OH SHIT: Social Security and Medicare are still on the table?

[Cali_Democrat]

Also, reports that Obama would support raising the retirement age are accurate?

Proposed Social Security, Medicare changes draw fire from AARP and others
July 13, 2011 12:50 PM
By Stephanie Condon

White House officials said yesterday it's still possible that President Obama and congressional leaders could reach a deal to reduce the deficit by as much as $4 trillion over a decade -- meaning cuts to Social Security and Medicare are still on the table.

The potential cuts to the possible entitlement programs have senior and health care advocates sounding out in alarm, while the Democratic and Republican parties are already crafting messages to blame the other side for potentially hurting the programs.

The nonpartisan AARP is spending millions of dollars to launch a television ad nationally and in local markets today, urging Congress and Mr. Obama to take Social Security and Medicare off the table.

...

When asked yesterday whether reports that Mr. Obama would support raising the retirement age were accurate, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said, "A lot of the reporting about what has been under consideration has been accurate."

Read more...http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20079155-503544.html

Damn.

[Jersey Devil]

1. big sigh

again?

[FrenchieCat]

7. Hyperventilating about speculative reports.......? yes, it appears that some of us

want to go back to that.......

After reports about possible cuts to Social Security emerged Thursday, White House spokesman Jay Carney noted that Mr. Obama has previously acknowledged the financial health of the program needs to be strengthened "in a balanced way that preserves the promise of the program and doesn't slash benefits."
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20077452-503544.html?tag=re1.channel

I suggest we keep up the heat about what we prefer by writing letters, faxing them, and making calls to the WH and ALL Congresspersons...whether they be Democrats or Republicans and telling them we want the cap raised as a balanced approach to strengthening Social Security for years to come....instead of handwringing and calling the President names and thinking that might make a difference. :eyes:

[Fire1]

13. Great post, Frenchie!! Thanks. n/t

[monmouth]

18. Many Oscar candidates auditioning Frenchie. Good to see you..n/t

[FrenchieCat]

23. Aye!

:hi:

[Cali_Democrat]

27. Don't forget about signing Bernie's letter to the President

http://sanders.senate.gov/petition/?uid=c1fd7f9b-abd8-4e7a-a370-1867881259d8

:hi:

[Liberalynn]

43. Signed

Thanks for the link.

[Jersey Devil]

32. Thank you very much

Well stated. Frankly I didn't have the energy or the inclination to hash through it again.

[Jakes Progress]

36. Yeah. Keep your mouth shut until after it happens.

Then we can just say to move forward. That worked so well with bushco.

[FrenchieCat]

40. Guess you didn't read my post.....to its end.

but I understand how much some folks hate to read,
so I'm not surprised.

[Jakes Progress]

50. You mean the part where you contradicted yourself?

Yeah, I read that. But I'm used to fan posts that behave as if the president isn't a part of Washington or of Democrats. Fans that blame everyone else for what goes on in the administration and give the man who looks so good in a bathing suit a pass for anything.

You do ahead with your adoration. I'll go ahead and hold my president, for whom I spend hundreds of hours campaigning and for whom I caucused and for whom I voted, accountable for what goes on under his watch. He asked for the job. He begged for the job. So don't tell me not to bother him with complaints when I see him screwing up again.

[mochajava666]

52. Well said

[OwnedByFerrets]

47. I guess we are too stupid to make the calls AND come here and

voice our displeasure that they are even in the discussion??? I have actually done both, ty.

[AtomicKitten]

2. Sure it's possible the GOP will acquiesce to revenue increases but GNorquist has tied their hands.

Of course Pres Obama is going to continue the dance. The GOP have offered the escape hatch vis a vis a clean bill raising the debt ceiling with no cuts, and Pres Obama will accept in due time. In the interim, the dance makes him look like a grown-up and the GOP as hopelessly tethered to GNorquist's no tax increase pledge.

[Safetykitten]

4. Phase II in cave. Well, he HAS to bargain, but don't worry. Tales of HCR.

[AtomicKitten]

10. Uh huh.

[great white snark]

12. My Goddess, when the MSM tells you to jump...

Well, you know.

I think this is more like tales of the cat food commission. So much outrage for what?

[vaberella]

39. This site is overrun with LEMMINGS! n/t

[former9thward]

41. That was not the GOP offer. That was not even MM's offer.

His said cuts.

[AtomicKitten]

45. Yes it was the offer: Suggested cuts "listed" but not voted on nor implemented.

In Yertle McConnell's words:

link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/12/mitch-mcconnell-debt-ceiling-plan_n_896254.html

The bill would require the president to recommend spending cuts -- without revenue-raisers -- in the same amounts of a debt ceiling increase request, although actually passing the cuts would not be necessary to raise the debt limit. "It gives the president 100 percent of the responsibility for increasing the debt limit," Sen. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.) told reporters after the press conference.

The debt limit would be increased three times during Obama's term: First, by $700 billion over the next few weeks, then $900 billion in the fall and another $900 billion in the spring, McConnell said.

