Obama picks Jim Messina as his campaign manager-seen as move to the right.

[old mark]

Mr. Obama's campaign for the 2012 election is expected to begin in 2 weeks, and to be the longest and most expensive in history...link from Democracy Now:

http://www.democracynow.org/2011/4/1/shunning_grassroots_that_propelled_08_election


If anyone expected Mr. Obama to move left in or after 2012 or to remember those of us on the left who supported him in '08, this is your answer.


mark

[Vinca]

1. So now that the hope and changey thing is kaput, what will the mantra be?

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sasha031]

5. "winning the future"

[DJ13]

7. "WTF"

[woo me with science]

50. Oh my god.

:rofl: :wow: :wtf:

[sad sally]

81. Slogan taken right off the cover of Newt Gingrich's book.

Mr. Gingrich joked that the theme of the president’s speech – “winning the future” – sounded an awful lot like the title of a book he wrote back in 2004, entitled, “Winning the Future: A 21st Century Contract with America.”

[leveymg]

8. Fall forward!

If you can't figure out how to get out of the morass you're in, just step into another war.

[Solomon]

34. You'll take it and you'll like it.

[ReggieVeggie]

59. or do you want to elect Sarah Palin??

[Armstead]

63. Like It or Lump It

[RandomKoolzip]

65. "You're on your own, assholes!"

"Lucrative post-prez book and speaking tours here I come!"

[Spirochete]

2. He should have picked Kenny Loggins instead

He's had more big hits...

[treestar]

90. And is obviously farther to the left! Loggins starts with an L.

L is the same letter that starts "left!"

[Dulcinea]

3. Didn't he sing with Kenny Loggins in the '70s?

:evilgrin:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdtzuY1z5RI

[Tansy_Gold]

6. For something completely different. . . .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x788237


TG, TT, totally shameless

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

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[polichick]

10. "Messina’s ties to corporate America" - Woo-hoo!!!

"Obama’s move has drawn scrutiny over Messina’s ties to corporate America, his push to drop the public option from healthcare reform, and his lack of support for gay rights."

Time for that elusive primary challenger to step forward.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

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[subterranean]

11. You mean *further* to the right.

[Buzz Clik]

12. Bullshit.

Messina has worked with nothing but Democrats, including Jon Tester's difficult campaign in Montana.

[ProSense]

13. Jim Messina Is a Perfect Choice to Be Obama's Campaign Manager

Jim Messina Is a Perfect Choice to Be Obama's Campaign Manager

Another opinion.

[ProudDad]

32. Of course...

From the point of view of retaining corporate control of the Federal Government via the near-right-wing of the Corporate War Party Duopoly, he's a perfect choice...

He's another asshole like Rahm to whip the deluded into making the same mistake they did in '08...

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[treestar]

91. From that link:

"When Messina left Baucus to join the Obama Campaign as Chief of Staff, those of us who had worked with him were thrilled. Messina was a committed progressive who started out in politics as a grassroots organizer in Montana. He has the management skill of a top CEO coupled with boatloads of political savvy.

And there was one other quality that made him the perfect choice for Campaign Chief of Staff then -- and Campaign Manager now:

From my personal experience working with Messina over the last six years, I can tell you firsthand that he is completely committed to progressive values. But he doesn't believe that is good enough. Messina believes that you have to put those values into practice -- that you have to convert them into public policy. Messina is passionate about winning."

[Peregrine Took]

14. Since the rethugs don't have a viable candidate can't Obama switch parties

and be "all he can be" in his natural political home - then a real Dem like Weiner or Dean could be the Democratic candidate.

[Arkana]

15. Messina worked on Obama '08. Stands to reason he'd work

on Obama '12 too.

[ProudDad]

33. Absolutely correct...

Obama was a corporate tool then and he's continuing the pattern...

[sharp_stick]

16. Obama takes a leak -

seen as a move to the right.

The bullshit being peddled by "some" is just a little boring these days.

[Arkana]

19. Obama becomes ambidextrous--seen as a move to the right.

[Solomon]

36. He made a lay-up with his right hand!

[RBInMaine]

17. More fringe attacks. Who ya gonna support? Nader? Now there's a joke.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProudDad]

35. I support removing corporations

from their ownership position in USAmerica...

Who you gonna support -- their tool?

[polichick]

51. I see - it's only "fringe" people who don't want corporations to run this country...

"Fringe" must be the new "hippie" - Republican bullshit tactics right here on DU.

