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KingOfLostSouls Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 05:49 PM
Original message
The honeymoon is over
who else didn't see this coming, honestly?

the MSM is no friend to dems and they really pulled a big one on us this time. they gave NO coverage to the only two qualified candidates (biden and bill richardson) and instead pimped out clinton and obama onto the world. two people with enough baggage and history and inexperience to fall right into it.

now as we're seeing over the past couple weeks, they've really put the thumbscrews to them. with mclame wrapping up the repub nomination, they know they've got their boy. they were hedging their bets incase there was a last minute surge by huckabee, but they knew they had to have romney or to a lesser extent mclame. up til then it was all puppy dogs and cookies and sweets for the two junior senators.

now its going to be every dirty scandal, every dirty deed, ever person with any kind of questionable past who even has their name mentioned in the same paragraph as they do.

and we're sitting here thinking to ourselves, they wouldn't have gotten away with it if this was joe. joe would have eaten them alive, he has a clean past. no weird preachers, no weird business partners, no shenanigans. I mean, the media is just having a field day helping these two tear each other apart. they've helped take a once secure presidential election and turned it completely around.

and the idiots were more excited to vote for "change" and "experience" and ignore the only real person who has brought change THROUGH experience.


the MSM really lead these guys into it, they gave them enough rope and helped them put the noose over their heads. now they're pulling it nice and tight and slowly taking the chair away. at least its a bittersweet victory for us to say we supported the guy who could have, and SHOULD have, gotten it done.
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bluemom Donating Member (21 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 06:14 PM
Response to Original message
1. Amen
You are so so Right- although even if it was Joe- they would have been flogging the plagiarism thing to death ( Wow that's so horrible?)
We were force fed these two candidates- the first black man- the first white woman- and now the Dems are at each others throats (except for this group of course)
just as some one wanted it. They had a casting call and we got Clinton and Obama- we didn't get the smartest guy in the room- Joe Biden. Pity...
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 08:17 PM
Response to Original message
2. well stated, esp. about change THROUGH experience
One of the reasons I wanted Biden (on top of his many qualifications and qualities) was I felt like I could see parts of this scenario playing out (though nowhere near this ugly) - that this election could be losable, but Biden would be absolutely the most electable if people paid attention.

I bet most Americans, even the ones who vote, didn't start paying attention to this until after Iowa, when it was too late for Biden, Richardson, or Dodd.

I've had moments of warming a bit more to either Obama or Clinton, or feeling like one or the other would be better against McCain but at this point (moreso Obama on that one), I don't like either of them enough to consider myself even a verbal supporter. I'll vote against McCain and hope for change.

For all Dems love to bash Republicans for being stoopid, the GOP played their cards VERY smart this time. Thanks to the media <--> money and all that.

:cry:
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 08:22 PM
Response to Original message
3. Many of us saw this coming,
but I have to say, I never thought it would be this bad. And why is this Pastor Wright a huge story all of a sudden? It is not like the man was some deep, dark secret. He's been a public figure in Obama's life for two decades, but until now he was invisible.

My head is spinning right now - having hard time believing that any of this is real.............
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 08:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. to be honest, I haven't read anything about it
other than headlines which give me the gist of preacher connection to Obama made offensive remarks and thus a problem or something.

Just couldn't get the energy up to dive into that. I feel powerless. I gave what little money I could to Biden, and it didn't do any good, and I don't have the money or inclination to really support Hillary or Barack.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. I had been out of the loop for several days
and when I returned, it was like some bizarre alternate reality. "Powerless" is an apt term, as well as depressed. In spite of losing our candidate, I really tried to see something positive in all this, but it is getting really difficult. Even the pundits have become rather subdued and somber. Pastor Wright was beyond offensive. The videos of his sermons were extreme and inflammatory, hardly spiritual or inspiring. Once again showing that religion and politics should never share the same stage and perhaps it is time that churches lose their tax-exempt status once and for all.

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1corona4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 06:59 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. Here ya go...
I've seen a few of his speeches.....most of them elevating blacks, and tearing down whites and the system....I've been commenting about this church all along, and everyone has just brushed it aside.

Obama Denounces Pastor's 9/11 Comments


Email this Story

Mar 15, 7:14 AM (ET)

By NEDRA PICKLER

(AP) Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., left, shown here with his pastor, the...
Full Image



WASHINGTON (AP) - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama on Friday denounced inflammatory remarks from his pastor, who has railed against the United States and accused the country of bringing on the Sept. 11 attacks by spreading terrorism.

Obama called the statements appearing on television and the Internet "completely unacceptable and inexcusable" in a Fox News interview and said they didn't reflect the kinds of sermons he had heard from the Rev. Jeremiah Wright while attending services at Chicago's Trinity United Church of Christ.

Obama, a member of the church since the early 1990s, said he would have quit Trinity had such statements been "the repeated tenor of the church. ... I wouldn't feel comfortable there."

Earlier Friday, Obama responded by posting a blog about his relationship with Wright and Trinity on the Huffington Post. Wright brought Obama to Christianity, officiated at his wedding, baptized his daughters and inspired the title of his book, "The Audacity of Hope."


Obama wrote that he's looked to Wright for spiritual advice, not political guidance, and he's been pained and angered to learn of some of his pastor's comments for which he had not been present. Obama told MSNBC that Wright had stepped down from his campaign's African American Religious Leadership Committee.

"I categorically denounce any statement that disparages our great country or serves to divide us from our allies," Obama said in his blog posting. "I also believe that words that degrade individuals have no place in our public dialogue, whether it's on the campaign stump or in the pulpit. In sum, I reject outright the statements by Reverend Wright that are at issue."

