My 2010-2012 advice for the pissers & moaners: "Dance with the one that brung ya."

[Amerigo Vespucci]

"All I am sayyyyyyyyyyyin'...is give "B" a chance."

President Barack Obama will be accused of a LOT of things in his lifetime.

Being "perfect" isn't one of them.

War sucks, and so does the economy, but President Obama cannot magically blow pixie dust on our world and erase 8 years of Bush and Cheney.

I WISH he could.

I really do.

But he can't.

His first year has not been "stellar."

What the hell did you EXPECT? LET THE MAN DO HIS JOB.

Here's a little reminder of the man-child who preceded him:



So let him do his fucking job. IF...at the end of four years...he's logged FOUR FAILED YEARS, guess what?

WE CAN ELECT ANOTHER DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT IN 2012!

This isn't "Omerta," this isn't a blood oath. He gets one chance at a first term, and...if successful...gets a shot at a second.

That's why it's called "Democracy."

Let him do his job, and if you don;t like the way he's doing it, write or email him...respectfully.

That is all.

:patriot:

[demosincebirth]

1. Eight years of Bush's f***kups will take more than four years to straightened out

[Amerigo Vespucci]

More than four AT MINIMUM...

...so what I am saying is acknowledge that. I don't expect things to be 100% in four years...if things are 400% worse, find a new candidate. If President Obama has stopped the bleeding and made progress, give credit where credit was due.

And one more thing.

Let's give thanks for the fact that we side-stepped four years of THIS man.



:patriot:

[IndianaGreen]

32. You don't fix this mess by continuing this war!

Instead of getting out of this quagmire, the President decided to jump into it head first, and with his eyes open.

[vaberella]

37. You did notice there is an exit plan. He's not going in without a strategy.

Further more...imagine leaving AFghanistan---just like that the way you want. Afghanistan's problems will bleed into neighboring nations--as it's already begun (because of Bush and a weak Pakistani government) and we'll go back in and there will be another war and we'd open ourselves up for more attacks. Sure staying in could be a national security risk but leaving just like that---most definitely is. We bare responsibility---if you believe in that word you'd understand why we may need to do as much good as we can or at least try. I hear a lot on the left want Bush to be investigated and pay the price and take responsibility. Leaving just like that is exactly what Bush did with the Presidency leaving a mess behind.

[IndianaGreen]

38. That was nothing but a baby's pacifier to keep the liberal happy

but it ain't gonna work.

[vaberella]

39. Unlike you I'll wait and see. n/t

[FarLeftFist]

48. If it's not going to work...

Then maybe it wasn't a pacifier at all. Maybe it was the truth.

[mkultra]

61. good. thats how we should always enter conflict.

Im glad he is going after AQ. unlike you, i want them captured or dead.

[Splinter Cell]

68. Here we go again...

:eyes:

[demosincebirth]

72. I don't know if you were following the Obama campaign, but this was one..

of the things he said he would do...and I backed him 100%. If we hadn't jumped into Iraq (no al-queda there) and concentrated on Afghanistan, we probably would have been out of there by now and had Osama's head on a pole.

[vaberella]

35. That is ultimately the real problem. n/t

[Top Cat]

2. K&R

[silverweb]

3. K&R

:patriot:

[donheld]

4. B is totally ignoring those who brung him.

totally

[JuniperLea]

6. Bull...

He told y'all what his plans were... that you ignored him, didn't understand him, or hoped you could change him is more a reflection of you than it is of him.

Where will you move the goalpost to when he ends this mess?

[ThomCat]

14. Your post is what is bull.

As the Rolling Stones documents pretty well this month, B.O. had progressive economists advising his campaign and he was making progressive promises during the campaign. The moment he won the election the progressive economists were booted to the curb and conservative economists were brought in who were all affiliated with Goldman Sachs and Robert Rubin, the guy who brought us NAFTA and massive deregulation.

