Should we really blame the DLC and the Democratic move to the right?

[Cali_Democrat]

It looks like many people in Massachusetts who voted for Obama voted for Brown in this election. If they are angry with Obama's move to the right, why would they then vote for a Republican? Does that make any sense? :shrug:

Make no mistake about it, Coakley was a terrible candidate. However, blaming the DLC bogeyman is shortsighted and misses the point IMO.

Maybe this country is just too conservative right now and we will never get a progressive agenda through Congress.

[xultar]

1. Yes. Blame the boogie man instead of yourself. Great move. That's what we do. That's why we lost.

[ananda]

2. What do you really think?

Really?

[msongs]

3. we need more bipartisanship, repubs n wall streeters in the administration lol nt

[LiberalFighter]

4. It is Coakley's fault because of her inept campaign.

[Avalux]

5. Honestly - it has nothing to do with Obama.

Coakley was a bad candidate and ran a shitty campaign. She failed to connect to the people. It was state politics, that's it.

[CTLawGuy]

6. it

was a special election, that the GOP could turn ALL their attention to. Chokeley ran a terrible campaign. Republicans are much more fired up than we are.

[PassingFair]

7. The DLCers and the Blue Dogs botched HCR so badly that NO ONE likes it.

Not even a third of our own party.

This was inevitable.

[bigwillq]

23. But don't you know

it's all DUs fault. Because we dared to criticize this president and this adminstration.
Has nothing to do with Congress. Nope. Not one bit. Or the party's heads. Nope. Just us. :hug:

[PassingFair]

25. Nothing to do with mandates without a public option to drive down costs....

Nope, nothing wrong with that Health Care Bill.

:eyes:

Best be moving along now, it's obvious
that the people want teabagging nudie posers....

[DJ13]

8. People expect our party to offer the change that was promised in 08

The kind of change they wanted wasnt a return to Bush conservatism.

The voters have just told DC to F off.

[treestar]

14. then why did these voters send a repuke?

that's saying halt the change, you're going to fast.

If they wanted that change and it wasn't enough, they'd at least have sent Coakley.

[DJ13]

17. As a repudiation to the way the Democrats are running the country

Coakley might have won if her campaign had been smart enough to come out and disagree with several policies and some of the legislation that have taken place over the last year.

HCR without a PO, but with mandates (which are contentious in MA).

The pandering to Wall street over helping Main street.

Those are a couple of examples that would have reassured the MA voters that she wasnt about to be a rubber stamp to the administration, and it would have secured her a win in this atmosphere.

[Cali_Democrat]

21. That flies in the face of the facts

People aren't going to protest a Democratic move to the right by voting in a Republican. That's silly.

[DJ13]

28. If they dont like the present course, and she didnt distance herself they will

Why do some of you want to turn our party into a GOP clone?

That wont win elections.

[treestar]

34. Um, we didn't need a GOP clone. we got the real thing. a 41st GOP senator.

So how can anyone say the problems with this state's voters is that DC isn't liberal enough/ They just sent us the message the DC is too liberal. They sent a new GOP Senator to get things back to the center or right.

[GreenArrow]

42. What's that old saying? Harry Truman?

"Given a choice between a Democrat that votes like a Republican and a real Republican, people will vote for the real Republican every time".

[treestar]

31. So I still don't understand why they sent a repuke unless they meant to

say they want Wall Street to be even more unregulated and that not only do they not want a PO, they don't want the plan up now, they want nothing or something even more watered down to favor big business.

they put a Rethug in the seat. That means they want no more regulation and no more government involvement at all. If they understand the position they were in, they want nothing to pass at all, nothing Obama wants to be passed, since they now that now there are 41 Repukes to all say no in lockstep to whatever Obama wants, no matter how watered down it is.

they know they won't get the public option now. If they wanted the PO, no way would they vote for a repuke. No repuke supports the PO.

[quiller4]

51. MA voters already have heath care. Many are not happy with state

Democrats. An adept Democratic candidate might have been able to distiance her/himself from unpopular actions taken at a state level (tax increases, tuition increases, cuts to popular services) and echoed some of the populist cry for jobs and a bailout of mainstreet. Coakley was less than adept and not convincing as a populist.

[GOTV]

20. It may be that the progressive voters stayed home leaving the vote to the right n/t

[treestar]

32. OK, so they wanted the country to move to the right as a protest to the country

being too far to the right? :wtf:

[GOTV]

40. No. Possibly they just stayed home because neither candidate would deliver what they wanted ...

... It's a possibility.

If you don't think Obama is going to give you what you want, there's not a lot of difference between the woman who would help Obama and the guy who would hurt Obama.

[Cali_Democrat]

49. According to this article, there was big turnout in Mass

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation-and-world/la-naw-mass-senate20-2010jan20,0,4411721.story

Big turn out in a state that leans heavily to the left.

