Tax cut deal can't be changed, Biden tells House Democrats

[cal04]

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/132815-tax-cut-deal-cant-be-changed-biden-tells-house-dems

Vice President Biden told House Democrats on Wednesday that the tax agreement the White House struck with Republicans was essentially final, forcing the divided caucus to decide whether to press its fight for changes in the package.

"It’s up or down," Biden told the caucus in a closed-door meeting, according to Rep. Yvette Clarke (D-N.Y.).

"So far as the administration is concerned, it's take it or leave it," Rep. Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.), one of the most vocal critics of the tax deal, told The Hill after the meeting. "I would say was pretty specific about that."

(snip)
“There remain very serious reservations on the House side, and there’s still a serious question about whether this package can pass in the form it’s in now,” said Rep. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), who had been the chief House Democratic negotiator on the tax talks before the White House cut its own deal with Republicans.

[NightWatcher]

1. Down! Maybe next time Obama will meet with the Dems first.

[tomm2thumbs]

26. DOWN!

waaaaaay DOWN!

[msongs]

2. yep the republicans might get mad at obama if it's changed lol nt

[Catherina]

3. So now they dictate from the top down? Vote no. Vote fuck no! n/t

[AndrewP]

4. So I'm assuming the administration is pretty confident if they are saying that

I'm geniunely curious as to the reports that many Democrats weren't brought into this whole thing earlier.

[peacebird]

then vote it DOWN.

[Poll_Blind]

5. Oh look how hard-line the President & VP can be to force the deal down Dem throats!

Line in the sand!

PB

[Angry Dragon]

6. Where was this up or down when it cam to

public option or single payer??

He sure gets feisty with the democrats, but kisses the republicans

[Foo Fighter]

23. Public option and/or single payer were never on the table.

The health insurance companies wouldn't allow it.

"He sure gets feisty with the democrats."

Hell yeah he does! And some people say he has no fight. Pfffft.

[bigtree]

7. the President will sign any modification on the deal the Democrats produce

Biden was probably just looking at the votes and trying to hold whatever coalition they thought they had together behind the original agreement instead of scattering and losing votes.

[displacedvermoter]

30. Just Biden being Biden again?

[MindandSoul]

8. I vote DOWN!

[bluestate10]

22. I agree. nt

[mmonk]

9. Down

the toilet.

[closeupready]

10. If Dems vote it down (and they should but won't), it will embarrass Obama

This is a unique time in American history, or at least recent American history. I have never EVER seen a party leader fumble and bumble from one band-aid to another, snapping at his erstwhile supporters, "this is what you get, and you better like it, because you ain't getting anything else!"

He's behaving disastrously. At this point, I'm worried about the party, and the repercussions of having such a weak leader.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

12. And, it should embarrass him..and his Repub allies.

[Autumn]

11. Down. n/t

[Greybnk48]

13. Remember those scam door-to-door sales people?

It was always "this deal is only good for today". That's what the Vice Prez seems to be doing--bogus pressure sales.

[Luminous Animal]

14. So the executive branch now controls the legislative branch, eh?

Edited to add, no doubt there is an implicit threat in there, "If you don't play on our side, we'll cut off all funding for your next campaign."

[Poll_Blind]

15. "It's fair to say that he said, 'We've negotiated with the Republicans, but we're NOT going to...

...negotiate with the Democrats," Rep. Anthony Weiner (D-N.Y.)

How fucked is that?

How sad is that?

People should read that WHOLE article!

PB

[femrap]

16. Gee, I love the way this Dem

prez works with the Dem Congress. 'Take it or leave it.' It sounds similar to that other prez...'You're either with us or against us.'

It's immoral to give the top 2% more money....more money to send out of the country to invest in hedge funds and commodity bubbles. They don't create jobs with this money.

Never mind the deficit.

Does this prez really think the base will knock on doors for him in 2 years?

[Laelth]

17. That's insane.

I think it's very unwise for the President to stick to his guns on this issue in the face of such widespread opposition from his Party.

It confirms the general impression that he's willing to play hardball with the left, but never with the right.

I am quite sick of this.

