In debt talks, Obama offers Social Security cuts

[Cali_Democrat]

Source: Washington Post

President Obama is pressing congressional leaders to consider a far-reaching debt-reduction plan that would force Democrats to accept major changes to Social Security and Medicare in exchange for Republican support for fresh tax revenue.

At a meeting with top House and Senate leaders set for Thursday morning, Obama plans to argue that a rare consensus has emerged about the size and scope of the nation’s budget problems and that policymakers should seize the moment to take dramatic action.

As part of his pitch, Obama is proposing significant reductions in Medicare spending and for the first time is offering to tackle the rising cost of Social Security, according to people in both parties with knowledge of the proposal. The move marks a major shift for the White House and could present a direct challenge to Democratic lawmakers who have vowed to protect health and retirement benefits from the assault on government spending.

“Obviously, there will be some Democrats who don’t believe we need to do entitlement reform. But there seems to be some hunger to do something of some significance,” said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking. “These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/in-debt-talks-obama-offers-social-security-cuts/2011/07/06/gIQA2sFO1H_story.html

---

Shit!

[Fumesucker]

1. Only Nixon could go to China..

:shrug:

[EFerrari]

68. Yep. n/t

[Downwinder]

2. With SS cuts I offer you Obama.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

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[Stuart G]

4. Don't know what to say..disappointed at best.

[aquart]

5. NO. That is OUR money, not his.

[Downwinder]

6. Money, hell -- LIFE

[closeupready]

7. Not acceptable. Period.

nt

[DJ13]

8. So let me get this straight

The wealthy people got record tax cuts that created a deficit, the big banks and assorted insurance companies gambled and lost vast sums and we kept them in business, adding untold trillions to the deficit....... and Mr. President you think the elderly, the disabled, and the poor should pay for it?

Mr. President, you are NO Democrat.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[EndElectoral]

19. Well said....This is not representative of why I became a Democrat.

[CakeGrrl]

63. No, you didn't get that straight.

But nice outrage post.

[Javaman]

172. Perhaps you could clarify? nt

[DJ13]

178. And your reasoning is......?

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bahrbearian]

13. +1

[CakeGrrl]

64. Is that an instruction for OTHER people to go get it started?

You gonna hang back and see what happens?

[Lifelong Protester]

11. I have just written to the White House? How about you?

This is ridiculous. I said any diminishing of these programs will mean I cannot vote for him again.

Granted, I want to hear the details, but it doesn't look good.

I think everyone here should send a quick email to the White House. Make your voices heard!

[neoralme]

45. Me neither. And much much worse.

[roxiejules]

57. The twitter townhall meeting...

was just a distraction, wasn't it?



Call White House: 202-456-1414

[lob1]

12. We're being sold out. We're not represented in Washington.

[woo me with science]

169. +1 nt

[BlueIdaho]

14. I sure wish we had a Democrat in the White House

Seriously, what is this guy's problem? 75% of America is ready willing and able to tax the rich and this guy is holding a fire sale on Democratic values.

[blkmusclmachine]

15. Drowning the Fed. Gov't,

one bi-partisan "deal" at a time.

First time is chance. Second time is happenstance. Third time is enemy action.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[1StrongBlackMan]

18. Wait a minute ...

I read the article and see nothing new about "offering Social Security Cuts." Call me stupid but didn't President Obama identify where the cuts would come from, i.e., efficiency and a reduction in provider over-payments?

What has changed? The article doesn't lead me to believe that anything has. But maybe that's because I go by what is said, not what some pundit projects.

[Iliyah]

25. True

all people see is cuts and thats it. He's not going right but has been in the center. Once the country economy starts improving espcially the jobs market and once people truly understand what these cuts are, if they even listen, they will see that its not destroying SSI nor Medicare, but voters can bring in Mittens and crazy Bachmann, and bitch even more. Sh*t look at what the gov gopers are doing, next it will be the all pver the country and if that happens I don't want to hear these people crying a river.

And yes, he is a Dem.

[BlueIdaho]

33. So why can't he simply say...

"Let me make one thing clear, I will veto any solution that postpones or degrades access to and benefits from these essential programs. Social Security and Medicare are promises made to the American people, and I refuse to break those promises"

[neoralme]

36. Oh, puhleeze. This man is not remotely a Dem. He is acting

on orders to destroy entitlements. If he alters SS and Medicare he WILL NOT be re-elected. Much will be done by many to defeat him. Mittens? Bachman? Do you really think these freaks would have had the gumption to destroy entitlements? No way. They would have folded, just like Bush.

[Iliyah]

49. LOL

Say what you will and YES he is a Dem, like it or not, and no matter all loud you guys yell that will not change. Sh*t I remember people saying the same damn thing about Prez Clinton and guess what, Americans prospered and no more deficits. I Remember my parents telling me about Prez Reagan and how he said Medicare was a socialist program which will DESTROY America. The gopers went crazy they hated Medicare, now the goper voters love it.

