Gallup: Everyone likes HCR except old white people who are not even much affected by it

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

Okay, the real Gallup headline was "Majority of Poor, Young, Uninsured Back Healthcare Bill" but I think mine is punchier.

A sharp divide is also seen by marital status -- another demographic factor related to healthcare coverage. By 51% to 41%, married adults call the bill a bad thing. In contrast, unmarried adults call it a good thing by an even wider margin, 60% to 26%.

Overall, the largest subgroup differences in support for the healthcare bill are seen by party identification. In a related finding, 73% of nonwhites (disproportionally Democratic in their party identification) say the bill's passage was a good thing, compared with 40% of whites (who lean Republican). The average income of nonwhites is also lower than that of whites, which likely contributes to their higher support for the healthcare vote.



http://www.gallup.com/poll/126959/Majority-Poor-Young-Uninsured-Back-Healthcare-Bill.aspx

[rfranklin]

1. Well, they will have to answer to the death panels...

And many of them will flunk the test.

[amandabeech]

7. Those of us who are over 50 , do not have employer-sponsored

or subsidized health care and are making a little too much to get a subsidy will not be helped much by this bill. The cost of health insurance will still be very high for us.

Sure, those of us with pre-existing conditions, and that's a huge percentage, will be able to get something if we can afford it, but if we make more than $43,000, then we have to pay at least $7,000 after taxes for it. There appears to be no location adjustment, so those of us who live in expensive areas because that's where the jobs are really won't end up with a whole lot else to live on. And we're supposed to be saving like crazy for retirement since there will be a push for Social Security "reform" until SS provides even less for retirees. Of course, we single women will be the hardest hit since we didn't get the benefits of more equal pay and prospects when we were younger and many of us took time off to care for children and are now having to take time off to help our parents and other aging relatives.

Right now, I can't afford $7,000. I could afford a catastrophic policy and maybe a little more, but as I understand it, HCR will not allow such a policy beginning in 2014. The bronze plan is still quite pricey for older folks.

What's your answer to the problems of me and my friends? How will this bill help us? I have 10 years and three months until I will be eligible for Medicare.

[saracat]

8. They don't care about us. Period. We are supposed to wok and pay and get nothing.

We are "selfish" otherwise.

[amandabeech]

13. They don't know what's coming for them, either.

Obama didn't look for votes from us, but we got out and worked anyway.

A gray-haired lady ran my Obama office, and she had lots of people like her working away.

I'm beating kids half my age in my lousy temp job because I learned a lot and can still do a lot of work in a given amount of time.

But will anyone hire me permanently?

At least I won't jump ship to China. I have two elderlies to look after here.

[stevenleser]

41. No, her figures are off.

Try checking here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/what-health-bill-means-for-you/

[rfranklin]

10. I am not a supporter of this approach...

There should have been a system put in place like other developed countries that provide good health care at rates that are not astronomical. At the very least there should have been a public option. I have a bit less time than you but will also have to pay huge premiums with huge deductibles until I reach Medicare age.

[stevenleser]

56. There is exactly such a system put in place by this bill

See my posts where I provide a link to the online calculator to how this bill will affect you.

[gateley]

11. I'm hoping we get a true non-profit PO in place long before we're eligible

for medicare (9 years for me) -- like Grayson's Medicare Buy-In.

This plan doesn't help me, either, but I'm excited that it's gotten the momentum started so we CAN continue to work toward real Health CARE Reform. nt

[amandabeech]

15. Nope. First Social Security.

Then make medicare more expensive.

I'm to the point that I have to see it to believe it.

I'm happy for you that you can be positive, still.

[gateley]

24. Social security is an entirely different animal, one with which I'm not familiar.

And I'm not sure how they're going to mend the ailing Medicare plans, but Grayson's is a buy-in, not using tax dollars at all. Hopefully, the revenue from the "buy-ins" might help the bottom line of the current system.