In a sermon on the Sunday after the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11, 2001, Wright suggested the United States brought on the attacks.

"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Wright said. "We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost."

In a 2003 sermon, he said blacks should condemn the United States.

"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people. God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

He also gave a sermon in December comparing Obama to Jesus, promoting his candidacy and criticizing his rival, Hillary Rodham Clinton.

"Barack knows what it means to be a black man to be living in a country and a culture that is controlled by rich white people," Wright told a cheering congregation. "Hillary can never know that. Hillary ain't never been called a nigger."

Obama told MSNBC that he would not repudiate Wright as a man, describing him as "like an uncle" who says something that he disagrees with and must speak out against. He also said he expects his political opponents will use video of the sermons to attack him as the campaign goes on.

Questions about Obama's religious beliefs have dogged him throughout his candidacy. He's had to fight against false Internet rumors suggesting he's really a Muslim intent on destroying the United States, and now his pastor's words uttered nearly seven years ago have become an issue.

Obama wrote on the Huffington Post that he never heard Wright say any of the statements, but he acknowledged that they have raised legitimate questions about the nature of his relationship with the pastor and the church. He wrote that he joined Wright's church nearly 20 years ago, familiar with the pastor's background as a former Marine and respected biblical scholar who lectured at seminaries across the country.

"Reverend Wright preached the gospel of Jesus, a gospel on which I base my life," he wrote. "And the sermons I heard him preach always related to our obligation to love God and one another, to work on behalf of the poor and to seek justice at every turn."

He said Wright's controversial statements first came to his attention at the beginning of his presidential campaign last year, and he condemned them. Because of his long and deep ties to the 6,000-member congregation church, Obama said he decided not to leave.

"With Reverend Wright's retirement and the ascension of my new pastor, Rev. Otis Moss III, Michelle and I look forward to continuing a relationship with a church that has done so much good," he wrote.

Also Friday, the United Church of Christ issued a 1,400-word statement defending Wright and his "flagship" congregation. The statement lauded Wright's church for its community service and work to nurture youth and the pastor for speaking out against homophobia and sexism in the black community.

"It's time for all of us to say no to these attacks and to declare that we will not allow anyone to undermine or destroy the ministries of any of our congregations in order to serve their own narrow political or ideological ends," John H. Thomas, United Church of Christ's president, said in the statement.



http://apnews.excite.com/article/20080315/D8VDR0GG0.html
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livvy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
5. All Dems are going to have to work really hard no matter who the nominee is.
Even if we have to hold our noses, cross our fingers, and practice in front of a mirror our most convincing bald-faced lying face of conviction, we will need to fight our butts off to convince people to vote for the Dem candidate instead of McCain. We will need to do whatever we can to communicate to people that a vote for McCain is a vote for more years of the Bush regime.

It is hard to believe, incomprehensible to understand, but there are a lot of people out there that will not do the roadwork, will not think beyond their vision of the sadly puffy face of the poster boy for aging veterans, so abused and mistreated by our former enemies, and the one who can keep us safe, because he knows what it is to be a warrior. I've already heard the "new" Bush despisers rationalizing McCain as a reasonable and prudent choice.

They will not know of, nor make the connection that he is merely a continuation of what has caused so much trouble for themselves, the country, and our standing in the world. They will hear the word maverick, and feel comfortable with the idea that he will be the change that is needed. What they won't understand is that the change will be worse, and the maverick does not lean toward the change that they need and desire.

We have our work cut out for us. I just hope that when a Dem candidate is chosen, we can come together, forget this ugliness in the choosing, and get our candidate in our White House.

We don't have any other viable options. This is critical. Our government and way of life is poised in a very precarious point right now. We have shifted dangerously far from the original intent of the Founding Fathers. If we don't defeat McCain, or it may be virtually impossible to regain our Republic without another revolution.
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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Mar-14-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. I just read some scary stuff about Iran
I was extra busy this week, lots of long meetings, so I didn't listen to the radio as I usually do. I missed the Cheney middle east visit, Fallon resignation, etc. hinting toward movement toward Iran. If they time it so this happens this fall, hello Commander in Chief McCain :scared:
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CrispyQ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Mar-16-08 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #5
13. I agree with every word you say. Especially this:
"If we don't defeat McCain, or it may be virtually impossible to regain our Republic without another revolution."

I wish Skinner would tombstone every poster who says they aren't going to vote if their candidate doesn't win.
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Steely_Dan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 01:53 AM
Response to Original message
8. Well Written and...
spot on.

Yes, I for one, did see this coming. I simply didn't think it would get this bad.

-P
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
10. I don't FEEL GOOD about EITHER of them.

At this point, I'm out of it except for voting Dem in the GE. I still haven't decided if I'll write in Joe or vote for one of 'them' in my state's primary.

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Muttocracy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. same here - I just can't get interested. yet another round of vote for the less bad

Being in NY, I'll be tempted to write in Joe since thanks to the electoral college my individual vote means little.
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PatSeg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Mar-15-08 10:26 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Welcome back Gateley!!!
:hi:
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gateley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. Hey, tsegat!
Just dropping by for a couple of minutes every day or so --

Don't care enough to post "out there" -- just coming by to see how you guys are doing.

Hope all is well!! :hug:
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Eurobabe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Mar-17-08 06:28 AM
Response to Original message
14. Don't fool yourself, the MSM would skewer whomever our nominee would be
There is literally no mention of Old Man McLame in the news. How he flies to Bagdhad while Rome is burning. :shrug:
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