Prez O is not destroying Medicare nor SSI. And yes he is a Dem.

[neoralme]

53. You are as wrong as you can be. Your comparison of events and

presidencies is ridiculous.

[Iliyah]

58. NOPE

Its history. Sh*t some progressives are still saying that Prez Clinton is more goper than Dem - LOL

A year from now come back and let us discuss this again OK

[neoralme]

60. Clinton is a DINO. Obama is a Republican.

[bitchkitty]

88. +1

[rurallib]

173. the center is now right of Reagan

we don't need a democratic president in that center.

[AlbertCat]

28. efficiency and a reduction in provider over-payments?

Now that's a good move.
But it should be done by an oversight agency, and not be a political bargaining chip to keep us from defaulting.... when wealthy people and corporations and the Military are all doing GREAT!

[eilen]

46. It is a reworking of the COLA and will effect

SS, SSI, Federal pensions etc. It will effect future and current retirees.

[high density]

47. Here's the important paragraph

Privately, some congressional Democrats were alarmed by the president’s proposal, which would adjust a formula that uses inflation to determine Social Security payouts. But others described it as primarily a bargaining strategy intended to demonstrate Obama’s willingness to compromise and highlight the Republican refusal to raise taxes.

Does one believe this formula would be "adjusted" to increase or decrease payouts?

I feel there are these possibilities based on this paragraph:

Cuts to benefits by changing the formula

Obama doesn't really want cuts, but is using them in a game to make an example of the "NO" Republicans (good luck to us all with that)

The Post has no clue what they are talking about and is totally wrong in this reporting

[CakeGrrl]

50. Nothing has changed. This is an excuse

for another bout of irrational, mouth-foaming outrage and nasty insults from people who are eager to do it whenever they get the chance.

Pretty disgusting.

[bitchkitty]

89. No, what's disgusting is

your complete and utter lack of feelings toward the segment of our population that is going to be hurt by his incessant compromising with the GOP.

[CakeGrrl]

90. Swing and a miss.

Where do you even get that?

People here are lapping up MSM speculation like fact. It's bizarre.

[bitchkitty]

91. If I mistook you for an apologist, i'm sorry.

I believe we have a lot to complain about with this Administration, and you can't really blame people who hear the speculation that he's going to cave again, and believe it.

[bvar22]

179. I agree. This is exactly like all the uproar over the rumor...

...that Obama was going to drop the Public Option.

Much Ado about Nothing....eh?

[JDPriestly]

74. Provider-cuts. And who do you think will pay for those cuts?

The Medicare recipients, that's who. Up go co-payments. That's not so bad if you don't have to see a doctor very often, but in the final years of life, we will all need to go to the doctor very often.

Start saving your money because you are going to need it when you get old and nobody wants to hire you.

[DavidDvorkin]

20. Terrible, if true, but is it true?

[Frisbee]

21. True or not...

it is pretty sad that it doesn't seem to be hard to believe, and speaks volumes about how far to the right Obama has moved (or always been).

[roxiejules]

43. From NYT

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/07/us/politics/07fiscal.html

The president’s renewed efforts follow what knowledgeable officials said was an overture from Mr. Boehner, who met secretly with Mr. Obama last weekend, to consider as much as $1 trillion in unspecified new revenues as part of an overhaul of tax laws in exchange for an agreement that made substantial spending cuts, including in such social programs as Medicare and Medicaid and Social Security — programs that had been off the table.

White House officials acknowledge the unrest among Democrats. But they argue that Democrats will be in stronger shape politically heading into November 2012 if they help enact a credible deficit reduction deal, allowing them to mount the argument that they protected Medicare from a much more drastic overhaul by Republicans.

[high density]

59. The GOP has had an impressive game:

1. Make yourselves and core constituency very rich with wars and tax cuts
   
2. Ignore deficits/debt until a Democrat is in the White House
   
3. Assert that the deficits and debt generated during step 1 are crippling problems, but instead blame it on Democratic spending, Medicare, and Social Security
   
4. Democrats accept (3) and join you at far crazy right to benefit the same people in (1).
   

[JDPriestly]

75. Obama is setting himself up for a big loss in 2012.

The Republicans have absolutely nothing to lose if Obama is such a fool that he agrees to Medicare and Social Security cuts. We need to find another candidate ------ NOW.

Obama has done nothing but double-cross Democratic voters since his first day in office.

[CakeGrrl]

52. NO. Not the way people THINK it is.

As was said above, this is nothing that the President hasn't mentioned before about general cost control.

But it's too late to stop the madding crowd. They're on a tear.

[roxiejules]

72. When did Obama mention this before?

I missed that...do you happen to have a news link?

Thanks!

