Is President Zelaya leaving Honduras? VanW has some info:

[EFerrari]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=405&topic_id=27589&mesg_id=27591

[VanW]

1. More info:

Wednesday, December 9, 2009

President Zelaya Heading for Mexico?

El Tiempo confirms reports from other media, including Telesur, that President José Manuel Zelaya Rosales is leaving Honduras and will be welcomed in Mexico.

Reuters has a report saying the same, from 22 minutes ago, citing "a politician close to Zelaya", saying
He is going to leave the country today for abroad. He is leaving of his own will.

Telesur and Tiempo identify their source as Enrique Flores Lanza.

Tiempo and La Tribuna report that the Honduras Chancellor has already signed a safe conduct for a car from the Mexican embassy to pick up Zelaya, his wife, and two children, and convey them to Toncontin airport where a plane from Mexico, sent for them, landed at 7 pm. Tegucigalpa time.

Flores Lanza said that Zelaya would establish his family in Mexico, then go to Havana for the ALBA summit.

Update: Radio Globo is broadcasting an interview with President Zelaya in which he states that he has not sought asylum in any country.
...



...
President Zelaya, on questioning, has said he is not going to confirm plans as he does not have firm agreements yet giving him permission to travel.

The Mexican government limited its comments to Tiempo to confirming that a Mexican airplane is on the way to Tegucigalpa.

The Washington Post reports that a spokesman for the de facto regime's Foreign Ministry, Milton Mateo
says the safe-conduct pass was signed and would be delivered to the Brazilian Embassy.
Meanwhile, Zelaya is playing guitar live and singing on Radio Globo...

http://hondurascoup2009.blogspot.com/2009/12/president-zelaya-heading-for-mexico.html#links

[Judi Lynn]

8. Thanks for breaking the story here!

Welcome to D.U., VanW. :hi:

[VanW]

9. Thank you

Twitter was first, more or less.

[rabs]

16. At about 4:30 p.m. Honduras time hooded police approached the main gate of the embassy

The golpista media, including TV stations, were reporting that Z. was about to leave the diplomatic mission.

Supporters of Z. went to the embassy but the reports, for now, have been debunked by Zelaya in an interview with Globo.

Z. said on Globo that he had not sought, did not want, and would not accept asylum in other country.

CholusatSur declined to report on the rumors and said that if it had done so, it would have been closed immediately ... but that the golpista media can get away with broadcasting such rumors.

I also heard Z. playing the guitar. His strumming was okay, but his singing baaaaad ... LOL ...

(Welcome to the Latin American forum :hi:

[VanW]

18. Thanks, rabs

I've been reading this forum for quite a while. Glad to see an oasis of sanity... ;)

[rabs]

19. Check out CholusatSur right now, it is repeating an earlier broadcast that includes the rumors

8:56 Honduran time

http://www.cholusatsur.com/


Fyi gorilobo was to fly to the Dominican Republic tomorrow. That trip had been canceled after protests in the DR.


(editing to correct that it is Pepe Lobo, not goriletti, who was to fly to DR tomorrow.)

Yesterday in San Jose, Arias told Lobo that Micheletti had to resign before he (Lobo) is inaugurated on Jan. 27 if Lobo wanted other governments to recognize him. The Panama president joined Arias in that position.

[VanW]

21. I can never get that to work

on my computer. x(

I didn't know about the protests in DR. Good for them!

[EFerrari]

24. LOL

Desentonodo mi compa!

[rabs]

39. si, desafinado total ...

... es mejor que siga como politico, porque como cantante se muere de hambre !! :rofl:

[VanW]

2. Saw a rumor on Twitter

that the Mexican plane that was going to pick up Zelaya in Teguz was denied permission to land, then diverted to San Pedro Sula, then diverted to El Salvador. Not sure what the significance of that is.

If anyone with better Spanish skills than me would like to check in with Radio Globo, Canal 11 (live outside the embassy) or other sources, that would be great.

