And another thing... This bill will be a Building Block for the Republicans

[Armstead]

For those who those are looking at the short term, here;s a little thinking ahead for you.

The Democrats push through a mandate for private insurance, and all of the other goodies for the insurance industry.

In the short term, this helps the Republicans immensly. It fits in perfectly with their Corporate Agenda, while the GOP allows the Democrats to get the blame. "See those damn socialist Democrats are forcing you to buy insurance. We tried to stop them."

Meanwhile, the GOP collects their share of the payoffs from big insurance, and gain a defacto victory for "free market" health care, while protesting "Big Glovernment intrusions" in public.


Then when they have a majority sooner or later they are not going to touch those mandates because they will be so embedded, AND they don't want to change them anyway. But they will further build on their "free market" beliefs by removing the few regulations Democrats did put in. "It is unAmerican to restrict the actions of an industry this way."

Heck, they might even eliminate or severely cut back the subsidies as just another form of "Democrat welfare" we can't afford.

Thus the Democrats get the blame while the GOP and their Corporate benefactors reap the rewards.

[Ozymanithrax]

1. Pass the Senate bill. Send it to Conference committee. Approve the Conference report. Sign it.

If it helps the Republicans, so what. The bill will get health coverage for millions who do not have it. If Democrats allow millions of Americans to continue to die without health coverage for political reasons Democrats don't deserve power.

[Armstead]

2. You miss the point

yes do something now. But take out the crap like corporate mandate, AND do the beneficial stuff without that now. That will help people much more, and sooner.

If the Democrats don't have the stomach for real reform now, at least don't hand the GOP a political victory and an ideological advancement for conservatives in the process of applying a band aid.

[Ozymanithrax]

3. Individual Mandates work in Germany, Switzerland, and Japan.

It is one of the two primary tracks used to provide universal or near universal health care, and single payer will not pass in this country at this time.

My biggest complaint is the way they fund it. I think it should be a funded by a tax increase of 1% to 2% on each tax bracket. But I perfer to dosomething for the 50+ million Americans without health care.

[Armstead]

4. They are strongly regulated and/or supported by government

Our bill is a half-assed system that contains the "sticks" of mandates without the "carrots" of actual government involvement in regulating and/or providing healthcoverage.

It is designed to benefit insurance companies, while leaving out the public interest aspects of a truly universal plan. It oputs us at the mercy of a private industry that is known for being basically shitty and abusive.

[brentspeak]

5. Mandates work in those countries because the government pays a giant portion of the coverage

and the private insurers are non-profit and heavily regulated. That's light-years difference compared to a proposed mandate system here where struggling citizens, many of whom are a paycheck away from outright poverty, will be suddenly confronted with the outrageous situation of somehow finding an extra $1,000-$2,000 a MONTH for crappy policies.