"But the bill doesn't guarantee that spending cuts will happen," McConnell said.

"We have become increasingly pessimistic that we will be able to reach an agreement with the only person in America who can sign something into law, and that's the president," he said.

[former9thward]

48. Thank you for the clarification.

I doubt there is GOP votes to pass that however -- at least in the House.

[AtomicKitten]

49. I completely agree.

The GOP is in disarray. I hope there are enough votes to raise the debt ceiling and close this ridiculous conversation down. We need to address jobs, not Kabuki theater.

[CakeGrrl]

3. Unrec for trying to stir up "Outrage Part XXXVI"

This is not a new thing.

No deal has been reached, and NOTHING has been decided.

Apart from that, the "changes" are NOT equivalent to removing benefits, nor have they ever been.

So what makes this so alarming?

Do you really need another alarmist thread based on nothing new? Do you enjoy ginning up the anger when it's died down?

[JoePhilly]

9. Chicken Little would struggle to get a word in edge-wise around here.

Or, as I often say ....

1) DU's Manufactured Outrage Machine runs 24/7.

2) Obama Bad Obama Bad Obama Bad Obama Bad Obama Bad

[Safetykitten]

11. Three weeks from now..."but he had to cut something...you SS buzzkills."

[CakeGrrl]

15. You just really do NOT get it.

Hopefully someday it will sink in. You're obviously beyond listening to what the President has been trying to say.

Willful ignorance will not serve you well.

[Safetykitten]

16. So what is there to get. He cuts SS/MC or not. I say he will. You agree or not?

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Safetykitten]

20. You did not answer the question. But he will not get elected anyway when he cuts SS/MC among the

reasons.

[FrenchieCat]

24. You have said he will not get re-elected BEFORE the rumors were spread

that he "might" cut SS/MC.

In fact, you have been saying this for a long time.
So nothing new from you.

[CakeGrrl]

21. No, he will not cut it. People will still have their benefits.

He HAS said, and I know this is the part you are most likely to ignore, that the program needs to be adjusted for the long term.

He said that in the SOTU and he maintains that stance.

But those of you who can't comprehend the idea that a program can operate inefficiently and CAN benefit from being changed for the better will hold onto the notion that that's equivalent to destroying it.

That's on you if you choose to think that.

[DJ13]

33. Is using a bastardized CPI to reduce COLAs a cut?

To those on SS it WILL be a cut.

[Liberalynn]

44. in the press conference he did actually use the phrase

"trimming benefits" which sounds like a cuts to me, despite the sanatized verbiage. JMHO though. We will just have to wait and see what happens but personally I am hedging my bets by signing petitions, calling Senators, etc. I am telling them to vote no on any benefit "trimming" or whatever you want to call it. Not that anybody is really listening but hey its worth the old college try.

[dennis4868]

31. great point....

Most DUers don't even listen to what Obama has to say because the facts hurt their narrative of him....Obama says that SS is not the cause of the debt problem and he wants to only strengthen it and from that we get DUers and the PL saying Obama wants to cut SS....WTF?

[dennis4868]

30. Ummmm....

this is what DUers do here...make shit up and use the shit to hyperspeculate in the most negative way about Obama....

[vaberella]

38. + Infinity. n/t

[FSogol]

5. Oh Noes! 1!11

:facpalm:

[DJ13]

6. Palin! Bachmann! Romney! Paul! Gingrich!

Insert "do you want them to win?!" here.........

[FrenchieCat]

8. Why?

[Fire1]

14. Sounds like someone is predicting the fall of POTUS. n/t

[DJ13]

17. Nah, he'll win easily

My post was a play on the all too typical retort thats used when someone dares to criticize Obama.

[FrenchieCat]

22. Someone "daring" to criticize this President is what happens 24/7 constantly here at DU....

and far as I'm concerned, those who retort to the truth by reminding those who obviously forget or simply don't care, that working at weakening this President as their primary action of only criticizing everything the Prez ever does over and over again and believing the worse from him at all times, while rarely if ever acknowledging anything he does that is positive (instead ignoring, dismissing, or diminishing those actions) while rarely if ever concentrating on doing real damage to the real enemies of this country; the Republicans--ARE IN FACT CORRECT, that this does nothing but indirectly helps the Right win elections.

It's called the very high pile-on squeeze play (since both sides do it)...and it works,
as proven by the results of the 2010 election.

[treestar]

25. That is the other option

Sneering at it is pretty dumb. Why be so cavalier about the fact the Republicans could win?

Makes a person wonder.

[FrenchieCat]

26. Because some have a similar mentality to that of the Tea Party folks........

Who don't truly care about this country's future.....
only that their very own ideology prevails, even if it means
that things get horribly worse for the most vunerable.

It's personal for them....and they don't care who falls
as long as they get their personal satisfaction of seeing through their #1 goal;
seeing this particular President fail regardless of the fall out that this would
mean to millions....