[lunamagica]

6. What I've read from the Honduran press

Is that he was authorized by the government to leave tonight, so I doubt it's being diverted

[VanW]

10. Yeah, that rumor doesn't make sense

Here is where I found it, in any case:

tayuso: Mexican Airplane sent for Zelaya was denied the right to land in TGU, later sent to SPS and finally touching down in El Salvador.
http://twitter.com/tayuso

[VanW]

11. Apparently that rumor is from El Heraldo:

"Update: El Heraldo minute-by-minute column says the Mexican plane has diverted to either San Pedro Sula or Comalapa, El Salvador."

http://hondurascoup2009.blogspot.com/

[VanW]

14. More from El Heraldo

"09:20pm Aeronave. El avión de la fuerza aérea mexicana que venía a Honduras para trasladar a Manuel Zelaya aterrizará en unos minutos en el aeropuerto internacional de Comalpa en El Salvador, ante el giro que ha dado esta situación.
09:19pm Comunicado. Cancilleria mexicana ha dicho en un comunicado que no tiene información de Manuel Zelaya vaya a México.
09:13pm "Mel". Yo soy presidente de Honduras hasta el 27 de enero de 2010. Yo no he pedido asilo, no necesito asilo no lo quiero, dijo el ex presidente a CNN.
09:12pm Zelaya. La información mientras no se verifique nosotros no podemos pronunciarnos sobre ella, dijo Zelaya, respecto a su supuesta salida.
08:59pm Giro. La aeronave que venía a Tegucigalpa será desviado al aeropuerto de Comalapa en El Salvador, o al Villeda Morales en San Pedro Sula, informaron medios radiales, ante la negativa de Zelaya de salir bajo un salvoconducto."


Apparently a "safe conduct" agreement was not made, so the plane diverted to El Salvador. A lot of contradictory info.

[Judi Lynn]

3. AP chimes in with the obligatory deprecatory language:

Honduras to let Zelaya leave country for Mexico
Ousted president has been holed up in the Brazilian Embassy for months


updated 47 minutes ago
TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras - Honduras' interim government says it has authorized ousted President Manuel Zelaya to leave the country and go to Mexico.

Foreign Ministry spokesman Milton Mateo says the safe-conduct pass was signed and would be delivered to the Brazilian Embassy, where Zelaya has been holed up since sneaking back into the country Sept. 21.

Mateo said Wednesday night that the Mexican government has sent an airplane to pick up Zelaya and his family.

Another official of the interim government's Foreign Ministry said Mexico requested that Zelaya be given safe conduct to leave.

A Mexican government official, speaking on condition of anonymity, says the matter has been under discussion but can't confirm any arrangements have been made.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34354769/ns/world_news-americas/

[Judi Lynn]

4. Xinhua even knows about it:

Ousted Honduran President Zelaya to leave for Mexico in exile
2009-12-10 10:41:10

TEGUCIGALPA, Dec. 9 (Xinhua) -- Ousted Honduran President Manuel Zelaya will leave the country Wednesday for exile in Mexico after nearly three months staying in the Brazilian embassy in Tegucigalpa.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2009-12/10/content_12622745.htm

[VanW]

5. Al Jazeera English:

David Romero, director of Radio Globo, a station that supports Zelaya, said on Wednesday that the ousted leader was seeking some assurance from the de facto government that he would not be arrested if he left the Brazilian embassy.

A Mexican government source told the Reuters news agency that Zelaya would arrive in Mexico on Wednesday night.


http://english.aljazeera.net/news/americas/2009/12/2009121023956759398.html

[EFerrari]

7. Al Jazeera reporting the president will fly to Mexico.

Heartbreaking.

[Judi Lynn]

12. Hope the coup government won't try to get the last word by having President Zelaya killed

between the sanctuary of the Brazilian embassy and the airplane.

Hope the Mexican government has already taken his vulnerability into account and will provide adequate protection.

Hope time will change this bad situation and he will be able to return to the country, and the home where his family has lived for hundreds of years.

[EFerrari]

13. If anything happens to Mel Zelaya, our government will be directly responsible.

I hope we're better than that.

[roody]

22. We are, but our government is not.

[EFerrari]

23. . . . .

:(

[VanW]

15. BBC: Confusion over Zelaya exile bid from Honduras

Confusion over Zelaya exile bid from Honduras


There are reports that ousted Honduran President Manuel Zelaya is about to leave for exile in Mexico but it is unclear if and when he will go.
Sources close to Mr Zelaya indicated he would leave Brazil's embassy in the capital, Tegucigalpa, where he has been holed up, and fly to Mexico.
But Mr Zelaya told the Telesur broadcaster he was not about to leave.

