To clarify: Kagan asked Clinton to endorse Daschle's abortion bill in 1997.

[madfloridian]

It is Obama's decision and he has spoken.

However there seems to be adverse reaction to mentioning the very punitive bill that Daschle and Clinton proposed in 1997.

Here is the gist of what Elena Kagan and her boss Bruce Reed of the DLC wrote to Obama about late term abortion.

From RH Reality Check:

Kagan and Reed urged Clinton to endorse Dashcle's amendment.

Documents reviewed Monday by The Associated Press show Kagan encouraging Clinton to support a bill that would have banned all abortions of viable fetuses except when the physical health of the mother was at risk. The documents from Clinton's presidential library are among the first to surface in which Kagan weighs in on the thorny issue of abortion...

..."The position favored by Kagan was a "compromise" of abortion rights crafted by Democratic Sen. Tom Daschle in response to efforts by Republicans to pass the so-called partial birth abortion ban. "Clinton supported it," reports AP, "but the proposal failed and Clinton vetoed a stricter Republican ban."

In a May 13, 1997, memo from the White House domestic policy office, Kagan and her boss, Bruce Reed, told Clinton that abortion rights groups opposed Daschle's compromise. But they urged the president to support it, saying he otherwise risked seeing a Republican-led Congress override his veto on the stricter bill.

They urged support lest he risk an override of his veto.

I think Daschle's bill went so far that it did not exempt a mother's health from a ban of late term abortions. I found more about it, and I think it only considered life of the mother, as the health issues were mostly shoved aside.

Daschle's 1997 abortion ban was even more rigid than the GOP bill.

"Daschle's so-called compromise bill, as quoted in the New York Times, permits an exception to the ban for `a severely debilitating disease or impairment specifically caused by the pregnancy (emphasis added),' but makes no provision for a pre-existing, life- and health-threatening `debilitating disease or impairment' that is being exacerbated by the pregnancy. This could include kidney disease, severe hypertension and some cancers. Nor does the Daschle bill allow for an abortion in cases of severe fetal abnormality where it is unlikely the fetus would live long outside the womb, even with technological support.

"The physician certification requirement and the potential loss of a medical license in the Daschle language invites government scrutiny of private medical matters and threatens doctor-patient confidentiality. The intent of this and other abortion ban bills is to control women and to limit their ability to make critical reproductive decisions that affect their families, their health and their lives. These bills represent the ultimate in Congressional arrogance," Gandy charged.

Tom Daschle appears to have bragged that his bill was even more rigid than the Republican bill.

KWAME HOLMAN: A Democratic amendment was briefly considered and rejected, giving way to the major alternative of the abortion debate. The bill by Minority Leader Tom Daschle has attracted support of Republicans and yesterday the endorsement of President Clinton.

SENATOR TOM DASCHLE, Minority Leader: That is really the fundamental difference between the two pending bills. We ban abortion; they ban a procedure. They allow all the other abortive procedures available--dilation and evacuation, induction, hysterotomies, hysterectomies--those are still legally available. What we ban are all of those procedures--all of them.

Their bill was more punitive to a woman than the Republican bill.

So if RH Reality is correct, that is the bill that Kagan and her boss, Bruce Reed, asked Clinton to endorse.

Obama is president, it is his call.

But women should begin to speak up for themselves. After years of being marginalized for political expediency, it is time to speak up. That bill may have been from 1997, but it is still going on today. Almost all late term abortions are banned, and woman could die because doctors must carefully sort out the details and determine how to follow the law to avoid a prison sentence.

[ProSense]

1. "Daschle's 1997 abortion ban was even more rigid than the GOP bill." Bogus

KWAME HOLMAN: The Daschle alternative would outlaw any abortion after a fetus can survive outside the womb, generally after six months. Such abortions would be legal only if the pregnancy threatened the woman's life or poses risk of grievous injury. Most Republicans, however, argue the Daschle ban amounts to no abortion ban at all.

[madfloridian]

4. Let's be honest.

""Daschle's so-called compromise bill, as quoted in the New York Times, permits an exception to the ban for `a severely debilitating disease or impairment specifically caused by the pregnancy (emphasis added),' but makes no provision for a pre-existing, life- and health-threatening `debilitating disease or impairment' that is being exacerbated by the pregnancy. This could include kidney disease, severe hypertension and some cancers. Nor does the Daschle bill allow for an abortion in cases of severe fetal abnormality where it is unlikely the fetus would live long outside the womb, even with technological support.

[ProSense]

5. You think the claim that it was worse than the GOP bill is honest? n/t

[madfloridian]

8. That is what Daschle said. I don't know his reasons.

"SENATOR TOM DASCHLE, Minority Leader: That is really the fundamental difference between the two pending bills. We ban abortion; they ban a procedure. They allow all the other abortive procedures available--dilation and evacuation, induction, hysterecotomies, hysterectomies--those are still legally available. What we ban are all of those procedures--all of them."