So a reminder that attacking this President relentlessly might mean
his defeat is much too painful and injurious to their motives,
and so they'd rather see it as an attack.....
because even if true that their actions will help elect Republicans as the result,
they don't want to see it as their goal....
so instead, they keep things tightly compartementalized....in order to avoid seeing
their own culpability.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProSense]

29. The media

searching for a way to keep the outrage going. Here is Carney today

<...>

Q Well, Republicans are saying that they can’t get commitments. I’m not in the room; I don’t know what the truth is. But Republicans are saying that they can’t get commitments. Mitch McConnell said that an administration official, which I believe is Budget Director Jack Lew -- he asked him how much would there be in entitlement cuts next year, and Lew said -- McConnell did not identify him, but it was Lew -- (laughter) -- and Lew said $2 billion, which is --

MR. CARNEY: I don’t -- actually that’s not talking about entitlements. And that is just a false moving of the chains here when we -- you got to compare apples to apples. The President has already committed to significant non-defense discretionary cuts that were embodied in the CR compromises that fulfill the fiscal year funding of 2011. And what the President is seeking and the commitments he’s made in terms of the spending he likes -- he would accept and seeks, in terms of non-defense discretionary spending, to lock in the savings represented from last year, represented in the CR, and to take them even further, and not just to have savings in one year.

But one of the reasons why he wants a big deal is because you can get a medium-size deal or a smaller deal, but that doesn’t deal with your long-term problem. Only a significantly sized deal in the trillions of dollars, between $3-$4 trillion is what we mostly talked about, over 10 to 12 years, that's the only way to really get at the problem of debt-to-GDP ratio -- to bring those costs in line so that we can get our fiscal house in order. That's what the President wants.

And he is willing to cut deeply in discretionary spending, carefully. He's willing to cut significantly in defense spending, if you do it carefully and maintain our national security interests. He's willing to reform entitlements and find savings there. And he's absolutely willing, of course, to make sure that it's balanced and that we find savings in our tax code.

<...>

Savings are not cuts.

[Vattel]

34. Raising the retirement age is a cut.

When asked yesterday whether reports that Mr. Obama would support raising the retirement age were accurate, White House Press Secretary Jay Carney said, "A lot of the reporting about what has been under consideration has been accurate."

[MannyGoldstein]

35. "Reform" = cut. (But not "slash", right?)

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/The-Vote/2011/0707/Briefing-room-word-games-What-s-a-slash-versus-a-cut-in-Social-Security">Briefing room word games: What's a 'slash' versus a 'cut' in Social Security?

So, a reporter asked, what does “slash” mean?

“Haven’t you got, like, a dictionary app on your iPhone?” Carney replied.

Q: Well, it’s a word that you use instead of “cut.”

Carney: “Slash” is, I think, quite clear. It’s slash. It’s like that. (Carney makes a slashing motion with his hand.) It’s a significant whack.

Q: So it means a significant …

Carney: I’m not going to put a numerical figure on it.

Q: So it means a significant cut.

No matter how many times I read this, it cracks me up.

Carney: I think slashing is a pretty sharp, direct …

Q: It’s not the same thing as cutting – the point is, it’s not the same thing as “cut.”

Carney: It’s slash. (Laughter.) And I don’t mean the guitarist. (Laughter.)

Q: A pledge to not slash benefits is not the same thing as a pledge to not cut benefits.

Carney: I’m not – again, we’re talking about a policy enunciated by the president back in January, and that is …

Q: This is a diction you guys have chosen.

Carney: No, no, I get that, and we did choose it, and the president used it. But I’m not here to negotiate the semantics …

Q: Just so everybody understands – just so everybody understands, when you say “slash,” you don’t mean “cut.”

Carney: We have said that to address the long-term solvency of the problem – of the program, because this is not an issue that drives short- or medium-term deficits, that we would look – the president is interested in looking at ways to strengthen the program and enhance its long-term solvency that protects the integrity of the program and doesn’t slash benefits.

Q: Which is not the same thing as not cutting benefits.

[vaberella]

37. You're doing it again..."eye roll." People will go crazy again. n/t

[Liberalynn]

42. Well then Olberman's guest on this last night was partially right

he said sources were telling him even if the McChinless deal is the one that goes through, cuts to Medicare on the supply side would still be included, as well as some potential changes to SS. As I said in previous posts about this I came in late on the interview and missed this guy's name. I think he was a reporter though I am not swearing to that.

Can anyone else who watched Countdown last night fill in the details about the guest who talked with Keith on the debt ceiling?

He, however, did say that the age raise for Medicare eligibilty was off because there were enough members of both parites who were dead set against that. So maybe he was wrong and it was never off the table? :shrug:

Truth be told I don't think anyone knows the hell what is going on including those doing the negotiating.

[vaberella]

46. It's not on the table because reports today said Obama walked out of the room. n/t

[Tarheel_Dem]

51. You get points for sheer tenacity, but that's about all you get.

:rofl: