ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:01 PM
Original message |
I read, memorized and repeated more Obama "walk scripts" than I care to remember in 2008, and... |
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...nowhere do I remember reading instructions to ridicule, belittle, demean and talk down to a potential supporter who had doubts about the candidate.
Has that changed this time around?
NGU.
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villager
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:04 PM
Response to Original message |
1. Apparently so. You're in for Palin-style snark if you're not *100% on board, no questions asked!* |
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I guess that is a "change" from last time 'round...
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madamesilverspurs
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Sat Sep-03-11 05:39 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
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it's those who support Obama who are no longer welcome at DU. We don't think he's perfect. We do think he's doing a great job in the face of incredible obstruction. We disagree with some of his actions. We admire his restraint in responding to those whose disrespect toward him is appalling. And because we are not *100% on board* with those who find constant fault and nothing else, we are accused of the damndest things, most recently an insinuation that our support is somehow dishonest. How's that for snark?
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Sat Sep-03-11 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #31 |
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Sat Sep-03-11 07:50 PM
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ClassWarrior
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Fri Sep-09-11 12:23 PM
Response to Reply #31 |
55. The people for whom you speak "admire his restraint in responding to those whose disrespect..." |
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"...toward him is appalling?" Then why don't many of those same people model that admirable restraint?
:shrug:
By the way, it's not those people's support that somehow seems dishonest. It's the hostile, divisive tactics that reflect poorly on the President and his campaign that makes one wonder what's their goal.
NGU.
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Arkana
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Mon Sep-05-11 04:22 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
47. No one said you had to be "100% on board". You're strawmanning the fuck |
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out of our argument.
All we asked was that your criticism be constructive and in good faith. You held to that for about two standard minutes, then it was back to bashing Obama for not using Boehner's picture as an Oval Office dartboard.
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ClassWarrior
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Fri Sep-09-11 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #47 |
56. You?? YOU?? Please don't associate ME, the OP with ANY nastiness from EITHER side. |
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Talk about "strawmanning the fuck" out of an argument.
NGU.
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TwilightGardener
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:09 PM
Response to Original message |
2. Who dominates this board? Really, ask yourself that, and look around. Especially in GD. |
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Ask yourself if those who "have doubts" are respectful of those who are supportive. This is silliness.
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
4. So you're saying retaliation is more important than shoring up support? |
TwilightGardener
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
5. I have my lapses, I'm human and I'm a little mean. But in general, I try to |
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defend my position using fact and analysis, not personal attacks.
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Bluenorthwest
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:21 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
6. Rather ask 'who keeps insisting it is about domination and |
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division' and why they would do so? Who characterizes themselves with direct words like supportive while painting others with little "air bunnies" and all? The crap I see posted here is usually not supportive, it is exploitative of the President and of constructed divisions for the sake of simple snark and argument. The politics is often just a facade employed to cover the sniper, who snipes for the sake of sniping. For the sake of using "air quote snark". For the jollies of it. It is, as you might put it, not for Obama but "for Obama". It is for Obama like wanking to a magazine is for the model.
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TwilightGardener
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
7. I'm baffled by much of what you say. But as for the quotation marks-- |
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I don't think many of Obama's detractors here are doubters who can be swayed by any rational argument. Doubt implies being receptive to convincing if one has a good argument. Some folks here don't like him, don't trust him, won't say anything good about him if he showed up at their door with chocolate chip cookies and a glass of milk. It's not really an apt word to use for much of what takes place here.
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
9. That's Camp Wellstone 101: Ignore the hardcores. You'll never convince 'em, you'll... |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 12:35 PM by ClassWarrior
...gin up unnecessary bad mojo and you'll waste valuable time that you could be spending on a fence-sitter.
To bring back an old DU meme, when you see a post by a hardcore, "let it drop."
NGU.
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CakeGrrl
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
14. Exactly. The OP's premise is misleading and skewed. |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 12:58 PM by CakeGrrl
There's a pattern here. While some create their threads to try to appear fair, their bias towards wanting to target a specific group seeps out.
"Obama supporters" are definitely targeted for a lot of these concerned nuggets of 'advice'.
And the ACTUAL desired effect is achieved: Bringing out the crowd to complain, once again, about those who fit the 'profile', so to speak.
Lather, rinse, repeat, repeat, repeat.
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treestar
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:22 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
21. Exactly, they are here to damage him |
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and the Democrats.
They never like anything he does.
