What kind of a deal would Obama have to get so most here would

[samrock]

NOT say he caved??

Can he make any kind of deal that does NOT have those earning above $250k ( married ) lose their Bush tax cut without being considered to have caved???

[gateley]

1. I'd be happy with a $1 million as the dividing line - but we need the revenue

and can't afford to add that lack of income to the deficit. AND it's not fair for those earning far less to pick up the tab.

I don't know if I'd consider it caving, bit I'll be greatly disappointed if he extends this cut.

Will you be okay with a "temporary" extension?

[samrock]

4. Ya know .. I wish he would just be content to let the tax cuts all go...

I think IF the republicans REALLY thought he would they would crack.. they know that the house next year will never produce a tax compromise the senate and Obama would want.. and if there was NO new tax cut.. then they would risk seeing the economy recover.. the deficit drop and they would have 0 credit to claim.. thats what happened under Bill Clinton.. there is NO way they could let unemployment compensation continue to not be passed.. there would be marches on the congress.. it could get real ugly..

[gateley]

8. That's why I like the $1 mil mark. The Republicans would have a harder time

claiming "oh, those poor small businessmen are going to get a tax hike and won't be able to hire anybody", and those who most need it would still get their break.

And I agree. they can't keep letting unemployment continue not to be passed.

[mazzarro]

14. It Did Not Prevent The Economic Downturn - So Why Will It Make Much Impact Now?

Hiring in general is not going to be much different whether the bush tax cuts are allowed to lapse or not. It has not made much impact in preventing the economic downturn for the past decade that it has been in existence. And Dems should slap down this argument and call the teapublicans' bluff on this.

[BzaDem]

18. That's faulty logic.

Just because the middle class tax cut portion of the package didn't prevent a recession doesn't mean the recession wouldn't be worse if we remove them in January.

Likewise, just because the recession occurred doesn't mean it wouldn't have been worse without the stimulus.

Job creation is directly tied to consumer demand. Pulling out 310 billion per year from the poor and middle class is a HUGE hit to consumer demand.

[gateley]

20. We know that, but the Repubs have brainwashed the masses it appears. nt

[Goldstein1984]

2. Fewer than 2% of Americans make > $250,000

So I'd say that he'd be alienating even more of his "base" for a very small demographic boost. Of course, that 2% runs the country, so he'd be playing the power game very well by caving to the ruling class.

[Iggo]

3. How is that not caving?

[BzaDem]

5. You are assuming that people would EVER be satisfied with any elected Democratic president,

under ANY scenario.

That's not a valid assumption. He could somehow get through the middle-class tax cuts only, and they would STILL say he is the caver-in-chief. You can't deal with irrational people.

[tkmorris]

15. No, you sure can't

Still disparaging DUers I see. Good luck with that.

[treestar]

22. Agreed. "caving" equals not getting what the poster calling him that

wants, exactly what they want, and what they want will change depending on what happens.

[msongs]

6. let tax cuts expire - submit new legislation for middle class cuts & dare repubs to vote against nt

[samrock]

7. unfortunately next year the house will be controlled by the

republicans.. all tax measures must start in the house.. they will NEVER pass such a bill..

[BzaDem]

11. Yeah. They won't even bring up such a bill in committee, let alone on the floor. n/t

[TwilightGardener]

9. House Repubs--and a number of Dems--already voted AGAINST tax cuts for the middle class.

There must have been a resulting huge outcry and a media firestorm against the Republicans, but I didn't see it. :eyes:

[asdjrocky]

10. I can't speak for everyone, but for me he caved long ago.

On too many things, and far too often.

[laughingliberal]

12. He needs to not extend tax cuts at all for anyone with income over a million.

An extension of the tax cut for those over $250,000 for a couple of years would be acceptable for me IF we got an extension of unemployment benefits for 9 months, not two months and back to fight again and not offset by other cuts or by using 'unspent' stimulus funds. Throw in the 'fix' for AMT, the doctor 'fix' for 2 years, and the repeal of the 1099 regulation and I'd call it a deal.

[laconicsax]

13. I think this one is equitable to both sides:

We get:
-2 year extension of unemployment insurance.
-Tax cuts on those making less than 250k

They get:
-A stick with a note telling them where to shove it.

If this isn't fair enough, I think the following additional concessions would be appropriate:
-They agree to end holds on Obama's appointees.
-We agree to invite them to a pizza party.

Since I'm sure there would be quibbling about how to pay for the pizza party, the following compromise seems fair to me:
-They agree to pay for the party out of their own pockets.
-We agree to reduce costs by only inviting Congressional Democrats.

[TheKentuckian]

16. You describe caving. Are you asking how he can cave and save some face?

[ibegurpard]

17. keep lower and middle class tax cuts only or veto whole thing

only two acceptable options for me

[iamtechus]

19. NO "DEAL"

[treestar]

21. There is none

If Obama were so insane as to let the middle class tax cuts expire, there would be a zillion posts about how he betrayed the middle class.

[hedgetrimmer]

23. He's full o'shit! Like every other politician.

He goes to Afghanistan while this is going on. Biden is the sit in quarterback. Obama is not the man we thought he was. He talked a good game but he ain't playing one. I voted for Obama, not Biden.

Obama can say FUCK YOU, here's my executive order, bitch! He can do his own signing statements, he can make it the way the US people want... then I won't say he caved.

But, he's being a pussy.

[Overseas]

24. Why would he need to compromise at all? To prove the GOP right that Dems are wimps?

The GOP knows that millions who voted for Obama in 2008 stayed home because they were so discouraged by the compromises made in his first two years, and in spite of the lists of actual accomplishments.

The GOP knows that their obstructionism and 100+ filibusters worked. They stood strong and the Dems capitulated. The Dems gave in and tossed out their most economically effective ideas and begged for one or two votes and didn't even get those sometime.

The GOP knows they crashed the economy with their tax cuts for the top 5%, and if they could oppose the most effective Democratic policies like Medicare for All and massive, necessary infrastructure repair projects, the economy would still be tanking in 2010 and they could win back more seats.

They also knew the sweet Democrats didn't filibuster the right wing judicial activists they had nominated to the Supreme Court so they would have unlimited campaign funds to further their aims in 2010.

The GOP knows the public is yearning for a line in the sand-- a place where the suffering of the 98% gives Democrats the courage to oppose the cruel demands of the Top 2%. So they'll keep stirring up the anti-government frenzy in the public and complaining publicly about how our president doesn't compromise with them enough. To see whether they can get the Democrats to give in to more disastrous economic policies that will help them in 2012.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

25. Well, we could say he, acquiesced, surrendered, bowed, sold-out, stuck it to us, bent over.

[ZombieHorde]

26. He could throw in legalized marijuana. nt