...

Sources close to Mr Zelaya said he wanted to leave the country but it was not confirmed whether he would be allowed safe passage.
However, the AFP news agency quoted the head of the Honduran Civil Aviation Authority as saying a Mexican plane was en route to pick up Mr Zelaya.
The Associated Press news agency quoted a Honduran foreign ministry spokesman as saying a safe-conduct pass had been signed.
But Mr Zelaya told Telesur he would not leave the country as an asylum seeker. He insisted he was still the president.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8405133.stm?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

[VanW]

17. Another wild rumor on Twitter

says that Zelaya may try to go to the Mexican Embassy in Tegucigalpa which apparently is next door to the Brazilian Embassy.



I'm getting the impressiong that the golpistas may not grant Zelaya safe passage, even just to get onto a plane.

[VanW]

20. Venezuelan diplomat Diego Arria

is dropping a lot of hints and bits of info on his Twitter page:

http://twitter.com/darria


Says Chavez "pushed them". Not sure if he referring to Brazil or Mexico or what.

[VanW]

25. Can anyone help translate these tweets

in context?

"Mi opinión es q Zelaya estuvo nuevamente hablando lo no debia
5 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Mexico iba a recoger Zelaya. Nadie gobmex informa razones impidieron llevarse Zelaya.
7 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Informaciones Zelaya estaban mezcladas. No pudo salir.
9 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Zelaya no estaba en avión. Gob Micheletti lo impidio
10 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Acaban de desviar avion mexicano con zelaya a el salvador
13 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Zelaya ya vuela a Mexico. Alli cambia por sombrero de charro. Super confirmado
17 minutes ago from TweetDeck

No debo decir mas ahora.RT @mariayolanda: tengo la impresión de que falta algo en esto de zelaya a mex, h
18 minutes ago from TweetDeck

No entendieron situacion. Chavez los empujó.RT @eduardog: @darria Qué lepasóa Brasisl con Z??? Chávez los utilizó o mejor dicho cobró
19 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Traje de charro.RT @eduardog: @darria ¿llegó la pijama?
24 minutes ago from TweetDeck

?Quien dijo?.RT @lalloquita: @darria El Presidente Micheletti ha ordenado que Manuel Zelaya no abandone el país vía México.
24 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Saldra.RT @lalloquita: Zelaya es un delincuente y debe enfrentar la justicia . Micheletti quiere capturarlo.
24 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Celso fue dominado por MA Garcia.RT @lavici: que metida de pata la de itamaraty en honduras, celso amorim y compañía ¿qué les pasó con z?
25 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Tengo info.RT @luciano_ve: @darria Pero embajador, el Presidente Calderon no ha dicho nada referente a Zelaya ???
26 minutes ago from TweetDeck

Mexico es un lugar tradicional para negociar situaciones diplomáticas complejas en la región. Seguro planean algo alli. Saben hacerlo
about 1 hour ago from TweetDeck

Si sale Zelaya para Mexico
about 1 hour ago from TweetDeck"

http://twitter.com/darria


I've been using Google Translate as a shortcut.

[EFerrari]

27. There's really not much context.

They're the same rumors/reports we've been getting with the exception of two that say Zelaya is on his way to Mexico.

[VanW]

28. OK, thanks!

He seemed to be hinting at something about Chavez, but I couldn't quite understand.

His last message says that Zelaya will stay in Tegucigalpa tonight. Looks like the trip is off for today.

[rabs]

30. Here ya go ...

Here is a rapid translation. These Twitter folks were all over the place on the rumor earlier tonight.

--------------------------


"Mi opinión es q Zelaya estuvo nuevamente hablando lo no debia
My opinion is that Zelaya again was saying what he should not say.

Mexico iba a recoger Zelaya. Nadie gobmex informa razones impidieron llevarse Zelaya.
Mexico was going to pick up Zelaya. No one in Mexican government reveals reasons why Zelaya was (not allowed to go.)

Informaciones Zelaya estaban mezcladas. No pudo salir.
Reports about Zelaya are mixed. He could not leave.

Zelaya no estaba en avión. Gob Micheletti lo impidio
Zelaya was not on the plane. Micheletti government prohibited it.

