Can any one explain what the President could have done to bring Lieberman on boardd

[Perky]

with the public Option? There were 12 Senators who wrot a letter to Reid regarding deep concerns about the Medicare buy-in.


Even if he could get Joe? He still had maybe 56 on the Public Option.

His only option would be the Bully Pulpit and that is a lot of political capital to expend with no sure result once it came back from conference and we had to start the process again.

It is easy to archair this thing out....but the votes were not there...and bluntly that is more the fault of Baucus and Reid then it was the President.

[NRaleighLiberal]

1. There is plenty of blame to go around. STARTING at a watered down position

is just the start - if you want real change you start from a position of real change, then negotiate from there. But deals cut with Pharma, for example, got it off to a bad start.

In a way, allowing Lieberman to keep his position - after what he pulled in the campaign - you can follow to root causes, but complaining about Lieberman now is just looking at one of the easy, obvious targets.

[lapfog_1]

2. Tell me what he tried to do first?

The first hint that Obama was directly involved with anything is when he started calling Reid and telling him to capitulate to Joementum. The next time we know that Obama called the Democratic caucus to the White House (including Joe) and telling them to sell sell sell it to their constituents (and take out anyone that speaks up).

That's what we know that he has done.

Did he threaten to veto this because it's now not reform at all but a giveaway to the insurance industry?

Did he call people to tell them to vote to allow the re-importation of prescription drugs. Or did his White House send a letter to all Democratic Senators warning them that re-imported drugs were not safe, apparently on FDA letterhead (if Senator Dorgan is to be believed).

These are the things that we know or suspect that President Obama did.

What, if any, of those things would lead you to believe that he WANTED to do any of the things that might have been done to bring Joe into the fold?

[hlthe2b]

3. threatened him with loss of the enormous submarine facility in CT

in the next round of military reorganizations for one... LBJ knew the carrot and stick approach... I'm convinced that Rahm is so damned far into the right of center thinking, that as a result, only sticks for loyal Dems and nothing but carrots for REPUGs and their ilck, including Liarman.

[phleshdef]

6. I don't believe in punishing a whole state because of one Senator.

Thats fucking thuggery.

[hlthe2b]

10. Happens all the time... give and take, carrot and stick, some idle

threats presented as effective "bluffs..." This is the way things have gotten done behind the scenes since inception, since it is the one bit of leverage that works with recalcitrant Congressional Reps and Senators. The fact that some here are arguing against any hardball strategies and tactics--even if they are bluffs-- is the very reason we are in this mess and why, by contrast, the REPUGS are able to keep their caucus in line and why DEMS have not--since LBJ.

[Perky]

7. Base realigmentt is done by a bipartisan commisssion

It would have also pissed off the rest of the CT delegation and punished the entire state. and would be seen for what it was a hollow threat....next

[hlthe2b]

8. Obviously it would NOT have been a threat made public...

These behind the scenes deals go on all the time. The recommendation for realignment prepared for the bipartisan commission, btw, comes from Sec. of Defense, who presumedly Is influenced by Obama.

YOU asked the question... this is how LBJ and others kept their congressional factions in line... Hardball poker playing--some idle threats and some bluffs delivered behind the scenes. The naivete' of some here is incredible, but only underscores why we are losing our fights. Politics is a rough business and not for the feint of heart.

[Perky]

11. You don't think Liebermann would have trotted out to the Press Gallery

as soon as such a threat was made? The White House would then have to deny it publicaly and privately to the entire CoDel. At which point the power of the threat would have been eviscerated.

.

[hlthe2b]

14. One needs to know your opponent to play hardball...

where their soft spots are....as well as their skeletons to be able to pull it off...I would bet that Lieberman has some skeletons that he'd be far more worried about revealing-- again the game of hardball bluff. Besides, part of the effectiveness of such a strategy would be the pressure that would come to bear if CT residents thought they were going to lose that lucrative sub facility.

