt you are going to get an attorney to handle your case, but there are some things that you can do. For one, call the police station and ask for them, during the MIDDLE of their shift. They are likely not there. When you find that they aren't there, ask for their supervisor. Talk to their supervisor and tell him that you wanted to let officer (I hope you at least got one of their names) know that your house is now clean and he can come over and inspect it. Tell his supervisor that if officer (whatever his name is) wants to, he can bring his videocamera again, like he did last time. Tell him that you know they were looking for some fugitive who had once lived there last time, but you also know that your case of having a dirty house is important to them. This is sure to cause red flags to come up with the supervisor. Wait until they do and see what happens. You notice that at no time are you being argumentative and anything less than subservient? This is what these guys like. So, while you are essentially reporting the officers to their supervisors, you can't be faulted for being hostile towards them.

If nothing happens, go to internal affairs and file a complaint against the officers. Even if something DOES happen, file the complaint.

Then, get out your paper and pen and call the police station and ask for the supervisor's name and phone number and address. Call that number and ask for HIS supervisor's name and number and address. Then, call that number and ask for that supervisor's name and number and address. Continue to gather this information until you get to the top of the food chain. Pen your letter and send a copy, addressed to each office, certified mail, return receipt requested. Go all the way up to the governor and the State's attorney general's office.

Believe me, heads will roll.

[tblue37]

31. She still needs publicity to protect her, because the LAPD is

pretty pervasively corrupt, and they will cover for each other. I still say tell Keith Olbermann. Maybe tell Bill Maher, too. He's pisssed at the way the LAPD bet up innocent people during that protest, including those not in any way associated with the protest.

[AZBlue]

102. And more local newspeople too! TV & Print.

[ellisonz]

114. LOL.

Given the current state of America I doubt KO or Bill Maher is worth the trouble.

[Clovis Sangrail]

9. Leave LA

If you're poor you've got a snowballs chance in hell against the LAPD.
It sucks, but that's the world we live in.

Move elsewhere and become politically active.

[magellan]

11. OMG, this is horrible!

I'm so sorry this happened to you. Please try calling around to all the big legal firms in L.A. and see if any of them will take your case pro bono. (I say "big legal firms" only because they'll likely represent you better, and you'll need a powerhouse to take on the LAPD. If my thinking is wrong on this I'm sure someone will correct me.)

Try to stay calm, and start phoning law firms right away. (Well, in between spring cleaning!)

[hedgehog]

12. Kick

Someone here should be able to help!

[Neecy]

13. Check the phone book for Legal Aid services

They take on low-income clients and they're probably more likely to help than the ACLU.

Stay strong and keep us informed.

[dogday]

14. Ever heard of the comment you can't fight City Hall, well

just replace CPS with City Hall and you have the gospel... The people at CPS can snatch a child from you, demand to see your home, whatever they want.... They can question your kids at school without your knowledge....

[kickysnana]

15. Clean your apartment. Get locks changed. Get out now.

Go stay with any relative out of their juristicion. Then move. THIS IS HURRICAN KATRINA FOR YOU.

You need your sons to be safe amd they won't be in foster care. You cannot possibly afford the legal fees to try to get them back.

GET OUT asap.

Mom of adult sons who was in a similar situation in a more forgiving area.

PS Your kids will probably have some mild PSTD from this because this is huge and scary to them

[ScreamingMeemie]

16. Did you get a badge number?

Any part of an officer's name you remember?


Something bothered me about this story, so I looked it up and the ACLU does have a chapter for So Cal, located right in Los Angeles:

http://www.aclu-sc.org/About/Contact/


I sincerely hope that I am not mistaken in my thought that we are all being taken for a ride here.

[blondeatlast]

49. Regrettably, I must say you aren't alone in your doubt. nt

[LostinVA]

64. Nope

[JuniperLea]

88. I'll make that three...

I just can't get past LAPD 70 miles away in Lancaster... we don't have enough for LA proper as it is!

[Th1onein]

71. I sincerely hope that I am not mistaken in my thought that we are all being taken for a ride here.

I think that IS pretty regretable. This person has been a member of DU for over two years now. And, really, when someone is having a hard time like this, it is just the better part of valor to take them at their word.

I remember when my nephew died in Iraq, there were people here saying that they thought I was lying about it. It made me feel like absolute shit at a time when I felt like absolute shit already.

[ScreamingMeemie]

72. It is an opinion board. I had questions with the OP. The ACLU

does indeed have offices in LA. And, I wasn't one of those people saying that. I only question when there is reason to question. Here there was reason.

[JuniperLea]

84. I highly doubt LAPD...

Goes 70 miles to do dirty deeds in Lancaster... never heard of such a thing. And I've lived in Los Angeles county all 50 years of my life.

[JuniperLea]

86. LAPD? In Lancaster?

That's 70 miles out of LA proper... I don't know that the OP is taking us for a ride, but she at the very least has her wires crossed...

[Codeine]

128. self-delete

[ryanus]

17. Sue the officers personally

and think about leaving the state. Get the officers names and sue them personally (there's an article I can't think of where you can sue police officers as individuals violating your rights, not just as members of the police force. This way you can go after their assets. house, etc.)

The right thing to do was to go public with this.

