ZELAYA ACCEPTS THE UNITY GOV'T. PROPOSAL and Pinochettis Reject It

[magbana]

I should have read the replies on the previous post. thanks to IndianaGreen

This article is way confusing. Telesur is saying the same thing.
magbana

July 18, 2009 - 9:46 PM Print this story Send this story RSS Feed

Honduras' Zelaya accepts unity proposal


By John McPhaul and Ana Isabel Martinez

SAN JOSE, Costa Rica (Reuters) - Ousted Honduran President Manuel Zelaya agreed on Saturday to give his enemies a share of power if he is allowed to return to office, but they rejected any deal that puts him back in the presidency.

Zelaya, who was toppled in a military coup on June 28 and is in exile in neighbouring Nicaragua, backed the proposal for a government of national reconciliation put forward by the mediator in talks aimed at ending Honduras' political crisis.

Zelaya also said in an interview with a Honduran radio station that he would return to Honduras in the coming days despite warnings by the de facto government that he would be arrested.

Costa Rica's Nobel Peace Prize-winning president, Oscar Arias, is trying to broker a compromise deal between Zelaya and interim president Roberto Micheletti, the former speaker of Congress who replaced him in a June 28 military coup.

A new round of talks opened in Costa Rica on Saturday with Arias laying out seven points for discussion, including Zelaya's return to power to complete his term ending in January 2010 and the formation of a coalition government with all the country's political parties represented.

Arias also proposed an amnesty for any political crimes committed after the coup and that Zelaya abandon his plans to hold a referendum on extending presidential terms.

But a spokesman for Micheletti's interim government again insisted it will not allow Zelaya's return to power.

The Honduran army was on maximum alert and boosted its presence in Zelaya home region of Olancho, where about 100 of his supporters gathered on his ranch, and other places seen as possible points of return, an army source said.

The coup triggered the worst political crisis in Central America since the Cold War and poses a challenge for President Barack Obama as he tries to improve U.S. relations with Latin America.

Zelaya upset Honduras' business elite and moderates in his own Liberal party with his leftist policies and rhetoric after taking office in 2005, allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez.

The military ousted Zelaya and whisked him out of the country, accusing him of violating the constitution by trying to extend presidential term limits.

Zelaya vowed from exile in Nicaragua on Friday to return to Honduras "one way or another," regardless of the outcome of the negotiations. His wife Xiomara Castro told Reuters that Zelaya had set a Saturday deadline for a deal in the talks.

Zelaya protesters marched near the airport in the capital Tegucigalpa on Saturday.

(Additional reporting by Simon Gardner, Esteban Israel, Gustavo Palencia and Juana Casas in Tegucigalpa, and Ivan Castro in Managua; Writing by Louise Egan; Editing by Anthony Boadle)
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[IndianaGreen]

1. According to El Pais, the golpistas rejected the proposal

which makes Zelaya look good.

[magbana]

2. Exactly. you hit the nail on the head

[IndianaGreen]

3. Any reports, other that Madrid's El Pais, of the golpistas response?

I haven't seen anything on TeleSUR.

On edit:

Or on the righwing Globovision. They just reported Arias' proposal, but nothing on Zelaya's acceptance or on what Micheletti's reaction is.

[flamingdem]

7. They are still negotiating via Twitter ten minutes ago

http://twitter.com/fernandofrancia

[IndianaGreen]

9. Reuters is reporting that Micheletti rejected the proposal

But a spokesman for Micheletti's interim government again insisted it will not allow Zelaya's return to power.

The Honduran army was on maximum alert and boosted its presence in Zelaya home region of Olancho, where about 100 of his supporters gathered on his ranch, and other places seen as possible points of return, an army source said.

The coup triggered the worst political crisis in Central America since the Cold War and poses a challenge for President Barack Obama as he tries to improve U.S. relations with Latin America.

http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSN1749101420090718

[magbana]

12. Now this is dangerous. The only reason for Zelaya to accept

(moved this reply from the IKN post to here where I meant it to go in the first place)

this proposal is if his aides at the Costa Rica meeting could absolutely verify that the Pinochettis would refuse any proposal that involves Zelaya returning as prez. In reality, when the Pinochettis said they would not accept the proposal, Zelaya's folks should have walked out and begun an immediate p. r. campaign focused on the message: "we've been patient, we compromised and accepted the 7 point proposal and the de facto regime refused to accept it. Honduras has to get back on its feet and Pres. Zelaya needs to return immediately." That way Zelaya is no longer bound to the 7 point plan, can return in a fashion whereby he does not devastate his supporters, and still gets kudos from the international community for originally agreeing to the plan.

Getting back to the negotiating table with these people now is a slippery slope.