Acaban de desviar avion mexicano con zelaya a el salvador
Mexican plane with Zelaya has been diverted to El Salvador

Zelaya ya vuela a Mexico. Alli cambia por sombrero de charro. Super confirmado
Zelaya flying to Mexic. There he will cange into a charro sombrero. Super confirmed.

No debo decir mas ahora.RT @mariayolanda: tengo la impresión de que falta algo en esto de zelaya a mex, h
I should not say any more now. Have the impression that something is missing in Zelaya going to Mexico

No entendieron situacion. Chavez los empujó.
Do not understand situation. Chavez pushed him.

Qué lepasóa Brasisl con Z??? Chávez los utilizó o mejor dicho cobró
What's with Brazil with Z? Chavez utilized him or better said he collected.

Traje de charro.RT @eduardog: @darria ¿llegó la pijama?
Charro suit, did the pyjama arrive?

?Quien dijo?.RT @lalloquita: @darria El Presidente Micheletti ha ordenado que Manuel Zelaya no abandone el país vía México.
Who said? President Micheletti had ordered that Manuel Zelaya no leave the country via Mexico.


Saldra.RT @lalloquita: Zelaya es un delincuente y debe enfrentar la justicia . Micheletti quiere capturarlo.
Zelaya is a criminal and should face justice. Micheletti want to capture him.


RT @lavici: que metida de pata la de itamaraty en honduras, celso amorim y compañía ¿qué les pasó con z?
What a wrong step by Itamaraty (Braz. foreign Ministry), celso amorim and company. What happened to them with Z?


@darria Pero embajador, el Presidente Calderon no ha dicho nada referente a Zelaya ???
Ambassador, President Calderon has not said anything in reference to Zelaya???

Mexico es un lugar tradicional para negociar situaciones diplomáticas complejas en la región. Seguro planean algo alli. Saben hacerlo
Mexico is a traditional (nation) to negotiate complex diplomatic situations in the region.

Si sale Zelaya para Mexico
Yes, Zelaya will leave for Mexico.

[VanW]

32. Thanks again!

Isn't "Chavez los empujó" Chavez pushed 'them', (meaning Brazil, Mexico or some other govt), rather than Chavez pushed 'him'?


also...

AJ English has Democracy Now journalist Andres Conteris saying that Zelaya believes he will be more effective from outside the country.

[rabs]

38. Yes, "Chavez pushed them."

Sorry, was in a hurry. But not clear to me who "them" are. Tweeters tend to talk in riddles to me :-)

[rabs]

26. Golpista regime: Zelaya's exit has been DENIED

Police outside the Brazilian Embassy tonight


(My hurried translation)

Honduras: Exit of Zelaya cut short

The Foreign minister of Honduras, Carlos Lopez Contreras, said that the safe conduct solicited by the Mexican government for ex president Manuel Zelaya had BEEN DENIED because it did not meet the necessary requirements ... "lacking the juridical qualification for the type of asylum that was going to be granted to him."

Honduras: Truncada salida de ZelayaEl canciller de Honduras, Carlos López Contreras, informó que el salvoconducto solicitado por el Gobierno de México se le negó al ex mandatario Manuel Zelaya porque no reunía los requisitos apropiados, “por falta de calificación jurídica del tipo de asilo que se le iba a dar”.


http://www.laprensahn.com/

[lunamagica]

29. Just heard Zelaya say on Univision that he wanted to leave

"under my status as The President of Honduras" The gov. didn't agree, wanted him to leave as a citizen, so they canceled the authorization for him to fly out of the country.

[rabs]

31. Thanks, that explains the golpist government

saying that Z. did not meet the "necessary requirements," i.e. as a common citizen he could leave. As the democratically elected president, he cannot.

Golpistas live in a parallel universe.

[Downwinder]

33. But they say he is not President.

Somebody must have figured out that without Mel and family as hostages their amnesty was not much good.

[EFerrari]

34. May karma let these pigs reap what they're sowing.

[Downwinder]

35. Keep giving them Catch 22 choices. n/t

[rabs]

36. Confusion just got somewhat clearer

Mexico did try to fly Z. out. The plane was due to arrive in Teguz at 8:45 p.m. Honduras time. Because of the confusion, it continued on to Comalapa airport in El Salvador.