[Armstead]

64. Now you get it

[Union Scribe]

88. ...we need to keep you away from voters.

"Haha you sucker you've got no choice so vote for Obama" has the same chance of winning votes as cruise missiles have of winning hearts and minds.

[old mark]

18. And yet another opinion:

http://www.thenation.com/article/159577/obamas-enforcer


mark

[ProSense]

20. That's not another opinion

That's by the same person interviewed in the OP.

[polichick]

22. Nice how they save the hardball to use against progressives.

[old mark]

21. and another opinion....

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/social/cminca/jim-messina---perfect-cho_b_843486_82831677.html


mark

[ClarkUSA]

23. More bullshit op-ed nonsense from an Obama-bashing media whore looking for hits to his drivel.

Supporters of Hillary fall squarely in the center-right spectrum.

[Buzz Clik]

27. Oh, my. Did anyone ever tell you that you're beautiful when you're angry?

[old mark]

43. ...his eyes just blaze!!!!!

:)

[ProudDad]

37. "fall squarely in the center-right spectrum"

right in there with Obama the prevaricator...

[Armstead]

66. Do you ever admit that Obama is not perfect?

Just wondering

(I know your predictable response...To save you the trouble, yes I have posted supportive things about him.)

[Armstead]

67. Do you ever admit that Obama is not perfect?

Just wondering

(I know your predictable response...To save you the trouble, yes I have posted supportive things about him.)

[NV Whino]

24. This may be good news

If he moves any farther right, he's going to be left.

He may also be left behind.

[Godhumor]

25. If true, it is a good choice. Messina should be very strong in the position

Smart play.

[Freddie Stubbs]

28. Messina has experience at winning races in red states

That is exactly what Obama needs.

[onenote]

54. But I thought all 50 states were really blue states and Obama would win them

if only became a clone of Grayson or Weiner. He doesn't need to win the red/purple states because they don't really exist (except maybe Utah).

I know this from reading DU.

[Davis_X_Machina]

29. Obama get up in morning...

...move seen - on DU anyways - as move to the right.

[ProudDad]

30. Gee, that hopey - changie thing's really working out, isn't it?

Now, let me see, where can Obama get $1,000,000,000+ for his "campaign"...

Oh, I know, THE CORPORATE FUCKS who have bought him already...

http://www.movetoamend.org

And forget the two right-wings of the Corporate War Party...

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

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[jefferson_dem]

55. Here ya go.

Perhaps change this to your ringtone? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Z5af1oTOkU&feature=related

[FrenchieCat]

38. Pres. Obama scratches Right ass cheek......

and is lambasted for two weeks non-stop by "only-if-Kucinich-was-President-life-would-be-fucking-perfect" Left wing netroots echo chamber.

Kucinich scratches left check with left finger and proclaimed
a fuckingingly-amazing-leader/hero by same.

Meanwhile the Republicans and their propaganda media continues with
24/7 assault on Americans including anything and everything Obama,
but no real news there.

Only in Kochs' owned America could this be possible! :patriot:

[CreekDog]

40. Oh come on, if Kenny Loggins didn't need him, why does he?

:wtf:

[Phx_Dem]

41. Great choice!

:P

[BklnDem75]

42. Unrec

[stevenleser]

44. This is hilarious. Does anyone actually believe this crap?

Anyone who buys this constant droning from the same characters deserves not to be taken seriously. Here are future articles I expect to see written and posted by the same folks:

A. Obama sneezes and mucous mostly comes out of right nostril. SEE! WE TOLD YOU! HE LEANS RIGHT!

B. Obama sleeps ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE BED! SEE! WE TOLD YOU! HE LEANS RIGHT!

C. Obama steps out of Air Force One usually with the right foot first. SEE! WE TOLD YOU! HE LEANS RIGHT!!!!!

And the above might be giving these folks too much credit. At least the word "right" is in the first sentences. That is a lot more reason than most folks give for the accusations.

[Buzz Clik]

45. Oh, hell yes!

They are out in force today. And in foul moods.

[FrenchieCat]

47. But he is Left-handed......

So somebody somewheres should calm the fuck down, IMO!

[ReggieVeggie]

60. you have no argument

as per usual

[stevenleser]

93. Its like a defense attorney where the prosecution has not proven its case. I dont need one.

The OP is unbelievable on its face.

