How much worse will this HCR bill get?

[brentspeak]

First, the public option was reduced to only a ~5%-of-the-population-eligible public option.

Then, even that was discarded.

Then (or actually, at the same time), a universal individual mandate to purchase private health insurance was included.

Then (or actually before anyone knew it), Obama made a secret deal with Big Pharma to disallow drug re-imports from Canada.

Then, the talk about revoking the insurance industry's anti-trust exemption was shelved.

Then, an excise tax on so-called "cadillac plans" was inserted.

What's next? What new and wonderful surprises are in store for us from Obama and the House of Lords?

[Speck Tater]

1. Next step: Ordinary citizens don't get any health care, but pay for health care for rich bankers.

Why not? It worked for the bailout, didn't it?

[Nite Owl]

2. You might not be far off

if are all mandated to buy insurance and many won't ever be able to use it due to the high deductibles and copays.

[DrDan]

6. exactly . . . and once the mandates kick in - there is only one way for

the insurance companies to increase profits - quit paying claims.

[Dinger]

8. Yup, It's Comin'

Won't be long either.

[harun]

19. Only in America.

[grytpype]

3. The Manchurian Meanie and his corporatist stooges take the poor man's last nickel... it makes me cry

:cry:

[Jackpine Radical]

4. They're about to add a new provision that gets around the individual risk-factor surcharge.

They'll just work it in reverse. You get a "bonus" that brings your rate "down" (i.e. to where it would have otherwise been anyway) if you don't have hypertension or high cholesterol or overweight or whatever. Get it? Instead of starting out "low" and adding on for risks, they start high and subtract for lower risks.

[freddie mertz]

5. Yeah, that's the worst one yet, and it is getting very little play.

It's a back door to bring back pre-existing conditions.

[nightrain]

7. I hadn't heard about that.... do you have a link?

[Jackpine Radical]

9. Here.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/01/08-12

[nightrain]

10. thank you. I missed it. more ways for corps to take money from individuals... would you

consider making that an OP?

[Jackpine Radical]

16. I think it was posted earlier, actually.

[enlightenment]

20. Twice over the last 24 hours, actually - it dropped like a rock both times.

Too many words in the OP, I suppose . . .

[GreenArrow]

21. Third time's the charm?

I missed it the first two.

[enlightenment]

23. One can always hope, eh?

Here is one of the original links, if you're interested (same info - but earlier posting by freddie mertz):

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7428413&mesg_id=7428413

[GreenArrow]

24. Thank you, I'll check that out.

Cheers!

[Captain Hilts]

11. The health ins. industry has maintained its anti-trust exemption. nt

[Blasphemer]

12. I am afraid that we will soon find out

It's going to be huge mess and if they are willing to create legislation that bad, then they don't care about their political futures. If the health insurance industry has that much of a hold on them, then I have to believe that reform was never the intention. Every time someone writes a rosy article talking about something good that is in the bill, it is stripped out.

[girl gone mad]

33. I'm of two minds on that.

Most of the bad provisions don't go into effect until 2013 so perhaps they do care about their political futures.

On the other hand, so many of the moves they've made lead me to believe that they aren't counting on a second term.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. Once people find out how much shit the few helpful pieces of this bill are wrapped in

the Republicans will jump up and say gleefully, "We were against it all the time!"

I say scrap it and start over. Pass the good parts separately without the mandate--unless there is a public option available to every American without exception.

[niyad]

14. I shudder to think.

[rug]

15. There's a robust debate on whether they can levy a lien on your kidney until the bill is paid.

The President has stated he will veto any bill with that provision.

[Jackpine Radical]

17. No, no, I think that was for livers.

People have two kidneys, so it's OK to put a lien on one of them.

[Jackpine Radical]

18. What are you talking about? This is the best of all possible worlds.

DR. PANGLOSS
Let us review
Lesson eleven!

STUDENTS:
Paragraph two
Axiom seven

PANGLOSS:
Once one dismisses
The rest of all possible worlds
One finds that this is
The best of all possible worlds!

STUDENTS:
Once one dismisses
The rest of all possible worlds
One finds that this is
The best of all possible worlds!

PANGLOSS:
Pray classify
Pigeons and camels

MAXIMILLIAN:
Pigeons can fly!

PAQUETTE:
Camels are mammals!

PANGLOSS:
There is a reason
For everything under the sun!

CANDIDE:
There is a reason
For everything under the sun!

MAXIMILLIAN:
Objection!
What about snakes?

PANGLOSS:
Snakes!
'Twas snake that tempted mother Eve
Because of snake we now believe
That though depraved
We can be saved
>From hellfire and damnation
(Because of snake's temptation!)

If snake had not seduced our lot
And primed us for salvation
Jehova could not pardon all
The sins that we call cardinal
Involving bed and bottle!

ALL
Now onto Aristotle!

PANGLOSS
Mankind is one
All men are brothers!

STUDENTS:
As you'd have done
Do unto others!

PANGLOSS
It's understood in
This best of all possible worlds--

MAXIMILLIAN
All's for the good in
This best of all possible worlds!

CANDIDE:
Objection!
What about war?

PANGLOSS:
War!
Though war may seem a bloody curse
It is a blessing in reverse
When canon roar
Both rich and poor
By danger are united!
(Till every wrong is righted!)

Philosophers make evident
The point that I have cited
'Tis war makes equal -- as it were --
The noble and the commoner
Thus war improves relations!

ALL:
Now onto conjugations!

PANGLOSS:
Amo, amas,
Amat, amamus!

STUDENTS:
Amo, amas,
Amat, amamus!

PANGLOSS:
Proving that this is
The best of all possible worlds
With love and kisses
The best of all possible worlds!

STUDENTS:
Proving that this is
The best of all possible worlds
With love and kisses
The best of all possible worlds!

PANGLOSS
Quod erat demunstrandum!
QED!
Amo, amas,
Amat amamus!

MAXIMILLIAN: (overlapping)
Quod erat demunstrandum!
QED!
Amo, amas!
Quod erat demunstrandum!

[neverforget]

22. How about the Stupak abortion amendment and the Nelson amendments?

Talk of lowering Medicare age availability but Lieberman killed that.

[donco6]

25. BUT BUT it's just a START!

We had to get the camel's nose in the tent! . . . another tired cliche, . . . wildly unsupported claim . . . YOU'RE JUST RACIST!

We're all so fucked.

[Skittles]

30. KEEP YOUR PANTIES ON, DONCO

HE'S PLAYING CHESS DON'TCHA KNOW

[donco6]

34. Whew! Thanks, I was worried there for a minute.

I feel so much better. :)

[cherokeeprogressive]

26. We won't actually know until AFTER President Obama signs it.

I predict that it will be rushed from the back room to the floors of both houses and passed by a party-line vote on a Tuesday.

Then it will be rushed to the Oval Office on the same day where it will be signed in private before having a huge photo-op signing minutes before President Obama takes the podium for the State of the Union Address.

Once it's over, administration officials will shrug their shoulders and say "what's all the fuss about?" while "liberal angst" over health care reform dies.

Only days after, when it's actually read will we know how bad it is. The day it comes to light, Democratic Senators and Congresspersons will start to crow "I never got the chance to read it fully!" and that will be their attempt at cover before the elections in November.

[kayla9170]

27. unrec.............

[Skittles]

29. WHY???

[TheKentuckian]

28. Only God knows but if you see something of any worth keep it under the hat

or Lieberman will demand it be deleted.

[Norrin Radd]

31. Blood lettings and leeches.

[Goldstein1984]

32. They will make it as bad as We the People let them.

Right now, it looks like we'll let them do whatever Wall Street tells them to do.