[yodermon]

19. I've lurked here for 4 years,

..and you came to the right place.
:hug:

[porphyrian]

20. A d20 is a weapon...

I think you've gotten some good advice already. I hope everything works out for you.

[Pacifist Patriot]

22. I'm a bit surprised by the advice to just leave.

This is rarely an option to people with little means as you've indicated. You may also very well have ties to your community via family, schools or job networking. It's easy to tell someone to move, a lot harder to do it.

I think the best advice above was to contact a crisis help-line or women's assistance program. Even if you are not a battered spouse, the individuals who volunteer at these types of places should have referrals for you.

Good luck! I cannot imagine how terrifying that situation must have been.

[KurtNYC]

87. As someone who did leave

I think it is a good option. One of my co-workers (white guy, if that matters) fell asleep behind the federal bldg in west LA after an office Xmas party. The LAPD handcuffed him, beat him unconscious and then let their dog chew on his face. They didn't even clean the blood off of him so that when he was arraigned in court the next morning, his 3 year-old daughter got to see him in that condition. They do whatever they want. The judge knew the name of the dog and asked if the dog was okay. (I wish I was making this up). While he was filling out a complaint form, another guy came in to file a complaint and they started talking -- the same thing had happened to him.

Another co-worker (african American) was stopped for absolutely nothing in his car while delivering a 35mm film print to a theater. They made him unreel one of the film reels into the street and laughed while they did. A $4000 print reeled into the dirt of the street for their amusement.

Some other friends were robbed and raped in their apartment in West Los Angles. The LAPD called them stupid and asked if they were supposed to just round up every male who came close to the description they gave. They did nothing and told the victims that they would do nothing.

I agree it is not easy to just pick up and go but it worked for me.

[ThomCat]

23. I agree, Call the ACLU.

I hope they can step in for you. There is no reason the police should be able to break the law and harass you. You should absolutely find out how to file a formal complaint for the shit they pulled.

:hug:
Hold on and stay strong.

[tblue37]

32. There is no reason why they should be able to--

and yet they are able to and they do get away with it. And the LAPD is among the worst in the country where that is concerned.

[mopinko]

24. the American Civil Liberties Union of Southern California

http://www.aclu-sc.org/About/Contact/

[ieoeja]

25. I can tell you exactly what to do.

Nothing. You pissed off the cops by arguing with them. They threatened you. End of story. You will never see these cops again.

The major difference between you and the cops is that, apparently, they actually know the law. My f'ing kitchen collapsed, two entire exterior walls completely missing, the roof propped up by a few 2x4s, gangs of squirrels** coming into the house terrorizing my cats ... and the child welfare people here in Chicago asked me take custody of a troubled kid.

Seriously. They sent someone else's kid to live with me under those circumstances. Are you abusing the kids? Are you leaving the kids unattended for lengthy periods? Are you not clothing and feeding them? Are you not getting them to school? Are you exposing them to danger? These are the questions they need answered. Not: is your house dirty.

But, as I say, the cop is never coming by anyway. If s/he did s/he would be opening her/himself up to harrassement charges. They have to put up with enough bullshit already. They don't want any more than they already have.


**Actually, it was only one squirrel. And it only came in the house once that I know of. With three cats in the house the squirrel was all for making a quick exit.

[seabeyond]

48. dont argue with cop. lower eyes. tail between legs. no eye contact

how dare you challenge a cop. the audacity

[ieoeja]

55. "O say, does that star-spangled banner yet wave"

"O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?"


No. Oh, wait, that was a rhetorical question. Sorry, officer.

Still, the OP is freaking out over something that is not going to happen. They are NOT coming back to make sure her apartment is clean.

[TX-RAT]

26. Forget the lawyer.

Get your house cleaned up. Sounds more like someone was concerned about the welfare of the children, and the landlord gave them permission to enter. Not sure a warrant is required on a child welfare check.


Very strange story. Would love to see the police report.

[blondeatlast]

27. I'd like to see the police report as well. nt

[Occulus]

45. There won't be any proof forthcoming from the police.

There is no police report, because the incident wasn/t reported by any of them. The video tape? Already erased.

Bank on it- it's how these types operate.

[RobinA]

61. Yeah, But....

Cops don't do child welfare checks on dirty houses. Even in LA, I would imagine. Something a little fishy here.

[TX-RAT]

67. All it takes is for someone to make the call.

The officers have to respond. I've had to do it myself a few times. The original call may have had nothing to do with a dirty house, just someone concerned about the welfare of the children, could have been neighbors, family, landlord.

[DiverDave]

122. Get your house cleaned up???

my, what a heart you have.
Why not just call her a liar and have done with it?

Oh, and if you think those pigs had the welfare of the kids in mind, I got a bridge to sell you.

Get a little compassion sheesh.

[TX-RAT]

125. I've got plenty of compassion.

When i think I'm being told the truth. I was a peace officer for 22 years and a judge for 8. I've heard allot of sob stories in my life. There's just too many holes and excuses in this story. Give me a police report and a back ground check to review and i might change my opinion, but until then, I'm going with my gut feelings on this one.

I hope I'm wrong.

[Louis Cipher]

28. Did you get their names?

I'd try to dig some shit up on these guys, hire a PI to follow them.

