Obama supporters don't really think that the only reason to vote for him is that he's not a Repub.

[LoZoccolo]

That might be the only argument we present after someone has indicated that they will be impervious to positive reasons to vote for him, though, or will use hyperbole or other manipulative tactics to avoid honest discussion. This argument may be so pervasive because intellectual dishonesty is also so pervasive, particularly when the aim is trying to denigrate Democrats in an arm-twisting effort to get more out of them as the Internet is percieved to readily facilitate.

[damntexdem]

1. I'm sure they don't -- but at this point it IS.

I was an Obama delegate to my state's Democratic Convention, I supported Obama throughout his challenge to Hillary. I worked for his election. I am now dislliusioned with him, but at least he's not a Repuke, so I'll vote for him.

Obama supporters had better take into account how many of us there are who feel that way and not do anything to drive us further away.

[CakeGrrl]

3. Drive you further away to...what?

I don't mean to be blunt, but at the end of the day, when all the putative Progressive heroes have said they're not going to mount a Primary challenge, and with Republican/Teabag/Neo-Con nutters salivating to take over, what are you going to do?

Throw it to the R's so you can spite some Obama supporters who annoyed you on a message board?

???????

[ClassWarrior]

7. Thanks for disproving the OP so quickly.

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

2. You're right. We shouldn't have to arm-twist Democrats to make them embrace Democratic values.

NGU.

[LoZoccolo]

4. Which Democrats, in your opinion, support Democratic values?

[ClassWarrior]

6. You don't know what Democratic values are?

Here, judge for yourself:

I believe that progressive values are traditional American values, that progressive principles are fundamental American principles, and that progressive policy directions point the way to where most Americans really want our country to go. The job of unifying progressives is really the job of bringing our country together around its finest traditional values.

CONSERVATIVES believe in...
STRONG DEFENSE
FREE MARKETS
LOWER TAXES
SMALLER GOVERNMENT
FAMILY VALUES

PROGRESSIVES believe in...
STRONGER AMERICA
BROAD PROSPERITY
BETTER FUTURE
EFFECTIVE GOVERNMENT
MUTUAL RESPONSIBILITY

» A stronger America is not just about defense, but about every dimension of strength: our effectiveness in the world, our economy, our educational system, our health care system, our families, our communities, our environment, and so forth.

» Broad prosperity is the effect that markets are supposed to bring about. But all markets are constructed for someone's benefit; no markets are completely free. Markets should be constructed for the broadest possible prosperity, and they haven't been.

» Americans want and deserve a better future — economically, educationally, environmentally, and in all other areas of life — for themselves and their children. Lowering taxes, primarily for the super-rich elite, has had the effect of defunding programs that would make a better future possible in all these areas. The proper goal is a better future for all Americans.

» Smaller government is, in conservative propaganda, supposed to eliminate waste. It is really about eliminating social programs. Effective government is what we need our government to accomplish to create a better future.

» Conservative family values are those of a strict father family — authoritarian, hierarchical, every man for himself, based around discipline and punishment. Progressives live by the best values of both families and communities: mutual responsibility, which is authoritative, equal, two-way, and based around caring, responsibility (both individual and social), and strength.

The remarkable thing is just how much progressives do agree on. These are just the things that voters tend to care about most: our values, our principles, and the direction in which we want to take the nation.

http://www.infoamerica.org/teoria_textos/manifiesto_lakoff.pdf

NGU.

[LoZoccolo]

8. Which Democrats, in your opinion, support Democratic values?

[ClassWarrior]

10. You don't know what Democratic values are?

Here, judge for yourself:

I believe that progressive values are traditional American values, that progressive principles are fundamental American principles, and that progressive policy directions point the way to where most Americans really want our country to go. The job of unifying progressives is really the job of bringing our country together around its finest traditional values.

CONSERVATIVES believe in...
STRONG DEFENSE
FREE MARKETS
LOWER TAXES
SMALLER GOVERNMENT
FAMILY VALUES

PROGRESSIVES believe in...
STRONGER AMERICA
BROAD PROSPERITY
BETTER FUTURE
EFFECTIVE GOVERNMENT
MUTUAL RESPONSIBILITY

» A stronger America is not just about defense, but about every dimension of strength: our effectiveness in the world, our economy, our educational system, our health care system, our families, our communities, our environment, and so forth.

» Broad prosperity is the effect that markets are supposed to bring about. But all markets are constructed for someone's benefit; no markets are completely free. Markets should be constructed for the broadest possible prosperity, and they haven't been.

» Americans want and deserve a better future — economically, educationally, environmentally, and in all other areas of life — for themselves and their children. Lowering taxes, primarily for the super-rich elite, has had the effect of defunding programs that would make a better future possible in all these areas. The proper goal is a better future for all Americans.

» Smaller government is, in conservative propaganda, supposed to eliminate waste. It is really about eliminating social programs. Effective government is what we need our government to accomplish to create a better future.

» Conservative family values are those of a strict father family — authoritarian, hierarchical, every man for himself, based around discipline and punishment. Progressives live by the best values of both families and communities: mutual responsibility, which is authoritative, equal, two-way, and based around caring, responsibility (both individual and social), and strength.

The remarkable thing is just how much progressives do agree on. These are just the things that voters tend to care about most: our values, our principles, and the direction in which we want to take the nation.

http://www.infoamerica.org/teoria_textos/manifiesto_lakoff.pdf

NGU.

[BklnDem75]

13. Want to read that question a third time?

It's pretty clear and you avoided answering it twice.

[LoZoccolo]

14. Are you going to answer the question I asked, or keep answering one that I didn't?

[ClassWarrior]

16. You know your thread title?

Remember when Nixon said, "I am not a crook?"

:rofl:

NGU.

[LoZoccolo]

18. My thread addresses manipulative tactics, which would include dodging and changing the subject.

Again, if anyone thinks they don't hear positive reasons for voting for Obama, they owe it to themselves to make sure that they aren't coming off as someone who's avoiding honest discussion. It could be the reason they're being given the lowest common denominator.

Thank you for your contribution.

[ClassWarrior]

23. So in other words, it's a convoluted attempt to call people who aren't enthusiastic...

...enough in their support for the Prez trolls, without actually calling them trolls. Classy.

NGU.

[BzaDem]

24. It's actually pointing out the people who are afraid of answering simple questions. And it's working

very well.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LoZoccolo]

15. I don't know what you mean by that because I was asking a question, not stating something.

I've made an assumption, though.

[Bobbie Jo]

9. ...and we shouldn't have to hand-hold Democrats to the polls.

Now what? Take your toys and go home?

This is a process...participation is essential.

[ClassWarrior]

11. We don't. We have to hand-hold swing voters to the polls. That's why we need...

...enthusiastic, engaged Dems. They all vote. But they only volunteer when they're engaged.

:shrug:

I didn't create this world. I just live in it.

NGU.

[Tom Rinaldo]

17. BINGO n/t

[Bake]

5. I'll vote for him.

But he's not exactly making it easy for me ...

Bake

[Bluerthanblue]

20. I'm not sure that many of us are making it

easy for him either.

I'm glad you're voting for him. I am too.

:hi:

[Bake]

21. It's not our job to make his job easy.

:hi:

Bake

[LoZoccolo]

22. A citizen holds the highest office in a democracy.

[creon]

19. I do not think that

Obama is one of the very few responsible adults in Washington.

Most of the rest are either blind kittens or hacks who are only out for what they can get