Not everyone on the Left are bunch of whining kids with no grasp of reality

[impik]

Even without the public option, which can be added on to the current legislative framework later if we stay on the ball and scrape up the votes for it, we're still getting community rating and subsidies for low- and middle-income families. That's huge. Ten years ago this bill would have seemed a godsend. The fact that it doesn't now is a reflection of higher aspirations from the left, and that's great. It demonstrates a resurgence of liberalism that's long overdue. But this is still a huge achievement that will benefits tens of millions of people in very concrete ways and will do it without expanding our long-term deficit. Either with or without a public option, this is more than Bill Clinton ever did, more than Teddy Kennedy did, more than LBJ did, more than Truman did, and more than FDR did. There won't be many other times in our lives any of us will be able to say that. So pass the bill. The longer we wait, the worse it will get. Pass it now.

AMEN!

http://motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2009/12/healthcares-home-stretch


And one of the comments:

"This imperfect bill gets us to something pretty closely resembling universal health insurance via the use of nearly a trillion bucks of public money. And health insurance companies will no longer be able to deny you coverage based on your medical history. That's HUGE. And health insurance companies will no longer be able to charge you higher premiums based on your medical history. That's huge, too. And health insurance companies will no longer be able to cancel your coverage for some flimsy excuse like than can, now. Again, huge. And we'll now have a federally-regulated framework -- the exchanges -- that effectively ends job lock, and helps small businesses compete on a more equal footing with their larger competitors. And we'll also be laying the ground word (via tax code changes, Medicare commissions, etc.) for a future, more substantive assault on costs".

[dbonds]

1. You sound like you don't like progressives with that name calling.

[Phx_Dem]

11. If so, who could blame him, or me.

[dbonds]

12. You are on the wrong site then.

[NJmaverick]

14. If you are bashing the Democrats on the DEMOCRATIC Underground

you are on the wrong site

[dbonds]

18. Imagine you standing for corporate centrist interest...

This is not Democrats marching orders site, where all dems have to march in step. I know your tired fear mongering argument you always use that if you complain about a dem then the republicans win. Well if we don't complain about them we still loose. What choice is that? This is a democracy where we stand up and tell them what we want them to do, they work for us, not we elect them and blindly follow them where ever they say go.

[NJmaverick]

19. I standing with the Democrats, are you? You can fantasize whatever you with

just remember though that fantasy is not the same as reality

[dbonds]

25. You are not standing for anything, you are blowing with the wind.

Whatever the wind from the noise machine is that day you go with it.

[treestar]

36. Black and white thinking

centrists are just as bad as right wingers?

I'm sure I can find freepers who think centrists are as bad as left wingers.

The center is what most of the country is closest to, I'm afraid.

[Norrin Radd]

37. The left is the center. The right has gone off the map.

Centrists are the new right.

[Norrin Radd]

38. The left is the true center. The right has gone off the map.

Centrists are the new right.

[dbonds]

39. What is the center today was hard core regressive republican of 20 years ago.

What was the center is now consider extreme left wing, and real progressives aren't even on the current map. What goes for RW these days is looney nutballs.

And if you ask people on issues they are progressive, way left of center. But you ask in terms of left or right, liberal or conservative, progressive or regressive - then they don't really know and say they are neither - in the middle.

[last_texas_dem]

21. 'scuse me?

Which Democratic Underground are you referring to? The one I've been frequenting for years has always bashed Democrats who sell out to corporate interests and right-wing ideology. Only the most empty-headed of partisan cheerleaders would be allowed to post here if everyone who bashed Democrats on DU was "on the wrong site."

[NJmaverick]

22. That's bullshit, previous wrongs do not excuse current wrong doing

or future wrong doing

[last_texas_dem]

24. So, what's your point? Is there a new rule that criticizing Democrats

is no longer permitted on DU? I doubt it. If so, the mods are gonna have a field day with all of the tombstonings that are gonna be going down...

[NJmaverick]

26. Same rule (just badly ignored), criticism is supposed to be constructive

rather than the destructive type that would be more than welcome over at FR

[last_texas_dem]

28. I agree with you to an extent, but "constructive" is often in the eye of the beholders

Additionally, there are a number of DUers who support vigorously enforcing such rules regarding the tone of criticism when it comes to Obama, but are some of the worst offenders when it comes to non-constructive criticism of other elected Democrats. In my experience, they tend to be the most likely posters to bring up the need to enforce the rules concerning constructive criticism, but IMHO they would be in for a rude awakening if these rules were actually enforced regarding *their* criticism of the Dems that *they* happen not to like.