[tblue37]

33. She has no money. PIs cost money. (eom)

[delilah]

34. Listening to Alice's Restaurant on a loop while I clean and make calls

I know this sounds like bullshit. I don't blame the skeptics. I'd be crying bullshit, my damn self. If you'll tell me the litmus test you need, I'll lick the strip, friends. I'm not making this up: This is not a drill. I wish i could tell you just how much i wish I WAS entirely full of shit.

I've sent off 3 emails to LA civil rights lawyers. I'm hoping that LAPD is a soft enough target with deep enough pockets to get a hungry shark on my team. I did read something about them having to settle a similar case for 150k, so one hopes thats just enough blood in the water.

My phone number is listed, as I am poor. My address appears with that information. I assume that is how they found me. What baffles ME is...my name isn't Jose whatever the dude was. Clearly, the number belongs to someone else now...so wtf?!

I did not get their names, and I know thats a major screw up. Every time I tried to reach for a pen and my notebook, another salvo of "Hey (forgot name), I really think we should take these kids" would start up and...

Deer. Meet Headlights.

If i could leave, having either the means or a place to land if I did, I'd go. Right.Freaking.Now. I LOATHE Los Angeles. I come from a small family, all of whom live here.

Incidentally, I am in Lancaster, which is northern LA County. I am not in LA itself. Lancaster is not just sorta red, its REALLY red. Lancaster makes Orange County look blue. Our (thankfully) deceased former state congressman was Pete Knight. You know, the author of the Defense of Marriage Act? Yeah, THAT Pete Knight. This place is not just red, folks, its Neo-Con CENTRAL. These are the loonies that voted for Buchannan. Oh, and they own the local paper >.<

Theres three libs here, that I personally know. Every now and then we sneak off into the desert and hug a joshua tree. Its all part of our plot to turn everyone gay. Shhh. Don't tell.

Please excuse the levity. Its that or cry.

Yessir Officer, I cannot tell a lie, I did put that envelope under that pile of garbage...

*edit...number is listed, not unlisted, sorry

[BlackVelvet04]

37. Did you contact the ACLU?

By the way, clutter isn't a crime. If your apartment was filthy dirty, full or roaches and rats then the police would have cause to involve CPS....and that's the only thing they could do. They don't have the right to inspect your apartment at their whim. What a bunch of bullshit.

Personally I think they were trying to intimidate you because you caught them doing something illegal.

CALL THE ACLU.

[pschoeb]

91. I agree with BlackVelevet, they got cought entering without a warrant

on someones property who wasn't actually a criminal. My guess is they thought they lucked out and the perp they were looking for had left his apt unlocked, even though this would still be illegal, they could probably get away with it if an actual criminal is involved, as they could make up some excuse. That's why they made the lame "I heard a baby cry', but that would not really cover their ass well, in a case with no obvious criminality, and I'm sure they were realizing that this was not the perps place. It's fairly normal for cops to get all tough and threatening when they fuck up, especially since you asked if they had a warrant, they want to make sure you feel scared so you won't report anything. I also doubt these cops got any call about a messy house or children not being taken care of, you said the car was an unmarked police car, this would more likely be detectives, and not beat cops, they wouldn't be making that kind of stop. So my guess is they came because they thought the perp lived in your house or was associated with it.

[Demeter]

40. If You Have Family In a Red County, You Have Protection There

Swallow your pride and go home, then go on from there. Get in a safe place BEFORE you start trying for justice. Save the ACLU, telephone tag, and all that neat stuff for after you and your boys have safety.

[ieoeja]

57. I never thought your story was bullshit.

It sounds like an honest mistake on their part. Consider yourself lucky your door was not locked, or they'd have destroyed it coming in. Heck, my brother's was unlocked, they knew it was unlocked, and they broke it down anyway because ... they had a new battering ram they wanted to try out.

That aside, there is no fucking way they are coming back. You pissed them off. So they threatened you. But they are not coming back. You are freaking out over nothing.

So clean some house, have a drink and chill.


Or is this all really about your, "hoping that LAPD is a soft enough target with deep enough pockets to get a hungry shark"? If this is just about you looking to make money then you can just look elsewhere for a sympathetic ear.

[JuniperLea]

81. I doubt LAPD respond in Lancaster...

LA County Sheriff, sure... there's a Lancaster Sheriff's Department too...

I live a hell of a lot closer to Los Angeles proper (20 miles) than Lancaster is (70 miles) and I've never seen an LAPD in this neck of the wood, not in over 40 years of living in Los Angeles County have I seen LAPD outside of LA proper. Never.

[delilah]

101. You misunderstand me...

I'm not someone who's looking for a quick road to a the easy life via lawsuit. While I can objectively understand that some would consider that a possible motive on my part, its sad to see anyone willing to apply it with no basis. Please do not make assumptions about me. You don't know me. That's not only unfair, its also illogical. Fact should substantiate opinion, no?

The only people who both care about the money in this situation and that matter to me, are the LAWYERS. They aren't cheap, and the sad reality is that if your case does not offer the potential of large cash settlements or awards, they won't represent you, no matter how flippin right you are. I'm not fool enough to believe that if this violation does not represent the possibility of financial reward for a lawyer, that they'll work for free. I'm also not operating with any sense of entitlement that suggests to me that they should.

