What Would Drive People Here to Rebellion?

[Bullet1987]

How long will it take before folks either here or across the country wake up and realize we need to coordinate better if we want good results? Sometimes I feel as if Americans have become too controlled or sedated and always need someone to do things for them. There is a very clear problem in America right now, a problem that I don't see getting changed anytime soon. The problem is plutocratic corporatism. Unregulated capitalism will destroy this country, but no one is saying that even though it's blatantly obvious. I didn't want to believe we were in a race to the bottom when Obama got elected because I honestly thought he would work to reel the "system" in. I have my doubts that will happen now. He's given his ear to the DLC and Republicans, but not the people who put him in office. Where is our seat at the table? Liberals are like the red-headed stepchild of politics, we get no respect and are constantly tuned out. Even though in the larger scheme of things, who has been right and who has been wrong? It seems the MSM is more than willing to give air time to the folks who have been the MOST WRONG for years. Our elected officials aren't doing much better I'm afraid and I'm beginning to lose faith in our system altogether. America is looking like a bad football team. We have horrible coaches that can't seem to get anything done (politicians), and an even worse gameplan that isn't built to our strengths and parade our weaknesses (policy). We need a shakeup in a BAD way. Because this football team is not built to win (infrastructure, healthcare, corruption, etc...the problems are building up). The only thing we seem to do any good is blow shit up.

I know I'm ranting, but the American people (and some on DU) need to wake the hell up. Barack Obama is not going to save us...we can only do that ourselves.

[Deep13]

1. A concerted effort by the upper middle class...

...relying on some gut-level cultural offense in the minds of ordinary people.

[AllentownJake]

6. That is the crux of it

People seem to think that the Revolutions are led by the uneducated masses. Nope they tend to be led by the upper middle class when they realize there is a barrier that has been put in place to prevent them from advancing and the wealthy are moving in to take them down a notch.

The dumbest thing wealthy people can do is piss off the upper middle class, yet time and time again, they try it generally after they've stolen all they can from the two lower classes below them.

See Rome when Caesar takes over, America in 1775, France in the 1780s, Russia in the 1900s, and Cuba in the 1950s.

[SIMPLYB1980]

2. ...

First you would all have to go buy guns? :shrug: Then you would have to find a way to defeat our military and police force? :shrug: Then you would have to create a government that meets your opinion as perfection. :rofl:

[Bullet1987]

3. Ok...allow me to elaborate.

By rebellion I don't mean armed, violent revolution. But definitely a LOOOT more than what we're doing now...which is essentially NOT A DAMN THING. Liberals are NOT organized, we DON'T have a message or even someone we can call our leader (Kucinich is not that). We're so ignored by everyone at large, that we forget who we are sometimes. I think we've been nice to the Democratic Party for long enough, they've played us time and time again. Alan Grayson was a good start, and I have seen liberals speaking out more. We just need more of it because this is our country too.

[SIMPLYB1980]

5. Only an armed rebellion could accomplish what you want,

which imo is to be the one and only voice that the President and Congress should listen to. All other voices are wrong and what you want seems to be a utopia which will never come.

[Bullet1987]

9. Not armed...you don't need to be armed to prove a point

[niceypoo]

4. The republicans are stuck on stupid

Something really bad has to happen for them to wake up. Until they wake up, nothing changes except for the worst. Republicans have to start paying for their fuckups. Because Bush and company got away with everything they did, the next one who comes along will be even more radical. War crimes trials would be a good start.

[happyslug]

7. You have to have a corp group to organize the rebellion, and they are NONE

Lenin said all he needed was 5% of the Russian population to overthrow the Government of Russia, and he was right. Lenin also pattern his party after the Jesuits, a tightly organized but dispersed and dedicated group. At the present time there is NO SUCH ORGANIZATION. Even the tea baggers are more mob then organizers, and thus NOT able to be used to ORGANIZE any revolution.

It will require time and effort to form a tightly controlled group dedicated to take over a mob and use that mob to take over the Government (i.e. a Revolution). Under Hitler the opposition to Hitler looked to the Catholic Church in Germany as the only organization that had the organization to form an effective opposition to Hitler (and the Military opposition to Hitler who approached the Catholic Church in this regard was a Protestant, please note this is AFTER Hitler destroyed the Communist party of Germany AND the Democratic Socialist Party of Germany). Mao organized the peasants of China and then took over the country. Castro did the same in Cuba (Even providing Schools to rural peasants while he was in revolt against Batista). The rise of the Fundamentalist Moslem in most of the Middle East arise from the same need, it is a form that can be tightly controlled when needed for it consist of people committed to radical change and willing to wait and then do what is needed when the time comes.