So instead of the progressive economic policies we were promised during the campaign we got a bait and switch, and now we have Reagonomics and Trickle Down economics again brought to us by a democratic administration. Give all the aid to big corporations and expect that the benefits will somehow trickle down to everyone else.

Every single economist in the Obama administration is affiliated with Robert Rubin, implementing policies that Obama campaigned against but apparently actually supported.

You have repeatedly claimed that anyone who is disappointed with Obama didn't understand him. It appears that you are the one who wasn't paying attention or didn't understand. Otherwise you would have noticed that he campaigned on reforming NAFTA and free trade, and rejected that as soon as he took office. You would have noticed that he campaigned against giving all our aide to wall street with nothing to mains street, but as soon as he was elected it was all about giving wall street whatever they wanted without any strings attached.

Perhaps you should take off those rose colored glasses you bought during the campaign and start paying attention to the real world.

[JuniperLea]

66. Oh everything will be much better once we're married!

Bullshit! Obama stated very clearly during the debates what his stance was on this issue. You're like a dewy-eyed bride who thought she was going to change her husband once they were married. You keep trying to insist that Obama lied to you about this. Bull. Fucking. Shit.

I hate war. I hate these two wars with a firey passion. But I knew what Obama was about WHEN I voted for him. I did not delude myself in any way. I knew we would part ways in thinking on this, but I never thought he'd change what he said he'd do.

[ThomCat]

74. You obviously didn't read the article, and didn't

have anything to say when we were all commenting early in B.O.'s term about the changes in his staff.

Nice blinders you're wearing. Do they cost much? :eyes:

[Shanti Mama]

15. Nope.

He's doing what he said he'd do. He's doing what he thinks he needs to do.

We at DU are not the only ones who voted for him. Millions upon millions wept when he won. We don't actually know what that 'silent majority' think.

[donheld]

34. Maybe so on the war, but when it comes to the Economy, health care, gay rights

- he's ignoring us.

[treestar]

69. The economy and health care?

Really?

You may not agree, but he's not ignoring it.

[mkultra]

62. wrong, this afghan war thing is a prime example

he clearly campaigned on this.

[tblue]

5. But I don't wanna "ELECT ANOTHER DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT IN 2012."

I want to reelect THIS president! And I want to do it with my whole heart and soul. I want to give money I barely have to help his campaign. I wanna work insane volunteer hours registering voters, phone banking, recruiting volunteers to support his reelection. I want to write letters to the editor of my local paper expressing my passionate support of everything he does. I badly want to, just as I did in 2008, wholeheartedly devote myself in these ways to reelecting Barack Obama. But sometimes, man, it's hard. Not so much on the war; I saw that coming before I voted for him. But on a lot of issues, it's hard for me to summon the energy and the hope I once had. I'm still rooting for him as much as I can, tho. Not giving up yet. Keeping hope alive.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

8. Same here.

But maybe if the people who are screaming for his head right NOW put that in their back pocket, they might chill out...right?

:patriot:

[salguine]

49. I want to do everything you said, too, except for Dennis Kucinich.

[Clio the Leo]

7. I'm kicking this thread just for the giant picture of the kid. NT

[Amerigo Vespucci]

9. That's some of my Photoshop mojo in action.

Glad you like it. When the photo was first published, I immediately recognized its staying power, enlarged it, then went nuts.

:patriot:

[valerief]

10. There is no excuse for war, so there are no reasons to give war a chance. nt

[Amerigo Vespucci]

13. Agreed, and I don't understand the reasons behind his current decisions...

...and I also don't see him as being "insulated" from the media like Bush.

Remember how Dan Bartlett used to make a "DVD News Briefing" for Junior so he wouldn't actually have to WATCH the news?

I don't see any evidence of that with President Obama.

I think he clearly understands where the public agrees with him, and where they part ways, on the subject of war.

All I am saying is this:

We have a few choices in 2012 (and it's still only 2009)...

1). If Barack Obama has consistently gone against every principle that the voters who put him in office held important, those voters are under no obligation to vote for a second term.

