Wow endless criticsm of Obama and very little criticism of Republicans

[book_worm]

I thought I had stumbled onto some republican website.

[babylonsister]

1. Amazing, isn't it. We can be our own worst enemies. :( nt

[Cosmocat]

52. only folks who denegrade him more than republicans ...

are the folks on the left ...

think about that ...

[kurtzapril4]

87. WoW! You made up a new word!

That's awesome!

[ConservativeDemocrat]

99. Wow, a spelling flame...

The word clearly intended was "denigrate". But making fun of spelling, I guess, is easier than discussing the message.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[rhett o rick]

100. Yeah, so what was the "message". Sit down and shut up? Bend over and hold on? Just exactly what is

the message here? The OP isnt about sending a message. The OP is bitching at the left. How constructive is that?

[ibegurpard]

2. I don't expect to influence repukes

opposition to them is a given

[alcibiades_mystery]

7. Since some significant majority of the anti-Obama crap says stuff like

"...he's a conservative in disguise..."

"...he's bought and paid for by corporations..."

"...he's a con man/liar/huckster/snake-oil salesman/false speechifier..."

"...he really believes the conservative position..."

AND similar nonsense, that statement - while perhaps holding water for YOU - does not hold water for the phenomenon in general. If we address criticisms toward Obama rather than the GOP, we cannot say that we do that because he can be influenced (and they cannot) if all those criticisms are saying that he is essentially the same as the GOP.

You can't buy yourself out of it with an assertion of difference if your whole game is imputing an identity.

[ibegurpard]

9. i can't make any sense out of your post

but regardless, in respect to what you are currently seeing on DU:
you are witnessing people venting who are fed up with two years of their values being tossed aside and policy being advanced that they cannot support.
If you want this to end then either push politicians to accommodate the concerns of these people or deal with the criticism.

[alcibiades_mystery]

18. I think what you're seeing is a crowding out

combined with an exodus. The combined effect is an appearance (a mere appearance, as the tradition says) of a particular viewpoint becoming more prominent. In fact, all that's really happening is that those who promote the newly prominent viewpoint are authorized to behave in as reckless a manner as possible, while those who do not are simply checking out.

There's no doubt that legitimate criticisms can and should be lodged. But that's a laughable description of what's been happening here.

As for the last post, I'll try it more plainly: you can't claim that the criticism is trying to influence Obama if the majority of the criticism is saying he can't be influenced. Your claim may be true for you but it cannot be true of most of the criticism, even according to your own description.

[ibegurpard]

21. that may be

but I repeat my point that much of what you are seeing is cynicism and anger based on the fact that their concerns have BEEN IGNORED for the past two years while they are repeatedly told they just "want ponies."

[alcibiades_mystery]

24. I'll leave you to your

"cynicism and anger," and whatever past insults you can imagine.

Let's not pretend that it is an attempt to influence, however, especially if the major claim is that the administration is "already in the bag" and therefore can't be influenced. That was your initial claim of some 35 minutes ago. My point is that it does not hold water.

The answer should not have been "(There is more criticism of Obama because I expect to influence him and) I don't expect to influence the GOP." That answer makes no sense, even according to your own explanations.

The answer should have been, "There's more criticism of Obama because we're cynical and angry after having been ignored for 2 years." That's a perfectly respectable position. But it's not your original position.

[Fruittree]

78. Problem is the attacks started soon after his inauguration

not two years into the presidency. And if the intent is to influence, then how about some positive ideas rather than just labeling, sarcasm and inflexible unrealistic demands which is a lot of what I see on here.

[guruoo]

83. When I see the kind of talk you're refering to, it makes me think of only one thing:

'agent provocateur'

[babylonsister]

10. So you're here to 'influence' people? Got it. nt

[ibegurpard]

13. and you're here why?

[babylonsister]

16. To support the Democratic party and the Democratic president.

Maybe I missed the meme about the change in the mission statement here.

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

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[glitch]

71. You did. The meme is to support progressive principles within the Democratic party. nt

[guruoo]

80. Sometimes, one must temporarily temper their individual principles to achieve a principled outcome

for all, in the long run.

[niceypoo]

75. I notice you left 'Democratic principles' off your list

Perhaps they are the 'pony' which we constantly hear about?

[guruoo]

81. 'principle': Something that can possably be found only in the eye of the beholder

[glitch]

70. They are not redeemable. Perhaps people criticizing President Obama still think he is

worth saving.

Something to consider.

[CakeGrrl]

76. But "fellow" Dems can be influenced? I know I can't.

I don't dislike someone just because someone else says they do and wants me to as well. Sounds like encouraging groupthink.

And the motives of Obama's detractors on this site are hardly similar and uniformly founded in noble Progressive ideals.

Some people NEVER wanted him in office and jump on any opportunity to express it.

Some people are stung over not seeing their personal "main issue" addressed to their satisfaction or have been set off by a particular action or more of the President or the administration.

This stuff factors into a lot of criticism and rebuke and it's pretty easy to spot if one remembers the dialogues during the primaries.

[peace13]

3. It has gotten very sad here.

I agree with your observation!

[Nite Owl]

4. Where's the President out there

criticizing the republicans? He's got his team behind closed doors making deals that will increase the deficit and and will make us all pay.

[NoPasaran]

5. Obama is the enemy now

Julian the Terrorist is the hero du jour.

[Hissyspit]

102. "Julian the Terrorist"

Your response to a complaint of this website sounding like a right-winger site is to use a right-wing label without apparent facetiousness?

[awoke_in_2003]

110. I may disagree with the president...

on many things, but he is not the enemy. Also, Julian Assange is not a terrorist. I don't know which word is more overused- "terrorist" or "hero".

[jefferson_dem]

6. DU jumps the shark.

It's disgusting. Some are hoping to turn DU into an all-hate-Obama, all-the-time cesspool. Some are even using the same talking points and smears that are routinely parroted on hate radio and free republic. Strange, huh?

[Mimosa]

109. NOBODY 'HATES" OBAMA> THAT'S B.S.

I think most people who contributed to Obama's campaign and worked to get him elected are surprised that Obama went far rightward. In June 2008 Obama was still supporting a health care public option. In August 2008 Obama was against keeping tax cuts for the rich 2%.

Many of us are stunned and wondering why President Obama is so different from candidate Obama.

[Clio the Leo]

8. crazy, huh? nt

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

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[jefferson_dem]

22. In my opinion, the buck stops with each poster.

You set up a flimsy straw man. Nobody is saying Obama is beyond criticism. Does that mean that any inane smear of Obama should go unchallenged here on this *Democratic* website? Of course not.

[Atman]

12. We criticized and actually fought the GOP for a decade...they always won.

Maybe it's time to admire them. They know how to play the game while we simply cower and capitulate.

[alcibiades_mystery]

20. They rarely turn on their own

That's for sure.

[vi5]

27. You're right they don't turn on their own....

The elected leaders in the Republican party don't turn on their own and actually work to appease their base of voters and do what the people who donate time, money, and support to get them elected want them to do.

You raise a very good point and I agree completely. Our elected democrats need to stop turning on their own and insulting and betraying their base. Thank you for pointing this out.

[still_one]

35. That is exactly what Howard Dean said the other day /nt

[WestSeattle2]

72. What? What's that whole tea party thing about? Their targets were

repugs in repug primaries. And, the term "Rino" did not come from repugs holding their repug representatives in high esteem. The repugs most certainly turn on their own, and with vengeance.

[corkhead]

14. this sums up my view on current matters, particularly the tax cuts

I wish he would give up trying to find common ground, it's pointless.

[Laelth]

25. Obama and the Democrats are currently in power.

The Republicans are not. Ultimately, the Republicans are irrelevant. Why criticize them? They're not doing anything.

-Laelth

[alcibiades_mystery]

30. ^^^^^^^^^Key Symptom^^^^^^^^

:wow:

[Bluerthanblue]

62. when the republicans are in power, they can almost always count

on their base supporting them- that isn't true for us. And that is part of the nature of who we are imo.

The republicans are NOT irrelevant, any more than the 'south' was irrelevant in the 1850's.

[vi5]

26. Whoa! I missed the republicans getting the presidency?

Wow. That must have been a hell of a nap. That Nyquil is stronger than I expected.

[Hepburn]

28. We KNOW the Repukes are sell-outs...

...what the problem is, as I see it, is that we expected Obama to follow through on his promises ~~ even just a little bit. In my opinion, he did the opposite and kissed Repuke butt. I don't know why others are angry, mad, disappointed, whatever, but that is the basis for my upset with Obama.

JMHO

[Bluerthanblue]

74. he can't follow through without the support of the legislature.

and as frustrating as that is, he has almost never had that when it counted.

I have my own share of frustrations with some of his positions- but they pale in comparison to the frustrations I feel when I log onto DU and read some of the over-the-top criticisms that have been flying around here lately. It only serves to remind me that that "we" are just as human and imperfect as those we claim to be "better than".

If you go back and read his campaign speeches I think you'll find frequent references to his intention to be the president of ALL America- I don't believe he hid the fact that he didn't plan to strong-arm his policies or play dictator as Bush did.

[countingbluecars]

29. It is depressing

to see right wing slurs on this board. I thought the new rules were good but didn't think some would sink to such a low level of discourse.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[proud2BlibKansan]

32. Obama might listen. The republican's never will.

[Exilednight]

33. It's been Obama's embrace of right-wing policies that has created the criticism

The latest of which been approving money for faith based groups. We were all up in arms when Bush did it, but now that Obama has done those very same people on this very website who jumped all over Bush are now defending Obama's decision. Yet, those same people get upset with people like me when point out their hypocrisy and refuse to take part in the right-wing sounding echo chamber.

It was wrong when Bush did it, and it's wrong when Obama does it.

Has this place begun to sound like a right-wing website? Yes, but not in the way you believe.

[Enthusiast]

55. Exactly.

I was outraged when Bush approved tax payer money to support faith based groups. I was even more outraged when Obama did it. I expected Obama to understand that it was a fundamental violation of the separation of church and state.

[still_one]

34. I don't know where you have been but the repukes are constantly being criticized. Perhaps you are

doing selective filtering on what you want to see

Probably the WORST and most dangerous legislation ever passed was the patriot act. Nothing has been
done to repeal it, nor has anything been done to undo the damage done to the War Powers Act, which allowed us to invade a country based on a lie, without Congressional oversight as the War Powers Act dictated

When we lost Kennedy's seat, Tim Kaine should have been fired.

Most of the people that the President brought on board were the very ones that jumped on board with the repukes to destroy the regulations that would have prevented the crap that led to the housing crash.

If you see criticism, of the administration and Congress, it is because promises were made, and then forgotten

but for you to believe in your own mind that this site does NOT criticize republicans, you are wrong.

[Union Scribe]

36. It's a criticism of policies, regardless of who supports them

The reason you see it as criticism of Obama is because he's overlapping the GOP in that diagram.

[jefferson_dem]

39. Constructive, reality-based critiques of his policies are not the problem.

But you already knew that, didn't you?

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[alcibiades_mystery]

46. I don't think

calling people "partisan hacks" who practice "blind loyalty" is a very nice thing to say. Surely you're not referring to anyone on these boards, right?

:hi:

[Laelth]

51. Of course not! Surely there are no partisan hacks here.

Niether are there people on DU who insist on blind loyalty to politicians who have the letter (D) following their names.

As I've said before, DU remains the premier LIBERAL American political forum. That's why we regularly select Dennis Kucinich as our choice for President. This community is, quite obviously, to the left of the political center, and even to the left of the mainstream Democratic Party. Constructive (and destructive) criticism of conservative Democrats has almost always been allowed here, and the new rules make it clear that criticism of Democrats is allowed so long as that criticism comes from a liberal perspective. I think the new rules encode the traditional spirit of DU, and I like them.

Given these rules, I suspect that the partisan hacks and the blind loyalists have gotten the hint ... and have left DU.

So, no. I wasn't referring to anyone here.

-Laelth

[alcibiades_mystery]

65. I'm glad you are open and honest in your assessment

I really don't like liars and hypocrites, rule-skirters, and similar destructive assholes.

So I'm super-happy that you're not one of those.

Have a wonderful rest of the weekend!

:hi:

[jefferson_dem]

48. Partisan hacks who insist on blind loyalty =

expecting that criticism OF THE DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENT be reality-based and constructive?

Get a grip.

[Laelth]

54. Grip gotten. See my post above.

Cheers.

-Laelth

[jefferson_dem]

56. Hey, thanks.

Take care. :hi:

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

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[Hello_Kitty]

79. Oh bullshit. No criticism of the President is tolerated by certain people here. eom

[jefferson_dem]

82. And every criticism (legit or not) is celebrated and promoted by certain people.

That is the spirit in which the OP was offered, I believe.