[CakeGrrl]

86. He mentioned opportunities for cost reduction the 2011 SOTU:

(snip)

The bipartisan fiscal commission I created last year made this crystal clear. I don’t agree with all their proposals, but they made important progress. And their conclusion is that the only way to tackle our deficit is to cut excessive spending wherever we find it –- in domestic spending, defense spending, health care spending, and spending through tax breaks and loopholes. (Applause.)

This means further reducing health care costs, including programs like Medicare and Medicaid, which are the single biggest contributor to our long-term deficit. The health insurance law we passed last year will slow these rising costs, which is part of the reason that nonpartisan economists have said that repealing the health care law would add a quarter of a trillion dollars to our deficit. Still, I’m willing to look at other ideas to bring down costs, including one that Republicans suggested last year -- medical malpractice reform to rein in frivolous lawsuits. (Applause.)

To put us on solid ground, we should also find a bipartisan solution to strengthen Social Security for future generations. (Applause.) We must do it without putting at risk current retirees, the most vulnerable, or people with disabilities; without slashing benefits for future generations; and without subjecting Americans’ guaranteed retirement income to the whims of the stock market. (Applause.)

And if we truly care about our deficit, we simply can’t afford a permanent extension of the tax cuts for the wealthiest 2 percent of Americans. (Applause.) Before we take money away from our schools or scholarships away from our students, we should ask millionaires to give up their tax break. It’s not a matter of punishing their success. It’s about promoting America’s success. (Applause.)

(snip)

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/01/25/remarks-president-state-union-address

It's about reducing costs WITHIN the programs, not doing away with the programs.

[JDPriestly]

76. Obama never mentioned changing the way that the cost of living

index is figured in order to cheat Social Security recipients out of their fair benefits.

He is making it very difficult for Democratic voters to vote for him.


If he wants Republicans to win, he sure is doing a great job of it.

[Bluenorthwest]

22. Primary him. He is so replacable with an actual Democrat.

He has offered nothing of value as a leader at all.

[julian09]

35. He has gun pointed at his head by 84 repugs who won't budge

on taxes. He doesn't want his legacy to be the president under whose watch, the world economy crashed. Blaming the republicans would not change that fact.
He can however warn the Gop that he would veto any bill that does not contain revenue increases; by doing away with tax breaks for oil, ethanol, hedge funds.
He has the american people on his side on that, he has to make the veto threat to show he means it.

[JDPriestly]

77. Nonsense. He hasn't played his cards well at all.

He didn't have to surround himself with conservatives like Geithner and Bernanke. He chose a right-wing cabinet, a banker's dream.

Obama has encouraged the right by not standing up to them, by always giving in. It's awful.

And Social Security recipients will pay the price while he enjoys his life of luxury in the White House.

May I remind DUers that Geithner was Pete Peterson's pick to head the New York Fed. Obama was a wolf in sheep's clothing from the very beginning -- a fraud. The whole point of his presidency and his economic policies has been the destruction of Social Security and Medicare. Why else would he appoint a Pete Peterson pick for Secretary of Treasury. Bankrupting Social Security and Medicare have been the goals of Pete Peterson for a long time. In fact Pete Peterson is obsessed with robbing the treasury of the FICA taxes the baby boomers entrusted as their savings with the US government.

Obviously, Obama's bread is buttered by the anti-Social-Security crowd.

[CakeGrrl]

44. Well, go get started!

If he's so easily replaceable, it should be a fun effort for you to undertake.

:hi:

[CakeGrrl]

84. Nothing that you're willing to recognize, but that doens't make it "nothing"

To paraphrase the President, you're entitled to your opinion, but you're not entitled to your version of the facts.

[Bluenorthwest]

177. Negotiates so poorly he would starve to death in real business.

He folds like a road map. He caves in advance. Sorry if it bothers you but there are many things about him I reject, such as the 'straights are special and sanctified' nonsense. I am not opposed to any minority having full rights, he is. I will never agree with cutting benefits and oppressing minorities. Sorry if that is too liberal for your tastes. Try not to let it fester.

[checks-n-balances]

23. Folded like a cheap card table.

“These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”

What complete and utter bullshit!!
:wtf::mad:

[DJ13]

34. “These moments come along at most once a decade."

So we have three "moments" (30+ YEARS) before anything really needs doing.

Whats the rush Mr. President?

[AlbertCat]

24. Say wha'????

“Obviously, there will be some Democrats who don’t believe we need to do entitlement reform. But there seems to be some hunger to do something of some significance,” said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking. “These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”


Does anyone know what this means? Sounds like word salad to me.

So... it's a momentous occasion to do something significant, is it. ?

I know! Put the money "borrowed" from SS back, using the old timey 20th Century tax rates left after the Bush tax cuts are gone and a reduction is theatres of war!

That wasn't so hard or complicated.