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[frazzled]

48. Stop with the lurid headline mongering

Jim Messina was already Chief of Staff for then-Senator Obama's last campaign, in 2008. Then he served as Director of Personnel for the transition team. Since 2009 he's been Deputy Chief of Staff for Operations. It's not like the devil has just dropped in.

Messina is also considered the number one person for having devised the Democratic strategy that prevented Bush and Co. from privatizing Social Security.

He's been with Obama all along. This signals absolutely nothing. Except that he can run a campaign.

[FrenchieCat]

49. I'm starting to believe that Fox ain't got nothing on DU

when it comes to simpleton headlines served up to kneejerkers.

[Harmony Blue]

89. Thank you for bringing these facts to the discussion

In my opinion, I think it would have been a wiser choice to pick a new person to run Obama's staff to mend the rift between the left and Obama's administration. It appears though that Obama's team is gearing up to make a run for the centrists, and Independent voters once more. But my concern is how will this effect Democrats enthusiasm to support Obama this time around?

[Enrique]

52. Messina thought firing Shirley Sherrod was a GOOD thing

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/07/21/886249/-Report:-Deputy-Chief-of-Staff-Jim-Messina-praised-Vilsacks-initial-decision

(...)

But three Democratic sources said Deputy Chief of Staff Jim Messina singled out the White House's initial response to the incident for praise in the regular 8:30 a.m. staff meeting Tuesday morning. The sources differed on the substance of Messina's praise, but concurred that he had praised the speed of White House communications in response to the flap, which was driven by a misleadingly-edited video posted to Andrew Breitbart's Big Government website.

(...)

[jefferson_dem]

53. Another illustration of how Obama is sucky and hates us ALL...

or something. :cry:

Seriously. What a crock. Democracy Now should be ashamed of promoting such drivel.

[Armstead]

62. Why? A guy whose job included shunning the left?

And it is drivel for progressives to be disappointed by that?

[jefferson_dem]

69. Ari Berman, on DN, jumps to the wild-eyed conclusion that the selection of Messina means...

that Obama is "shunning the grassroots that propelled the 2008 election." As evidence, Ari Berman alerts everyone that Obama selected a "Corporate Insider" to run his 2012 effort. The horror... Oh, he means the "Corporate Insider" who happened to be Obama's CoS in 2008. How do people not see the absurdity of such illogic? Perhaps some believe the fact that Mesinna is skilled at fundraising is somehow a bad thing. Brilliant! Never mind that the other side will be raking in heaps of unregulated cash that they will spin into the most nasty smears we've ever seen.

Frankly, I don't give a shit who on the Left Messina has supposedly offended the past couple years. If he can take it to the Repugs - the real political enemy - like I believe he can...that's what matters.

[Armstead]

71. It's not that the "left has supposedly been offended" by him

It's that he helped to undermine the ISSUES that actually are supposed to separate Democrats from Republicans.

And one has to wonder how many promises he will be making to the fat cats -- including what liberal reforms Obama will never do -- to get that cash.

Yes it's obviously important to raise money. But there are ways and there are ways...

[Safetykitten]

57. Cue "you have not been paying attention and he said that in the campaign".

Because it's our fault. Never His. Ours all the time.

[bvar22]

58. K&R.

The curtain was pulled back when Obama did this:


The DLC New Team
Chamber of Commerce APPROVED!!!

(Screen Capped from the DLC Website)
http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?contentid=254886&kaid=86&subid=85




Its been more of the same ever since.



Who will STAND UP and FIGHT for THIS American Majority?
Lofty Rhetoric, Empty Promises, and Excuses are meaningless now.

"By their WORKS you will know them,"
And by their WORKS they will be held accountable.

[ClarkUSA]

61. Apparently, Obama is better than "Hillary: The Corporate Candidate" (by OP linked author Ari Berman)

Berman long ago wrote off Hillary as a credible presidential candidate (by May 2008, to be exact):