The golpista government insisted that he leave as a political refugee, i.e. under international political asylum rules.

Z. refused, saying he would only leave as the constitutional president until Jan. 27 and not as a political refugee.

Had he left as a political refugee, under international political asylum rules in theory he would not have been able to participate in any activities against the golpista regime. He would have been muzzled.

------------------------------------------

Meantime, golpistas tonight taking no chances Z. may sneak out of Brazilian Embassy :sarcasm:

[EFerrari]

37. Thank you, rabs.

:grr:

[struggle4progress]

40. Zelaya Negotiating Deal to Leave Honduras (AP)

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: December 10, 2009

Filed at 2:20 a.m. ET

TEGUCIGALPA, Honduras (AP) -- Mexico is working to get ousted President Manuel Zelaya out of the Brazilian Embassy, a refuge where he has spent nearly three months in a failed effort to get his office back and prevent the election of his successor

Mexico's Foreign Relations Department said late Wednesday that it asked the interim administration installed after the coup that removed Zelaya to guarantee his safe passage out of the country without being arrested on treason and abuse of power charges.

Honduran officials said the interim government agreed to let Zelaya go if he was willing to accept political asylum, but Zelaya said he would not accept a departure under those terms.

''I want to leave as a distinguished guest, not as political refugee like the interim government wants,'' Zelaya told Radio Globo late Wednesday ...

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/12/10/world/AP-LT-Honduras-Coup.html?_r=1

[EFerrari]

42. Amy reported this am that the Pinochettis wanted him to sign a document

validating his ouster -- much as US forces try to force prisoners released from Gitmo to sign a doc saying they were not mistreated.

[Judi Lynn]

41. Zelaya refuses to leave Honduras as political exile

Zelaya refuses to leave Honduras as political exile
Ousted president offered asylum by Mexico but post-coup regime says he must first accept political refugee status
Staff and agencies
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 10 December 2009 08.58 GMT

A plan for the ousted Honduran president, Manuel Zelaya, to leave the country for Mexico has stalled over his refusal to accept political asylum. Mexico's foreign relations department said it asked the post-coup regime to guarantee Zelaya's safe passage out of the country without being arrested on treason and abuse of power charges.

Honduran officials said the regime agreed to let Zelaya go if he was willing to accept political asylum but Zelaya said he would not accept a departure under those terms.

"I want to leave as a distinguished guest, not as a political refugee like the interim government wants," Zelaya told Radio Globo late last night from the Brazilian embassy, where he has spent nearly three months after a failed effort to get his office back and prevent the election of his successor.

The regime had been insistent Zelaya would be arrested on the charges that led to his overthrow on 28 June for ignoring a supreme court order against holding a referendum on changing the constitution. But recently it began hinting Zelaya could leave for exile or political asylum in another country.

More:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/dec/10/manuel-zelaya-refuses-political-asylum

[Peace Patriot]

43. Thanks to all for clearing this up--and for your up-to-the-minute reporting! Wow!

I was afraid when I opened this thread that a deal had been struck for safe passage, but that Zelaya had smelled a rat and called it off. Actually, that's still a possibility, but less so now. It's quite like him--consistent with all that has gone before--not to allow them to strip him of his remaining weeks as president, nor of his ability to speak out from exile about this putrid, illegitimate regime running Honduras. His purpose is not selfish--his own safety, although that would be understandable. His purpose is political reform of Honduras' extremely bad political system and constitution, for the sake of most Hondurans--the vast poor majority. This stance on principles of the rule of law makes sense as his reason for not leaving as an "asylum seeker" (which would mean him being silenced).

And I hope that's all it is. I do suspect that the Obamites put one condition on their support of the coup--no assassination of Zelaya. (That MAY be why the U.S. military at Soto Cano stood down while the plane carrying the kidnapped president of the country landed at their air base on its way out of the country, back in June.) (I stress "may be.") And that also supports the stated reasons now for his refusing their "safe passage," i.e., he smelled political rats but not murderous rats.

Again, thanks to all for the quick translations and on-going news.

[Judi Lynn]

44. It was phenomenal, wasn't it? Wonderful coverage.

Hoping the Obama administration did and will put intense pressure on them to keep their filthy mitts off Zelaya now that they've committed their vicious crime against him and the Honduran people.