Aren't there enough other places to go for unbridled Obama-bashing?

[livetohike]

37. When Ron Paul is being praised here, we know we have hit

the wall :-(.

[Enthusiast]

58. Very few have praised

Ron Paul. And those that have are Ron Paul disciples. There are most likely some Sarah Palin disciples here as well. As incredible as that might seem.

[Onlooker]

38. We're not Republicans

We're not lemmings like Republicans who stood by while Bush destroyed the economy, killed thousands of American troops and Iraqi civilians, and failed the nation in every way. If you're looking for non-thinking followers, try freerepublic.

[Atman]

45. That's like saying a football player isn't a futbol player.

Although similar in many ways, both games require entirely different strategies and different methods for scoring goals. The GOP has learned a strategy that helps them win every time. The Democrats seem to think that maybe if they play by different rules and continue to employ strategies that have proven not to help them win, they'll eventually beat the GOP. This isn't about changing our idealogy...it's about learning how to be an effective, winning team -- before every one of our "fans" desert us and we're playing to empty stadiums.

.

[Enthusiast]

60. Republicans don't win every time

We won a majority in 2006 and 2008. It just seems like Republicans win all the time because certain key elected 'Democrats' seem to believe it is their duty to capitulate.

[political_Dem]

41. Sad, but true. :( That's why critical thinking needs to be emphasized in school and in society.

That would change things quite a bit. Otherwise, you get people parroting the same things repeatedly just because the RW was playing an elaborate game of telephone.

[tekisui]

42. The Obama Administration is making the decisions, leading this country.

We very much should be discussing the policies, actions and directions the WH is taking this country. I maintain that criticisms of him as a person are unproductive and and only make his staunchest supporters respond with a similar low-level of discourse.

But every policy decision should be closely scrutinized. We've done it for every president in the past. We'll do it for subsequent president's. We have to.

[Exilednight]

64. Every "policy decision" has a person that pushes policy. Right now that person is President Obama.

I would never argue that Obama is not intelligent, but I will argue that I highly doubt that he is an intellectual. I would never argue that he's not the President or represents our country in foreign policy, but I would argue that he's not a statesman.

The person and the policy are forever linked; that's political reality.

[treestar]

44. Everything the Republicans do seems to be Obama's fault

for not having a "spine." It is ridiculous, I know. Getting to the point of pathetic. It's clear expectation that Daddy would take care of them.

When the whole time, Obama said: "Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are the change that we seek." We these people will wait forever. Hopefully the American Presidency will never allow one person the powers their long awaited leader would have.

[political_Dem]

47. Exactly. This is the crux of the issue.

[Skittles]

90. no, it is NOT

the "crux" of the issue is Obama sucking up to people who behave like RABID DOGS

[Exilednight]

69. Riddle me this:

After LBJ, which president passed more of their legislative agenda than any other president? Here's a hint, it's not (h).

a) Richard Nixon
b) Gerald Ford
c) Jimmy Carter
d) Ronald Reagan
e) George HW Bush
f) Bill Clinton
g) George W Bush
h) Barack Obama

The answer will probably surprise you, but it proves that you can have a spine and wield the power of the presidency with great effectiveness.

Edit: and within a short period of time.

[JAbuchan08]

105. It's gotta be George W. Bush.

The only thing he was really defeated on was social security.

[Exilednight]

107. Actually, it was Jimmy Carter. Bush failed in many of his campaign promises............

The only modern president to have a better average than Jimmy Carter was LBJ. He fulfilled more of his campaign promises than any other modern president.

[polichick]

49. The "enemy" is the same, regardless of party...

...corporate power.

[jzodda]

53. People here are rightly upset

All we have been asking is for Obama and the west wing to fight the repukers as much as they want to fight and destroy him. Not cave, not surrender.

If they won't fight then why should we support this administration?

The Repubs are in full attack mode..What mode is Obama in?

[cherokeeprogressive]

57. Some cheese to accompany your whine?

[jefferson_dem]

61. Your post made me chuckle...

Since the point is that there's too MUCH damn whining on DU ... about the President.

[SidDithers]

59. Yup...nt

Sid

[Name removed]

63. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[political_Dem]

73. [phone]

[bvar22]

66. I am a "Democrat".

I EXPECT the Republicans to be Republicans.
I expect the Republicans to represent The RICH & Powerful top 1%.
I don't hate dogs for being dogs.