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Sat Sep-03-11 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
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Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
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woolldog
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Sat Sep-03-11 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
26. treestar, do you honestly believe |
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anything written on here has the power to hurt Obama? He's the POTUS and he will rise and fall based on what he does, not what's written on some obscure corner of the web. You vastly overestimate the importance of this board.
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TwilightGardener
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Sat Sep-03-11 02:33 PM
Response to Reply #26 |
27. I believe that larger news outlets do use blogs and forums when formulating |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 02:33 PM by TwilightGardener
angles for political reporting, yes. DU might only be a tiny fraction of the sum, but I have no doubt they're reading the blogosphere. Edit to add: it's free and accessible content.
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ClassWarrior
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Sun Sep-04-11 12:24 PM
Response to Reply #21 |
44. Yeah, they're here to damage him from both sides. Some say they'll never vote for him and... |
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...the others say he can do no wrong.
And that generates hostility, which sets good Dems at one another's throats.
Let's cool down the rhetoric, okay?
NGU.
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ClassWarrior
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Mon Sep-05-11 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #44 |
ClassWarrior
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Thu Sep-08-11 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #46 |
Armstead
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:27 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
8. Many are respectful when they are treated with respect |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 12:28 PM by Armstead
Think about it
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
Bluenorthwest
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:12 PM
Response to Original message |
3. I'm thinking that might have been what lost us so many elections |
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in 2010. We won out here, but then we do not do that mean routine. Perhaps the mean team botched it for us? Knock knock. 'Hello, I'm here representing the Democrats and you ain't got shit, you need to stop whining about your pet issues unless you want a Republican in the White House. Thanks for your time. Would you care to donate?'
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Armstead
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:31 PM
Response to Original message |
10. "Oh just shut up and stop whining. You have nowhere else to go." |
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That is the new mantra...Actually the same old mantra that is pulled out whenever a Democrat disappoints.
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
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Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
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treestar
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
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You set the bar too high for the political system we have.
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 03:16 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
Armstead
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Sat Sep-03-11 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
30. If people hadn't tried to raise the bar throughout history.... |
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We'd still be living under feudalism, or absolute monarchies or fascist dictators, etc.
The only way there is ever improvement is when people demand more.
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Armstead
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:31 PM
Response to Original message |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 12:32 PM by Armstead
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ClassWarrior
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Sun Sep-04-11 01:36 AM
Response to Reply #11 |
ClassWarrior
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Sun Sep-04-11 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #41 |
ClassWarrior
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Sun Sep-04-11 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #42 |
sufrommich
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:35 PM
Response to Original message |
12. What do walk scripts have to do with posting on DU? nt |
Ikonoklast
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
16. They get them at other sites. |
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Then come here and poop on Democrats.
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Vincardog
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Sat Sep-03-11 12:52 PM
Response to Original message |
13. Net recommendation: +1 votes (Your vote: +1) |
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:04 PM
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jefferson_dem
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:06 PM
Response to Original message |
18. Please. There's been plenty of ridiculing, belittling, demeaning to go around. |
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Bottom line is this: politically informed partisans such as those on this board should, at this point, have zero doubts about what the right thing to do is next November 6. Should we entertain every outrageous, unsubstantiated smear with reasonable rebuttals...when those slinging the smears are not open to reason to begin with? Of course not. Some should be dismissed for what they are.
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #18 |
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Ignore the hardcores. Use your energy productively for the President.
:shrug:
NGU.
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treestar
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:21 PM
Response to Original message |
20. Message boards are different |
ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #20 |
23. People's feelings aren't. |
ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-10-11 01:10 AM
Response to Reply #23 |
yardwork
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Sat Sep-03-11 02:03 PM
Response to Original message |
25. Actually, I remember being treated that way in 2008. I'm gay. |
QC
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Sat Sep-03-11 07:25 PM
Response to Reply #25 |
33. Yes, gay people had plenty of experience with mockery and scorn in 2008. n/t |
dionysus
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Sat Sep-03-11 07:49 PM
Response to Original message |
34. don't worry, you've had enough practise campaigning against obama here, you're allset for next fall. |
ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 08:44 PM
Response to Reply #34 |
36. Really? I thought I was campaigning against hostility and division. |
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Edited on Sat Sep-03-11 08:45 PM by ClassWarrior
And here all along I thought that supported Obama. Boy, was I wrong.
:rofl:
NGU.
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RetroLounge
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Sat Sep-03-11 09:26 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
37. See what happens when you don't follow the Obama Script? |
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Under the bus, you go!