[Divine Discontent]

26. once again, as I stated in the other story from the other day that didn't have any specifics about

cuts to social services and entitlements - there will be no specifics - as I believe these press releases are designed to garner how much of a reaction it gets - let's put it out there rather clearly - - - - - - -



CUT SOCIAL SECURITY, MEDICARE AND MEDICAID BENEFITS FOR THE "PEOPLE" (MEANING NON-RICH) AND WATCH AS A GOP SCUMBAG WINS THE PRESIDENCY - BECAUSE I KNOW DOZENS OF PEOPLE CLOSE IN MY LIFE, ALL BUT TWO ARE DEMS - AND NONE OF THEM, NOT ONE, ARE PLEASED WITH THE CAPITULATIONS.



"Shit!" is right. The rich have seen their personal wealth balloon, their tax burden drop drastically over the past 30 years, and corporations are doin' as they please and some are paying zilch in taxes, all while a trillion is wasted on moving soldiers on the Risk© board, and the environment is poisoned, which will poison us... did I miss anything?


"The fiscal good has to outweigh the pain", I think that may be the dirtiest and weakest bullshit I've heard in a while from a "Democrat". How about we jack up the taxes on the wealthy to 40%, or how about 70% like under President Nixon? There's some fairness, because if you take much more from the "people", there's gonna be extreme dissent in this country. Let's make sure their "eyes" understand the reductions in costs must effect the wealthy almost entirely.

[Scottybeamer70]

27. "in exchange for Republican support".......

sound familiar?

[Divine Discontent]

31. you mean the rethuglican support we didn't get on healthcare? that support? lol

they're nothing but a sickened party that only thinks about obtaining wealth for themselves, even if they don't get it. All the GOPers I know have a vicious hate of President Obama in their hearts, I've witnessed in their eyes, they cannot believe I voted for him, and it PAINS me when he has capitulated by giving them immediate concessions to get something back - they sure as hell don't do that. They gotta love our President, because they were on life support when he got in, and somehow, they're relevant after W nearly destroyed this country.... nice!

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[neoralme]

41. If he does this, he will be regarded as the worst Democratic

president in history, and maybe the worst president in history period.

[KoKo]

30. Oh...it's the WAPO...like Salon, NYT, Firedoglake, TPM, Global Research & other sites...It Lies...

Right? :eyes: Of course this is just lies and propaganda. Obama would never do this. WaPo is just now another Left Wing Betrayer of this President. They've always been liars.

[roxiejules]

32. How much would you lose in benefits if President Obama makes a deal with GOP to cut SS?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rj-eskow/how-much-would-a-white-ho_b_891655.html

The average retired woman receives $890 in Social Security benefits, so the "chained CPI" cut would slash her benefits by almost $500 by the time she's 80. Here's how the cuts work out overall: By the age of 75, benefits would be cut by nearly 4 percent. By 85 that figure would be 6.5 percent, and by 95 it would be 9.2 percent. It gets much worse for younger people, because the effect is cumulative.

Why would the president and his team agree to a cut like this? That gets into the realm of speculation. But there's a naive calculus, expressed by Kevin Drum and others, that a deal now would "take Social Security off the table for a long, long time." Is that your impression of how today's Republicans operate? Deals are made to be broken, and if they invent a phony "crisis" over morning coffee it'll be reported as fact by dinnertime.

[Divine Discontent]

38. any cuts are an attack on life, so I don't agree with "keeping it off the table" later by

capitulating a few percentage progressively. I think it opens the floodgates to further entitlement cuts, because they know they can get it done. FDR would be all over the Administration to not cave - I pray they do not give up much at all, except from the rich. It hasn't occurred so I'm hoping for the best.

[high density]

62. What the heck is Kevin Drum talking about, a "Long, long time?"

We were told in 2008 that the Bush tax cuts for the rich wouldn't be renewed. Until they had to be renewed so that Republicans would accept extensions for unemployment benefits. Nothing is off the table with these insane people.

[Amonester]

66. Does that mean they want to cut 75-85+ old people who struggle...

paying for their food and prescriptions to the point they must choose which ones they will neglect?

Does that mean the rich DLC contributors will still get the millions more (they don't need) next year?

Damn.

[JDPriestly]

79. Does that meant that the middle-class seniors -- who are not indigent

will have to spend down the money they would leave their children while the multi-millionaires leave their fortunes to their heirs without paying estate taxes?

This is a big step toward finishing off the middle class. Ordinary people work and save so that they can leave a small amount of money to their children when they die. And these cuts to Social Security will end that practice. Being able to leave something, however small, for your children upon your death is an important part of the so-called "American Dream." The wealthy want to eat the small savings of the middle class and then starve the very poor.

[Oldenuff]

37. This is the sickest thing I have heard...

and IF it is true,then it the most foul thing that could possibly be done,and I will never trust a "Caveocrat" again.Not that they all cave by any means,but too many of them do.



and I would have to agree with the poster that suggested a 3rd party vote.With only 2 parties,there is often little difference between the 2 in performance.

[HankyDubs]

39. So I guess now there will be apologies from those

on DU who told us that he wouldn't do this. I knew I would be right about this, but that's not much comfort right now.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[QC]

67. e. They are attacking everything that moves in the general discussion forums.

People aren't as willing to take it as in the past, though.

[brooklynite]

42. You don't mind if I wait for Obama to actually MAKE a proposal, do you?

I thought it might add some perspective to the discussion.

[Tx4obama]

48. +100. n/t

[HankyDubs]

54. "There seems to be a hunger..."

As part of his pitch, Obama is proposing significant reductions in Medicare spending and for the first time is offering to tackle the rising cost of Social Security, according to people in both parties with knowledge of the proposal. The move marks a major shift for the White House and could present a direct challenge to Democratic lawmakers who have vowed to protect health and retirement benefits from the assault on government spending.

“Obviously, there will be some Democrats who don’t believe we need to do entitlement reform. But there seems to be some hunger to do something of some significance,” said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking. “These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”

[eilen]

56. Did you throw up in your mouth after reading that too? nt

[Name removed]

70. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[eilen]

55. We will hold our "I told you so's" until then

just like we did with the stimulus, public option, Iraq, gay marriage, support for public labor unions, foreclosures, the tax cuts.....

Gosh, does everyone else here left of Nixon feel like they live in a bell jar?

[peace4ever]

69. as long as you don't mind us applying pressure before the die is cast

the only time to be effective, btw.

[russspeakeasy]

51. How I wish I could say, " I'm surprised".

[kestrel91316]

61. He just offered to throw us all under the bus. He can no longer count on my vote.

[Name removed]

65. Deleted message

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[roxiejules]

71. Touch Social Security, End Your Public Career

http://www.usalone.com/cgi-bin/oen.cgi?qnum=11479

[JDPriestly]

73. Well, well, well. There you go. Just as I predicted.

Traitor. Lots of money for wars. Billions a week -- but not enough to repay the loans that millions of low-income workers made to the US government.

Obama is shameless, just shameless. When can we get a really good president.

[CakeGrrl]

85. Wait...did something actually OCCUR to support your prediction? -nt

[JDPriestly]

181. Yes. Obama made a threatening, ugly speech in which

he said that Social Security and Medicare are on the table. That is what the word "entitlements" means.

[Ozymanithrax]

78. I will not vote for a Democrat that cuts Social Security or Medicare...

If this passes, I will not vote for any Democrat, be it President or Dog Catcher.

I will support a party that stands behind the middle class.

[21st Century FDR]

80. The words of the last decent Republican president come to mind here

"Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes that you can do these things. Among them are a few Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or businessman from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid." - President Dwight D. Eisenhower 11/8/54

Ike was a personal friend of Prescott Bush and other members of his Crime Family, but he saw much of their agenda for what it was, as evidenced here and in his final speech as President, regarding the military industrial complex.

Ike thought it was his own party that was in danger of political suicide. I'm sure where ever he is now, he's probably choking on the irony that a supposed Democratic President and Senate are going to be the ones to do it.

[Safetykitten]

81. That big fat crow is getting ready to be served. We should know in relatively short time at this...

pace on when to serve it.

[CakeGrrl]

83. Don't bother. You won't have the chance. -nt

[BklnDem75]

82. 'said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking'

Wow! And people actually believe this tripe?

[Ice Number Nine]

87. thank for the anonymous drivel, it's been so accurate in the past.

[Cali_Democrat]

92. In debt talks, Obama offers Social Security cuts

In debt talks, Obama offers Social Security cuts
By Lori Montgomery, Wednesday, July 6, 6:38 PM

President Obama is pressing congressional leaders to consider a far-reaching debt-reduction plan that would force Democrats to accept major changes to Social Security and Medicare in exchange for Republican support for fresh tax revenue.

At a meeting with top House and Senate leaders set for Thursday morning, Obama plans to argue that a rare consensus has emerged about the size and scope of the nation’s budget problems and that policymakers should seize the moment to take dramatic action.

As part of his pitch, Obama is proposing significant reductions in Medicare spending and for the first time is offering to tackle the rising cost of Social Security, according to people in both parties with knowledge of the proposal. The move marks a major shift for the White House and could present a direct challenge to Democratic lawmakers who have vowed to protect health and retirement benefits from the assault on government spending.

“Obviously, there will be some Democrats who don’t believe we need to do entitlement reform. But there seems to be some hunger to do something of some significance,” said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking. “These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”

Read more...http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/in-debt-talks-obama-offers-social-security-cuts/2011/07/06/gIQA2sFO1H_story.html

[Mojambo]

93. If true...

Fuck.This.Guy.

