What blocking unemployment extension is really about:

[ProfessionalLeftist]

Making Obama fail. Making him a one-term President.

We are in an arguably weak economic recovery. One easy way to put the kaibosh on that is to refuse to extend unemployment compensation to those who will spend that money immediately in the economy. Whereas, in contrast, tax cuts for the rich just sit in their offshore accounts unspent - they don't NEED any more money.

This is why their assinine argument about unemployment adding to the debt (whilst extending tax cuts for the rich adds even MORE) makes no logical sense. 'Cause that ain't want it's about folks. And they know it. That's just the pretense. The REAL reason is that making the recovery (such as it is) fail means Obama fails. And THAT, folks is the Republicans' #1 priority. Period. NOT lowering unemployment. Not fixing the economy. Not health care. NOT anything else that helps the middle class or anyone but the corprats and the very rich. As for everyone else - you don't matter.

Boner said it. Joe Barton said it. They are 'declaring war on Obama'. That's it. They're not declaring war on high unemployment. Or any other problem faced by most Americans today. Just Obama. If they can kill in its infancy the current "recovery" (again, such as it is) - and keep it from ever taking another breath, they have 2012 in the bag. And THAT is all they give a rat's ass about.

[yourout]

1. Just once I would love to see him use the bully pullpit like this. Call a press....

conference or a televised address and say this.

"I am very much against tax cuts for the rich but right now the Republicans are holding extending unemployment benefits hostage to it so I have no choice but to extend them. If I do not do this millions of Americans will be bankrupt or out on the streets in the next 6 months so I have no choice but to sign it."

[knitter4democracy]

2. That's a good idea.

It's too partisan, though, so he won't do it. *sigh* I wish that grand talker we all voted for actually, you know, talked with the people and not the powers.

[yourout]

4. You would think by now he would understand what he is up against and.....

throw a few of his own political haymakers at them.

Put them on the defensive for a change instead of "thank you sir may I have another".

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdFLPn30dvQ>

[RKP5637]

24. The democrats always sound apologetic. I'm really tired of hearing appeasing behavior. n/t

[hayu_lol]

3. You hit the nail on the head with this thread...

Obama and the Dems will be the target if unemployment fails to be extended. All too many people, particularly those at the bottom of the food chain, are out of savings and other assets. They are hanging on by the proverbial skin of their teeth. Making this a political attack is the lowest of low blows.

There will be no job increases until corporate America is forced to return factories to this country if they want to do business here. We need those factories which provided the jobs we all once depended upon.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

16. that's another illogical BS point (not yours- theirs)

HOW in the freaking hell does anyone (especially on Capitol Hill - of any party) think that unemployment will EVER go back down when all our manufacturing and jobs are being sent overseas in favor of bigger corprat profits? I hear people on both sides of the isle including Obama talking about 'free trade' and how ohhh-sooo-wonderful it is and how it's something we "must" embrace (NO we don't have to), but at the same time talking about the high numbers of unemployed in the US and how that's a problem.

HOW THE F*CK are they going to fix it (not talking Repigs here because they don't give a flip about it to begin with) UNLESS we stem the outsourcing of manufacturing and jobs and can this 'free trade' shit?

Doesn't add up. Hellooo?

I don't think so.

Americans are being fed a huge pile of steaming bullshit even by their own party and their own President. Pfft.

[RKP5637]

25. And it's not just manuf. jobs going out of the country. R&D is leaving, hi-tech has been,

medical jobs are done remotely now out of the country, on and on. Some of the other job loses haven't been as dramatic as manufacturing, but they will catch up.

This is a nation setting itself up for complete failure for the majority of the citizens. The goal is reduction of the world labor rate to the lowest common denominator. The US will NEVER have healthy employment following the path it's currently on for fixing unemployment. It makes absolutely no F'en sense.

The majority of Americans are being made out as a bunch of suckers. These guys know precisely what they are doing in bringing American wages down to pennies on the dollar and a third world country. They know precisely what they are doing. The MSM spins a bunch of bullshit, rhetoric and propaganda.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

26. "They know precisely what they are doing"

They do. And they lie about it every day. I really think it will take a civil war to clean up the corprat rot in our gov't.

[SoCalDem]

43. Or..just let the sun set on the whole tax package

The middles are screwed anyway, so just let the thing drop off the edge, and then make THEM propose a fully-formed NEW plan..and then block them at every turn like they have done to us for 24 months..

Lay the whole canceled unemployment extension at their doorstep.

For too long now, the republicans have acted like recalcitrant toddlers who just say "NO" to everything.

