Obama: Peace is goal, but war sometimes justified (AP)

[jefferson_dem]

OSLO – President Barack Obama says war is sometimes necessary and justified, even as he accepts the Nobel Peace Prize.

The president acknowledged on Thursday that many people feel he has not done enough to deserve the prize that he received in Oslo. He also noted that he recently ordered another 30,000 U.S. troops to fight in Afghanistan.

But Obama said in his acceptance speech that people must accept "the hard truth" that violence cannot be eradicated and nations sometimes must wage war to protect their citizens from evil regimes or terrorist groups.

Obama says a nonviolent movement could not have halted Hitler's armies and negotiations cannot persuade al-Qaida's leaders to disarm. He says accepting that is not a call to cynicism but a recognition of man's imperfections.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091210/ap_on_re_eu/eu_obama_nobel

[ShortnFiery]

1. I think I just threw-up in my mouth a little bit.

:puke:

[jefferson_dem]

3. AP produced this headline for that purpose...

"Mission Accomplished"

[ShortnFiery]

5. Yeah, it's all AP's fault that President Obama has CHANGED our original mission

from al Qaeda to only Karzai's Taliban enemies - in order to suit the MIC and endless war. :crazy:

[polpilot]

33. Obama Apologists Unite!!! Is that George in that 'Obama Suit'?

Go ahead DU, make excuses for him...while you struggle with lack of healthcare and a renewed and growing disrespect for the ole U.S. of A. He had everything and gave it all away. I was at Invesco Field in Denver when he accepted the nomination. I worked for his campaign. Not again. No honor. No integrity. No representation of those who can't defend or represent themselves. No math ability either. No math ability to 'cipher' the cost benefit of leaving your good name behind to attempt to be re-elected.

O.K. Who's next? How 'bout that rep from Florida. He's a damn lot smarter, a damn lot more capable, and SURE AS HELL HAS A LOT MORE COURAGE.

[timeforpeace]

85. Whatever happened to "this will only create more terrorists!"?

[Cha]

86. I have no need to apologize for

President Obama..he's the one I voted to do the job and he's doing it.

[mkultra]

109. same for me. He is doing what he said

and its what i wanted. Iraq was wrong but im good with Afghanistan.

[Ken Burch]

124. He wasn't elected to be Scoop Jackson, for God's sake

War always ruins Democratic presidencies.

[Fearless]

96. +1

[beyond cynical]

51. I don't know why--it's been this way since the beginning of time.

And it be this way until you arrive in heaven (if you believe in heaven). :)

[midnight]

2. But this is a stupid war..... End it now....

[ShortnFiery]

4. Anyone note that President Obama is using BushCo's Orwellian language?

What's old is new again?

[chimpymustgo]

18. I HATED the speech. Justifying WAR. PIMPING Martin Luther King and Ghandhi. Disgusting. Very 1984.

[ShortnFiery]

20. I'm now only angry at myself for being such a gullible American. :(

[polpilot]

44. Obama's not weak on national security. No sireee!! He'lldrop more bombs than Cheney.

I heard he's replacing Gates with Cheney. Any truth??

[ClarkUSA]

49. Funny how you defended Hillary's warmongering votes for years.... but now you're a peacenik, eh?

Who do you think you're kidding?

Oh the Obama Outrage!!!

:eyes:

[dionysus]

50. that's the funniest part of it. people do remember stuff you know.

[ClarkUSA]

54. Yup. It is funny how so MANY warmonger worshippers turned Obama Outrage peaceniks there are at DU.

Hilarious, even. Bitterly so.

[dionysus]

58. i don't even like this increase,but i can understand there are logical arguments why it is necessary

these people foaming at the mouth over every single thing, despite the claims "BUT I CAMPAIGNED AND RAISED MONE-"(*cough*bullshit*cough*) have hated his ass since day one. anyone who reads DU with any regularity knows this.

but it's taboo to mention it.

:shrug:

[ClarkUSA]

64. I hear ya and agree with you 100%, dionysus; I've been rabidly attacked for stating those arguments.

WTH "likes" it? However, "Rational Progressives" (as per Nate Silver) understand why Pres. Obama made the decision.

