Can I clear up a fundamental misunderstanding?

[Very_Boring_Name]

People aren't upset that Obama didn't get the public option, or DADT, or other such progressive ideas passed, they're upset that he didn't try, and indeed, even lobbied against them in some instances. I keep hearing people say "You expect him to wave a magic wand and make all your wishes come true" -- No, I expect him to fight for the things he promised, even if he fails at accomplishing them.

[cowcommander]

1. Actually, he did. Just not hard enough.

[Very_Boring_Name]

2. Not really

I know that when the HC debate was going on, and there was hope that the public option would make it into the final bill, we learned that behind the scenes the white house was trying to stop it from getting in.

[calimary]

4. Similar problem with the midterms in general. WHY did he get involved in the last

several weeks of the campaign? WHY wasn't he out there banging away from, say, JANUARY? Does he truly NOT understand who/what he's up against, and how relentless they're fighting him? Why, with these wavering Senators who may or may not blah-blah-blah, WHY did he not take it to their front yards, going to Maine, going to Massachusetts, going wherever - to make his case and suck up all the oxygen in the local media and dominate the news cycle and frickin USE HIS BULLY PULPIT????? What the hell was with this "hastily called news conference" yesterday morning when he and his advisors evidently just woke up and noticed there was a firestorm out there? WHERE were the news conferences AT LEAST once a week - to control the narrative and ACT, thus forcing the bad guys to REACT? WTF???

Dammit, people want a FIGHTER!!! Even the assholes in the wrong-wing, they don't care if they're honest or lying or bending the truth like a pretzel or correct or incorrect, they still get out there and just FIGHT LIKE HELL. And I think the average Joe respects that. Remember how dubya used to campaign, back in 2004, with "you may not agree with me, but you know where I stand"? That is SO CRITICAL to victory!!! That is SO critical to managing the perception YOUR way instead of your opponents' way. It's SO critical to project at least the IMAGE of having a backbone. For the Love of God! What the hell is he doing?

:banghead:

[Suich]

9. Oh jeez, calimary!

You said it so much better than I did down thread!



:yourock:

[calimary]

16. Awww...

:hug:

But doesn't it just burn you up? This is The Fiery Orator Guy, okay? SO WHERE IS IT????? WHY has he not turned all the burners on, up FULL, and KEPT them on? It just frustrates me to no end! You've got the bully pulpit, sir. The one WE ALL worked our frickin' tails off throughout 2008 to make sure you won. Use it or LOSE IT, Mr. President!!!

[HughBeaumont]

19. Then again, it's not like R's and Bewsh had to fight all THAT hard for what they wanted.

Not when most of your "D"s were (and are) pretty much "R"s. Makes the "fight" a little easier.

Humans are being conditioned to believe that progressive movement forward is like an illness that only those benevolent corporations and the arch-right wing can remedy. It's kind of why people still think Clinton and Obama are "lib'rul Comm'nists"; anyone who thinks that is, of course, a complete idiot. But that's what the media does.

[Segami]

21. Well said!! The confusion ( others see it as betrayal ) here I believe is that Obama's speeches

don't quite align with his actions. Its the old ' say one thing, then turn around and do another '. Even the repukes, while spreading their lies, distortions and vitriol, are cohesively passionate and remain fairly focused on swaying public opinion. It would seem such actions are above Obama's pay scale but the passion comes out when he wants to scuttle a deal ( like the public option ) from behind the scenes, then he decides to go into overdrive and begin firmly asserting his position.

[Very_Boring_Name]

23. +1

[bobbolink]

31. On the other hand, WHY did he insert himself in Dem primaries, when the PEOPLE are supposed to have

the say????

And, he did that early on... the game was rigged.

He gained NO FRIENDS with that dumb move! :grr: :nuke:

[myrna minx]

33. Excellent. n/t

[immoderate]

36. "you may not agree with me, but you know where I stand"

That's amazing. There's something about that that makes you want to vote for it. Crazy. But it works.

--imm

[CBGLuthier]

25. The 1919 "Black Sox" put on more of a show of an effort.

While throwing the world series.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

26. The public option was -

used as a negotiating point by Obama -- he nerve fought for it because he never had any intention of it being included in the final plan. It was one of the very first things given away, along with reimportation of drugs.

[thanks_imjustlurking]

30. "Given away" - that's what's been happening. It's infuriating. nt

[CaliforniaPeggy]

3. Exactly right.

Yes. He didn't even try.

Thank you so much.

[Lord Magus]

5. Yes, he did try.

But in the end, when the votes aren't there in the ludicrously undemocratic Senate, all he can do is ask senators to change their votes. He has no ability to force them to.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

27. Sorry, read up on it --

it was strictly a negotiatons tool, never really meant to be enacted.

[nashville_brook]

35. actually, he didn't even caucus with the Dems on the Tax Giveaway to the Filthy Rich

didn't even bother to show his face and make his case.

[Suich]

6. I agree.

What I heard him say in his press conference was that he either "passed or tried to pass" the issues we're talking about: Gitmo, DADT, Public Option, etc. I don't think he has kept us informed of his efforts at all.

I feel like we got sand kicked in our face for 8 years under shrub, and another two years under Obama.

Maybe he should hold more press conferences.

:shrug:

[leftstreet]

7. K&R

[chill_wind]

8. At the very least, we should be able to expect him to not try to revise history

and to go as far as even denying what he campaigned on and claiming he didn't.

Here's one of those whoppers:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7300576#top

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gateley]

11. I've also heard criticism that his negotiations didn't start out strong -- like

instead of starting with public option, he could have started with Medicare for all or something that he knew wouldn't pass, then go from there.

[rucky]

20. That's how the other side does it.

[laughingliberal]

12. K & R nt

[lob1]

13. I agree. Plan A should not be to fold.

[jannyk]

14. Totally Agree. Fight the good fight - dammit! n/t

[napi21]

15. I"ve read akk the oists so far & hink there's something everyone is not

realizing. Pubs are viscious and hateful, an dems are simply NOT! The Dems always try to get somnething done for the people, wether it be common people or smalll businesses. The Dems really are Not the nasty people like the Pubs are and they don't lie all the time. i'm not sure if I want the Dems to change to lying and slamming the Pubs with their own tactics or if I should hope that the American people to recognize what the truth/lies really are. There are so many iesbut I feel guilty suggesting that we lie too.

[OneGrassRoot]

18. We don't even need to lie....

We just need to get on the same page and hammer the truth home with a unified effort. We need to control the message. Then fight and stand strong.

Republicans control the message and say lies so often I think even THEY start to believe them.

We suck at controlling the message; maybe that's why Dems, including President Obama, don't fight as a whole because the message gets so watered down.

And maybe, at least in the recent past, this is because Obama's message starts off in such a gray area they lose sight of WHAT they're fighting for.

Honestly, I'm very confused. It seems that President Obama starts off in the middle, and we end up with a compromise that is almost an entirely Republican position.

:shrug:

[KT2000]

17. Agree with you

We heard the tax sell-out from Axelrod a while ago. Then the WH denied it. Then next thing we hear - it's a done deal. Isn't the public part of the equation here? Someone on tv (Sekoff I think) said that he should have campaigned across the country for this. We have heard nothing and had no idea what was being bartered.

And then to strike out at Democrats after he conducted everything in secret? No - he should have explained this better.

[mstinamotorcity]

22. And I expect

for those who expect and see him working, since the days before he took the oath, knows he is working to get the votes. This is not his fault. He is only one man. And has many issues that are of importance also. I expect us to keep up the heat, but not burn down the kitchen!!!!!You have a right to be disappointed in the process of Government, but you must look at ALL the issues surrounding our President and know that each issue is of equal importance to the affected group. And of ALL the legislation that has passed how ever inadequate you or others may think it is, WHAT WOULD DUBYA DO??Easy to listen to lies about our Government, Hard to hear and see the truth.

[snot]

24. It's also a NECESSARY part of negotiation --

you have to show that you're willing to AT LEAST invest some time and energy into making your case; and you have to sound like you MEAN it -- and then you have to actually NOT compromise once in a while, so people will know that at least some of the time, you're serious about it.

And getting your positions out clearly and consistently, for the benefit of the other side and for the watching world, helps persuade EVERYONE in the vicinity of the rightness of your positions -- esp. when your positions are RIGHT.

It's negotation 101, and many other DU'er's have said it before me.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

29. And you have to ask for the moon -

to start, and then settle for what it is you really want. Negotion 101a.

[tomg]

38. Negotiation 101?

Hell, that is Remedial Class Negotiation. I have done negotiations, and seriously, I don't think he even sees himself as negotiating. I have been trying to figure it out, and I think he sees himself as a teacher following a model where he moderates a discussion amongst a group of students and from their discussions a consensus will emerge. Its not like he brought a knife to a gun fight. He brought a box of dunkin donuts and coffee for everyone.

[readmoreoften]

28. Thank you for stating the simple truth.

I don't expect him to change anything. I expect him not to hand the keys over to the Republicans and the Banks and then clink wine glasses with them before berating Democrats in the media.

[Canuckistanian]

32. In a nutshell. Right.

Bill Press made that VERY point on his radio show yesterday.

[Toucano]

34. And BINGO was his name-o!

That's exactly the point.

And no, some half-assed, weak as water "fighting" doesn't count.

[amborin]

37. K&R