[demo dutch]

9. 53% MA voters approve of Obama. I think you need to look at Congress and general unhapiness with the

politics inside MA

[GOTV]

10. Evidence for your first sentence?

[Cali_Democrat]

15. We will have to wait for a final breakdown of the polls

However, I read a post on DU earlier today mentioning this....the fact that many Obama voters in Mass voted for Brown. I believe Brown was even winning the union vote.

[GOTV]

24. I read that there were very few exit polls - so it might be hard to determine.

[Cali_Democrat]

19. This DU post talks about record turnout across all demographics...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7512046

If that's the case then my post is accurate IMO. However, we will have to wait for hard numbers to be sure, but it's looking like this country is more conservative than we thought.

[GOTV]

26. Yes, but provides no link or reference. Perhaps ...

... we must look at precincts that went for and against Obama in 08 and see which had the greatest gains or losses in turnout since then.

[treestar]

11. I agree with you

They are putting the brakes on - telling them they are going too far to the left.

[martymar64]

46. So are you saying we should go right wing and adopt Republican policies?

Tell us what you really think. It sounds like you are saying that we should become more like Republicans and adopt their policies as our own. Is that correct? Do you feel that we should preserve and expand on Bush Administration economic policies?

[WeDidIt]

12. The rightwing candidate won

The only chice now is to move to the right.

Congratulations MA.

[Lord Helmet]

13. Coakley didn't fight for it. A better candidate could have saved Teddy's seat.

[Clio the Leo]

16. nailed it. NT

[freddie mertz]

18. I blame the lame political strategy we have seen the past year.

Time to get focused.

[Overseas]

22. Of course we should. Dems capitulating to Republicans on policy is not a winning strategy.

Obama campaigned like a progressive, populist Democrat and our country is desperate for progressive change after the destructive regressive administration of GWB for eight years.

[treestar]

39. Well, thanks to Mass., now they don't have to bother to capitulate

there is no way to pass anything to the left of Snowe.

[martymar64]

48. That is only because you fall for the 60 vote myth.

They have a greater majority than any in recent memory and they still whine that they can't get anything done. Senate rules can be changed. Bills can be passed with 50+1 via reconciliation.

You're just too willing to capitulate to Republicans and their Blue Lap Dogs. All you preach is defeatism.

[Overseas]

52. Exactly. We busted that super majority myth with the health care wreckage.

The GOP pushed all kinds of corporate friendly legislation through with a far smaller majority for years.

Sorry Dems, that Gotta Have Sixty dog doesn't hunt any more.

Heard it too many times.

Groveling for one GOP or Blue Dog vote was really humiliating and pathetic. It has left a lasting impression I'm sorry to say.

It's going to take some bold Alpha Dog action to undo the damage from our dear "centrist" democrats willingness to compromise the very pillars of our party platform to retain campaign donations, pretending they can expect any honest bipartisanship when that hasn't been possible for over ten years now.

Enough already fellas. You don't need all those votes. We have seen it now.

[kenny blankenship]

27. People aren't given subtle instruments with which to register their dismay

They can say "We don't like where this is going!" and vote for someone who'll cause trouble for the leader and party currently in charge. That's about the extent of their ability to talk back to power. It rarely makes sense like you want it to. If people are pissed with a President who campaigns promising change and vowing that Main St. is going to be restored to its equal place beside Wall St. and he doesn't deliver, the people don't have any way of expressing their loss of trust in the President and his party than to elect someone of the opposing party, even if that person would be worse.

[DJ13]

29. +++111

[GOTV]

33. You can get a little more info if you can determine which demographics turned out ...

... and which didn't.

Did teabaggers turn out in greater numbers afraid of Obamas "socialism"? Did progressives stay home because Obama isn't producing for them?

I don't know but I hope the data appears somewhere because this is a question we need to answer correctly.

[treestar]

36. Come on they are not that pathetic

You make these voters sound so helpless and mindless.

They just sent a Senator who will do all he can for Wall Street. That's how they protest Wall Street getting too much over Main street? These voters just sold Main street out.

[kenny blankenship]

44. If you don't think voters particularly independents are capable of that kind of stupidity

then you don't know shit about voters, my friend. Millions of voters voted for Ronald Reagan BELIEVING EXACTLY THAT - that he was "Main St." like them, and his two terms would result in "Morning in America" again, the triumph of Main St. over Washington and NYC. They couldn't have been more wrong. And do we really have to analyze George Bush's elections again? Say what you want to about Florida and the Supreme Court, millions of Americans, not just Republicans, voted for his dumb hick impersonation, and voted for it again in even greater numbers (59 million of them) in 2004. George Bush couldn't find Main St. USA with a map and a compass. That goes for father and son. Nevertheless he presented himself as the "plainspoken" champion of ordinary Americans against the high falutin', elitist idears of Albert Gore. And then again later against the equally highly nuanced, Ivy League verbosity of John Kerry.