<<these peopel foaming at the mouth over every single thing, despite the claims "BUT I CAMPAIGNED AND RASISED MONE-"(*cough*bullshit*cough*) have hated his ass since day one. anyone who reads DU with any regularity knows this.

but it's taboo to mention it.>>

You said it. There are only a rare few here who are the honest opposition. And I know who they are.

So do you.

Let's keep 'em honest.

[Duende azul]

83. If you really liked Obama, you'd better start thinking.

You are never defending the positions Obama takes, you are only defending the person.

In a very disrespectful way towards his critics from the base. Sure, you may spot one or two Hillary supporters that are now peaceniks. So what?
The greater number of them is in your camp now. Cause the agenda fits.
So continue pissing of the real progressives and you will stand alone to do the heavy lifting come the election.
The enthusiasm of the most motivated part of Obama's voters is gone.

I find your behaviour highly divisive. You can't misrepresent opposition on the issues as "Obama hate" on a daily basis and rarely contribute to the issues youself.

Why is that? Do you really think you will convince anybody that way? Nope. You will likely piss more and more people of.
So please rethink your attitude.

[ClarkUSA]

88. Oh, I'm thinking alright. Are you?

<<You are never defending the positions Obama takes, you are only defending the person.>>

This one statement disqualifies you from serious consideration, because you obviously haven't read any of my recent OPs.
The rest of your post further illustrates your lack of understanding and your bias.

[SIMPLYB1980]

53. Yes that is funny isn't it.

[ClarkUSA]

60. Hilarious even.

And so very transparent to those of us who remember them well.

[mkultra]

110. +1 oh wow, lying hater exposed.

[mdmc]

6. change

war as self defense is justified..

[freddie mertz]

7. "War is Peace."

Sure, sometimes you have to fight in self-defense.

That is not what we did in Iraq, and is not what we are presently doing in Afghanistan.

Can we get a deal on "Peacekeeper" missiles?

[jefferson_dem]

15. Afghanistan is not Iraq.

n/t

[freddie mertz]

22. It is also not a matter of self-defense, anymore.nt.

[mkultra]

111. thats where we disagree

and the reason i support the increase. Afghanistan was the ONLY place we should have been and i find it hard to believe that AQ has been reduced from 4000 to 400 just due to the Iraqi war. They are still there and they will probably try to strike again.

[freddie mertz]

126. And they can organize a strike almost anywhere too.

This is about propping up the Karzai regime and trying to leave a veneer of stability in a country we failed to pay attention to after tearing the place up and putting in a government of crooks.

[mkultra]

127. i cant disagree with this at all

but i think that the presence of AQ is an added element. I also do not think that these mistakes mean we should stay out.

[freddie mertz]

129. It's a matter of judgment in the end.

It is true that there is no "good" solution to the situation there.

My worry is that he sending precious resources (our troops) against a virtually hopeless end.

[mkultra]

131. a reasonable concern

I think that he is just trying to finish what bush should have done instead of dicking around in Iraq. There will be an end though. Either we will just leave or he will succeed.

[SIMPLYB1980]

8. Well this should be a fun day on DU.

K&R :popcorn:

[Clio the Leo]

9. Oh to stay up..... or to go back to bed. lol NT

[SIMPLYB1980]

10. Back to bed and toss your slipper at Mica again

before you do!

[Clio the Leo]

24. ha ha .... no, I'm up for good, got coffee and everything....

.... I'll be taking a nap later for sure though.

[SIMPLYB1980]

29. Not starbucks I hope....

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-june-8-2009/morning-joe-s-sarcastic-starbucks-sponsorship

[Clio the Leo]

37. lol, no grocery store generic instant.

with two heaping spoonfulls of sugar free Hazelnut Coffeemate.

[SIMPLYB1980]

42. Working on my second cup of Jamaica Blue Mountain Coffee.

http://www.bluemountaincoffee.com/

Got hooked on it in Jamaica a few years ago. Good stuff and If I want to be like Mica I could spike it with some Appleton's spiced Rum.

http://www.appletonrum.com/

[Garam_Masala]

84. LOL you will soon need de-toxification

to the friendly detox facility!