[flamingdem]

18. However if Zelaya returns arrest or worse is a result that could take things backwards nt

[magbana]

22. Yes, the threat to Zelaya is very real. I'm just not sure that a proposal

brokered by a very duplicitous Oscar Arias who was anointed by Hillary ensures any safer entry into Honduras than what Zelaya may be planning now. As Fidel said in his latest reflection, Hillary's insertion of Arias into this process ensured that the issue would be dealt with in a manner well beyond the purview of the OAS and the UN. And,the exclusion of the OAS and the UN achieved Hillary's primary purpose, making sure that Chavez, Ortega, Correa, and Morales were not able to participate.

I think the only way for Zelaya to get home safely is to use every bit of assistance he obviously has been offered by his allies - Chavez, Ortega, Correa and Morales.

[Downwinder]

4. He bested them strategically and diplomatically.

Viva Zelaya

[flamingdem]

5. Radio Progreso is saying that the United States knew about and helped the golpistas

An announcement is being repeated that the US has to stop being ambiguous at this dangerous time. They are specifying actions that Llorens did but I didn't catch it all.

http://www.radioprogresohn.net

[EFerrari]

6. How anyone can believe the Honduran military would move w/out our green light

is BEYOND me.

[Downwinder]

8. I don't think the question is a green light but whose finger is on the switch.

or

what secret CIA project got canceled?

[EFerrari]

10. The pattern is pretty clear. Progressive democratic governments

all over Latin America are being targeted. Funes in El Salvador better watch out. And Lugo, too.

[Downwinder]

11. Have to remember that

the Bay of Pigs was CIA but the Tonkin Gulf was military

[IndianaGreen]

13. Actually, Gulf of Tonkin was also CIA

CIA had been conducting covert operations against North Vietnam, including:

South Vietnamese special operation forces, part of an American covert intelligence effort known as Operation Plan 34A (or 34 Alpha)

http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/54/106.html

[Downwinder]

17. I stand corrected, I didn't know that the Maddox was under CIA control.

Thanks for the link. It would be nice to still have Republicans like Wayne Morse.

[magbana]

14. At the top of the 7PM news, Telesur is reporting that the Pinochettis have refused the proposal

and no talk of additional negotiating.

[IndianaGreen]

15. So there it is!

Now the world must pressure the US to freeze Honduran assets in US to bring the golpistas to their knees.

[magbana]

16. The Telesur correspondent in San Jose is saying that discussions are

continuing at Arias' house. Jeez, I'm dizzy from trying to keep up with this. Old age,

[Judi Lynn]

19. Remarkable the corporate media is openly pretending Zelaya's intention to return

is a terrifying act of agression, painting an image of him as the wolf standing outside the house of the three little pigs, trying to blow it down.

Sadly this is the best we can expect from these "journaists" by now. The time for credible, honest news reporting is long gone, if it ever really existed at all. You have to wonder if it ever really did!

[Downwinder]

20. Do they name the Pigs? Immanently appropriate.

First little pig -- the military
Second little pig -- congress
third little pig == Supreme Court.

Which house? Straw, wood or stone?

[Judi Lynn]

21. If they lose control of the military they are using as a weapon against the people,

it will be as if their house is made of grass clippings.

Hope more soldiers will be taking this problem to heart.

[Peace Patriot]

23. "leftist policies" and "allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez"--specifics, please!

"Zelaya upset Honduras' business elite and moderates in his own Liberal party with his leftist policies and rhetoric after taking office in 2005, allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez."--from the OP

Let me just lay out what these things mean, in practical terms--as far as I understand the situation from widespread reading...

--Zelaya raised the minimum wage and improved health care for the poor ("leftist policies").

--Zelaya joined ALBA, the Latin American barter trade group organized by Venezuela, and immediately gained a benefit for Honduras in cheap oil from Venezuela; he said at the time that US-dominated "free trade" was not benefiting Hondurans--"allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez" and the six or so other ALBA countries).

--Zelaya proposed that the US/Honduran military air field in Honduras be converted to a commercial airport--"allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez," Ecuador's Rafael Correa (who is evicting the US base at Manta, Ecuador), Paraguay's Fernando Lugo, Bolivia's Evo Morales, and others--and most Latin Americans--who do not want the US military in their countries, and view it as a matter of sovereignty.

--Zelaya proposed an advisory vote of the people on reform of the Constitution--thus "allying himself with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez, Ecuador's Rafael Correa, and Bolivia's Evo Morales, all of whom recently led Constitutional revision processes in their countries, which resulted in greatly improved civil rights and other benefits. Latin Americans view their constitutions differently than we do. They frequently re-discuss, re-write/revise and re-vote on their constitutions, as Thomas Jefferson suggested that we do, every couple of decades. There is nothing unusual about this, in Latin America. In proposing this advisory vote--which didn't even have the force of law (more of an opinion poll)--Zelay was thus "allying" himself with those who want fundamental reform in Latin America, as opposed to those who like things as they are (generally, the entrenched, corrupt rich elite).