If Hillary Clinton really wanted to curtail the influence of the powerful as she says in her speeches, she might start with the advisers to her own campaign, who represent some of the weightiest interests in corporate America. Her chief strategist, Mark Penn, not only polls for America's biggest companies but also runs one of the world's premier PR agencies. A bevy of current and former Hillary advisers, including her communications guru, Howard Wolfson, are linked to a prominent lobbying and PR firm -- the Glover Park Group -- that has cozied up to the pharmaceutical industry and Rupert Murdoch. Her fundraiser in chief, Terry McAuliffe, has the priciest Rolodex in Washington, luring high-rolling contributors to Clinton's campaign. Her husband, since leaving the presidency, has made millions giving speeches and counsel to investment banks like Goldman Sachs and Citigroup. They house, in addition to other Wall Street firms, the Clintons' closest economic advisers, such as Bob Rubin and Roger Altman, whose DC brain trust, the Hamilton Project, is Clinton's economic team in waiting. Even the liberal in her camp, former deputy chief of staff Harold Ickes, has lobbied for the telecom and healthcare industries, including a for-profit nursing home association indicted in Texas for improperly funneling money to disgraced former House majority leader Tom DeLay."

http://www.alternet.org/story/51619

If Messina is the only person that Berman objects to, I'd say Democrats are incredibly fortunate because we could've ended up with DLC Hillary and her cozy coterie of corporate tools (see above). One can only imagine the outrage of "those on the left" if that had happened!

[Armstead]

73. You don't think those corporate croniesd didn't come back into the fold?

Once the messy little matter of the primary was over -- and the formality of the presidential campaign -- Obama turned to the same crew. We still ended up with a Goldman Sachs presidency.

[ClarkUSA]

80. Wrong. None of the people Berman named (Hillary's corporate campaign cronies) are in the WH employ.

Facts trump empty demonizing rhetoric that is easily proved false. Try reading the excerpted quote next time.

[Armstead]

84. Um, Obama interviewed and seriously considered....

....Roger Altman as a potential replacement to Larry Summers (from the Clinton administration) on the council of economic policy, but instead hired gene sperling ( another Clinton alumni and former well-paid contractor with Goldman Sachs.)

As for Rubin of Citigroup....Earlier (New York Times Nov 2008)

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/24/business/worldbusiness/24iht-rubin.4.18116856.html


WASHINGTON — It is testament to the star power of former Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin among many Democrats that as Barack Obama fills out his economic team, a virtual Rubin constellation is taking shape.

The president-elect used the announcement Monday that he was appointing two Rubin protégés, Timothy Geithner as Treasury secretary and Lawrence Summers as senior White House economic adviser, to underscore his determination to step aggressively into a economic leadership vacuum in Washington while also maintaining continuity with the Bush administration before the transition of power Jan. 20.

Obama is expected to soon announce the appointment of another Rubin protégé, Peter Orszag, as White House budget director. And even the headhunters for Obama have Rubin ties: Michael Froman, who was Rubin's chief of staff in the Treasury Department and followed him to Citigroup, and James Rubin, Robert Rubin's son.

Geithner, Summers and Orszag have all been followers of the economic formula that came to be called Rubinomics: balanced budgets, free trade and financial deregulation....

[ClarkUSA]

85. lol! Moving the goalpost now? Of course you are, especially since I proved you wrong.

Keep muttering to yourself. Buh bye.

[Armstead]

87. Sure, despite what the Times said...

The Clinton crew have had nothing to do with the Obama WH...

Speaking of moving the goalposts...

Look, if you think it's fine, then at least own up to it and tell me I'm full of it because there is nothing wrong with Obama as Clinton 2

But it's silly to deny it, and then claim that I am raising goalposts when I show you evidence to refute your denial

[jefferson_dem]

74. Apparently, Berman regularly launches into hyperbolic witch hunts against Democrats.

http://www.alternet.org/story/24296/

Ack.

[Armstead]

76. No, he tells the nasty llittle truths that some would prefer to gloss over

There is an entrenched and intellectually inbred elite that pulls the strings of the Democratic party. They are never humbled when they are proven to be wrong (remember Iraq? Remember the Crash of 08?) and they have the ability to keep their boots on the whole party, no magtter who is elected or what the majority might want. They prevent new ideas and perspectives from ever really influencing the political system.

No they are not bad people. And yes they are smart and often capable. But they have a worldview that is stifling and often wrong.

[KoKo]

94. Some interesting bits from the article:

The Nation / By Ari Berman
comments_image 50 COMMENTS
Meet Jim Messina, Obama's 'Enforcer' Against Progressives
He's been called "the most powerful person in Washington that you haven't heard of."