[rug]

11. Ok, what's the justification?

[VMI Dem]

13. Possibility of a future threat.

[rug]

16. I'm glad I'm not an asteriod.

[Clio the Leo]

26. "the murder of innocents by those .... who attacked my country from Afghanistan."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x48628

[ShortnFiery]

28. Then I guess we're gonna have to BOMB OURSELVES?!?

[Cleobulus]

More like all countries south of the Rio Grande are justified in declaring war on us...

Not to mention many countries in Southeast Asia, Africa, Middle East, etc.

[SIMPLYB1980]

46. Or just you. You're working awfuly hard at justifying the existance of

Al Qaida

[Cleobulus]

55. Will the war in Afghanistan eliminate Al Queda? n/t

[SIMPLYB1980]

56. Will pulling out now giving them a free base of operations?

[Cleobulus]

57. Will pulling out 50 years from now give them a free base of operations?

How successful do you honestly think our "nation building" will be when its at the point of a gun, turn the gun away and then what happens?

[Clio the Leo]

72. lol, well they have a right to peacefully co-exist dont they? lol

:sarcasm:

[jefferson_dem]

14. Read his remarks...

for clues. :)

[rug]

17. I just did. He left out the part about self-defense.

[VMI Dem]

12. Justified war based on possibility of future threats

equals Bush Doctrine.

[chimpymustgo]

21. Gotta fight those evil-doers. Over there. Threat to America. Blah blah blah.

[freddie mertz]

23. Freedom is on the march! nt.

[polpilot]

40. Freedom ain't free. Protecting us. Bringing democracy. Axis of Evil!!

[SIMPLYB1980]

19. A good quote I think all should read and think about.

"A nonviolent movement could not have halted Hitler's armies. Negotiations cannot convince al-Qaida's leaders to lay down their arms," Obama said. "To say that force is sometimes necessary is not a call to cynicism, it is a recognition of history."

[ShortnFiery]

25. It's BULLSHIT. Violence Begets Violence.

I'm so very ashamed ... and "The World" will not honor President Obama any longer. The Curtain has been pulled back and reveals the ugly truth: AMERICA stands for "Warmongers R US."

[SIMPLYB1980]

31. LoL! Is this what you want me to post?

[ShortnFiery]

35. There's no "LOL" about thuggery - the Taliban that we're propping up for Karzai is every

bit as misogynistic and corrupt as the rest. Besides, it was al Qaeda not the Taliban who attacked us on 9/11.

BTW, here's YOUR sign: :evilgrin:

[Name removed]

39. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

75. LOLing war atrocities

Hooray for DU!

[SIMPLYB1980]

76. Excusing Al Qaeda for killing more and targeting

innocent people including their own! Hooray for DU!

[Freddie Stubbs]

77. Do you actually believe that a nonviolent movement outside of Germany could have stopped Hitler?

:shrug:

[mkultra]

112. being completly anti-war requires that you avoid thinking about this point

its like a pink elephant that must be ignored. It also mostly requires that one be ok with the existence of violence as long as you can throw your hands up and claim that its not your fault. The fact is that without war, slaves would still be in slavery here in America, Japan would have invaded the western united states, and Hitler would call England the Deutsch Insel.

[Clio the Leo]

27. A very good quote...

.... but those who need to hear it have already plugged their ears.

[SIMPLYB1980]

45. Yep, but that's O.K.

I never expected them to listen with a open mind anyway.

[jefferson_dem]

30. +1.

"Hope" fortified by a strong sense of practical realism.

[ShortnFiery]

32. Yes, but only God Almighty America gets to decide who's GOOD and who's EVIL.

:puke:

[harun]

59. I'll second that

:puke:

:puke:

:puke:

[mkultra]

113. sounds like your after his job

[Duende azul]

82. Hello Chickenhawk.To your knowledge: Al Queda is not Hitler. And Afghanistan is not about Al Queda.

But you knew that already.

[SIMPLYB1980]

91. Like I give a shit about what you think?

And welcome to DU. :hi:

[oviedodem]

34. What most of DU will miss is that the statement alone is misleading the

Rest of the speech talks about the ills of the world that can be avoided by:

nation building
climate change
human rights
LOVE

I would suggest that all the people here that will wig out over the line LISTEN OR READ THE REST of the speech so you can understand that he talks mostly about how to AVOID conflict.

However, we all must realize that there are times when military action is justified.

I don't think anyone here would argue with Pearl Harbor for example.

[Clio the Leo]

36. Or the liberation of the concentration camps....

.... cant wait for the word cloud on this one.

This is a word cloud from the Inaugural...





Or his speech in Cairo...

[ShortnFiery]

38. The last I heard is that GITMO is still open and Bahrain is now "Torture Central" for the CIA? eom

[Cleobulus]

47. The last time we were successful at nation building was after WWII...

Hell, both the Iraq and Afghanistan wars are examples of failures of the same, and the only reason why we were successful(with our allies) in rebuilding Germany and Japan was because of relatively unique historical and geopolitical factors. It hasn't worked successfully since then.

[ShortnFiery]

61. Yes, but if we keep these Occupations going, the MIC gets to reap the profits of testing out

their "pretty weapons" on an all but HELPLESS population. That will recruit more terrorist and ENSURE "endless war."

Endless War is GOOD for the MIC and Wall Street.

It's a WIN-WIN for the ruling elites and arms merchants throughout the world. For the average citizen of all these war-torn countries? ... not so much. :(

[Cleobulus]

63. It seems to me these Pro-escalation people are extremely naive.

What do they think is going to happen in either Iraq or Afghanistan within the next decade? Peace, Love and Democracy? The most we can hope for at this point is Single Party rule or yet another 2 nominally pro-US dictatorships similar to what Iraq was before 1989, or Iran before 1979. We can't really hope for much more than that.

[Hatchling]

80. What crap.

Right now the only nation we should be building is ours.

[elocs]

41. This is simple: when it is our war it is just. All of Bush's wars were evil.

This is what allows some of us to sleep at night.

I don't remember any Afghanis on those 9/11 planes (yes, how we loathed when Bushco invoked 9/11) but I guess the entire country of Afghanistan and its population must pay the price for our "just" war. That'll teach 'em.

[NYC_SKP]

43. I LOL at the hard-hearded replies. Congratulations Mr. President!

Whenever something positive happens it's like an outpouring of predictable posturing.

Pretty Petty.

:P

[Clio the Leo]

65. Skippy....

.... I'm having a hard time finding some of our friend's posts on previous threads relating to the President's foreign policy approach, like these for example...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8302910

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8321763

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8323873

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8326075

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=8326784

Odd, huh? I'd heard of "fair weather fans" by never "stormy weather critics."

[Cleobulus]

48. How can peace be the goal when your nation is the one who starts the wars? n/t

[LibDemAlways]

52. The Peace Prize, in theory, should go to an individual or organization that

during the past year "shall have done the most or the best work for fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promoting of peace congresses." It's a sad day when the recipient feels compelled to justify war in his acceptance speech. The Committee no doubt had its reasons at the time. Wonder what they are thinking now.

[Clio the Leo]

62. Sounds like you missed the Chairman's speech...

.... because he explained even futher why the committe was still in agreement that President Obama deserved the award.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=48298&mesg_id=48599

It's a sad day when we cherry pick our assesment of the President's foreign policy approach.

[ClarkUSA]

66. Europe praised his recent decision. Having gone through two WW themselves, they "get it".

It was a great aspirational speech written by the President himself. I can't imagine Bush II writing anything like it,
much less any other modern president.

[ShortnFiery]

68. Now ClarkUSA, some "dignitary" from Europe praised him, not EUROPE itself.

;)

[ClarkUSA]

78. I am referring to the polls they took in European countries after the speech, Shorty.

They found that a sizable majority of Europeans were happy with his overall decision.

;)

[Duende azul]

81. Show me the polls.

The people in Europe are tired of your wars.
They regret to have let themselves lure into your assault on Afghanistan in the wake of nine-eleven.

Rest assured, the pity and the sympathy has worn off.

The governments - that's a mixed bag. Some only participate hoping to get part of the bounty, some hope for other favors from America (like a missileshield against Russia),some were cooerced, some only feared an even more insane reaction from the empire under bush, some have their own geopolitical interests at heart (if America invites them, why not go to a region, where they also have interests?).

[ClarkUSA]

87. Check the archives. Some DUers from Europe remarked on it.

Also, a NY/NJ newspaper called The Epoch Times featured this news on its front page in its last edition.

Europeans are happy that there is an end in sight to both wars, thanks to Pres. Obama.

[Duende azul]

89. Got nothing? And the only interpretation you can give is they are happy about the end in sight?

Must be the timeline that's already in the wastebasket.

So what did I miss? When will those wars "thanks to Pres. Obama" end?
When can I hold you accountable for your assertions? Give me a date.

[arcadian]

94. Intellectual dishonesty on ClarkUSA's part

Clark cited these polls. I'd like to see them too. Just more rah rah propaganda from this one.

[ClarkUSA]

99. Says the person who posted Nazi imagery in response to a poster's query about why he was here at DU?

Sorry, I don't help anyone who does crap like that.

[arcadian]

106. You are unhinged.

Seek help.

[ClarkUSA]

108. Looking in the mirror? Many saw that vile photo. I know the person who asked you the question.

Anyway, I won't indulge your petty attacks anymore. Enjoy your Obama bashing all weekend long!

[arcadian]

118. It's bad form to bring in an outside discussion from another thread.

What exactly did I do? Explain it to me. I posted a picture of a Nazi? Is that what you are claiming. Yeah? Big deal. That poster was proposing performing party unity checks on posters, so I posted a pick of a German guard checking somebody's papers, with the caption, "Papers please!". Why are you so unhinged over that?

[Duende azul]

103. It's not a bug. It's a feature.

[ClarkUSA]

105. Enjoy this "feature"... this Norwegian Socialist DUer says it best...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=49408&mesg_id=49408

Funny how European lefties know a good President when they see one but the 24/7 Obama Outrage Club hasn't got a clue.

[ClarkUSA]

98. Ignore everything I said? I'm not going to repeat it. You just want to argue and be divisive.

I'm not interested in your Obama Outrage.

[Duende azul]

101. Why should I take you seriously if you can't back anything up?

"Argue and be divisive" - Projecting much?

Are you really that dense? Or just faking?
"Obama outrage"? Again, Obama is not the center of my concerns. He may be a fine human being. But he can commit errors. My concern is the fucking war.
As I told you in another post: you should abstain from pissing off real progressives.
Normally they can handle disagreements on the issues pretty well. They generally love it. But divisive oneliners, strawmen and distorted arguments on a daily basis don't please them. If you are really interested in Obama's success - and if only electionwise - perhaps you should revise your attitude.

But who the fuck knows what your real interest is?

[ClarkUSA]

107. You're mistaking me for someone who cares what a 24/7 Obama basher thinks.

But do check out my link to what a Norwegian Socialist DUer says about President Obama. That should give you a hint of
what you should look for in the archives. :)

[arcadian]

93. That is your job. You cited the polls.

Let's see them. "Check the archive" Please.

[ClarkUSA]

100. Says who? You? I won't lift a finger for you.

:puke:

[arcadian]

104. Says everybody, DA

In a debate if you cite information it's your job to provide it, that's how it goes, ask anybody, otherwise, you are just talking out of your ass, as per usual. :rofl:

[ClarkUSA]

115. Really? You speak for "everybody" now? I thought you only spoke for the Obama Outrage Club.

:rofl:

[arcadian]

117. Yeah, it pretty much goes with out saying.

It's why people provide links for news stories they post. So they don't come across looking like a complete fraud, making shit up. Didn't you ever write a paper in college where you had to provide notations?

[Forkboy]

114. Cop out.

[ClarkUSA]

116. No, it's a waste of my time. This link says it all... but only Obama supporters can appreciate it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=49408&mesg_id=49408

[ShortnFiery]

67. I'd settle for one - President - who didn't gift another TRILLION of our tax dollars to the MIC

for more death and destruction which JUST MAY usher in WW-III.

Every day we occupy and BOMB THE SHIT OUT OF these two Muslim Nations, Americans are less safe, both at home and abroad.

Newsflash: Our recent Nobel Peace Prize President is making AMERICANS less safe every damn day we have our combat troops occupy those two countries.

To believe otherwise is Jingoistic Naivete.

[LibDemAlways]

70. Just watched an MSNBC review of the speech by Pat Buchanan. He

loved it. Couldn't say enough good things about Obama. Interesting.

[ShortnFiery]

73. Yes, that makes the hair on the back of my neck stand on end. eom

[spiritual_gunfighter]

79. When paleoconservatives and Neo Cons

are praising the Presidents decision on Afghanistan it only reinforces my opinions on how stupid a decision he has made.

[LibDemAlways]

71. I wouldn't expect him to do anything other than express his

public support. He's not going to say, "Jeez, we fucked up."

[VMI Dem]

74. Remember, Kissinger won too.

[Mass]

69. I would have preferred that he focused on how to avoid reaching this stage.

Hitler did not come in a vacuum. German did not wake up and decide to invade other countries. The Treaty of Versailles started this (and for once, the US were not the bad guys. Wilson was surprisingly clearminded on this). A peaceful movement trying to act on the reason of the crisis may have help avoiding it. The movement did not exist and was not heard.

This piece was certainly one of my least favorite moment in the speech. Listening more to non violent movements could avoid reaching the point where war is unavoidable.

Another irritating moment was certainly that the US have never attacked any Democracy. Chile may differ with that. Sure, this war was not waged with tanks, rockets, and batallions, but it was certainly a war against the Chilean people.

[earth mom]

90. There you have it. War is Peace. nt

[arcadian]

92. Changelicious!

It's a regular Hope™ Spectacular! The EOP is a fucking death cult.

[IndianaGreen]

95. War is Peace

Published on Thursday, December 10, 2009 by CommonDreams.org

Mr. President, War Is Not Peace

by Norman Solomon

Eloquence in Oslo cannot change the realities of war.

As President Obama neared the close of his Nobel address, he called for "the continued expansion of our moral imagination." Yet his speech was tightly circumscribed by the policies that his oratory labored to justify.

Lofty rationales easily tell us that warfare is striving for the noble goal of peace. But the rationales scarcely intersect with actual war. The oratory sugarcoats the poisons, helping to kill hope in the name of it.

A few months ago, when I visited an Afghan office for women's empowerment, staffers took me to a pilot project in one of Kabul's poorest neighborhoods. There, women were learning small-scale business skills while also gaining personal strength and mutual support.

Two-dozen women, who ranged in age from early 20s to late 50s, talked with enthusiasm about the workshops. They were desperate to change their lives. When it was time to leave, I had a question: What should I tell people in the United States, if they ask what Afghan women want most of all?

After several women spoke, the translator summed up. "They all said that the first priority is peace."

In Afghanistan, after 30 years under the murderous twin shadows of poverty and war, the only lifeline is peace.

http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/12/10-3

[Fearless]

97. +1

[swilton]

102. Only if you have Big Oil

And the MIC Bankrolling it and only if you are engaged with countries that are militarily and financially weaker than you are.

[smalll]

121. For how long will you fuckups be able to replay the Leninist Theory of Imperialism?

Maybe some time yet, but not forever. :shrug:

[jeanpalmer]

119. Would Martin Luther King

have sent troops to Afghanistan? :shrug:

[smalll]

120. I know it's a headline, but "Peace is the goal, but sometimes war is justified?"

Makes a certain amount of sense, all things considered. :shrug:

Unless, of course, you're a non-campagin-promise-listening, non-Party-Platform-reading, anti-Obama, anti-Party, leftbagger deviationist, splittist, impossibilist, and/or militant denier of a reality-based view of history who can't but miss the forest for your half-imagined anti-American, pseudo-pacifist trees. :shrug:

I'm

Just

Sayin'!

:shrug::patriot::shrug:

[cornermouse]

122. You don't see the statement as disrespectful and dismissive

of Martin Luther King and everything he accomplished?

[Ken Burch]

125. And with that, you just turned into Arsenio Hall imitating Rush LImbaugh

n/t.

[Ken Burch]

123. The fight against Hitler was the LAST just war, at least in terms of wars involving THIS country

We've done nothing but serve the rich in the wars that happened since.

And it's clear that violence in Afghanistan can't be eradicated by violence from THIS country.

[HopeOverFear]

128. Ah, look at all the peace loving people.

So peaceful are they that they would feign righteous anger over someone getting a Nobel award.

:sarcasm:

[SIMPLYB1980]

130. Indeed. nt

[stevietheman]

132. Obama is absolutely correct. He is a realist. n/t

n/t

[and-justice-for-all]

133. There has not been a justifiable war since WWII! nt