-Laelth

[Kablooie]

18. Leave it and let the R House come up with something to keep their jobs next term.

[ArcticFox]

19. I vote for "vote it down"

I'd rather not continue kicking our problems down the road by continuing to pretend giving money to the rich is an inherent plus for the economy (it is not), continuing to deplete government revenues by refusing to make rich people pay in proportion to the benefits they receive from the infrastructure of this country, drastically lowering the tax on accumulated wealth that rich families are able to pass from one generation to the next so that their offspring can become more and more useless to society while their wealth multiplies by its sheer mass, and continuing to live in fear of starvation and homelessness when there is certainly enough wealth in this country to house and feed every single person if only we didn't actively redistribute everything up to those at the top.

Yesterday, I heard Obama saying his "deal" was a good one because it nets the middle class 2.5 times the benefits that it nets the rich. But each of the richest 1% of people has something like 40 times the wealth of each of the rest of us (on average). So why shouldn't we poor souls get 40 times the benefits given to the rich?

(The above 40 times figure is according to my quick and not necessarily 100% accurate analysis using these tables found at http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html):

Table 1: Distribution of net worth and financial wealth in the United States, 1983-2007
Total Net Worth
Top 1 percent Next 19 percent Bottom 80 percent
1983 33.8% 47.5% 18.7%
1989 37.4% 46.2% 16.5%
1992 37.2% 46.6% 16.2%
1995 38.5% 45.4% 16.1%
1998 38.1% 45.3% 16.6%
2001 33.4% 51.0% 15.6%
2004 34.3% 50.3% 15.3%
2007 34.6% 50.5% 15.0%

Financial Wealth
Top 1 percent Next 19 percent Bottom 80 percent
1983 42.9% 48.4% 8.7%
1989 46.9% 46.5% 6.6%
1992 45.6% 46.7% 7.7%
1995 47.2% 45.9% 7.0%
1998 47.3% 43.6% 9.1%
2001 39.7% 51.5% 8.7%
2004 42.2% 50.3% 7.5%
2007 42.7% 50.3% 7.0%

Total assets are defined as the sum of: (1) the gross value of owner-occupied housing; (2) other real estate owned by the household; (3) cash and demand deposits; (4) time and savings deposits, certificates of deposit, and money market accounts; (5) government bonds, corporate bonds, foreign bonds, and other financial securities; (6) the cash surrender value of life insurance plans; (7) the cash surrender value of pension plans, including IRAs, Keogh, and 401(k) plans; (8) corporate stock and mutual funds; (9) net equity in unincorporated businesses; and (10) equity in trust funds.

Total liabilities are the sum of: (1) mortgage debt; (2) consumer debt, including auto loans; and (3) other debt. From Wolff (2004, 2007, & 2010).

[bluestate10]

20. Start the war early, defeat the package. Then stonewall republicans for

2 years like republicans did democrats. Democrats can't allow themselves to be beaten at the sound bite game this time. If democrats go along with the Obama tax plan as hatched, the democratic party is lost. Next will come brutal cuts in social programs and Social Security, all the while the gap between rich and poor will grow larger.

[Individualist]

21. Down!

[demwing]

24. WAIT! I Thought Obama LIVED For Compromise?

Where is that desire to reach across the table and work out issues to the mutual benefit of both parties? Helloooo?

I guess that's a measure of respect only the Republicans deserve. Dems just get the big "Fuck you, talk or walk, baby!"

Hey Obama? Here's the "Fuck You Back" - Do what ever you want, Mr President. But in 2012, you either hit the road willingly, or through more forceful measures, you jack ass.

[tavalon]

25. How about up yours Biden

Stupid move on your bosses part.

[kath]

29. And up yours, Mr. Prez.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pa28]

28. Down. He picked the wrong time to dust off the bully pulpit. n/t

[Supersedeas]

31. take it or leave it--no compromise, no consultation--not backing down to Dems??

[Bluebear]

32. So they negotiated with the Republicans ONLY. Nice.

Whatever, White House.

[City Lights]

33. Down!

:thumbsdown:

:wtf:

[AuntPatsy]

34. Smoke and mirrors, good cop bad cop, the more things change the more they

Fail to show proof.......

[Hannah Bell]

35. lol. so the gop maneuvered to put *democrats* in the position of voting *against* "middle class"

tax cuts.

how machiavellian of them.

it could have been obama calling out the pubs. oh well