It is important not to just glide over a phrase like "leftist policies." What did he do? What did he propose? All beneficial, it seems to me, and democratic. Zelaya became allied with Venezuela's Hugo Chavez--and many others--because they have similar social justice policies which he, as president, feels are in the interest of most Hondurans.

[IndianaGreen]

24. Zelaya also raised teachers' salaries

Public school teachers that is. Honduran elites send their children to private schools, as do the Venezuelan elites.

[Peace Patriot]

26. Just found this thread--great detail on Zelaya's anti-poverty policies

Important info...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=405x19328

[lexanman]

25. Much of the Honduran government and court system

is SOA trained and installed and goes back decades. This is not a country where people democratically elected or appointed people to influential positions. The Honduran constitution was written by SOA trained puppets and supported by an SOA influenced legislature and judiciary.

[Peace Patriot]

27. Yes, and it is badly in need of reform, which will likely be one of the casualties of the coup,

whether or not Zelaya returns to fill out his term (this year). They have likely stopped the reform movement--probably the point of it all, from the US military and corpo/fascist point of view (in addition to their hidden oil war agenda).

That is what the coup government is fighting for now--being part of a coalition government in order to blockade reform--and also legitimize themselves as candidates for elections which will be conducted in their coup-terrorized nation. All on the plus side for them, whether Zelaya returns or not.

I also want to say how much I admire Zelaya's courage and his strong effort to return with no coup conditions upon him. He may not win that battle, but he is very right in insisting upon it. He also has nothing to gain, personally, in fighting for Honduran democracy, and much to lose, including his life. He could have thrown up his hands, when he was exiled at gunpoint, and settled into a comfortable life in exile, in any number of countries, and written pamphlets against the coup. He chose to fight for Honduras and its people. Frankly, in the beginning, I didn't think he had it in him. He seemed a latecomer to the leftist movement that has swept over the region; a member of the Oligarchy (whom someone here--Downwinder, I think--has called "Don Zelaya"--Don Zelaya trying to save his soul). (Ha!) But he has proved his mettle and his good intentions. Also his reforms in Honduras were more substantial--and more of a threat to the Oligarchy--than I had realized. (I also had not heard of his proposal to convert the US airbase in Honduras to a commercial airport. If I had known that, I think I would have realized what a threat he posed, not just to the Oligarchy in Honduras, but to the Bushwhacks and their war plans.)

I guess I showed my own prejudice, thinking that a timber baron, and one of the "born to rule" elite, could not be a genuine champion of the people. I forgot about Simon Bolivar! I forgot about our own FDR. Also, Honduras has been a "black hole" as to news. It was very hard to find out what was going on in Honduras before this happened. I did try, but I couldn't find much out. I knew he had turned against the Bushwhacks, and joined ALBA, but the Bushwhacks were on their way out, at that point (or so we thought). Was he just blowing with the wind? I've substantially revised my opinion of Zelaya since that time. I was particularly impressed with his flight into Honduras and attempt to land, last week. (And where was the USAF in Honduras while that was happening--the president of the country being prevented from landing in Honduras?) That took guts! He was walking right into the arms of the coup, to be arrested. How ironical that, having trumped up an arrest warrant against him, they didn't let him return! That effort--at risk of his life--exposed both their fraud, and US inaction. It was brilliant. And it is likely that only a man with genuinely good intentions--quite apart from his own ambitions--would have risked it. No, he did it for the principle of democracy and the right of the people to reform their government. He is not likely to ever be president again, after this term ends. It will likely be years before the reform movement gets on its feet again. And he will be demonized as a "divisive" figure in any future elections, and the Oligarchy backed by the US will fight like hell to prevent any move to let him run again.

So, what is he fighting for? Why risk his life? Why persist? For the future of Honduras, and the well-being of its people and of the region as a whole--which is now in fear of more rightwing coups.

I was also not aware of this whole McCain-Negroponte-Reich-Bolton "axis of evil" focusing on Honduras, nor that Negroponte was advising Clinton on Honduras (Good God!).

This coup in Honduras has taught me a lot about our corpo/fascist media and how they drill corpo/fascist "talking points" even into the heads of people like me, who try hard to be alert to their brainwashing, lies and disinformation--and also how their "black-holing" of information (our simply not knowing) affects our judgment of events and people. I actually, for a time, bought their "talking point" that Zelaya was trying to extend his term limit--which turned out to be entirely untrue. I didn't think that was bad. (FDR was elected to four terms in office!) But I bought their "talking point," for a time, that the referendum he was proposing was about term limits. One more lesson, I guess, in questioning even the most basic facts in corpo/fascist 'news.' They LIE. They really do. Often.

[lexanman]

28. excellent post

spot on

[Downwinder]

29. I used the "Don" honorific advisedly because Zelaya is earning it.

I give respect where respect is due.