After shooting, House Dems take small steps in moving gun reform

[babylonsister]

Good. Small steps are better than no steps, and this is a start.

After shooting, House Dems take small steps in moving gun reform
By Mike Lillis - 01/10/11 08:02 PM ET


Saturday’s shooting of Rep. Gabrielle Giffords (D-Ariz.) and 19 others has reignited the Capitol Hill debate over the scope of the Second Amendment — an issue that’s been all but dormant in Washington for several years.

Yet the liberal push to bolster the nation’s gun laws is running smack into the political reality that the current Congress simply has no appetite for gun reform — even in the wake of an assassination attempt on one of its members.

As a result, Capitol Hill gun reformers are instead offering a much more limited proposal in the wake of the Arizona rampage.

Indeed, Rep. Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.) and Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.) — both advocates for sweeping gun reforms like a return of the assault-weapons ban — are crafting legislation this week that tackles just a tiny sliver of that law, which expired in 2004. Their bill would ban high-capacity magazines, or clips, like those allegedly used by Jared Lee Loughner, the 22-year-old arrested in the Arizona shootings.

“The only reason to have 33 bullets loaded in a handgun is to kill a lot of people very quickly,” Lautenberg said Monday in a statement announcing the bill. “Before 2004, these ammunition clips were banned, and they must be banned again.”

more...

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/137127-small-steps-in-moving-gun-reform

[CBHagman]

1. Carolyn McCarthy's pragmatism.

This passage in the article interested me:

http://thehill.com/homenews/house/137127-small-steps-in-moving-gun-reform

For McCarthy, the congressional face of gun reform who came to Congress three years after her husband was killed and son injured by a gunman on a commuter train, scaling back the reforms has been an exercise in political pragmatism.

“I’ve been in Congress 14 years,” McCarthy told The Huffington Post on Monday. “I know what I can get passed and I know what I can’t get passed. And if I wanted to get something symbolic … it won’t go anywhere. It won’t even get to committee.”

McCarthy spokesman Shams Tarek said the lawmaker has reached out to both Pelosi and Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) in an effort to discern “what’s reasonable, what’s feasible, what can actually pass.”

It would be ideal if they could build some additional alliances, including both veterans and newcomers, especially given that the current Congress started on a note of symbolism (i.e., the planned votes on health care reform repeal) rather than pragmatism.

[reformed_military]

42. Wow

Why doesn't she just write a check to the NRA?

Her picture will be on EVERY NRA fund raising flyer and on the cover of all of their magazines.

In the words of Tom Foley, "Dead on Arrival"

[bluestateguy]

2. And would you mind telling us where they will find the votes to pass their shopping list?

This is a waste of time and likely would have even not had the votes in the last Congress.

[Imajika]

5. Worse than a waste of time...

Not only will no new gun control measures pass, this can only remind people that the Democratic party still has elements within it that push this extremely unpopular agenda.

[ClassWarrior]

6. Doing the right thing is never a waste of time. Sometimes you have to do it time and time again...

...but ultimately the good guys win.

NGU.

[babylonsister]

7. Thank you very much, ClassWarrior. nt

[ClassWarrior]

8. Thank you, Sistah!

:hi:

NGU.

[golfguru]

13. The good guys are all those who voted for 2nd Amendment

If Hitler's Germany had equivalent of 2nd Amendment, 6 million
hapless, gunless, defenseless people might have had a chance to fight
being led like cattle into gas ovens.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ClassWarrior]

37. The founding fathers? Gather your armies?

:shrug:

NGU.

[texshelters]

39. And your proof of this is?

and are you afraid we are just like Nazi Germany.

I see lots of difference that apparently you don't see.

Plus, no one is calling for a ban on guns. So why all the fear mongering?

Peace,
Tex Shelters

[golfguru]

14. . .

[Imajika]

3. Where gun control is concerned....

...no steps are better than small steps.

The national crime rate is going down, not up. As gun restrictions have been abolished there has been no evidence of increased crime. There will always be horrific acts of violence, but an assassination attempt like this is not a good reason to resurrect and dust off a horribly unpopular agenda.

Gun control is a loser of an issue and we should stay as far away from it as possible.

The Democratic party has FINALLY shaken the stereotype of being the party of gun grabbers, and I can only hope we keep it that way.

[CBHagman]

10. The cops aren't necessarily going to see it that way.

The issue has been neglected too long.

[Union Scribe]

20. Cops shoot people holding hose nozzles

Maybe we should start by taking their guns.

[Recursion]

31. Police deaths in the line of duty are at a *50 YEAR LOW* in absolute terms

let alone in percentages.

[peacebird]

4. this is a foolish move that will go nowhere and do nothing except insure gains for the R's

in the next election. I agree - gun control would be great, but it is not going to pass, and will just turn off independents and moderates who believe the 2nd amendment means no restrictions at all for gun ownership.

I hope they drop this. It is just too big a gift to the RW noise machine.

[babylonsister]

9. Baloney. Maybe now is exactly the right time to do something. nt

[peacebird]

19. It would be an EPIC FAIL. My son said he is sure the D's will snatch defeat again by proposing this

He is a gun owner, NRA supporter and Democrat. It is not so uncommon as you might think. IF they take the gun control tack, then they will lose. We will lose.

