The media's question of the day: "Don't you think it's time to work with Republicans to pass HCR?"

[jenmito]

Are they serious? They're really buying the Repub. LInE that now that Scott Brown is going to be in the Senate, they WANT to work together with Dems., "from scratch," to pass healthcare reform. McCain, Hatch, and every other Repub. on tv these past couple days has been saying the same thing: "Let's start over to get something done. We ALL want healthcare reform." As if the Dems. haven't been trying to get Repubs. on board all along. And as if they really want Obama to succeed now by helping him get a bill. :eyes:

[FrenchieCat]

1. That's because, now that Dems are talking about "ramming" something through,

The Republicans become the victims.

That's how it works.

That's the part that Obama miscalculated, IMO; the fact that ALL Republicans would rather we get nothing as long as politically it helps them. Think he thought there were still a few honorable Republicans around; even 1 or 2. It appears that he greatly overestimated their hearts; him thinking that there was good in all of us. Hopefully now he knows that Republicans are of a different species....

[Yavin4]

2. If You're Right, Then Obama Is Extremely Naive or He Got Awful Political Advice

He was sent to Washington to get things done, not play nice with the Republicans. He has to produce tangible results that will directly improve the lives of Americans.

This is why so many of us were so distraught over losing the Public Option. That was the one thing in all of the HCR legislation that people could point to as something that helped all of us.

[FrenchieCat]

6. Well, the way that you are characterizing it is very different from how I would.....

Because what the Republicans are doing, to the extent that they are, at a time when the United States is in such dire shape, is indeed unprecedented, and I don't think that even we expected them to be as cold blooded as they have been. To say that one exactly expected the Republicans to act as they have is not telling the truth. The fact is that is why we laughed when we saw the first signs of teabagging activity in February, one month after Obama's election, and why we kept up the ridicule through August, instead of getting busy to combat it. The netroot failed as much as the President on this....in our failure to fight back the framing that the corporate media put on the town hall protestors. We barely didn't get how the media was going to manipulate that whole situation until it was more or less done. That is because most of us also believed that the general public would see it for what it was. So saying, after the fact, that Obama was naive, IMO, is disengeneous, and reasonable people can disagree on this much more than you are letting on.

Again I stress that initially, Obama thought that the American people would see this Republican insanity for what it was (because so many did during the campaign, which is why he ended up being elected), but now he knows that even the people cannot see clearly. and I might add, many included are on our side.

To witness so many Democrats too willing to kick him to the curb, and repudiate just about every thing he does, almost as much as the other side in quite breathtaking. I know that we have waited for a long time, but still, I thought that the more sane among us would have a bit more of a strategy on how to get the message to the president without literally joining those on the other side, in terms of the end result. So for me, the problem lies not so much in his naivete, inasmuch as in the people's lack of reason-ability; mainly Republicans, but yes, Democrats are guilty of it too. When that whole recipe is added to his humanity in regards to Republicans, his approach isn't working; that is true.

End of the day, it's best that I think he now understands this, and I hope he realize that he's gonna have to take a different tack. Personally, I believe he got the message in late October, and in particular, on the Bank front, he planned on what we now see is his pivot on the economic front. There are articles dating back to early December that points to this. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=388&topic_id=14292&mesg_id=14307

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=388x14451

As for being distraught about the PO, I understand this, but I don't understand the savagery that has accompanied it. Obama wasn't going to get more than the 60th senator wanted; the one that literally campaigned against him during the elections. He did nearly have Snow with the trigger, but we, Democrats, rejected that out of hand.

[jenmito]

3. Yeah...

"jamming through" what they already passed in the Senate and House after a full year of working on it.

I really think Obama knows that no Repubs. want to negotiate "in good faith" to get something done. I also think he's going to make it clear that he wants to get HCR passed with or WITHOUT Repubs.

[Cosmocat]

5. Look ...

my patience on it is gone like everyon else's, and I KNEW the Rs would be jaggoff about it all along like they have been ...

it is time, the house has to pass the senate version and use reconciliation as much as possible to get it done, as soon as possible ...

the people who are partisans and will kill the Ds either way will scream about it, but they are going to find SOMETHING to be enraged about either way ... The media will, as the media always does, carry their water ...

HOWEVER, I do believe that there ARE those who truly are in the middle, who will know that BO did all that he could to work with Rs, and once a bill gets past and the Rs initial BS about it "getting rammed through" is rinsed and repeated by the MSM, what will be left is that a bill got done, and while it won't be a net gain overall, it WILL recoup a sizable portion of the political capital that has been chewed up on it ...

The more the Ds do, the hollow the "they are not including us" and "they are extreme left" will sound ... Again, it will reverberate with those who are against BO and the Dems REGARDLESS. But most of the TRUE middle will get it on some level at least ...

[Hansel]

9. Dems always fall into the trap of letting Repugs frame the issues.

Let's hope there is a bigger plan behind Obama saying this, but I can't see what it would be.

The Senate has already passed the bill and he supposedly is just waiting for the House to approve it so he can sign it. Since Brown is in the Senate, he wouldn't even need to be involved. So Obama is showing a lack of confidence by signaling that the bill will go back to the Senate before Brown is seated. I don't think that does anything to build the confidence of House members who were thinking twice about voting for it already.

He had no constructive reason for making the statement and, as avid of an Obama supporter as I am, it pissed me off because it made him look like a chump and the Republicans, as you say, like victims. The victims are the people dying because of lack of health care. Especially annoying was his contention that they should wait to get health insurance for 49 other states because a state that already has universal coverage supposedly voted against it. It was just a weak and stupid statement and it really pissed me off.

[FrenchieCat]

10. Aye......

I do agree that it wasn't required, that statement about waiting for Brown.
There is no way that people will be reasonable and see the GOP for what it is;
the MA race demonstrated that amply....if there ever was to be a measure.
So since that's become more than obvious now,
it is now time and not a minute longer for this administration to make a big shift.

We will soon see.

[Andy823]

4. I think it's time

To force he republicans to vote on the things we know all americans want from health care reform. Make them vote no to putting a stop to the pre-existing conditions issue, make them vote no on stopping insurance companies from dropping customers who have paid for years and years, and now that they need treatment that is expensive they get dropped. Make them vote no on stopping caps on what they insurance companies will pay each year. make them vote no on dropping the exemptions they have on monopoly laws. Make them vote no to making medicare changes that will bring costs under control. Take all the issues that the people want and make them vote no! This is an election year, so force them to come out and vote "NO". They can make excuses on big bills loaded with pork or things people don't want like mandates, but they will be committing political suicide if they vote NO on smaller things they know the people really want!

[Captain Hilts]

7. All those hours of face time Ollie Snowe got with the president don't seem to count with the media.

[rufus dog]

8. Are you remotely surprised?

They will forget all the work in conference, they will forget 'this can be his Waterloo,' they will forget all of the provisions entered by R's. IMO Obama's mistake was not to push back on this during the summer and I hope he has learned that you can't work with them.

BTW the R healthcare reform will be tort reform and selling across state lines and the media won't report that their solution is far less beneficial to the current plan, and would promote it as a win for Repubs and a loss for Dems.

[timeforpeace]

11. In other words, "you said you would be bi-partisan but you haven't even tried it yet!"

[timeforpeace]

12. Obama says "don't ram it through" and Dems said "we aren't, that was your idea". Cost them a lot of

political capital, too.

[treestar]

13. since Brown said he would not change Mass's plan

He better vote for one for all of us! Be a maverick!

[underpants]

14. "bipartisan" = do what the Republicans want

Obama and others tried to include them in the process but they refused

[Proud Liberal Dem]

15. Grover Norquist="Bipartisanship is another name for date rape"

There is absolutely NO evidence whatsoever that the Republicans have disavowed this kind of thinking and until they do, I refuse to believe that any of them are even the slightest bit interested in genuine bipartisanship, especially when being genuinely bipartisan would be seen as a victory for the Democrats (never mind the fact that it would benefit the American people as well- that it wouldn't benefit the REPUBLICANS politically is all that matters to them, however :eyes:).
There is absolutely NO reason whatsoever to start over on HCR for the Republican's sake. They had their chance to be part of the process but they decided that going on with Jim DeMint on stalling/dragging out "negotiations" for as long as possible to try to "break" President Obama was a better *plan* for them and those involved in the "negotiations" eventually admitted as much. Since the Republicans have fallen down on the job of governing this country, it is OUR solemn responsibility to do what must be done even if it is over their furious denunciations and objections.

[DailyGrind51]

16. Like letting a hamster "work with" a boa constrictor!