Thats not greed, friend. Its pragmatism.

While I understand that the world is filled with a goodly number of people who look for any possible way to sue anything that twitches, please do not mistake my desperation to secure brutal legal counsel as anything other than a desire to feel safe again. I don't want the money. I want a really mean person between me and these cops.

[Gormy Cuss]

68. You need to get your story straight.

Details: LAPD or LASD? Uniforms or no? Ranks offered? Badges worn or displayed? Write down EVERYTHING that you remember starting with a physical description of each officer. Since you don't have names, code them based on description as Officer A, Officer B, etc. Be sure to ascribe words and actions to specific individuals when you can remember it clearly. Do it now while it's fresh and before you retell the tale repeatedly.

and don't post the detailed description here -- save it for your attorneys.

[gollygee]

78. Why would LAPD go to Lancaster?

Wouldn't the county sheriffs office send someone instead of the LAPD?

[JuniperLea]

83. bingo

totally bogus... never happen... if you Google Lancaster, CA, you'll see they have a Lancaster Sheriff's Department, and an LA Sheriff... I highly doubt it was LAPD... highly.

[tblue37]

30. I say send this story to Keith Olbermann.

He could do a "Worst People in the World" segment on it.

[VP505]

36. Here is a resource

where you might find some info and or help:

http://www.copwatch.com/

[kerry-is-my-prez]

39. They could probably do this to me too if they saw my bedroom....

I've got newspapers, magazines, books and videotapes stacked up to the sky.

[Critters2]

53. Mine, too

Because parishioners or trustees (who do actually own the place) might drop by unexpectedly, my first floor is presentable (but only just), but my bedroom is a wreck!! Don't know why, but it's the way I am. My dad always says my space isn't dirty--that is, not germy, dangerous, etc--but it is cluttered. And so it is. Glad these cops didn't visit me!!

[teriyaki jones]

41. Here's a link for pro bono legal help

http://www.abanet.org/legalservices/findlegalhelp/home.cfm

My husband works for the American Bar Association's pro bono division, and the guide at this link will help you find an attorney who will provide pro bono legal help. The ABA doesn't provide direct help but they do maintain this and other directories.

I'm not a great housekeeper myself, and every time I hear or read about stories like this it frightens me. We had a tragic incident in our neighborhood (a Chicago suburb) a number of years ago where a teenage boy unintentionally killed his abusive, alcoholic father. That should have been tragic enough. But when the cops came to investigate the death, they discovered the house was a mess (they had a couple of large dogs who tended to get into the garbage and also shit regularly in the house). The authorities determined that the housekeeping did not meet "community standards" and made the family move out until it could be cleaned up, AND made the mom take cleaning lessons before they could move back in. Remember, this was on top of a murdered father and a son in jail for the murder.

The situation you just experienced is unacceptable--I hope you can find help from the above link. You shouldn't have to move to have something resembling justice, to say nothing of privacy. But definitely, get new locks!

[Rosemary2205]

60. Wow, great resource THANKS

I'm not the OP but I know one too many people that might could benefit from that type of resource. Thanks so much.

[teriyaki jones]

63. You're quite welcome

my husband is fortunate to have a paying job where he actually is able to do some good for the world. He did a lot of work coordinating legal volunteers for post-Katrina New Orleans.

tj

[Hekate]

43. KnR with tears in my eyes & a fervent prayer in my heart.I know others here will have good advice.

:hug:
Keep yourself and those boys safe.

Hekate

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Hekate]

50. Judgmental much? Ever been chronically sick yourself? and trying to keep kids going?

Most men have a woman take care of the house when they're sick, most men aren't simultaneously trying to keep the kids going. Could be wrong about you, Seriousstan; for all I know you have Chronic Fatigue Syndrome or Rheumatoid Arthritis and are the single parent of 4 kids of your own.

But I expect your house to be spotless at all times, even so.

In all my life I've only known one male in those circumstances: he had CFS and two very young kids. Couldn't hold a job any more. Since our lives only intersected every few months, I wasn't in a position to drop in on him to check on the state of his housekeeping.

Or give him a kick in the butt. Whichever.

Hekate

[seabeyond]

52. harsh but points. regardless, going in without warrant is against law

and the police getting around it by baby crying is wrong.

people cannot allow cops the freedom to do as they please. they too have laws and rules to follow

[ieoeja]

59. USAPATRIOT Act

Were the guys who used to have the number wanted on drug charges? Some illegal controlled substance activity is used to fund terrorism. As such ALL drug crimes now fall under the USA PATRIOT act which allows the police to do warrantless searches.

That is what the police told my brother after they destroyed his front door and gun safe then confiscated all his firearms and his coin collection (they show no record of having confiscated the latter and claim no knowledge of its whereabouts or even having ever existed).

[Critters2]

54. Wow. I believe someone missed the point completely.

There's this thing called the 4th Amendment, see. And it says the police can't just come into your home without just cause and a warrant, no matter how long it's been since you last vacuumed.

But judging others is fun, ain't it?!

[SammyWinstonJack]

58. ...

:yoiks:

[orleans]

62. oh please! why don't you just beat the crap out of her and get it over with? n/t

[seriousstan]

70. Because, obviously, shame already worked.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

66. Let's see...

We can rule out social work or psychological counseling as possible career opportunities for you, Stan.

Have you considered the exciting and mediocre-paying position of prison guard?

[High Plains]

69. Judgemental assholes reign supreme.

[insane_cratic_gal]

80. way to assume

wtf you make a leap to the fact that someone called the police about the house?

So how many loads of laundry and kids are you raising on your own there Stan?

[yewberry]

96. A "what" kind of tale?

Now I know what site you've been spending time at.

Ew.

[bling bling]

97. Ha. I noticed that too.

That name is a verb in-of-itself over there. Or is it an adjective? Eh, whatever.

[Canuckistanian]

104. You're an asshole

You know next to NOTHING about her situation. And by the tone of your post, you ain't even interested.

Get some help, seriously.

[delilah]

110. oh noes. a male is angry with me. someone fetch mah smellin salts, i might get tha vapahs!

Hi Stan. I'm sitting here all deeply ashamed that I do not measure up to your standards as a housekeeper. It's going to keep me awake nights, I tell you.

If you suspect someone called me in, as you say, then why on earth did this officer ask me about Jose? Why the photo? What the heck was THAT all about?

Where *I* come from, we call this logic. I give out free lessons on Tuesdays, but I thought toss you a sample. I'm a giver like that.

Obviously, you've never lived as a single mother in a town so red it elected both Phil Wyman and Pete Knight...repeatedly. I think they took one look at my bookshelf and went back to their car for the camera. I might have slipped past them, for I doubt they know who Maureen Dowd and John Hope Franklin are. But the Michael Moore sank me. It let them know a CYA was in order.

I can't for the life of me imagine how you've extrapolated sitting at home doing jack shit, from unemployed. Ever looked for work, my friend? Ever used public transportation to do that? It is only, apparently, in your imagination that I have leisure time. I hope that I'm enjoying it. Maybe I'll send me a postcard someday.

I'm not miraculously rejuvenated to anything. I'm not going out on the job hunt until my apartment shines like a new penny. The time I spent the last few weeks, doing that, I'm now spending making sure that everything is neat as a pin. You know, to please the pricks.

You've got to try this logic stuff. Its really quite fun. Alliteration on the side is for bonus points.

The only thing I can thank these abusive people for, is the opportunity to teach my sons about civics and constitutional law in the first person. As a parent, its a small consolation prize, to be able to illustrate so effectively, why we have the laws that we have.

Do you want some quotes from the boys? I'll share one with you.

"Mommy, theres no baby at our house. Why did the policeman tell a lie?"

Oh yeah. I'm grateful. Thats totally what I'm feeling right now. Blinding red gratitude. I'm positively brimming with it.

You know the best part of your post? The part where you ignored my willingness to prove that I'm not playing some lame prank on DU, after lurking for two years, and then accused me of playing some lame prank on DU after lurking for two years.

I'm willing to put up, if you'll do the rest.

[shanti]

111. wow

:wow: you sound like one of them...

[Madspirit]

47. I'm Just Saying

I'm just saying what the others have said...ACLU, the news media. Tell everyone. Shit I would put up posters I would be so livid but mostly make sure it gets on the news.

Lee

[BlooInBloo]

65. More criminal police.

[MLFerrell]

74. Put up a sign that says:

"This residence protected by explosive devices." That'll scare 'em, the fucking cowards.

:sarcasm:

Seriously though, contact the ACLU, and consider leaving an audio recording device (video if you can manage it) in a surreptitious location should they make good on their threat to "check up on you". Hard evidence is MUCH preferable than trying to win a creditability contest with a fucking pig. If you hear a knock on the door, flip the "on-off" switch on the recorder to "on". Trust me, this is something that you're going to want to do. You can thank me later. :)

Also, invest in new locks, and talk to your sons and tell them that the police are NOT their friends, and that they should never say ANYTHING to a cop if you're not right there with them. EVER. The poor kids have probably figured that out for themselves, but just in case, you need to talk to them. If these fucking pigs want to get a few jollies, they'll send someone to talk with your kids while they're in school, and all sorts of innocent remarks can (and WILL) be misconstrued as child abuse/neglect.

If I can think of anything else, I'l let you know. Best of luck!

[JuniperLea]

75. Call Bet Tzedek... NOW!!!

They are the best in town.


http://www.bettzedek.org/

[ecstatic]

76. "I have no criminal record to speak of, I've never been arrested. I'm a boring white nerd."

You lost me there.

:eyes:

[delilah]

95. Quicknotes, on the run.

Gotta be zippy in my replies, please forgive if they seem terse.

Thanks to those who posted supportive messages. I didn't come here seeking compassion, my goal was information. I'm a bit stunned to have received both, even more that the supportive posts were helpful to me. I'm not all that big on touchy-feely, so its mildly strange to me to discover it has value.

Seriousstan, I'll come back later, when my work is done and reply to you. I can't find the time to bother with your AMAZINGLY presumptive little missive at present. I also need to read the forum rules to find out exactly how much I can flame you. I appreciate your inadvertent attempt to help me, by providing me with an such an excellent target for venting.

My illness was never life threatening, nor am I chronically ill. I dont wanna give people the impression that theres some cancer patient scrubbing floors out here, lol. I had a fairly routine surgery that didn't go well. It took a while for the doctors to stop arguing about who had to correct things. No. Really.

A friend of mine is a locksmith. He's coming over after work to re-key my locks. Thanks to whomever suggested that.

These officers were NOT LAPD. They were LASD. Sheriffs, as opposed to city police. I didn't know there was a difference.

GWB is NOT a nerd. Nerds don't get C's at Yale. FFS, the man can't even pronounce nuclear. Sorry, I think yer gonna have to pawn him off on the Jocks. Baseball and all that, you know.

Law office to call in a few min, will post whatever they tell me. Heres a link to the place I will be talking to: http://www.sdshh.com/

[BlackVelvet04]

129. delilah......

I'm truly sorry for what you went through and I feel for you, but I have to tell you that your witty replies have made my day. Damn, girl, you're funny, even in the midst of adversity. I love sarcasm and you do it very, very well.

Hope everything is better for you today.

[MissB]

82. I'm still stuck on you leaving your house unlocked.

At the same time, I'm a bit surprised that you only have one key to your place.

Both of those seem like basic common sense. You don't leave your place unlocked. You're a single mom with two young kids. You don't *only* have one key to your place. If your landlord only gives you one, then dammit go to the locksmith at your local variety store and have a few extra ones made for 99 cents each.

I get the messy apartment thing. Once when my oldest was a newborn, our master bedroom was a mess - dirty clothes on the floor, dishes here and there, kleenex tossed aside. That night, I had to call 911 because my son was having a febrile seizure. I was horrified (much after the fact - the next day, when we came home and had calmed down) that I'd had four strapping and handsome firefighters in my masterbedroom and the place was a hell hole. They didn't lecture me, though.

But your kids are 9. Time to start having them help you clean. When you're down sick, they can help keep the place tidy. Unless the whole family is down sick, your home should be reasonably clean. It doesn't need to be white glove clean, but a 9 year old (and you have two!!) can certainly straighten up the bottles, pull out a vacuum or broom, and keep things generally trash-free. You have two built in housekeepers. Start using them, and realize that teaching them these skills will be as useful to them (and their future spouses) later in life as it is to you now. Plus, you don't have to worry about the cops reporting the condition of your place to CPS.

Everyone else has given you good ACLU-type advice. I can't imagine being without a support system to lean on during a police situation such as this, so I really can't relate to this at all. I wouldn't have taken it, but I'm coming from a different point in my life than you are.

[ceile]

85. Kicked for a possible update. n/t

[huskerlaw]

92. If you haven't already started cleaning...

take date-stamped pictures. That way you have proof that, while cluttered, your apartment wasn't dangerous for your children. Take pictures of the dust-covered alcohol. And definitely call the ACLU...not email, CALL them.

Also, I'm a little bit confused. Lancaster is outside of the LAPD's jurisdiction. (http://www.lapdonline.org/our_communities#L). When you call the ACLU, you should ask them how in the hell they had the right to be on your property in the first place. Lancaster is under the jurisdiction of the Los Angeles COUNTY Sheriff's Dept...not the LAPD.

Then familiarize yourself with the Los Angeles County Department of Children and Family Services. Who would they normally send out if someone called in suspected abuse? Learn your rights. http://dcfs.co.la.ca.us/index.html

Good luck!

[Xithras]

93. CRLA

California Rural Legal Assistance. I don't know if they serve LA (they do have an office in Oxnard), but they do provide general legal services to those who can't otherwise afford it. Many decades ago when she was young and poor, they even helped my mom complete and file her divorce papers. CRLA tends to focus more on farmworker legal issues nowadays, but I believe they still provide general legal services to those who need them. If CRLA can't help, there are many other groups who can.

Really, there isn't much a lawyer could do for you right now though. What you need to do is simply speak to a lawyer and VERIFY that the entry wasn't legal. It may seem redundant, but this step is important. When the police officer comes back, you can simply say, with 100$ honesty, "I have already spoken to a lawyer, and he confirmed that your entry into my home was illegal. You do not have my permission to enter my home." Step out the door, and close it behind you when you're speaking to him, so he can't attempt to look past you into the home. No matter what he intimates, he CANNOT arrest you for having a messy home. The worst he can do is call CPS and have them investigate you. An arrest would require evidence of an imminent threat to the childrens lives, and that doesn't sound like it's the case. Do not get argumentative with him, but do not let him into your house.

Three other points: 1) Don't worry about that video. Without a warrant the entry was illegal, making any evidence they claimed inadmissable. They could have found a crack syringe on your coffee table, and they wouldn't have been able to hold it against you. 2) Get a damned key for that door. If you live in an apartment, tell your landlord that the key was stolen or something. Landlords are legally required to provide reasonable maintenance on their properties, and the periodic replacement of locks is part of that. 3) No offense, but those boys should be cleaning the house if you can't do it yourself. I have a 9 year old kid too, and his chores include cleaning his room and cleaning the dining room. My slightly older daughter is responsible for straightening up the living room, and we all work on the kitchen together. Even my almost-three year old pitches in, putting dishes away in the lower cupboards and picking up toys around the house. Not only does this help to keep the house clean, but it helps to teach the kids responsibility and helps them to have pride in their home. They may resist at first, but if you be firm they'll do it. I usually turn the TV, video games, and radios off, and tell my kids that they cannot leave or turn anything back on until their chores are done. They sometimes have a fit about it, but they eventually get bored and just clean everything up.