Some say they were trying to protect women from a more severe bill, but that is not what he said nor is it what it sounds like to me.

I don't know his stance now except that he does not think women should be jailed for having an abortion.

Daschle says a woman should not be sent to jail for having an abortion.

Video at the link must be viewed at You Tube. My impression is they are trying not to antagonize the religious right.

[depakid]

2. Triangulating away fundamental rights

Only- since Planned Parenthood v. Casey, the right to choose is NO LONGER A FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT.

That's where triangulation gets you.

[HughMoran]

3. Tiangulating tirangles for the sake of triangulation

I know one word too :D

[Hekate]

6. Kagen has been endorsed today by NOW, NARAL, and Planned Parenthood. Why do you think that is?

:shrug:

[madfloridian]

7. Did they endorse or make a general statement with open questions?

NARAL:

"WASHINGTON, May 10, 2010 - Nancy Keenan, president of NARAL Pro-Choice America, issued the following statement on President Obama's selection of Solicitor General Elena Kagan to succeed retiring Justice John Paul Stevens on the U.S. Supreme Court.

"President Obama has selected a nominee with a sound record of legal accomplishment. We call on the Senate to give Solicitor General Kagan a fair hearing and look forward to learning more about her views on the right to privacy and the landmark Roe v. Wade decision. President Obama recently reiterated his strong support for constitutional principles that protect women's rights. We will work to ensure Americans receive clear answers to questions regarding these principles as this nomination process moves forward."

"Given the current composition of the court, we will assess Solicitor General Kagan's complete record on privacy and other relevant issues in the same way we did during Justice Sonia Sotomayor's confirmation process. Unlike Chief Justice Roberts or Justice Alito, each of whom had anti-choice records before coming to the Supreme Court, Justice Sotomayor articulated several times throughout her hearing that the constitutional right to privacy includes the right to choose, and thus we supported her nomination for a seat on the nation's highest court."

http://www.naral.org/

Planned Parenthood's statement does not mention her privacy stance and Rove V Wade...a nuanced non-endorsement.

"Elena Kagan is an accomplished and experienced lawyer and legal scholar who has been a trailblazer throughout her career. She was the first woman to be named solicitor general of the United States. Earlier in her career, she was also the first woman to serve as dean of Harvard Law School.

It is clear that Americans want a Supreme Court justice who has a deep understanding of the law, an appreciation of the impact of the court’s decisions on everyday Americans, and a commitment to the rule of law and protecting our individual liberties. We are confident that Kagan will bring the dedication and commitment that have marked her career with her to the highest court in the land."

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/about-us/newsroom/press-releases/statement-cecile-richards-president-planned-parenthood-federation-america-nomination-elena-kaga-32611.htm

NOW's statement:

"The National Organization for Women applauds President Barack Obama's decision to nominate a woman to follow Justice John Paul Stevens on the U.S. Supreme Court. Upon confirmation by the U.S. Senate, Solicitor General Elena Kagan would join Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Sonia Sotomayor to become the third woman currently sitting on the Supreme Court -- a historic achievement.

...""While we are pleased to see the second woman in a row nominated to the court, gender alone is not enough," said O'Neill. "Justice Stevens was a clear champion of social justice, who will leave behind a proud liberal legacy. We are eager to learn that Elena Kagan, too, will stand for equality and fairness across the board."

Encouragingly, Kagan has expressed clear opposition to the discriminatory Don't Ask, Don't Tell policy that has forced out thousands of lesbian and gay service members from the military. However, having never served as a judge herself, it is unclear where Kagan stands on most of NOW's key issues.

"NOW will closely monitor the confirmation process," promised O'Neill. "We will listen carefully to Elena Kagan's answers, to determine if she will be a defender of the rights of women, racial minorities, the poor and other oppressed groups. And we will follow the comments of the senators and the media, as both have a history of sexist treatment of women nominees. As Elena Kagan prepares to add another crack to the marble ceiling, we hope to see that stereotyped attitudes, at long last, are history."

http://www.now.org/press/05-10/05-10.html

[VMI Dem]

9. NARAL endorsement my ass.

[madfloridian]

10. Here's the full memo from Kagan and Reed to Clinton and his response.

It appears to be urging him to do what is expedient, and not especially showing concern for the health and life and privacy of women.

It's rather sad, but that is just how it is now. Women are not considered equal to men in making their own decisions. And that is a shame.

http://abcnews.go.com/images/Politics/May13,1997memo.pdf

The draft of the answer is not signed by Clinton, but the text shows he considers decisions about women and late abortions best made by the GOP and by men.

It really should not be something that a doctor has to research whether he is breaking the law in giving his patient advice in a crisis.