In the USA at the present time I see NO such organization. The closest thing to such an organization is the fundamentalist Right wing religious groups, but such groups are so centered around their individual preachers that it had no center (In fact until Lenin was returned to Russia by the Germans, neither did the Communists, which is one of the reason the Germans sent him to Russia). The Democratic and Republican Parties are more HOW to rule parties then a party dedicated to Change (Through the GOP is more dedicated to change, but in the wrong way, compared to the Democratic Party). While the GOP is more dedicated to change, the Democratic Party will lead a change if force to do so (Which is why we need to protest for Single Payer health care) but the Democratic Party is NOT centralized and enough and have enough members DEDICATED to radical change to do a revolution.

My point is on the left they is no one who can organized a revolution, you can have riots, you can have massive protest but without a corp of people to take those to the next level, revolution, no revolution will take place. On the right you have the Religious Right which CAN be used to do so, but Corporate America does NOT want a Religious Right Revolution for sooner or later such a Revolution will have to address the central conflict within the Religious Right, how should we take care of the poor? (i.e. the heart of the teaching of Christ). Those teachings can be ignored, but the left can keep citing them till the Religious Right address the problem, and whatever solution the Religious Right would come up with will be opposed by the Corporate Right. The Corporate Right knows this a will oppose any Religious Right Revolution, and given the Makeup of the GOP, will doom such a Revolution. Thus while the Religious Right is the closest thing we have to be able to take over and lead a Revolution, its closest ally the Corporate Right would OPPOSE such a revolution (and in many ways oppose it more then the Corporate Right would oppose a Left wing Revolution, in the Corporate Culture the left is always viewed as being failures, but the Religious Right are viewed as being able to make enough compromises to stay in power forever).

Just a comment, I see NO organization on the left that can lead a Revolution. The Religious Right can do so, but its present alliance with Corporate America would doom either the Revolution or that Alliance (In either case leaving it open for the return to the government we have at present). To have a Revolution you MUST have a dedicated set of Volunteers dispersed around the Country Committed to such a Revolution. The closest thing to such an organization in the USA today is the Religious Right and it is NOT a centralized as what is truly needed to lead a revolution.

[stray cat]

8. Isn't the slogan PEACE or NO WAR or WAR is not the answer?

[mkultra]

10. looks like the paid posters are getting more bold with their posts

its getting entertaining.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

11. A massive and ridiculous decline in our standards of living.

[happyslug]

16. Only after the decline bottoms out

One of the chief "discovery" of history was done by Karl Marx when he observed that Revolutions do NOT occur as things go bad, but only after things have bottomed out and are improving. The rationale for this is simple, as things go bad, people are to worried about where they next meal is coming from to revolt against the Government. Only once they no longer have to worry about the next meal do they have time to think about WHY things went bad and revolt. The worse year for the French Peasants were 1787 during the Great Famine, by 1789 things were looking better and such peasants had the time to demand a change so something like the Great Famine would NOT occur again. The worse year for the Russians during WWI was 1916, things were looking better in 1917 thus the people had time to think WHY were they fighting and demand an end to the War (Which lead to the Communist Revolution of November/October 1917, for only the Communists offered peace, the Government installed by the Spring Revolution had Refused to sign a peace treaty with Germany and that failure was one of the reason that Government had no support when Lenin Overthrew it in the Fall).

Just a comment, that revolutions NEVER occur as things go bad, they occur only after things have bottomed out.

[Tailormyst]

12. It will take something catastrophic as a catalyst.

Sadly- nothing as large as our country will change without a event just as big sparking the match.

[Oregone]

13. Nothing short of the government taking LCD widescreens away (and X-Boxes)

[ShortnFiery]

14. ....

That's true. Americans, in general, sadly have become numb and/or dumbed-down. :(

[happyslug]

15. Discussed in another thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7175864

[tranche]

17. When the country's in bad enough shape for that. You'll be crying for mommy.

[DCBob]

18. President Palin...

:puke:

[sofa king]

19. Take away their televisions, says my friend.

I for one have always had an infatuation with the 18th and 19th Centuries, how large populations lived primarily on human and animal muscle power, without petrochemically-supplied heat, where every little town had about ten horsepower worth of machinery and three hundred crap-spraying actual horses.

Now, I realize, it's possible that I'm going to be unlucky enough to see how it all worked first hand. At the same time, I'm going to watch nature cull five billion people from the herd. By 2109, some of the kids here are going to be the meanest, toughest people who ever walked the earth. I hope they remember how to love, and how to care about the welfare of others.

[timeforpeace]

20. The incremental march to socialism being thwarted somehow.

[Occam Bandage]

21. I can't imagine anything that would cause me to do that. nt