2). President McCain (and Vice President Palin) would have been MUCH WORSE than what we've seen in the last year.

3). I am by NO means advocating a "blank check" for President Obama...that's why I made the comment about writing to him if you disagree with him.

Barack Obama is an ELECTED OFFICIAL...he works for US...but I do not believe that ANY man or woman could have "corrected" 8 years of Bush-Cheney in ONE year.

I'm just saying "it's been one year." President Obama most certainly has not hit a home run out of the park in that one year. But he's got three years to go. I'd rather be staring down the barrel of three more years of Obama than three more years of McCain, the guy who wanted to "bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran."

:patriot:

[valerief]

20. Well, sure. It's like the difference between being hit with a bucketload of shit and single turd.

I know he campaigned with a lot talk about "Pocky"stan, but some of us hoped it was just rhetoric to get elected. Too many bad guys are keeping tax dollars from taxpayers. This war is more of that with the added horror of killing more and more people.

It doesn't have to happen.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

24. Nothing's gonna make it right. So it becomes a matter of...

...in the face of overwhelming disapproval, what is his next move?

I don't know.

He's inherited some unpopular situations, and whether he handles them in a popular or unpopular manner, he's charting the course of his own political future. We shall see.

[valerief]

25. If nothing makes it right, we should get out now. Save money, save lives. nt

[Amerigo Vespucci]

26. That's what I'm saying, but...

...he will listen to those voices or he won't. He knows that the people who put him in office wanted to see an end to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Democratic voters, on a whole, were hardly "pro-war."

So he knows that sending in more troops will not win the admiration of some of the people who elected him.

And he's sending in more troops.

So if he does this ten, twenty, two hundred, two thousand more times in the next three years...makes decisions that are clearly in opposition to the wishes of the people who elected him to office...he will harvest the crops that come from planting those seeds.

That's all I'm saying. It's been one year. He inherited a mess. He's had no major, unquestionable, career-defining victories. He's pissed off segments of his "base." He's got three years to shine. I saw we give him the chance to shine, but hold him accountable. I would encourage you to write everything you've written to me to him. Seriously. It's your right, it's what being an American is all about. Write him.

I am in no way, shape or form saying "Let's support him no matter what." That would be just as bad as doing a Joan of Arc on him after only his first year in office.

:patriot:

[valerief]

29. Gotcha. Let's hope the remaining three years don't get Bushier.

I really don't care about his political career. He'll always have a hot meal and roof over his head. I just hate seeing America getting fucked over again and again.

BTW I emailed whitehouse.gov.

[Political Heretic]

11. Here's why you're wrong: corporate power and monied interests don't "speak up" once every four years

You suggest that the appropriate time for criticism, or disagreement, or even outrage at the direction chosen by our leaders is once every election. In between, we should sit back silently and wish them well, then check in up them every two, four or six years.

Trouble is, not only is that not how a health political system functions, but it also demands that we be at a complete disadvantage to the rich and powerful who use their billion dollar megaphones to SCREAM THEIR WISHES at our leaders EVERY SECOND OF EVERY DAY.

So, I'm sorry - but we don't get one chance to challenger our leaders each election. That's not only not how it works, it actually horribly destructive to the health of our country that many people think that way.

The President of the United States is a representative of the people. That means he works for me. That means I will use every resource at my disposal (big or small, in my case probably very small) to speak out for and advocate for what I believe to be right.

I will demand from my elected leaders that they be about the business of prioritizing the needs of ordinary Americans - that would be the bottom 80% of American that is not wealthy, with particular and special interest in the poor - ahead of the wants and whims of the financial elite.

And I will use that as my lens for policy analysis. And I will make policy analysis every time there is new policy out there.

To not do this is to put the voice of ordinary people at a complete disadvantage and establish one set of rules for the rich who lobby their government every minute of every day, and another set of rules for ordinary folk who are supposed to just shut up and let the "smart elite people handle it" until each election year.