And how does Scott Brown package himself? "Hi, I'm Scott Brown. This is my truck. I'm Main St. - just like you turdknockers. I drive a domestic truck cause I got a plain ol' American job and plain ol' American background. I'm not fancy, and educated, and I don't have a fancy degree and title like "Attorney General." Can you say Attorney General? I can't unless I have this card in front of me to read from. I don't even know what that means. Vote for me, because I'm just like you. I have your Main St. values and I'd be too stupid to trick you."

They fall for it more often than not.

[Blasphemer]

41. Good point

I can understand being disgruntled (I'm disgruntled too) but it's harder to fathom those who vote for a Republican while the GOP remains wildly unpopular and is still largely (and rightfully) blamed for the mess we are in. Staying at home is different than making a point to vote for the other guy even if the other guy is a Republican. But, you make sense. For most people, all they have (or feel they have) is the power of a protest vote.

[Robeson]

43. You speak the truth..

...nicely said.

[theothersnippywshrub]

30. Excellent post. You seem to understand the difference between politics and utopian fantasy.

I have noticed that in several of your posts.

[ShortnFiery]

35. Hell to the *YES!" DLC = Corporate Control of our Government = Fascism = GOP Lite. eom

[Bluenorthwest]

37. Because people do not think of 'moves to the right' or left

But they do get pissed off at being lied to in such a large manner as the DLC and Obama have done with this health care package that is the opposite of what he ran on, and so many other things. Lie to people's face, and they will vote against your pals. It is that simple. Especially when there are two choices, there is no 'more left' option at all. Pissed people just do not vote for the party they are pissed at.
This country is not too conservative, the DLC, and Obama is too conservative. MA has marriage equality, Obama opposes that, as do his DLC pals, and his chosen Party Chair. Chew on that one. A majority of the people wanted an open, strong public option. Not the DLC crowd. Chew on that one. It goes on and on.
Frame all you want, you can not change what's clearly in that picture.

[higgs]

38. Obama didn't move right - that's absurd

They aren't angry with Obama's move to the right, he never moved to the right, he's the most left president we've had since FDR. They're angry with Obama's insistence that we pass a terrible bill at all costs. A bill filled with scandalous payoffs (Nebraska, Louisiana, etc), jail time for people who do not have insurance, massive tax increases and penalties for the middle class and so forth.

That's what people are voting against. They know the bill is terrible, they're sick of seeing the corruption, independents are sick of being called "teabaggers" because they disagree with Obama, and they're sick of being ignored for the sake of passing a horrible piece of legislation just to boost Obama's ego. I'm not sure why it's so hard for some people to see this. Add to all this the corruption of Geithner and his banking pals, the lack of openness that Obama promised, the lies, the revolving door between his administration and the banks who are destroying us, and it's a recipe for revolt. He promised change, yet he's no better than the Republicans that preceded him.

[Gopens]

45. Uh, yeah.

"They aren't angry with Obama's move to the right, he never moved to the right, he's the most left president we've had since FDR."

Ridiculous. On domestic policy, Nixon was to the left of Obama. So was LBJ. I'd even wager that Ford was, too, in the scheme of things.

[Cha]

54. Oh fuck off..troll

[yourout]

55. Somehow I dont think you are going to be around long.

[vaberella]

47. Maybe the blame could go to Obama...it always seems to be his fault on this board. n/t

[quiller4]

50. You could but then you'd learn nothing useful to apply in coming elections.

[Krashkopf]

53. Not only YES, but HELL YES!

Everyone seems to forget that Barack Obama was NOT swept into office by the Democratic party regulars, who mostly supported Hilary Clinton.

Barack Obama's Democratic base were the Anti-War Progressives. He was swept into office by a ground swell of young, "first time" voters, left-leaning independents, and even some cross-over Republicans.

Those folks voted for Obama because they believed that was an agent for REAL CHANGE.

But Obama did not fight for REAL CHANGE. Instead, he supported a DLC-inspired, pro-corporate, health care "reform" package; and a DLC-inspired, pro-corporate bank bailout; and DLC-inspired, pro-corporate Wall Street "regulatory reform."

I'll bet you "dollars to donuts" that when the exit poll numbers are "crunched" you will find that - despite turnout that was high "for a special election" - alot of the "Obama coalition" of progressives, "first time voters" and left-leaning independents - stayed home tonight because they were disheartened, and alienated, by Barack Obama's move to the DLC-right.

[rapturedbyrobots]

56. single issue votes

we hear about single issues voters all the time. abortion is a big one.

maybe HCR is THE biggest friggin single issue we've ever seen.

its not about other people's bodies, or lives. its about life and death for YOU. we ALL need health care. and we all need it at an affordable price.

so it does not surprise me that 22% of voters who would rather see the health insurance industry rescue bill burn than bend over for the industry have a D on their registration card.

maybe that matters more than anything to people right now. maybe that's what the DLC (including Obama) don't get.

this is the big one. i've never seen conservatives and progressives agree so much on anything (even conservation...yes...conservatives are often big conservationists). this bill sucks...and everyone except the DLC centrist dems seem to know it.