[bling bling]

98. I doubt they'll even file a police report on it.

There are cops on DU who could probably be helpful to you here. Or at least, there USED to be. Unfortunately, most of the Dem cops who come around have been treated like such shit here they don't usually stay too long.

[treestar]

100. Call a tort lawyer

I believe there is one guy in LA who is famous for taking cases against cops. Yagman? Or something like that.

[Nucular Terrorist]

103. Crooked drug-pushing cops or criminals impersonating cops

- Four "officers" showing up in an unmarked car.

- Men claiming to be LAPD, when you're out of their jurisdiction, and cops frequently get bugs up their asses about that.

- Some cops are known for being dicks, but they were really aggressive for no reason.

- Why would they conduct a lengthy search for basic identification?

- Gung-ho cops wouldn't threaten you more than twice, they'll just do it.


The angry-looking Hispanic guy with a record might have been heavily involved in drugs, and these goons could have been apart of something way bigger than a stereotypical pig that gets his rocks off on scaring innocent women.

[ellisonz]

115. Welcome to DU!

[delilah]

105. Update and assorted responses to questions

House: Cleaning between phone calls. Contrary to some of the odd assumptions I've seen posted, my home has no vermin, bugs, excrement (human or animal), nor ritual animal sacrifice. There are no exposed wires, missing walls, broken windows, etc. Its just messy. Well, it was messy. Now its less messy. I should be entirely de-messy'd tonight.

Kids: On the advice of a good friend who's children were briefly removed from her home some years ago, I called my mother and asked her to take the kids tonight. I will pick them up tomorrow morning, by the grace of another wonderful friend who agreed to loan me their car, and drop them off at school. From school they go right back to gramma's for the weekend. As this is a holiday weekend, I do not expect anyone from DFS to come to my home, but one can never be too safe, as I've recently learned.

ACLU: This was my first phone call this morning. I am sorry for my careless post, my complaint was not that they don't have a phone, it was that nobody answers it. It's not a live phone line, its a message machine. You leave a message and hope they pick you. As I'm not part of a group action (yet, see below), I felt that I was unlikely to find help there. I'd already researched that when I posted. I will likely email them as well.

Officer Names: The officer with the video camera was of Asian heritage, and his name began with a K. I've concocted a plan to find out his full name. Kudos to several ppl's suggestions that gave me the idea. I'll let you know the name (and the plan) if and when it works :)

Police Report: If one was filed, the officers certainly did not give me any case/ref number. In any event, police reports are not usually available until seven days after an incident. If one is filed, I'll know next week, when I go ask about it.

Confusion About the Agency: Again, apologies on my part. Lancaster does not have, to my knowledge, its own City Police. We've always contracted out services here, at least thats what I've always read in the Valley Press (its torture to read, by the way). As I've never had extensive contact with the police, I assumed we contracted with the City of Los Angeles. Actually, we contract with the County. I honestly wouldn't know from looking at a police officer, the difference between a sheriff and a city officer. Man with gun=the police. I'm usually not someone he's looking for, lol.

Keys: I recently lost my house key. This is especially annoying, as I've had the same key chain for 8 years, no kidding. I'm absent minded, that key chain not being missing for more than 10 min for so long was a personal victory. Anyhow, the store is VERY close, it was broad daylight and I've frankly nothing of value to steal. I've lived here for six years, and never heard of anyone's apartment being broken into. Despite that...yes, it was really stupid to leave the door unlocked. I guess I just got too comfortable in my little cocoon. At one point, I did have two keys, but my roommate accidentally took it with him, when he moved to NC. I didn't bother to ask him to send it back. Also stupid to not have made a copy, when that happened.

Lawyer: Spoke to a nice young woman for about 20 minutes. Her job appears to be to take down particulars and then the big law guys call you back if you "are a case they'd like to pursue". She seemed most especially interested in the details of abusive behavior. I'd assumed that would be the case, gave her the story and left it at that. I have 3 more people to speak with tomorrow. One is a friend who is a lawyer but does not practice civil law. I'm hoping he might know someone who does.

New Information: This just got a smidge weirder. Last night, after the incident, I called my best friend, in full weep mode. She did what best friends do, told me all the stuff I needed to hear and said she'd call me today after work, to check and see how I was. Today when she called, she had a story for me, from her office. This is secondhand, but heres the nuts and bolts of what she told me.

It seems that I was not the only Lancasterite to be paid a visit last night by a squad of 5 burly cops. Sometime around 3am, my friend's co-worker received a visit. Pound pound pound on door, scares this woman I'm gonna call Missy right out of her bed. She hustles downstairs to her door, thinking someone must be hurt, the house must be on fire, panicked and half asleep.