It's high time that they were held accountable. They wanted to run thing, and we all know how bad they are at it.. Let them show their true colors..

[crikkett]

46. he has a choice. n/t

[Initech]

5. I have never seen such vile, outright hatred for a leader like the repukes display with Obama.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

12. And he doesn't seem to realize what he's dealing with

Honestly, he seems lost. Clueless. I'm certain he isn't (?) but :wtf:

[treestar]

75. Maybe you don't know what he is dealing with

[Kali]

20. I don't know

I felt that way about boosh and darth...

[knitter4democracy]

21. Nope. Clinton.

I've never seen my conservative friends rant and rave and go red in the face and scream about haircuts and crap with Obama like they did with Clinton. They still do it about Clinton and, worse, Hillary. I'm not saying they're sane about Obama, but they're not quite to the batshit crazy level with him yet like they were with Clinton.

[Initech]

22. No - what they did to Clinton was child's play.

Look at the birthers, the tea party, Glenn Beck, and all that ****. The hate flows through the freepers.

[knitter4democracy]

60. Impeachment was child's play?

Rush Limbaugh was worse than Beck from Day One with Clinton, the rabid right wasn't contained in a smaller group like the Teaists and instead throughout the entire party, and they dogged every single step he made. It was bad. It's bad now, don't get me wrong, and flat-out scary, but they learned how to destroy a president then.

[uponit7771]

31. Clinton didn't deal with 2 wars and collapsed financial and health system with KKKons protesting at

...every step

[knitter4democracy]

59. True, but he had Mogadishu and a divided country.

It was bad then, too, just not as bad as it is now. He also was a corporatist who ended up blinding by the powers that be and watered too many of his decent ideas down to nothing or worse.

[FiveGoodMen]

58. They're faking it.

The puke leaders, anyway.

They know full well that he's a critical part of THEIR plans and he's doing his bit perfectly from their point of view.

[Obamanaut]

72. To be fair, I read a lot of it here directed at Bush. And Cheney. nt

[2Design]

6. Die Quickly !!!! Grayson calls it like it is

[ProfessionalLeftist]

17. That's just it. "You. Not rich? DROP DEAD!" n/t

[DimplesinMI]

7. No, no....Let's Tell the TRUTH here

As a member of many active unemployment advocate groups, America's Job Seekers are NOT FOOLED! They know who is the issue and it is NOT the most of the House/Senate Democrats or Nancy Pelosi fault on why the unemployed are suffering this holiday season.

It is the direct weakness of President Obama manifesting itself on this issue and pretty much EVERY OTHER ISSUE THAT DEMOCRATS STAND FOR. Today, many unemployed watched that "Press Conference" and saw that he talked four paragraphs worth about some FREAKING tax cuts for Million and Billionaires, while during the Thanksgiving holiday, another job seeker gave up the fight and decided to take their own life. Probably because he or she could not afford to pay their bills for another month.

No, the unemployed are not fooled and they do NOT blame a majority of the Democrats for their plight. They blame two people/groups....The Republicans and President Obama!

[Skittles]

8. worthy of its own thread

yes INDEED :thumbsup:

[RKP5637]

10. +1, n/t

[emilyg]

15. +1

[ProfessionalLeftist]

19. Unless he fights them, he is certainly to blame.

I don't see a whole lotta fight in Obama, sorry to say. And yes, I voted for him. But - his idea of bringing tea and 'diplomacy' to a fight with jackbooted Nazi thugs ain't gonna work.

[uponit7771]

33. President Obama also killed Bambi because of the same reasons you listed :rolleyes:. This shit gets

...laughable

[DimplesinMI]

35. While you laugh....

Somewhere is America, a child is going to be hungry going to school next week because their parent just lost the ONLY source of income (supplemental unemployment extensions) on December 1st at 12:01 am.

That is not so funny now, is it? :puke:

[Skittles]

63. yeah, keep on laughing

it is surprising you can do that while your head is firmly stuck in the sand

[SammyWinstonJack]

70. +1000! The blame is well deserved and rightly placed.

[RKP5637]

9. In fact, the republicans have declared WAR on America. I wish the D's would

stand up and say that!!!

[ProfessionalLeftist]

11. They should - including Obama. n/t

[RKP5637]

13. Yes!!! Agree!!! n/t

[RC]

14. some of us out here in the real world have been saying just that.

Usually including the word Treason along with it.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

18. You won't get any argument from me on the use of that word. n/t

[RKP5637]

23. It is Treasonous IMO. The republicans sound completely un-American to me. IMO they are

trying to bring the country down. They seem to represent wanting a new America that is completely antithetical to the founding of this country. The more I listen to their goals it sounds like anarchism. You listen to them and it's really hard to conclude otherwise, especially the RW.