[Name removed]

164. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
here] to review the message board rules.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

94. Goddamn it, he's not listening to the people.

Most of us do NOT want Social Security or Medicare touched.

He has no right to do this.

[Honeycombe8]

142. Why do you assume a Republican-biased business sec. is right about something...

that Obama would be doing behind closed doors?

Consider the source. It MIGHT be true. Or it MIGHT be a Republican feed to get the public angry with Obama, since this is a Republican biased news source.

Best to wait and see if this appears in an objective news source.

[hulka38]

151. Why kid yourself?

[vaberella]

152. Did you read the article?! Does no one read anything past the headline anymore? n/t

[boppers]

160. Do you want the cap on annual SS contribution amounts increased?

Do you want means testing on SS?
Changes on means testing on Medicare?
Increased fraud detection/prevention on both?

Most people DO want changes. It's *what* changes that are the sticky parts. Nobody's arguing that both are currently perfect and should never be touched again in any way.

[Mimosa]

162. You're right. NO DEM has the right to dismantle the new deal. n/t

[Ice Number Nine]

168. You're not listening to Obama. Apparently anonymous is a good enough source.

[DJ13]

95. If he does this HE will forever be known as the DEMOCRAT that damaged the New Deal

He might as well start packing in late 2012.

[bluestateguy]

96. Sounds pretty vague and unspecific and chock full of anonymous sources

So I am going to dismiss this.

[Hippo_Tron]

116. Yea, at worst it sounds like a trial balloon.

The White House reads polls and they know that people don't want to cut entitlements. They may in the end compromise and give in to some Republican demands for cuts in Social Security and Medicare, but I would be surprised if they plan to go around championing it to other Democrats. In the end if they do concede to cuts they will downplay it, not play it up.

[dflprincess]

97. "there seems to be some hunger to do something of some significance"

:wtf: I suppose you could say that destroying what remains of the New Deal is "doing something of significance".

Cut Social Security and there will be plenty of hunger. Not that Obama or most Members of Congress care about that - their retirements are secure.

[FreakinDJ]

98. "I had a Dream" just died today

[CakeGrrl]

128. Really? What happened today?

[Name removed]

99. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jefferson_dem]

108. The "Blue Link Brigade"?

:shrug:

[rug]

111. Eliminate the middleman.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room

[Name removed]

135. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cali_Democrat]

100. ***EVERYONE BE SURE TO SIGN BERNIES LETTER****

It's not too late....

http://sanders.senate.gov/petition/?uid=c1fd7f9b-abd8-4e7a-a370-1867881259d8

[opiate69]

104. Signed

[flamingdem]

106. yes nt

[TheDebbieDee]

101. I will never vote republican - it will never be in my best interest.

But I am well past sick of President O playing doormat for these lame-assed repukes..........

For crap's sake, grow a spine, Mr. President!

[dflprincess]

132. I won't vote for Republicans either

and that includes the ones who put "D" after their name.

[high density]

102. Am I still in America?

Our government is hijacked by people who only want it to serve the rich.

“These moments come along at most once a decade. And it would be a real mistake if we let it pass us by.”

Actually, it seems these moments to fuck the middle class and poor are becoming quite regular, and both political parties seem to be very excited over the idea.

The administration argues that lawmakers would also get an important victory to sell to voters in 2012. “The fiscal good has to outweigh the pain,” said a Democratic official familiar with the discussions.

Victory?! What planet are these idiots on? Not a single voter is going to care that the deficit was cut, at least not the ones that are possibly going to vote for Obama.

[jefferson_dem]

103. Ruh Roh...

:hide:

I'll await the nitty gritty details before passing judgement. :)

[flamingdem]

105. I think they needed to get the nit and grit out fast to avoid assumption jumping parties nt

[high density]

117. I'm sure it's just The Prez playing 59238-dimension chess with the GOP

Obama: Hey Republicans, I see your insanity of absolutely no tax increases and raise it with cuts to Medicare and Social Security. Take that!

GOP: No, it still raises taxes so we can't accept this plan.

Obama: Hey, look at how crazy and unwilling to compromise the Republicans are!

Me: Yeah, I already know they are very crazy, thanks much. Let's stop trying to meet the crazy half-way, because half crazy is still crazy.

[CakeGrrl]

123. Exactly.

I just read this elsewhere and am not surprised how it showed up here, with all the flame-baitiest parts appropriately emphasized.

Cue a fresh new round of knife-sharpening, "It's time to primary Obama" pre-outrage.

Again.

I have a feeling this is not going to be the doomsday development people are already twisting themselves up over.

[bhikkhu]

107. Reagan led the most recent SS modifications

...back in the 80's when some slight demographic shifts were suggesting problems in the program's funding, long-term. Back then, they simply raised the payroll tax up a bit, if I remember right. I have heard that what is being discussed now is possible phasing in a two or three year later retirement - for workers who will be retiring beginning around 2075.