Yeah, I still have high hopes. My sense is that we have some really good people representing us, and little by little we can turn this ship around.

[amandabeech]

34. The Medicare buy-in is at least $700 a month, and that doesn't include

drugs and a Medigap plan, which is really necessary, and might cost $300-400 more per month.

I don't have that kind of after-tax dollars.

More power to you if you do.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

14. "Old" refers to the 65+ group. Your (and my) group favored it 48-41

The bill will not do much for a lot of folks, but the only age bracket in the poll that was majority-against was the only group eligible for medicare.

Hence the headline.

[amandabeech]

16. Yes, I saw that.

I expect that when more people our age realize what isn't in the bill for them that percentage may change.

I'm treated like a grumpy old fart now, so I might just as well be one outside the office.

[stevenleser]

40. Not true, your figures are off considerably

This http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/what-health-bill-means-for-you/
says your premiums would be capped at $4085 if you are single with no dependants, i.e. the worst case scenario for someone earning what you earn.

[TexasObserver]

45. It's the Republicans who don't want the gubmint messin' with their Medicare!!

Isn't it ironic that all these right wingers in that age group seem unaware that their beloved GOP fought Medicare every step of the way?

Isn't it ironic they never spoke up when the GOP leaders advocated often the curbing of Social Security benefits?

[BlueIdaho]

2. Gray haired grumpy old farts...

Part of the "I got mine - fuck you buddy" brigades.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

4. Get that health coverage off of my lawn!

[Doctor_Horrible]

38. dude - you made me spew Diet Dr. Pepper on my keyboard. :) NT

[KayLaw]

6. I'm afraid so.

Pretty darn selfish if that's it.

[amandabeech]

9. See my post #7.

I wash away the gray, but there's plenty of it now.

I don't got mine, by the way. I'm still working for it.

[stevenleser]

42. See my post #40

[saracat]

12. That actually should be turned back on those who "DO" benefit. The

50 year olds with no employer insurance are the ones that don't "get" anything and they are being mocked by those who have "gotten" theirs! And it isn't selfish to want tp protect your own life as well as that of othewrs. It is "selfish" to expect folks to sacrifice their own quality of life to benefit yourself only.

[MadBadger]

25. They always vote against the school budget here for similar reasons

MY kids are all grown up, Fuck your Kids!

[BlueIdaho]

29. How sad.

I remember all the older folks that lived in my neighborhood that faithfully voted for school levies. They understood it was their obligation to "pay it forward" as a previous generation had done for them.

Today's older generation is greedy, grumpy, and unbelievably self centered.

Far from the "greatest" generation - the are the IGM-FYB generation.

[Lost-in-FL]

3. ...

:yoiks:

[CaliforniaPeggy]

5. Hey, wait a damn minute!

I happen to be an older white married woman, and I LOVE HCR!

So. There.

:P

[Clyde39]

17. I'm also an older white married woman and LOVE HCR

Girl power!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

22. *High five!*

[MgtPA]

35. Count me too.

[Prism]

18. Seems electorally ominous

The working middle class and older voters aren't going for it - as in, the people who are more likely to show up at the polls. Given this is an off year, those numbers should be especially worrisome. During Scott Brown's win in MA, only 15% of the youth vote bothered. In 2006 mid-terms, turn-out for 18-29 year-olds was a mere 13%.

I except the good parts that are set to take effect before the election will budge these numbers up. If approval/disapproval among the largest voting blocs can be leveled into a wash, that might be the best possible scenario.

Of course, 2014 will be a different story. It'll be highly interesting to see this same poll once the mandates are in full effect.

[denimgirly]

19. Mentally it has been shown Old People tend to resist change -- Interestingly,White Males are similar

The most resistant groups to change are #1: old people, and then followed by #2: white men. This was based on a study some time way back...i will see about digging up that article.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

20. Anyone else struck by the 65+ / Medicare difference?

On Medicare 45-47%

65+ 36-54%

So seniors not on medicare must oppose HCR by a HUGE margin.