If you can't see how ridiculous that is, then I can't help you.

THAT is all.

[Zodiak]

12. pissers, moaners

Forgive me if I do not believe that you are interested in reasoned discourse with an opening like that, nor do I believe that you really want the votes of these people. No one votes because they were cajoled by an internet bully.

Just more rhetorical chaff, and the same argument launched thousands of times already with no real effect.

Please raise the discourse level higher than 7th grade.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

17. Re-OWWWWR!

Jesus, can I feel the sting from your words or WHAT? The last time I encountered such wit it was lifting its leg on a fire hydrant.

"I do not believe that you are interested in reasoned discourse with an opening like that, nor do I believe that you really want the votes of these people"

The question you should be asking, rather than questioning the motives of someone posting on a political chat message board that you DO NOT KNOW, is "at what point did your belief in me...or lack OF it...MATTER?"

The answer, of course, is "Never."

Don't put words in my mouth, tough guy, and I'll return the favor.

I've just put you on my ignore list to save any future annoyances from you. Have a nice day, eighth grader.

[Zodiak]

19. LOL

Now THAT was a reasoned response!

[QC]

31. I hope you can pick up the shattered pieces of your life and carry on.

It will be hard, but you must be brave.

[TheCowsCameHome]

16. Who brung who? I thought we brung him.

[Amerigo Vespucci]

18. We did!

Come on, don't nit-pick. You know what I meant.

:rofl:

:toast:

[Political Heretic]

65. I notice that you've still not responded to my post. Pretty much sums it up.

[polichick]

21. Exactly, and yet he slaps down his base over and over...

He's been dancing with his political enemies, corporate America and the MIC.

[DCBob]

22. The way America is treating Barack Obama, I doubt he will run again in 2012..

And I don't blame him. His job sucks.

[Common Sense Party]

27. Remember, he asked for this job. He wanted it. Bad.

And he knew full well how tough it was going to be, and how screwed up things were. And he asked for our vote, by promising that he would fix things and CHANGE things.

How's that workin' for ya?

[Cha]

30. It's working fine for me. And, he wanted bad to help out his

country.

[DCBob]

45. You expected him to "fix things" in 10 months??

Are you completely clueless our just pretending?

[salguine]

50. Who's clueless? It's not the speed he's moving, it's the goddamn direction. Jesus Christ.

[Common Sense Party]

52. Bingo. That's just what I was thinking.

If you've lost your way, and you find yourself, broken down and exhausted in, say, St. Louis, and the place you really need to go is Los Angeles if you're going to solve your problems, you don't start walking toward New Jersey. If you start going in the wrong direction, and you keep heading in the wrong direction, how are you going to reach anywhere but the WRONG DESTINATION?

You can stroll as slowly and leisurely as you want towards New Jersey. But it's not going to get you to L.A.

[DCBob]

56. Any normal non-clueless person should be thrilled with any direction away from the past 8 yrs..

and I suggest you keep Jesus out of this.

[avaistheone1]

51. You don't fix things by acting like a bull in a china shop.

Escalating things in Afghanistan is going to make things worse. Every time we increase troops the violence increases there.
The only unity we are going to create is the tribes are going to unit to drive us out.

Psst...Osama isn't there. And there are only 100 Al Qaeda present, possibly only a dozen. Not worth adding another 37,000 soldiers at a cost of $1 million dollars a piece, and $800 per gallon for each and every gallon of gasoline to support them. That is the definition of insanity. This should be a limited police operation if any thing.

[DCBob]

60. Wow, seems you have some valuable intel on OBL and AQ..

Please send that to the WH ASAP!

[Common Sense Party]

53. I believe you must be the clueless one.

How are you going to fix a broken and leaking pipe by beating on it with a typewriter?

Wrong tool, wrong strategy, wrong ideas...will never get you the right outcome.

You can't fix a problem unless you address the problem and come up with a real solution.