[NJmaverick]

29. No I am not talking about judgement call types

I am talking about memes like= Obama is awful, See I am right Obama is terrible, Don't support the Dems, We need a third party, The Dems are not good, They are all corporate sell outs etc

I for one don't think any Dem should be bashed, period. It's funny some of the worst Dem bashers will attack you like a rabid weasel though if you dare to criticize one of their progressive non-Dem heroes.

[jgraz]

44. Another massive authoritarian FAIL for the *choke* "maverick"

:eyes:

[tabatha]

2. I recommended but the unrecs are winning.

[freddie mertz]

33. I thought the text was very much worth reading, but the tag line turned it into flame-bait.

I may just repost it myself, without the insult.

[FSogol]

3. k & r n/t

[bluestateguy]

4. I'll support the bill

but I'm still not happy right now. And we need to keep trying with some kind of public option right up until the last minute of the conference committee.

[daleanime]

5. I beg to differ...

We would not be subsiding low and middle income families, we would be giving money to insurance companies, and with the profits that they have been making I don't think they need it.

[Clio the Leo]

6. LBJ would be ....

.... dancing a jig.

And so would Albert Gore.

[Cha]

7. Here's to it getting

better before Pres Obama signs it:toast:

[Armstead]

8. How about this? Fuck you! I aint no kid and objections is not "whining"

I'm 57 and been through too many repeats of this debacle.

My initial expectations for health care reform were relatively modest. I got angry when it became clear that the Corporate Democratic Power Structure was once again going to crush another attempt at even modest liberal reform.

[dbonds]

10. +1

[Fire1]

17. I know you're serious but I can just hear you saying this!! LOL!!!

I'm a boomer, too, so I know how it would sound!!!:rofl:

[Armstead]

31. Feel free to LOL.....There was a bit of black humor in there

[BlueIdaho]

9. There comes a point where what you can get isn't worth having.

We have reached that point. Candidate Obama would NEVER have supported this travesty with its mandates and pay outs to big pharma and the insurance industry. Stop insulting people.

[damntexdem]

13. Yeah, some of us are whining oldsters with a declining stomach for reality.

At least for the reality of U.S. politics.

[tkmorris]

15. Oh but some are? That's interesting.

[NJmaverick]

16. A mature understanding of the facts and the situation

is all it takes, to see it's not the end of the world.

[Fire1]

20. No, but it's a far cry from what we expected. I was willing to

let universal coverage go in favor of the more pragmatic public option. Now, we have neither. Furthermore, I don't appreciate paying for something four years in advance with increased premiums. In this economy, I need every dime I get my hands on.

[NJmaverick]

23. I am dissappointed but not surprised. I appreciated the historical difficulties of this issue

so any success was a win, in my book. I guess the dissappointment comes from the hope that we could have gotten even more, until Liberman derailed it.

[Fire1]

27. I think you're right. n/t

[HopeOverFear]

30. K & R

[freddie mertz]

32. The quoted argument is well and reasonably made.

Unfortunately, the positive contribution to discussion is undermined by the nasty, ad hominem language of the OP's tag line.

Unrec'd for the title.

Maybe this should be re-posted with a rational tag-line.

[Bluenorthwest]

34. but all of you on the right are whining all the time,

if anyone has another opinion, you more to the right types have hysterics about it, post threads, call names, the works. Whining. Petulant, self absorbed writing.
My favorite part of this post is that all you added was a headline that those who wrote the content for you would abhor.

[Jersey Devil]

35. Whining about whining

LOL, this is like Seinfeld.

[depakid]

40. "companies will no longer be able to deny you coverage based on your medical history."

Yep- but they can AND WILL be able to charge 3 times more for the privilege of selling making you buy junk insurance- while the federal government throws tons of money down their inefficient ratholes.

[brentspeak]

41. In addition to the flamebait header title, the article is laughably wrong

"This bill...is more than LBJ did."

More than Medicare?

[hileeopnyn8d]

42. I know you're annoyed

and playing tit for tat, but your thread title is divisive and diverts attention away from an otherwise good OP/article.

[andym]

43. If they really go for Medicare expansion/Srong Public Option using reconciliation next year

then the bill will be very helpful, as we will have the subsidies and rules we need for Medicare/PO to change everything for average Americans. We'll see..

[NYC_SKP]

45. K&R nt

[eridani]

46. We are NOT getting any fucking goddam community rating, you lying piece of shit!

Oh, wait, I forgot. People between 50 and 65 aren't part of the community. That's why we are just disposable human garbage who will be forced to pay THREE TIMES as much to parasitic shitstains who give their employees bonuses for denying claims.

[Vinca]

47. Ditto what you said. They might as well put older Americans

on icebergs and send us out to sea. What will we have to give up to afford to pay big insurance and not become criminals? Food? Shelter? If had a spare $20,000 laying around every year I could buy insurance now.