[neverforget]

27. Bernie Sanders speech on the Senate Floor today was awesome. I kept thinking

too bad that wasn't Obama giving that speech. The fire and the passion.....

[ProfessionalLeftist]

29. That would have been nice. Obama is not much of a fighter.

*sigh*

[DimplesinMI]

34. Well, if the beginning of your fight begins with....

(This is my summary of President Obama's position)...."We will negotiate with Republicans to give Millionaires and Billionaires tax cuts because we know, these are the job creators in this country. Also, as for the unemployed....well, if they just try or beg harder, they will get a job. Meanwhile, the unemployed can wait, until we negotiate the all important Tax Cuts with the GOP first".

You do not have much of a fight to worry about at all....

[ProfessionalLeftist]

28. Just watched Bernie S. on Rachel. He said the same thing.

ie: they're doing it to make Obama fail. 'war on Obama' 'one-term President'. He also said Obama needs to rally his supporters and other Dems and hasn't done it (obviously). WTH is the matter with him? The majority of Americans would support him if he'd just freaking fight!

[uponit7771]

30. At some point it's time to get rid of Tim Kaine, If dems where doing this they'd be in jail...

...by now if the message was getting delivered by kkkons

[TK421]

78. I agree with you on that one nt

[laughingliberal]

32. Yes. Lovely. I just read where Obama may delay his vacation in order to shepherd the deal on tax...

cuts for billionaires. Can't have them all worried about their taxes right here at the holidays, for heavens sake! Wonder why he couldn't delay the vacation to kick some serious butt over people who are about to lose all their income at the holidays.

Oh, right....that wouldn't be very bipartisan of him.

[DimplesinMI]

36. Lord knows...

He could not ask Congress to delay going home for the Congressional recess period to work out the unemployment extensions before the September break but, for Tax Cuts....well, let's just stay in Washington, D.C. and "get-her done".

WOW, JUST WOW!!

[ProfessionalLeftist]

51. Noted. I've heard not a peep out of him about unemployment extension

Only about 'compromising' on the tax cuts ie: letting the rich keep them. Pfft.

He oughtta be out there calling Republicans out on their selfishness and saying exactly what the OP here does. As should all other Democrats.

[SpiralHawk]

37. The k and the r

Why do republicons HATE America?

[inna]

38. you really think Obama gives a shit about the plight of the unemployed?

or has a slightest intention to even RUN in 2012?


all evidence points to the contrary. please feel free to enlighten in case I missed something.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

39. Yes And Yes

He would be a lot more bold if he didn't think he has to worry about being reelected.

[DimplesinMI]

40. Umm...No and No is more like it

I have no idea how many times I have to point this out but, here it is again. On November 30th, during a Press Conference, President Obama gave 15 minutes to discussing is upcoming negotiations of the Bush Era Tax Cuts. Those same tax cuts will add $700 Trillion Dollars to a 13.7 Trillion Dollar deficit.

Meanwhile, at the SAME press conference, President Obama give three sentences (yeap, that is how much the unemployed is worth in his or his speech-writers opinion) and less than a minute, on the call to pass unemployment compensation for 2 Million of the nations' jobless. The extension would cost $56 Billion dollars to the same deficit and assist many in paying their bills, place food on the table or place gas in the car to look for work.

Fifteen minutes....less than a minute.

NO, President Obama does not care about the plight of the unemployed and I agree with Inna, he sees the writing on the wall and probably will not consider running, in 2012.

It is time for this Republican light President, to go.

[SammyWinstonJack]

71. Well he did say that if his policies fail or failed to be enacted that he would not seek re-election

That was blood in the water for repukes. Obama asked for this, along with his BS bi-partisanship.

[Zebedeo]

41. Unemployment insurance

is supposed to be a TEMPORARY assistance to people who lose their jobs. It is not designed to last for years and years. I understand the beneficial attributes of having a safety net for people who lose their jobs, and I fully support that. But at some point, there has to be an end to benefits. It cannot be a program that PERMANENTLY pays people not to work, using money taken from people who are working. That would set up perverse incentives that would discourage people from working and encourage them to simply rely on the unemployment insurance.

The question, then, is HOW LONG should the UI benefits be available. 99 weeks is almost two years. What would you propose as a limit? Do you agree that there should be a time limit at all?