[TeamJordan23]

4. Sell the public option to the public

and then people Lieberman, Nelson, and Snowe would have no clout.

[Enrique]

5. he sent Rahm to tell Reid to back Lieberman

if he could do that, why is it inconceivable that he send Rahm to tell Reid not to back Lieberman? Or at least tell Rahm to go home and stay out of it?

[JVS]

9. Back when he started, he shouldn't have written off single payer. When the teabaggers...

started going at it, he shouldn't have simply stood back as they put him in a weaker position. He should have campaigned for good HCR. If he had approached the issue with the force and urgency that he took when dealing with the Rev. Wright scandals, we'd all be a lot better off.

[waiting for hope]

12. When is it going to become clear that this is the

Health Care Insurance Bail Out Plan from the start?

Obama Locks Out Single Payer Supporters

Call The White House: Let Single Payer In

On Thursday, March 5, 2009, the White House will host a summit on how to reform health care.

The 120 invited guests include lobbyists for various interest groups including the private insurance industry (AHIP), some members of Congress including Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus, who has already ruled single payer "off the table," and various others concerned with health care.

No single payer advocates have been invited to attend.

Obama Has Met At Least 27 Times With Private Health Care Industry Executives

The records show that, from early February to late June, the White House has invited 15 of the health care and pharmaceutical industry's most powerful players.

Internal Memo Confirms Big Giveaways In White House Deal With Big Pharma



Wellpoint "really did" write the Baucus health plan

Fowler learned as a sophomore at the University of Pennsylvania that the United States was the only industrialized country without universal health care, and she decided then to dedicate her professional life to the work.

She first worked for Baucus from 2001 through 2005, playing a key role in negotiating the Medicare Part D prescription drug program. Feeling burned out, she left for the private sector but rejoined Baucus in 2008, sensing that a Democratic-controlled Congress would make progress on overhauling the health care system.

Baucus and Fowler spent a year putting the senator in a position to pursue reform, including holding hearings last summer and issuing a white paper in November. They deliberately avoided releasing legislation in order to send a signal of openness and avoid early attacks.

"People know when Liz is speaking, she is speaking for Baucus," said Dean Rosen, the health policy adviser to former Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tenn.).

Health care groups lobby at record pace

WASHINGTON — The drug and insurance industries have dramatically amped up their efforts to lobby Congress, spending millions over a three-month period to influence legislation aimed at reshaping the nation's health care system, new reports show.

The Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America reported nearly $7 million in lobbying expenses from July through September. Overall, the group has spent nearly as much during the first nine months of 2009 as it did during the entire previous year.

Individual drug companies also have sharply increased lobbying. Pfizer, for instance, has spent more than $17 million in lobbying during the first nine months of this year, nearly twice its lobbying budget during the same period in 2008. Pfizer spokeswoman Kristen Neese said the spending reflects a commitment to "making our voice heard."

America's Health Insurance Plans, an association of insurance companies now battling with President Obama over the final shape of health care legislation, racked up $6.3 million in lobbying expenses this year — $1 million more than the same period in 2008, according to lobbying reports filed with Congress and data compiled by the non-partisan CQ MoneyLine.

The sooner people wake up to the fact that the government, congress and the White House included, only cares about the next election, only cares about their campaign money, only cares about the connections they make so they can continue making gobs of money after they leave office and that they don't care about the lower 99% of us, perhaps then real change can occur.

[Clio the Leo]

13. These responses are KILLING me....

.... :rofl:

Because the ONE thing that Lieberman and Nelson and all of that bunch would have gotten on board with is SINGLE PAYER!!!! too funny

[applegrove]

15. NOTHING. Joe Lieberman is a neocon. He cares nothing for the american public anymore.

[Ken Burch]

16. Have Reid threaten to strip him of his chair!

That would affect him.

Also, threaten to hold a WH fundraiser for whatever Dem challenger Joe will have in '12.

Tell him"you do this, you damn well don't get to be in the Rose Garden for the signing".

Those are a few.