That sort of thing. All the angst and panic is entirely misplaced, imho, and just a local version here of Obama Derangement Syndrom.

[zalinda]

165. Adding a few years on to retirement may be

fine for people who work in an office, but people who do physical labor, are pretty much running on fumes when they are 65. Telling they have to work longer, or get less money.......how is that NOT fucking the poor.

zalinda

[MichDem10]

109. The Capitulator and Chief

Holy crap!! Who is advising this guy! How did we elect such a wimp!!?

[FrenchieCat]

110. The headlines say Social Security "Cuts", but the article doesn't.....

so would raising the cap on Social Security also fit into the one phrase that speaks of Social Security within the entire article? "is offering to tackle the rising cost of Social Security"? or would it not? I think it could...which is why folks saying "fuck him", etc.....want to say that, no matter the facts or lackthereof.

[jefferson_dem]

112. Who cares!11!!!!11

No time for rationality. Must.Wig.Out.!

[FrenchieCat]

119. It only shows that people seek the worse of any scenario........

And of course, the WAPO is only more than willing to oblige.....the headliner writers, that is.

Our Activists Warriors are obviously quick to call names, and must be ultra delicate by nature.....and are constantly searching out ways to become unglued and point the finger. Those are not the kind of folks interested in winning elections, only in winning the "pulled it out of my ass, and it smells" theories. Sad for the country...when facts on both sides are replaced by headline fiction.

In fact, the op shows no critical analysis in posting the negative shit shoved at him by the Corporate media, which appears to be a constant when it comes to this President in particular.

[high density]

131. "Tackling the rising cost of social security"

It seems to me that "tackling rising the cost" of something is typically controlled in one of two ways:

1. Increase the funding of it, to cover the rising costs
2. Cut the outlays so that the costs are lowered

It seems option one is doubtful given the Republicans won't accept any tax increases.

Privately, some congressional Democrats were alarmed by the president’s proposal, which would adjust a formula that uses inflation to determine Social Security payouts.

That sounds like cutting Social Security to me. Is there something else between the lines that I am missing? I realize the article is based on a bunch of anonymous stuff, but this seems typical for this administration and its crazy trial balloons.

[OhioBlue]

115. +1 n/t

[CakeGrrl]

127. But Frenchie, the OP didn't emphasize THAT part!

Only the portions that are sure to get the premature anger all fired up again.

[FrenchieCat]

148. When all you've got is "said a Democratic official familiar with the administration’s thinking"

How far should one get...really?

[woolldog]

113. Well that would be the final straw

As far as I'm concerned. He'd have to be primaried in that case and if that doesn't work there's no chance he's res-elected. What a betrayal of those who elected him. Despicable.

[jefferson_dem]

118. Another "final straw" for you?

:spray:

[FrenchieCat]

120. That's a whole lot of straws for just one person.....

I'd say!

[Name removed]

122. Deleted message

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[jefferson_dem]

124. ...

:hi:

[Name removed]

125. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

129. Deleted message

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[Joe the Revelator]

130. Says a person foaming at the mouth over an unsourced DC rumor.....

[CakeGrrl]

133. What has he DONE, again?

[woolldog]

139. Nothing....yet

which is why I used the subjunctive

[tekisui]

176. Personality over policy. At least they are consistent.

[Bluenorthwest]

145. Bully tactics, personal attacks

Nice.

[CakeGrrl]

147. But calling the President "Captain Capitulation" and

not being sure that he has warm blood in his veins, besides being the "weakest excuse for a President ever"...that's just "holding his feet to the fire", right?

[Bluenorthwest]

175. That is called political speech. It is the reason DU exists.

Personal attacks on other DUers are in fact against the rules, as well as being indicative of a vapid mind with nothing other to add than some schoolyard slam at the other poster. If anyone can not bear to hear political opinion without spewing venom at and about those they do not agree with, that person is not discussing politics, but expressing pure ego.
Ganging up on people to taunt them is what bullies do. As all mature DUers understand.

[Name removed]

149. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[woolldog]

121. Not my final straw....

The base's. Politically it's over if he makes cuts to social security. Folks will just stay home in November like they did in the midterms.

[jefferson_dem]

134. Don't project your ill will onto others.

Sorry. You have zero credibility in terms of being able to say when his "base" has run out of straws. Just the other day, you were remarking about how you may not vote in 2012 and how "presidential" Bachmann is.

[woolldog]

137. It's not a big leap to note that caving on SS

Is going to weaken Obama politically within his own party. It's a no brainer and it's obvious that a lot even on DU are upset about the possibility. If you do t like me noting that or don't approve of my posts, too bad, that's ur problem.