I actually think that having some definite limit is not only fiscally responsible (since the funds for the program are borrowed from China), but also economically advantageous, since it creates an incentive for people who have lost their jobs to find new ones, or if they are unable to find new ones, to start a business of their own. To those who would say that starting a business takes significant capital - not necessarily. There are many people who have started eBay businesses and the like with virtually no capital. What is essential is that people have the motivation to get off the couch and work for it. Not sure where I read this (probably here on DU), but my understanding is that a high percentage of the unemployed who have their UI cut off get a job within a couple weeks after their UI ends. I think that is telling. UI can have very salutary effects in certain cases; but in other cases, it can create a dependency and can decrease the motivation to find a new job.

And yes, I know that it is hard to find a job in this economy. But it is not impossible. Open the classified ad section of any paper. There are jobs available. Employers are looking to hire people.

I am NOT saying that UI should be eliminated or shortened or reduced. I am just saying that it IS necessary and desirable to have SOME time limit on it.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

48. Sorry to disagree.

You must be living in a different world, mentally or otherwise. You wrote:

And yes, I know that it is hard to find a job in this economy. But it is not impossible. Open the classified ad section of any paper. There are jobs available. Employers are looking to hire people.

So what? Wal-mart greeter? Dishwasher? (I know people with masters degrees that can't even get that) Ever tried to make a living and make ends meet when underemployed ie: part-time or on minimum-wage? What about those over 50? There are few jobs for those under 50 and fewer still (ie: NONE) for those over 50, with few exceptions.

Limit? Well, I recently read that the Fed (ie: Goldman Sachs) says unemployment will remain unacceptably high (not that it has to but no one is interested in doing anything about it) for at least another 5-6 years. So, how about that for a limit?

If they want to use unemployment compensation as an excuse for 'reducing the debt', then they should get their asses busy and make damn sure there are hella lot more jobs out there than there are now. AND let the bu$h tax cuts expire for those making over $250K. But - they won't. Because - well, that makes too much sense.

[Zebedeo]

53. There is no shame

in being a dishwasher or a Walmart greeter. Someone who does an honest day's work is admirable, even if they are "underemployed" because they have a Master's degree in art appreciation. The point is that people who have been unemployed for two years or more need to change what they are doing. And to just pay them indefinitely (or for 7-8 years, as you suggest) not to work has the potential, in some cases, to sap their motivation to find a job. It creates an incentive that tends to make it easier to just stay unemployed, and collect government payments instead of earning a living.

[erodriguez]

67. "Earning a living" is not putting you and your family in a hole.

Minimum wage or near minimum wage jobs put and keep people in poverty. A person who is a professional or has an advanced degree loses out on their professional and educational investment when they are working for peanuts in a job in which they are overqualified.

Our country needs to invest in our workers. It needs to capitalize on our skills; instead of letting them atrophy through unemployment or underemployment. It should hire us.

And should those skills not meet the current market needs, it should re-train the unemployed and put them to work.

Two years is a long time to be out of work...but when corporations are hoarding cash and using workers desperation and pain against them...when the wealthy continue gain in terms of power and percentage of income...it is wrong to place the burden and blame on unemployed workers.

[mstinamotorcity]

74. I want to know how long

you think someone who has paid unemployment insurance for twenty-five years and now they are unemployed,should get????I get tired of people acting as if people on unemployment are asking for a handout. They pay into the system with every week of work. And its not like they are getting what they made before they were unemployed. I see its okay to take someones money for the insurance but help them please if they need it!!!!! This is a stronghold tactic to drive down wages and bust unions.This is Privatization on steroids. President Obama being a one-term President is the bonus plan. They have already said they would like to lower minimum wage.

[Chisox08]

79. What about those who apply for jobs on a daily bases but

don't even get a response from those employers

[coalition_unwilling]

52. Yipes! The national unemployment rate hovers around 10% (and

here in California hit 12.4% as of October 31).

And your solution to this is to cut off extended unemployment benis at 99 weeks for those who are already in the federal program, deny extended benis to those who are not already in the federal program and have those cut off start e-bay businesses?

Forgive me if I've mis-stated your position. If so, exactly what do you propose for the 2 million people slated to lose their extended federal benis in the next month?

[Name removed]

55. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tavalon]

57. Time for a WPA

Well past time, I'd say.

[TK421]

77. All for it....why isn't this talked about more often? It doesn't seem to get coverage

go for it...it should be discussed, it should be implemented

[Kat45]

65. That's bull. I've been unemployed for 2 years and NOT collecting.

I worked for a church, and when you work for a church you are not eligible to collect unemployment. I have ZERO incentive to not find a new job. In the past two years, all I've found are occasional part time/temporary jobs (usually with low pay). I've been supplementing by meager earnings with my savings, ie money I EARNED when I had a good job in previous years. As my savings is getting depleted, I'm going to have to try to find things to sell, but that's just a one-time thing, not the source of a steady income. I don't have any particular skills to create my own business.