[DCBob]

58. Your typewriter analogy is also clueless..

President Obama is using every tool available to him to get things done and so far he has accomplished amazing things despite intense resistance from a united GOP and some clueless left-wingnuts.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ShortnFiery]

28. Jingoism and trust of "authority" ... how sad.

:eyes:

[NYC_SKP]

41. Jingoism? Oh, never mind.

Not worth it.

[paulk]

33. tell you what

you "respectfully" refer to those who don't agree with Obama's policy decisions as something other than "pissers and moaners" and I'll take you seriously.

[Moochy]

36. K&U

[Starry Messenger]

40. Obama doesn't demand the faith that the man-child did.

:shrug: I thought the fun of having a Dem in office is that our input would be welcome.

[R. P. McMurphy]

42. Well said Amerigo. n/t

edit for spelling

[MrMickeysMom]

43. You keep saying, "let him do his job"...

I thought I was.

It's my job to participate in the executive, as well as the legislative branches, and that goes for local, state and national government.

The way I figure it, we had best be direct, do our homework, and be honest if we think the speech sounds like Bush, the policy steers too far to the right, or the submissiveness in response to the right drives us deeper into poverty and despair!

[Lilith Velkor]

46. I keep asking how the hell anything posted on DU prevents him from doing his job

I never get a coherent answer.

Oh well.

[MrMickeysMom]

47. Indeed...

This is where you separate an online community from an online pre-teen community. Sorry to be such a bitch in describing the non-coherent people who can't converse about the direction of the country... No, I'm not.

[Starry Messenger]

57. LOL.

I keep wondering that too.

[QC]

70. They seem to think that he reads this site and gets his feelings hurt.

Or that the rest of the world reads this site and thus comments posted here can shift world opinion against the president.

It's silly either way.

[Aramchek]

44. or you don't dance at all...

[lamp_shade]

54. Big rec and morning kick.

[BR_Parkway]

55. It'd be nice to but it sure seems that he's told me to go sit in the corner

and is over there hanging out with all the players from the other team.

[ShortnFiery]

59. Obama, Gates and Clinton are lying and distorting facts with such impunity ...

I'd swear that talent was only demonstrated by the GOP. I've learned different. This is NOT just about geopolitics, but one last big GIFT (a trillion of our tax dollars) before the American Empire goes broke and the upper 1% quit politics for "Master of War" positions within Carlyle Investments, et. al.

American Crusade 2001 is ongoing with our CONTINUED OCCUPATION of these two Muslim Nations. :(



This is what we are about:

[Orsino]

63. In another thread, we were informed that posting photos is somehow unfair.

You won't get that admonishment from me...but I will take issue with a demand for respectfulness.

The war is not respectful of individual lives. Any expansion of it, any failure to end it as soon as possible, earns the president a hell of a lot of bad karma.

I have a lot of sympathy for President Obama, who was stuck with an enormously bloody and expensive failpile (and even volunteered to be stuck with it, to his still greater credit), but I have more for the war's victims who have been killed, bereaved, maimed, paupered and made homeless.

The president only has to face criticism from me.

[PVnRT]

64. Invalid use of saying

It applies to politicians remembering those that supported them.

Furthermore, calling people "pissers and moaners" while berating them to be "respectful" is just idiotic, but emblematic of the new DU.

[QC]

71. Yeah, it looks like we now have two people here who misuse the divine Molly Ivins

to apologize for the establishment.

Anyone who has read Ivins knows that the saying refers to politicians remaining loyal to those who put them in office, not, as the fan club here would have it, the voters blindly supporting politicians no matter what they do--or fail to do.

But, as you say, this sort of mindless cheering and juvenile snark is what this place has been all about for a couple of years now.

[smalll]

67. K&R. Amazingly good Obama pic, by the way.

Give "B" a chance! :patriot:

(And down with the leftbagger deviationist pissers and moaners!) :evilgrin:

[DRoseDARs]

73. If he'd stop stomping on toes & telling the gays to like it, they'd stop "pissing and moaning."