Or else people on medicare who oppose the bill don't want to admit they are on medicare or do not even know they are on medicare.

Anyone know the percentage of 65+ Americans on Medicare off hand?

[Prism]

21. Here's a link to Medicare enrollee demographics

http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparebar.jsp?ind=294&cat=6

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

23. Thanks Couldn't find the datum, though

44,831,390 medicare participants. 85% of participants are 65+.

But I don't know what % of over 65s are on medicare.

(I'm sure the numbers are in there to deduce the answer, but it doesn't seem broken out directly)

[Prism]

26. My rough math

Disclaimer: I am not a math major.

85% of 44,831,390 is 38,106,682.

The 2009 census.gov estimate puts the population of 65+ at 39,472,928

Based on those numbers, you're looking at 96.5% of people over 65.

This jives with statements I've read that almost all Americans over 65 have at least some hospital insurance through Medicare.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

27. Which means the people in the poll are, in fact, lying or hopelessly confused

There are not enough seniors not-on-medicare to account for the difference in the Gallup numbers.

Wing-nuts on Medicare must think they're not on Medicare!

(Then there are the "keep government's hands off my medicare" folks.)

[Prism]

28. There are possible explanations for the discrepencies

This is just one daily tracking poll of 1,000 Americans with a margin of error of +/- 4 percentage points. Given it's only a snapshot poll, it's subject to some seriously squishyness in the numbers. Small sample size and margin of error alone can account for why it looks a touch od.

Second, under 65s who are receiving Medicare could be substantially more in favor of the bill.

Third, I imagine the "cuts to Medicare" topic probably scared the hell out of seniors. A lot of people currently dependent on it and opposed to the bill aren't necessarily "no government health care!" types. They could be worried about the future quality and cost of their care as affected by the legislation.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

31. Well...

>>>This is just one daily tracking poll of 1,000 Americans with a margin of error of +/- 4 percentage points. Given it's only a snapshot poll, it's subject to some seriously squishyness in the numbers. Small sample size and margin of error alone can account for why it looks a touch od.

A small sample can be more affected by an eccentric respondent, of course, but most problems associated with sampling do not lead to internal inconsistencies like that. One day's tracking could erroneously favor McCain over Obama but would not be likely to feature dissonant results, like too many McCain voters in the sample but with too many Democrats in the sample. It can happen but is not the first thing I'd look to.

>>>Second, under 65s who are receiving Medicare could be substantially more in favor of the bill.

A good point. That said, only 15% of medicare recipients are under 65. If you happened to get several of those unusual people and they all favored HCR it could have an effect, but I think we would need an over-sample of them to account for this. (Though, as noted by us both, small samples can magnify eccentric respondents.)

>>> Third, I imagine the "cuts to Medicare" topic probably scared the hell out of seniors. A lot of people currently dependent on it and opposed to the bill aren't necessarily "no government health care!" types. They could be worried about the future quality and cost of their care as affected by the legislation.

Yes, but that shouldn't create this result. The question is not why seniors dislike the HCR bill but rather why those seniors who dislike the bill are likely to claim (inaccurately) that they are not on medicare. People who oppose the bill because they fear for their medicare should be the most aware that they are on medicare, not the least.

[DURHAM D]

30. I discovered someone on DU a couple of days ago that believes

that her older relatives are not on Medicare. I assumed that the relatives were on employer paid post retirement programs and they don't realize that Medicare was still the "first payer". I didn't bother to argue the point.

One other thing - if you don't have 10 years of pay-in to Medicare you are not automatically eligible. You call still enroll but pay more each month than those that have in their 10 years. Perhaps this accounts for part of the over 65 crowd that says they don't have Medicare - they are on other assistance. Ya' know - one of those unfunded mandates being extracted from Medicare funds. Guess it could be Medicaid. Many don't know there is a difference.