I cannot be accused of lacking motivation to find a job because of UI payments--since I don't get UP payments. There are almost NO JOBS out there. On two occasions when I have been called about a job, I was told that 60 and 120 people had applied for the job. I did not get those jobs. Being over 50 also does not make me a highly desired person to hire. So, with two years of virtually no income, I do not lack the motivation to find a new job.

[Zebedeo]

66. If you would be so kind as to give me your state and city,

I will endeavor to find you job opportunities there.

[Kat45]

68. I am in the Boston area.

Very few jobs advertised, and when there is a job opening, they will wait until they find the person 110% perfect for the position. I am never that person.

[Zebedeo]

69. Here's what I've found so far:

craigslist

There are over 500 posts which were posted today offering a wide variety of jobs. Another 500 or so posts yesterday, etc.

monster

more than 1000 jobs

bostonglobe

thousands of openings advertised

Don't give up. There are jobs out there. I wish you good luck in finding one that is right for you.

:)

[Gormy Cuss]

76. Take a closer look at the craigslist postings.

Many are duplicates in order to have the listing show up in multiple skill categories. Many others require specific skills or attributes that limit the pool (surrogacy, for one.) Others are "internships" and other positions with dubious possibility for pay.

Unless there's been a seismic shift in the Globe's classified section I would imagine that at least one third of the ads are for similar positions based on my own experience with that newspaper. In addition, a certain number of professional ads are posted even though a leading candidate has already been identified.

It's very easy to sit back and use raw counts from craigslist et alia to say there are brazillion jobs out there but it's coarse measure that is meaningless for the individual job seeker. Whenever unemployment in an area is above 5% or so, it's an employer's market for all but the most specialized jobs. That means that they can and do set the barre very high. Employers don't need to take a chance on someone who doesn't have the perfect background when they're attracting many applicants who do have the precise c.v. sought.

[GoCubsGo]

42. And, he's letting them get their way, it appears.

WTF???

[piratefish08]

44. Obama's inability to fight back is making him a one-term President.

the President always has opposition.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

49. I agree. He's digging himself and the country into a hole

that we will never get out of.

[LWolf]

45. It's not all about Obama.

It's about corporatism, capitalism, and eroding the power, and quality of life, of the masses. About concentrating power and wealth with the few.

It doesn't matter who is president; the goal is the same.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

50. Yes. The goal has always been thus. But it has heretofore been thwarted

by REAL Democrats and REAL Democratic Presidents ie: FDR for instance. "I welcome their hatred" said he.

So should Obama. Instead, he's chauffeuring it through. I don't argue with that.

And Republicans of course are glad to help him because as the country falls further and further into third-world status, Obama will be blamed and Republicans will have 2012 all sewed up - which is their primary objective sans much else. And that's where the OP came from - that spot right there. Just like corprats have always been wrestling for control of everything on the planet, that has always been the Republican priority - themselves.

Obama's priorities however are a little less clear -- but are becoming clearer all the time - supporting them in their selfishness. That he calls himself a Democrat makes this inexcusable. They certain find common ground there. :-\

>>>Still doesn't change the fact that Republicans are hellbent on making him a one-termer as well -- and that that is what is behind their otherwise inexplicable refusal to extend unemployment benefits.

[LWolf]

54. Agreed.

:(

[raccoon]

47. Ding, Ding, we have a winner!

"They are 'declaring war on Obama'. "

Yep,and just like the parent who abuses a child just to piss off the other parent, or the ex-spouse who trash talks the other parent to a child to turn the child against the other parent, they don't care a hoot in Hades who gets hurt in the process.

[GoCubsGo]

56. That's a great way of describing it, raccoon.

It's like we're all the kid in "Kramer vs. Kramer". Especially those of us who need a job.

[PM Martin]

61. If he truly cares, then Obama MUST make much noise about this.

[RainDog]

62. Then Obama should answer that war with an uzi.

instead of oozing bipartisan bullshit.

there's nothing tactical, three-dimensional or any other bullshit explanation for Obama not simply recognizing the state of emergency that exists for millions of Americans today - he needs to use his presidential power to tell congress to go fuck itself.

if he doesn't - then, yeah, who cares if he's in office. the republicans do what they want anyway.

[lonestarnot]

64. I believe you missed the donkey with that tail./tale too.

:eyes:

[4dsc]

73. Its about LEADERSHIP and lack thereof

If the president is not going to stand up for the average joe who is?