:hi:
NGU
RL
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ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 09:52 PM
Response to Reply #37 |
38. At least I'm in good company down here. |
yardwork
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Sun Sep-04-11 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
45. You are! Almost the entire Democratic base is down here. |
ClassWarrior
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Mon Sep-05-11 05:04 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
48. Yeah, and we know how to parrr-tayyy!! |
ClassWarrior
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Wed Sep-07-11 09:11 PM
Response to Reply #48 |
MessiahRp
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Sat Sep-10-11 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #37 |
60. This bus is an extended cab 36 wheeler with monster truck tires. |
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I've been under it a long time. It could be worse. At least down here our eyes are open and we're not acting like sheep too blind to see that they are being fucked over. If we all died today, one group of us will at least have died with integrity and truth on our side. The others, well they liked some speeches and talking point lists. The off a cliff at 5mph versus 100mph analogy is perfect IMO.
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ClarkUSA
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Sat Sep-03-11 10:10 PM
Response to Original message |
39. You're not a supporter of Obama, though. You have already said you won't be "campaigning" for him. |
ClassWarrior
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Sat Sep-03-11 11:15 PM
Response to Reply #39 |
40. I support him. But you convinced me there's a higher priority for my energies this time around... |
scheming daemons
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Thu Sep-08-11 03:43 PM
Response to Original message |
51. In other words, "please stop attacking the concern trolls and sock puppets!" |
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They aren't potential supporters of Obama. They are here to spread discontent and FUD.
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ClassWarrior
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Thu Sep-08-11 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #51 |
52. In other words, "Please stop ACTING LIKE concern trolls and sock puppets!" |
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OF COURSE they're here to spread discontent and FUD!! And many supposed Obama supporters are swallowing the bait WHOLE.
PLEASE represent the President with the respect and decorum he deserves.
There are A THOUSAND TIMES AS MANY potential supporters of Obama here as there are trolls. And a thousand times more than that who are looking in and not posting. What kind of image do you want to project on the President and his campaign?
NGU.
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Phx_Dem
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Thu Sep-08-11 04:12 PM
Response to Original message |
53. Do the "instructions" say it's okay to ridicule, belittle and demean the Democractic |
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Edited on Thu Sep-08-11 04:13 PM by Phx_Dem
President and candidate? If it's okay to demean and ridicule him, why would it be "against the rules" to do the same to those who are doing the demeaning?
Another example of double standards and sour grapes from the group that has had nothing decent to say about President Obama since he was elected.
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ClassWarrior
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Thu Sep-08-11 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
54. Who says it's "against the rules?" I just said it's a piss-poor way to re-elect a President. |
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And a President who deserves a hell of a lot more respect than that, to boot.
:shrug:
NGU.
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Ignis
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Fri Sep-09-11 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #53 |
57. Jesus Fucking Christ, how many times does this need to be spelled out? |
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Attacking the policies of an elected public official is in no way morally equivalent to personally attacking another DUer.
:argh:
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ClassWarrior
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Fri Sep-09-11 10:32 PM
Response to Reply #57 |
58. Who said one is worse than the other? |
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All I said was acting an ass to people is not helpful to the President's re-election.
Thank you, by the way, for providing an excellent example of that kind of behavior.
NGU.
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Ignis
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Sun Sep-11-11 03:09 AM
Response to Reply #58 |
61. You're responding to the wrong post. |
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Or you're confused about which post I was responding to. :shrug:
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Sun Sep-11-11 03:35 AM
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BlueIris
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Sun Sep-11-11 05:57 AM
Response to Original message |
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I was repeatedly derided by Obama supporters throughout 2008 for not loving the candidate. The ones I met had no shame about such behavior, either. It happened so often I wondered if it was in a script somewhere.
It was actually quite difficult for me to vote for him, remembering the rude way I was treated--and no, I was not a closet Hillary supporter, "secret Republican" or otherwise disrespectful to him with these supporters (also, I did vote for him, something I now deeply regret doing.)
Supporters' behaviors are always a reflection of the campaign, and by extension, the candidate it represents. Just something to think about, Obama fans.
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mtnsnake
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Sun Sep-11-11 09:04 AM
Response to Original message |
64. You nailed it, Class Warrior |
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and you can tell you nailed it by the reactions. Sometimes the truth is just a little too hard to handle.
:thumbsup:
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yurbud
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Sun Sep-11-11 02:07 PM
Response to Original message |
65. this the DLC way--top down, corporate led governing. We have to be insulted so we |
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forget that in a democracy, we should be listened to.
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