When she opens the door (this is exactly as my friend told it to me), shes greeted by 5 large male cops, weapons drawn, pointed at her. With 5 guns aimed at her, they ask her if they can search her house for her nephew. Staring at the FIVE FREAKIN GUNS in her grill, Missy instantly grants permission to enter. She knows her nephew is not in the house and is not concerned that the police will find anything because shes a law-abiding citizen. Plus, you know, did I mention the FIVE FREAKIN GUNS in her grill? Right.

Apparently, her nephew is wanted in Arizona for beating some guy damn near to death. His name is Jose.

She sits silently with her other nephew, a small child she is raising since the death of her sister, in her living room, while these men search her house. Other than to repeatedly ask her where Jose is, they apparently say little to her. These policemen search her entire house, and leave eventually (time unknown at present), satisfied that Jose is not on the premises.

This was at 3am. The police left my apartment around 10PM, the night before. Thats roughly 5 hours later. How many roving squads of FIVE burly cops can there be, roaming a city of just under 150k, on the same night, looking for a fugitive named Jose? Arizona and Nevada are awfully close (at least to me they are). Plus my magic eight ball says all signs point to yes, when I ask if its the same dudes.

Pretty please, I swear not to call anyone an asshat for at least a week, if it's the same guys. I might even go to Mass with my mother on Christmas, even though I've been an atheist for the last 16 years.

Best bud just left my place. She promised to relay MY story to Missy and find out what more there is to Missy's story. She seems to think that Missy would be inclined to at least be a witness of some kind, or even possibly a co-plaintiff. Missy, against all odds, is a Dem. In THIS freakin town, thats like a miracle all by itself. That makes 4 of us. I'll have to invite her to the secret tree grope next Tuesday.

[Hekate]

109. Thanks for the update.As to the confusion re LAPD vs City of Lancaster PD--my new city "borrows"...

...cops from the County. My unincorporated town has been around forever but only incorporated into a city a few years ago. As we are slowly building infrastructure we contract with the County (Santa Barbara) for various personnel and services like the police. They cruise around in City of Goleta police cars, but as far as I know still come from the County Sheriff. It is possible your city has a similar arrangement.

You are well in motion now. :hug: Think of me when you (carefully) hug that Joshua Tree ;-) Stay in touch here at DU.

Hekate

[blondeatlast]

117. It's very possible, if this has happened to a friend, that these AREN'T law enforcement.

Which is possibly even scarier.

In my area, there was a series of break-ins committed by a group claiming to be bounty hunters who actually weren't--they were, quite simply, criminals.

If you think for a moment that is a possibility, call the local paper and you might want to show them this thread because you have many details here.

[file83]

106. You live in L.A., and you left your house unlocked?!?

You are fucking LUCKY it was only the Police in your house. Are you crazy!?

All this 4th Amendment stuff is well and good and important, but it isn't going to protect your home from unwelcomed vistors when you leave your front door unlocked, even if it is just for a few minutes. If you felt it was safe, those are too often "famous last words".

Your story is a case in point - again, you're lucky it was just police.

This basic responsibility to keep your home secured is yours, and yours alone. If you had a spare key (you should always have several spares) you would have been able to avoid this entire fiasco.

I'd say those rude and unconstitutional cops were the wake-up call you needed to get your act together. So, stop focusing on the cops and start focusing on yourself.

[huskerlaw]

119. First of all,

she doesn't live in LA.

Secondly, Los Angeles isn't some crazy lawless town in which you're robbed or raped if you let your guard down for 3 seconds. Should she have locked the door, obviously, yes. But saying "you're lucky it was just the police" is ridiculous.

[file83]

120. So the LAPD aren't in LA?

That's news to me.

If you leave your door unlocked in any urban/suburban area of southern California, don't come crying to the DU when you come home and unwelcomed visitors are in your house.

That's my point. And it isn't ridiculous, it's responsibility.

[huskerlaw]

121. Did I ever say that? Nope.

But if you would take the time to actually read the thread, you would discover that the OP is from Lancaster, and apparently mistook the LA COUNTY Sheriff for the LAPD. Lancaster is 60 miles outside of LA.

[file83]

123. So the OP is irresponsible, got your point.

So on top of leaving her house unlocked because she didn't have a spare key (nor did she take the time to get a replacement), when she writes a post in the DU as a plight for help, she slanders the LAPD for something they didn't do? :wtf:

Umm...this lady needs to get her shit together. Not sure why it merits discussion here at the DU.

[geek_sabre]

112. Are you ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN

That these were police officers?

Don't wait around for the report to be filed, contact the police department and confirm that a) there is a warrant for this hispanic guy, and b) that the LAPD (or whoever) was sent to your home to investigate.

You knew what they were doing was illegal, so YOU should have immediately filed a police report. You should still do it, before the details get fuzzy. While it alone likely won't get anything solved, it is important to get the details on record. If this miraculously ends up going to trial, it will be your word against theirs, and since only their version of events will be on record, you'll come out looking bad.

Be sure to preserve anything that you saw them touching, in case you need fingerprints to ID them or prove they were in your home. In fact, when you file your report, ask them if they can check fingerprints against their officer records.

[Vadem]

126. Jeebus! This scares the hell out of me! Was your pet still in your

apartment? Please change your locks and get some keys--that is the most immediate thing you have to do!

Are we in a police state, yet, people?

[BlackVelvet04]

131. Please keep us updated. n/t