I say leave gun control alone, we have much bigger fish to fry these days.

Sorry babylonsister, normally I agree with you, and I always look for your posts, but in this case I think you are wrong. Fortunately we can agree to disagree without being disagreeable, right? :-)

[hollowdweller]

34. Pretty Much Agree w/you there Peacebird

While I think the limiting of magazines is probably a GOOD THING, I would much rather see the party "walk the plank" on the Public Option, or Banning Derivatives, or raising the min wage.

Since taking power in 06 I think the dems have done a good job at removing the gun grabber image created for them by the GOP and NRA. The GOP could use this to good advantage in 2012 and I don't want them to take the senate.

Also on the legislation itself:

Why not just make the magazines harder to get but not ban them. Don't allow sale of them at the same time as a gun. Require a person has some sort of MMPI or other psych testing before buying them, or make local law enforcement sign off. At least that way they wouldn't be able to say dems banned them but it would cut back on the crazies getting them.

I don't think a 30 round clip for a pistol is practical or safe, but I'm worried about the fallout.

[Last_Stand]

11. Or they could fight for increased availability for mental health care...

or they could fight to ensure that the stranglehold of the right-wing is removed from the media, the banks, the military, the educational system, etc.

They could do these things that would have longer, farther reaching effects...

or they could fight for something that Americans have made pretty clear they will not support and will result in more losses for Democratic candidates in the future.

[ClassWarrior]

12. Maybe with more mental health care, more Americans WILL support it.

:shrug:

Jus' sayin...

NGU.

[golfguru]

15. kick for more mental health care.

[Union Scribe]

21. Exactly. We need things like this, desperately.

All we get on this front is lip service and "band-aid" token gestures like this magazine capacity thing. It's the soil that needs attention, but all our leaders do is pick low-hanging fruit.

[DirkGently]

17. Might start with something more obvious, like the NRA bills that prevent tracing & registration.

[TheWraith]

27. There is no law preventing either tracing or registration.

Please check your facts.

[Odin2005]

18. This will drive people into the hands of the teabaggers, BILLIANT idea!!!

:banghead:

[CBHagman]

23. You might want to edit your post...

...if you've quite finished with that wall.

[FormerDittoHead]

26. Why? I thought it was one of the most "BILLIANT" posts I've read in a long time... n/t

If not the most billiant post EVER.

One shouldn't troll for spelling / grammar errors, however this one was asking for it.

[vaberella]

22. Based just by the posts I see here. If we're the left---in regards to guns we're CHICKENSHIT!n/t

[benEzra]

24. IMO, it takes more courage to stand up against a moral panic

than to go along with it.

Moral panics gave us alcohol prohibition, cannabis prohibition, WW2 internment camps, the 1994 rifle non-ban, the Patriot Act, secret watchlists, torture, and the war in Iraq. In all of those cases, it took more courage to oppose them than to go along with the media hysteria, IMO.

[aikoaiko]

25. This bill will fail and be used against us to win more seats in the south and west.

Thank you, Representative McCarthy from NY.

[Kaleva]

28. High capacity magazines were never totally banned.

Even when the AWB was in effect. True, new ones couldn't be manufactured and sold after the AWB went into effect but old ones were easily available. The Soviets made many 100s of thousands of high capacity magazines for the AK-47 and its variants.

[lynne]

29. Better to focus on identifying and requiring help for mentally ill -

- instead of just fearing and avoiding them.

[Norwood]

30. Brilliant idea! Try to pass something that will absolutely not pass

and drive away voters who are pro second amendment all at the same time!

Criminalizing firearms or clips will do absolutely nothing, if a criminal wants to get their hands on a certain weapon they will. This just punishes the law abiding citizens.

[ClassWarrior]

38. Yes! We should void all laws against murder too! Cuz if a criminal wants to commit it s/he will.

So why should we take the legitimate remedy of murder away from law-abiding citizens?

:crazy:

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

41. .

[Lurks Often]

32. After shooting, House Dems take steps in giving control

of Congress and the Presidency back to the Republicans.

Per Bill Clinton in cost the Democrats control of Congress in 1994 and it is very probably that it led to Al Gore losing in his home state of TN during the 2000 Presidential election. If Al Gore had won TN, Florida would not have mattered.

[paulk]

33. small steps indeed

maybe the House Dems should have "taken steps" to return the assault weapons ban - when they had a huge majority would have been a good time, I would think - but I guess they were afraid of losing the House in 2010 over such a contentious issue - wouldn't want to rock any boats, after all...

[AtomicKitten]

35. Schumer with a preemptive: "The votes just aren't there."

:eyes: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/01/16/schumer-gun-control-votes_n_809658.html

[aikoaiko]

36. I think the common ground will be effectively disqualifying mentally ill who pose a threat.

Trying to reset magazine capacity at 10 is not going to happen.

But creating a system where dangerous people are flagged but also have due process to address wrongful disqualifications.

[texshelters]

40. On Martin Luther King day,

perhaps we should have a dream instead of being pragmatist. Perhaps we should stand for something and a reduction of violence.
http://texshelters.wordpress.com/2011/01/17/why-we-remember-dr-martin-luther-king-jr/

Peace,
Tex Shelters