A bruising fight with republicans over the appointment of a solid, pro-consumer advocate...

[Zenlitened]

... would have been a good thing, no?

What's the downside?

Warren should have been nominated to be the boss of this thing weeks ago, IMO.

Imagine the spectacle of 'pukes fighting tooth and nail against Pres. Obama's knight-in-shining-armor, sent to defend Main Street...

That would have been good, positive (for Democrats) political theater.

Eye-opening and uplifting, in the very finest theater tradition.

Instead, if reports are to be believed, we get tepid avoidance of confrontation.

Oh well, at least the DNC website relaunch went smoothly. :eyes:

[ProSense]

1. Reality:

They would have blocked her with the help of a couple of Dems.

Why would anyone want a battle when Warren gets the position without one?

[Radical Activist]

5. But it would make great political theater!

We all have our priorities.

[Zenlitened]

9. Sorry, didn't mean to imply that you should get your hands dirty or anything.

Connecting with ordinary Americans in a direct, gut-level way... how terribly tawdry.

[Zenlitened]

7. Because the battle itself would be meaningful. - n/t

[Telly Savalas]

12. Would it?

Political battles these days are dominated by clueless shitheads who shout vacuous talking points at one another on 24 hour news channels. Any war of ideas between Warren and the Republicans in Congress would reach the American public through the filter of the buffoons on CNN, MSNBC, and Fox "News".

She'd be much more effective helping govern than she would be as fodder for dumbass pundits to bicker about. Granted it's still a huge open question as to how much authority she'll have in her newly appointed position.

[Zenlitened]

13. I think there's a way to get beyond bickering bullshit punditry...

...but it involves taking advantage of opportunities, like this, when they arise.

This is real archetype-level stuff, just the sort of thing the overworked, overwhelmed, too-tired-for nuance voting public can and does respond to.

That's a message that does seep in, despite the brain-dead mewlings of the Wolf Blitzers of the world, in a way that quietly effective agency administration just can't.

There's a contingent of people on DU who, despite being new to the whole game of politics, do a lot of talking about political "reality."

The reality is, putting on a good political show is the practical, pragmatic thing to do sometimes, if doing so will strengthen your hand at governance when the show's over.

I think this is just such a case.

[vaberella]

20. Even at a loss of a great mind you advocate for?!

That makes not an ounce of sense.

[Zenlitened]

22. Huh?

Your post makes not an ounce of sense to me, I'm afraid. Could you clarify?

[Cosmocat]

37. One major problem with this concept ...

the media ...

Sorry, in your model, the right wing finds a picture of Warren standing next to a poster of Che, and they go on a month long rant about how she is a socialist, the dems note the picture of che was in a Barnes and Nobles, and the "liberal" media would spend the month saying how it is reasonable to suspect that she is in fact a socilist because she once stood next to a poster of che ...

Sorry, there is no win in something like this, the Rs would turn it into a crapefest and the media would lap it up ...

[Zenlitened]

38. You're right. The media is mean. Avoidance and passivity is our best bet.

:eyes:

[rufus dog]

21. Another Reality

Fox would have run a smear campaign on her, then CNN and MSNBC would pick up the attack.

[arcane1]

2. I had the same thought

It seems it would've been especially good during the lead-up to the election.

[ProSense]

3. Well, you'll be happy when

the Republicans throw a fit over the appointment, except in this case it's a done deal.

[Jackpine Radical]

4. Well, for one thing, it puts political expedience ahead of

doing the right thing. For another, there are enough blue dogs & bankster mouthpieces like Christopher Dodd (D-Shitsville) who oppose it & would be fighting on the other side. Obama did it right.

[arcane1]

6. That's a great point!

[Zenlitened]

11. I'm confident the President has the skills to position all this in a way...

... that would make high-profile Dem opposition all but impossible.

The will, I guess, is not there this time.

[Arkana]

18. It keeps her from having to sit in a hearing where Republicans lie and distort her record

to her face, smear her in the press for weeks, and make her life a living hell. Instead, she can get to work right away--and I guarantee you she'll get confirmed when she does go to a vote.

[FrenchieCat]

8. LOL!

:rofl:

[Zenlitened]

10. Well-argued!

Is your post meant to be reflective of the vast depth and breadth of your political experience?

[impik]

24. I agree with every word.

[AtomicKitten]

43. Best response on this thread.

:thumbsup:

[alcibiades_mystery]

14. You're talking about people who have thrown the judiciary into a crisis

You think they would think twice about blocking Ms. Warren?

The question is, "What's the goal?" If the goal is to have a public fight and make GOPers look bad, then fine. If the goal is to get Ms. Warren into that position, then your strategy is a no-go. They'd filibuster her and be done with it, and you'd have your bruising fight, but no Ms. Warren.

[Zenlitened]

27. The goal: Democrats taking a clear stand that shows the voters...

... the party is on their side, the side of the ordinary working man and woman.

Handled well, the result could be a Senate cornered into confirming her.

Alternatively, Pres. Obama could have put her in charge of the new agency via a recess appointment, using that as yet another opportunity to drive home the point that it is the Democratic Party that is on the side of Joe and Jane Mainstreet.

Battle waged, benefits realized, Warren on the job.

[alcibiades_mystery]

35. We're missing 20% of the judiciary

You have no idea how the confirmation process would or even could work in this environment. You're simply selecting the rosiest result and pretending that it's possible.

[Zenlitened]

36. I honestly disagree, I don't think a recess appointment...

... is overly rosy or optimistic.

She could be on the job right now, appointed during the last recess.

[gkhouston]

15. Dawn Johnsen? n/t

[AtomicKitten]

16. Here's the reality: She can get in there immediately.

The GOP would have otherwise held her up in the nomination process til the end of time during which time she, as Chris Hayes explained it on Rachel tonight, would go into the Cone of Silence.

This way she bypasses a protracted confirmation process and can get in their immediately to set up and run the organization. She is also free to talk publicly and there is nobody better to explain the department better than she.

You are entitled to kneejerk react with the usual the Democrats are out to get me response, but the passive-aggressive drama is getting tiresome. :eyes: indeed.

[Zenlitened]

28. Recess appointment.

And, to respond to the gratuitous and poorly thought-out nonsense you added to the end of your post... bullshit:

You are entitled to kneejerk react with the usual the Democrats are out to get me response, but the passive-aggressive drama is getting tiresome. :eyes: indeed.

Save your one-size-fits none, last-resort talking points for some other thread, okay?

[AtomicKitten]

39. A recess appt is the least best way to get around a protracted fractious Senate confirmation.

Also, your ridiculously misguided summation "We get tepid avoidance of confrontation," is precisely what a gratuitous, poorly thought-out nonsense, one-size-fits none, kneejerk last-resort horseshit talking point looks like.

[Zenlitened]

42. The confrontation would have served its purpose by then.

Really, I don't think you understand politics at all.

[AtomicKitten]

44. Gee wiz, hmmmm, let's see, maybe the point was an end-run around the GOP obstructionists and Dodd.

The fact that you are itching for confrontation, any confrontation (as played out in this thread), is beside the point. It's clear you don't understand politics at all.

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Arkana]

17. She got the job without the fight.

What's your problem?

When it comes time for an appointment, she'll have a leg up because she'll already BE director of the agency and will most likely get the job for real.

I'm puzzled as to why you think the theater is more important than the goddamn results.

[Zenlitened]

29. She didn't get THE job. As you noted, she got A job.

I'm puzzled as to why the "pragmatists" and "realist" on this board refuse to recognize the political aspects of governance.

[Arkana]

40. We're not the ones bitching because we didn't get a massive floor fight.

She's going to design the agency and most likely direct it when it's finished. I fail to see a problem with this.

[Zenlitened]

41. Talking politics = bitching now?

[boppers]

19. Hey, bruising fights are to be admired, right?

Ask any domestic violence survivor, and they'll tell you all about how great bruising fights are.

[Zenlitened]

30. Weak.

Even by your standards of distortion and diversion.

[boppers]

48. Glorify violence, and live with the results?

This is reality, not professional wrestling.

[Zenlitened]

50. Meaningful.

Not.

[killbotfactory]

23. Sometimes political theater isn't as important as getting things done

[Zenlitened]

31. Sometimes positive political theater is necessary in order to get things done.

With the November elections looming, I think this was just such a case.

[Uzybone]

33. not sometimes...at all times

political theater is for fools and cable show addicts.

[Zenlitened]

34. I don't think you understand much about politics, if that's your POV.

[impik]

25. GO PROFFESIONAL LEFT!

Never give up. NEVER!

[Zenlitened]

32. Better professionally left than professionally passive, I suppose.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dionysus]

45. downside? fillibustering, no liz warren in a position.

[Tarheel_Dem]

47. That's it? The new complaint of the professional left is "not enough theater"?

Just so I'm straight...political theater now takes precendence over actual governance? Just when I think I've heard it all. :eyes:

[Zenlitened]

49. I don't think there's any risk of you having heard it all.

Since you don't appear to have "heard" a single point I've made in this thread.

:hi:

[Tarheel_Dem]

51. Well, if you had a point, I admit it was totally lost on me. And judging by..

the rest of this wreck of a thread, I'm not the only one. :hi:

[Zenlitened]

52. It does have a "trampled by orcs" look to it by now, doesn't it?

Oh well.