Continued from previous page




In 1999 Messina became chief of staff to New York Congresswoman Carolyn McCarthy but returned to manage Baucus’s re-election campaign in 2002. The campaign became infamous when the Montana Democratic Party ran an ad showing his GOP opponent, Mike Taylor, a former hairdresser, fondling the hair and face of a male client while wearing a ’70s-style leisure suit. Taylor dropped out days after the ad aired, accusing the Baucus campaign of “character assassination and personal destruction.” Gay rights groups condemned the ad as antigay, but it greatly enhanced Messina’s reputation as a top Democratic operative. “He touted the ad as the way to do politics in the West,” said Toole.


--------------------
Even as Messina jet-sets around the country, huddling with big donors, will the campaign cultivate the small donors and grassroots activists who powered and shaped the ‘08 Obama campaign? On February 1 Politico’s Mike Allen reported that “Obama’s political operation is quietly using the afterglow of his State of the Union address to begin activating grassroots supporters as the start of a continuous wave of engagement that will culminate when he stands for reelection on Nov. 6, 2012.” As part of the effort, OFA offered T-shirts to activists featuring a tag line from Obama’s speech: “We do big things.” The article provided a revealing glimpse into the campaign’s early strategy for 2012—woo wealthy donors and sell T-shirts to the masses.

[Beacool]

99. I might just stay home in 11/12

Both parties are making me sick. I wish we had a viable third party in this country. Both major parties are mirror images of each other.

:puke:

[KoKo]

105. I thought his "Everybody's on the Make" from that particular article was interesting, though

Quote from your link to his Alternet Article from 2005:

'Everybody's On the Make'

"There's an approach which says, 'Let's raise the stakes and call,'" says former Senator Gary Hart, a rare voice of principled opposition in the party today. "That if Republicans want a ten-division Army, let's be for a twelve-division Army. I think that's just nonsense, frankly. It's stupid policy. Trying to get on the other side of the Republicans is folly, both politically and substantively."

If Hart is correct, then why does so much of the Democratic strategic class march in lockstep? There's no simple answer. The insularity of Washington, pressures of careerism, fear of appearing soft and the absence of institutional alternatives all contribute to a limiting of the debate. Bill Clinton's misguided political dictum that the public "would rather have somebody who's strong and wrong than somebody who's weak and right" applies equally to the strategic class.

[ProudDad]

101. Why do you continually blame "the left"

for pointing out to you...

That they are ALL fucking right-wing corporate tools...

The ones you should be speaking to are the near-right-wing corporate tools who supported Hillary AND Barack...

Stop misusing the term "Left"!

Thank you...

[Canuckistanian]

68. "He's the best president money can buy"

Now with added corporate goodness.

[ClarkUSA]

70. Why the quotation marks? Berman never said that about Pres. Obama in his interview.

BTW, President Obama is 10000000 times better than Canadian PM Heil Harper, who better fits your description. Hope you Canucks can solve your own problems in leadership because it looks like Conservatives are going to get a majority come May. I'm pretty sure Liberal Democrats would love to have a Barack Obama lead them out of the wilderness into the promised land again but alas, they don't.

[Canuckistanian]

72. I said it. And I meant it.

And you know zip about Canadian politics.

[ClarkUSA]

77. lol! So you're quoting yourself? Nice of you to clear that up.

<< And you know zip about Canadian politics. >>

I said it. And I meant it. I also read plenty of Canadian news. PM Harper is a bullying corporate fascist that no doubt makes his buddy Cheney proud. And he has a good chance of getting a majority in May. The press is cowed and so are voters.

[Canuckistanian]

78. I have no quarrel with your view of Canadian politics

It's just your PREDICTION of our election results, which Americans tend to get wrong every time.

[ClarkUSA]

79. Changed your mind? You originally said, "And you know zip about Canadian politics."

Proof: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=642544&mesg_id=642854

<< It's just your PREDICTION of our election results, which Americans tend to get wrong every time.>>

"every time"? Wrong. You underestimate Americans. I predicted Harper would win a minority way back when he was a very studied Bush clone running for PM. I'm not the only one who thinks Harper is likely to win a majority, either. Many Canadians think so, too:
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=harper+will+win+majority&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

[Canuckistanian]

82. You have a reading comprehension problem

"which Americans tend to get wrong every time"

tend
verb, transitive.
"to have a general disposition (to do something); be inclined"

[ClarkUSA]

83. Splitting semantic hairs? No, I heard you loud and clear. BTW, I know alot about Canuck politics...

... as is obvious to you by now. I'm quite sure Liberal Democrats wish they had a Barack Obama of their very own.