I EXPECT Democrats to represent the Working Class.

When the Democrats behave like Republicans, they should expect outrage.
When the Democratic Party Leadership bows down before the Republican MINORITY in HOPE of achieving appeasement,
I WILL express MY righteous OUTRAGE....LOUD and OFTEN.


"If we don't fight hard enough for the things we stand for,
at some point we have to recognize that we don't really stand for them."
--- Paul Wellstone

[Phx_Dem]

67. DU has become an alternative universe where Dems claim they will vote Republican

and bash Dems instead of Republicans. Even though the Dems have a huge number of BIG successes.

I'm curious to know why are they allowed to continue posting here? This is a private Democratic form. Not an independent or Republican forum. I don't understand why Democrats who post here have to be subjected to insane bashing against their own party on a Democratic forum.

:crazy:

[Number23]

91. The "prigressives" have taken over. Even the owners ain't happy about it

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=437&topic_id=1126&mesg_id=1134

And while it ain't pretty, it certainly understandable why so many sit in corners wondering why they have no power and no one wants to be in the same room with them.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

68. "...very little criticism of Republicans."

Completely and totally untrue.

[Vinca]

77. It's kind of a waste of time to carp about the Republicans

when you know, in the end, their "compromise" (our way or the highway) will most likely win out and there's zilch we, the peons, can do about it.

[Name removed]

84. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[girl gone mad]

85. Endless criticsm of the left and constant capitulation to the right.

I think we have stumbled onto another Republican Presidency.

[tomp]

86. and i thought we had a democratic president.

i think the criticism of obama counts as criticism of republicans, because that seems to be what his positions are.

[Itchinjim]

88. Big KNR!

[Skittles]

89. the fact at repukes stink IS A GIVEN

the fact that Obama sucks up to them REALLY STINKS

[mistertrickster]

92. If he'd stop acting like a Republican, we'd stop criticising him.

Promises not met--

No health care reform bill without a public option.

Passing the Employee Free Trade Act to make it easier to unionize.

Repealing DADT.

Real re-regulation of Wall Street.

End no bid contracts.

Allow re-importation of American drugs to hold price down.

"Transparency" in government--White House logs, public discussion of bills.

Allow bankruptcy judges to modify foreclosures.

Tougher rules on revolving door government to lobbyists.

On edit--Close Gitmo.

*****

He has done a few things that he didn't say he would do however, like freezing the pay of middle class gov't workers and re-hiring Blackwater.

[mikekohr]

95. You'll Be Happy With The Following Website, "What The Fuck Has Obama Done So Far."

http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

or matbe not, because if you actually look at it, it does not fit the narative being hawked here. The record sucks for Republicans and those that do their bidding, knowingly and unwittingly.

[mistertrickster]

96. Yup, I've seen that. And it proves he's way better than W. Thrilling, isn't it. nt

[budkin]

93. Because he doesn't fight them... at all.

[grumgrum]

94. BINGO!! He has in essence become one of them..hence, the Enemy.

[killbotfactory]

97. And little to no understanding of the political realities democrats are faced with

just sayin'.

[TheKentuckian]

98. and the politicians have no understanding of the REALITY those they "represent" have to deal with

The first concern is always for out of touch rich people that are set for life and their "difficulties" serving the people instead of corporate "stakeholders".

[rhett o rick]

101. What's your point? Do you support giving $800 billion to the super-wealthy?

Do you align with the republicans on that issue? Do you go along with the idiotic idea that if we dont give the super-wealthy their 0.8 trillion they wont give us any "cake".

0.8 trillion for the billionaires will be the last straw.

I want him to stand and fight and stop the groveling and capitulating.

You are either for or against the middle class. Choose.

[old mark]

103. We all KNEW the republicans were shit...we expected better from Mr. Obama, and the

criticism is mostly given with the fading hope he will improve his record as a Democrat rather than continue as an honorary republican...


mark

[JAbuchan08]

104. Beating up on Republicans at this point is like going after terrorists

It goes without saying that they suck.

[hedgetrimmer]

106. When a republican gets elected I know what to expect...

when I helped elect Obama I did not expect compromise when no compromise is needed.

[hulka38]

108. To criticize Obama is to criticize a Republican.

I don't understand your point.