[CakeGrrl]

136. The "base" - the TRUE base - will not stay home in November. -nt

[woolldog]

141. well the "true" base

is shrinking with every cave in by this guy.

[CakeGrrl]

143. No it's not.

The people here who are having conniptions about this SPECULATION are the same who have threatened over and over to abandon him or primary him.

Meanwhile in the outside world, Dem/Liberal approval is a steady 80%.

But stay in "what-if" world if you prefer; I'll evaluate the situation on the ACTUALS.

[Hawkowl]

167. The "TRUE" base is smaller than Nader's

Good luck winning an election with a micro base. Face it. Many famous, powerful politicians have said that any president that messes with the "third rail" is finished.

You can ridicule all the DU'ers you want (which is a great strategy to build support for your guy btw), but Obama won't just lose in 2012, he will be the most reviled Democratic president in history. A truly tragic legacy and epic waste of potential for America's first black president.

[EndElectoral]

114. For the life of me I have no idea what the man is thinking lately.

[FrenchieCat]

126. Breaking News......NEITHER DOES THE WAPO!

[Tx4obama]

157. Touche`. n/t

[vaberella]

154. You didn't read past the article or the stuff in bold, did you?

You might realize that the author actually doesn't have a clue what Obama will do either. People are allowed to hide behind "sources" even if the "sources" don't exist. And it seems many people are quick to believe the shit even when the writer uses language that quickly identifies their stupidity.

[Honeycombe8]

138. DON'T BELIEVE WAPO BUSINESS SECTION RE DEMOCRATS. It's biased.

Do you have a link to an objective news source? If not, this is unreliable. Republicans feed info to WAPO to barf it into the public stream.

[CakeGrrl]

140. Thank you. They love to stir up crap, and it works very well here. -nt

[vaberella]

153. But there are so many Dems helping them stir up crap if the post means anything. n/t

[Bluenorthwest]

146. Is the President unable to communicate?

He just has a Tweet Party. He should be our news source, but he fails to do so.

[OhioBlue]

144. Well... something needs to happen.

There is not one of us on this board that have the answer on how to negotiate with the current crop of Republicans in Congress. The debt ceiling HAS to be raised. Legislation HAS to start moving. Compromises HAVE to be found. This is about governing the Country and not drawing ideological lines in the sand. Saying that Social Security and Medicare CANNOT be touched is the same as the Republicans saying that absolutely no taxes can be raised or tax cuts eliminated.

I don't support drastic changes... but I'm also open minded enough to hear the proposals before I decide. If I hear that we're talking about reducing benefits by a percentage or two or raising the retirement age by 6 months 10 years from now... and this is combined with measures to increase revenue and prevent a default and the stoppage of government checks... well... I'll listen.

I think most of us agree on this board on what should happen... what needs to happen... we need the wealthiest to pay more, increased stimulus spending in the short term, long term fiscal solutions, preservation of entitlement programs, a path toward single payer healthcare, preventative healthcare, healthier population (better food - reduced processed food - more active populace with livable cities,etc.) solutions for global warming, an end to the wars, less defense spending, civil liberties and equal rights, etc.

What many of us can't agree on... or really don't know how to achieve within our current political atmosphere is on how to work toward those goals. If my peers and I have to wait 6 months to retire 20-30 years from now, but we are healthier, there are ample job opportunities, our children and grandchildren have better opportunities, and the Country is on a better path... I'm cool with that. I'm also cool with my SS check being 98% of what it would have been estimated to be instead of letting the Republicans have all the power and eliminate it or slash it to 50%.

My mind is still open on this.

[vaberella]

150. "Obama plans to argue..." You forgot to highlight this part.

How in the hell do they know what Obama is going to argue. What is the source of this article. Lord. There are no facts here....just supposition. Give me facts for god's sakes!

[Name removed]

155. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

156. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[vaberella]

163. My wounds? From what? n/t

[Tx4obama]

158. UNrec. n/t

[thelordofhell]

159. Let's look at the "liberal" press checklist

opinion as news------check
"sources"------------check
wild predictions-----check
word parsing---------check

This is yet another full of shit article that says absolutely nothing that can be substantiated by any credible source.

[Mimosa]

161. Some swore he wouldn't

Tell me he didn't do this.

[BklnDem75]

166. Huge Unrec

[woo me with science]

170. Despicable and disgusting,

and nothing that a Democrat would do.

[DCBob]

171. Misleading headline. I dont see any specifics in the article about cuts.

It sounds more like strategic positioning to pressure the GOPers to make a deal. Much like the budget deal earlier in the spring which Obama negotiated with GOPers that contained program cuts which turned out to be insignificant.

[OwnedByFerrets]

174. You just dont get it do you...you touch SS, you are finished

Period, end of story.

[Thrill]

180. I don't think any Democratic President

would be dumb enough to agree to SS cuts. So I call bullshit on this