Good luck with a Harper majority. Canada will need it.

[Canuckistanian]

86. Good night

:hi:

[11 Bravo]

75. Presidential motorcade turns left from E St NW towards White House - seen as a move to the right

[ProudDad]

92. Meet Jim Messina, Obama's 'Enforcer' Against Progressives

He's been called "the most powerful person in Washington that you haven't heard of."

In March 2009 the Campaign for America’s Future, a top progressive group in Washington, launched a campaign called “Dog The (Blue) Dogs” to pressure conservative Blue Dog Democrats to support President Obama’s budget. When he heard about the effort, White House deputy chief of staff Jim Messina, who was regarded as the Obama administration’s designated “fixer,” called CAF’s leaders into the White House for a dressing down, according to a CAF official. If the group wanted to join the Common Purpose Project, an exclusive weekly strategy meeting between progressive groups and administration officials, CAF had to drop the campaign. We know how to handle the Blue Dogs better than you do, Messina said. Not wanting to sour its relationship with the White House at this early date, CAF complied, and the campaign quickly disappeared from its website. Despite Messina’s assurance, however, the Blue Dogs would remain a major obstacle to the realization of the president’s legislative agenda.

The hardball tactics used by Messina against CAF exemplified how the Obama administration would operate going forward—insistent on demanding total control, hostile to any public pressure from progressives on dissident Democrats or administration allies, committed to working the system inside Washington rather than changing it. As deputy chief of staff, Messina held the same position once occupied by Karl Rove (and Josh Lyman on The West Wing). He worked as a top lieutenant for Rahm Emanuel and became the administration’s lead enforcer after Emanuel left for Chicago. White House communications director Dan Pfeiffer calls Messina “the most powerful person in Washington that you haven’t heard of.” Messina’s dream job was to become chief of staff. Instead, he recently got an arguably more important assignment—manager of Obama’s re-election campaign.

http://www.alternet.org/story/150467/meet_jim_messina%2C_obama%27s_%27enforcer%27_against_progressives?akid=6779.152900.06YCYx&rd=1&t=18

[KoKo]

95. I think what Messina did to Shirley Sherrod...is very creepy according to article..

:-(

[stevenleser]

97. Everything done to Shirley Sherrod was creepy. I've had the chance to speak to her one on one about

it. Messina is not the person she singles out by any stretch of the imagination.

[stevenleser]

100. That is very bizarre spin when you consider reality.

Reality is, administrations want to ensure a consistent message. So, yes, a group that wanted to be within the tent but giving off a message that is not consistent with the administration's is a problem regardless of particular ideological bent.

This is a problem I have with a particular segment of progressives. Everything is spun as a deliberate slight and that does not reflect reality.

[ProudDad]

102. The reality is the government is bought and sold by the highest bidders

the plutocracy is (still) in charge...

And pretending that Obama or Hillary or any democan or republicrat is your "friend", a friend of the working class, when they have to get completely vetted and financed by the plutocracy in order to win high office is folly.

[stevenleser]

103. The reality is that what you wrote has nothing to do with the conversation I was having n/t

[ProudDad]

104. Yes, it does.

You were talking about a "consistent" message. I was reminding you that the "consistent" message is detrimental to us and the survival of Earth as a viable habitat for humans and other air-breathing creatures...

Because the message is by and for the Plutocrat class...

The "consistent" message is one detrimental to the working class and squarely on the side of the Plutocrats who selected Obama...

[stevenleser]

106. No, it doesnt. And welcome to my ignore list and say hello to the rest of the folks for whom

logic means nothing.

[KoKo]

96. Kick & REC

[Beacool]

98. Messina, Plouffe, Axelrod, does it really matter?

It's all about obtaining and remaining in power. The little people are only needed to send money to the campaign and to show up on election day. The rest of the time they should know their place and remain quiet.

Suckers!!!

:eyes:

[stevenleser]

107. Yup, Messina, Plouffe, Axelrod and Hillary Clinton, does it really matter?

Oh wait, is that not what you meant? :eyes:

[Beacool]

108. Hillary is a strategist for Obama's campaign?

That's new to me........

:eyes:

[stevenleser]

110. She's that and much more. The Sec State is an integral part of an administration. I'm sure she is

doing everything possible to help with his re-election.

[cliffordu]

109. Oh, yeah? What does Kenny Logins say about this??

[Quantess]

111. My thoughts exactly.

LOL.