[Prism]

33. Medicare's confusing sometimes

My parents never consciously used it, as my dad wasn't SS age and my mom was covered under his union. Once my dad retired in December they needed to compensate for the reduction in his employer's/union's coverage. Figuring out how it all worked with Parts B and D, what payments were required, what they were eligible for, etc, wasn't the most enjoyable experience. They were confused and scared (both have serious pre-existings and the retirement was forced as the company started to collapse). The people over the phone really seemed to exacerbate the entire experience.

I'm still not sure they really understand all that Medicare entails.

But if you had asked my mom a year ago if she was on Medicare, I'd bet quite a bit that she would have answered no.

[Bluenorthwest]

32. Lots of seniors do not qualify for Medicare

They get Medicaid. Yep. Medicare is for those who paid in enough. And it has premiums and copays and deductibles that have to be met.
The two programs are not the same.

[Number23]

36. lol You don't say!!!

After reading DU, I doubt anyone is truly surprised by this data.

I think this is the key quote: "The average income of nonwhites is also lower than that of whites, which likely contributes to their higher support for the healthcare vote."

[golfguru]

37. I like HCR ...just not the mandates to force my young adult kids

to buy health insurance. They are healthy as a horse and I pay
their bills on as needed basis. And those bills don't amount to much.

When they start making big bucks, I am sure they will be happy to
buy health insurance. Until then, I don't like the forced mandates.

[kestrel91316]

39. At least 3 DUers are among the unhappy - so unhappy that they visciously attack

those of us who are actually gonna get some crumbs from the law.

[stevenleser]

43. What's worse is that their figures are wrong while they are doing it.

They are going to benefit a lot more than they realize.

[kestrel91316]

50. I've been attcked both for being happy for the 32 million even if I don't benefit,

and for being happy that I apparently benefit along with the 32 million. Some folks are really nasty pieces of work.

[wisteria]

44. Older American's no matter what color the skin is have been mislead about what is in the bill

and when you get older you will understand that change is more difficult to accept the older you get. I am sure a majority will come around in time-that is unless some on our side continue to insult them.

[Skittles]

46. check back with them in a couple years

[Jennicut]

47. Wow, 58% approval from those of us 18 to 34.

I hate for this to be a young vs old battle but...

My parents and their friends...all 62 and over think they are going to the death panels or something. I am 34 and all of my friends range in age from 25 to 35 and none of them were against the HCR.

[goclark]

48. Great for our country ~ the nut cases are in the

older generation ~ you are our future! :bounce:

[Jennicut]

49. Well, I am a Gen Xer but I love my Grandma. She is 89. I am going to try to explain

things to her the best I can. My parents are a lost cause, total conservatives who love Glenn Beck. Oh well.

[Number23]

55. It looks as though younger, minority people -- the ones who would MOST BENEFIT

from health care reform -- are coincidentally the ones who are the most in favor of it. Also lower income individuals. Truly, that should come as no surprise. Even a cursory glance of the bills' critics on DU, in the right wing, the teabag effort etc. will tell you that few members of ANY of these groups have been the ones protesting its passage.

This thread has been incredibly helpful.

[applegrove]

51. That stinks that the baby boomers don't like health care.

[SpartanDem]

52. I think more due to GOP feamongering

than them being selfish it would be good if the President did another on of those AARP townhalls

[nickinSTL]

53. old white people

who already HAVE government-run health care :eyes:

[Warren Stupidity]

54. 65% approval from people making 24K or less.

Hmmm... after months of hearing how it was exactly these people who would be supposedly harmed by this new law, it seems they are the one group most enthusiastic about it.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

57. PS: The reason I specified white...

73% of nonwhites favorable
40% of whites favorable

It is possible that older non-white people are less favorable to the bill than younger non-white people but with a 73% total it seems extremely likely that the non-white 65+ subset is majority favorable.

Not meant to be gratuitous.