WE CURED AIDS!!!

[Taverner]

Fuck all the bad news, there is one great glowing rock of good news WE FUCKING CURED AIDS!!!!!

Yeah, I know all this research means AIDS really should be called HIV and it was done only in one patient, but WE CURED AIDS!!!!!!


------------------------------------------

I have watched people die of this

It is no way for some one to go

Now we can cure it. I don't care how much it costs or what effects it has WE FUCKING CURED AIDS!!!!!!

[Taverner]

1. Let me add, We=Man

OK, go on with your bizzzzness

[NorthCarolina]

45. Yes, because it was cured in a country that has evil socialized medicine

and that sure as hell isn't America. It's astonishing what mankind can accomplish when greed is taken out of the equation.

[Fire1]

2. Aren't "we" still quibbling about stem cell research? n/t

[Taverner]

3. Fuck "we," there's a bloody cure now!

[Fire1]

8. There may be a cure but it's not HERE, yet. n/t

[Taverner]

11. but...IT EXISTS!!!!

[WiffenPoof]

4. If This Is True...

...it is the best news, indeed.

-PLA

[Taverner]

5. Yes it is

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/14/hiv-cure-berlin-patient_n_796521.html

[zoechen]

6. I have to ask...

I have looked at several different articles but none of them come out and say what type of stem cells were used in the proceedure.

I'm guessing that it was adult stem cells but I don't know for sure. Can someone clear it up?

[Taverner]

7. I have no idea - I am told they are not embryonic tho

[spanone]

9. here's a story found

Stem cell transplant has cured HIV infection in 'Berlin patient', say doctors

Doctors who carried out a stem cell transplant on an HIV-infected man with leukaemia in 2007 say they now believe the man to have been cured of HIV infection as a result of the treatment, which introduced stem cells which happened to be resistant to HIV infection.

The man received bone marrow from a donor who had natural resistance to HIV infection; this was due to a genetic profile which led to the CCR5 co-receptor being absent from his cells. The most common variety of HIV uses CCR5 as its ‘docking station’, attaching to it in order to enter and infect CD4 cells, and people with this mutation are almost completely protected against infection.

The case was first reported at the 2008 Conference on Retroviruses and Opportunistic Infections in Boston, and Berlin doctors subsequently published a detailed case history in the New England Journal of Medicine in February 2009.

They have now published a follow-up report in the journal Blood, arguing that based on the results of extensive tests, “It is reasonable to conclude that cure of HIV infection has been achieved in this patient.”

http://www.aidsmap.com/page/1577949/

[angstlessk]

12. Hope they can reproduce that bone marrow ..cause as I understand it is painful to contribute

Hope this becomes some sort of manufacturing procedure..and not a need to extract bone marrow for each patient

[stray cat]

10. How about if the minority who are naturally resistant can't give away enough stem cells?

[kenny blankenship]

50. Human stem cells can be cultured in vitro - and now they can be cultured cheaply

http://machineslikeus.com/news/growing-human-embryonic-stem-cells-lab

Writing this week (Nov. 14) in the journal Nature Methods, a team led by Laura Kiessling, a UW-Madison professor of chemistry, unveiled an inexpensive system that takes much of the guess work out of culturing the all-purpose cells. "It's a technology that anyone can use," says Kiessling. "It's very simple."

At present, human embryonic stem cells are cultured mostly for use in research settings. And while culture systems have improved over time, scientists still use surfaces that contain mouse cells or mouse proteins to grow batches of human cells, whether embryonic or induced stem cells. Doing so increases the chances of contamination by animal pathogens such as viruses, a serious concern for cells that might be used in therapy.

The new culture system utilizes a synthetic, chemically made substrate of protein fragments, peptides, which have an affinity for binding with stem cells. Used in combination with a defined growth medium, the system devised by the Wisconsin team can culture cells in their undifferentiated states for up to three months and possibly longer. The system, according to the new report, also works for induced pluripotent stem cells, the adult cells genetically reprogrammed to behave like embryonic stem cells.

"The disadvantages of the culture systems commonly used now are that they are undefined – you don't really know what your cells are in contact with – and there is no uniformity, which means there is batch-to-batch variability," Kiessling explains. "The system we've developed is fully defined and inexpensive."

[sakabatou]

13. I'm sorry to rain on the parade

But it really does need to be further studied.

[Taverner]

14. Yeah yeah yeah, study study study but - - - WE CURED AIDS!!!!

:)

[NuclearDem]

15. If they have to raise taxes on me to fund the research I'll do it

Because we're THIS CLOSE to a widespread cure for AIDS!

[sakabatou]

16. I'd give my money to the study

[customerserviceguy]

17. Better give a lot

I have a feeling that this 'cure' is not cheap, and never will be.

[sakabatou]

18. I would, but I really don't have that much (on SSD)

Most of it goes to personal medical stuff.

[customerserviceguy]

21. My point is

Any cure that costs many hundreds of thousands of dollars a person, and cannot be made materially cheaper by mass production, is not really that much of a cure.

[Taverner]

23. Then go cry in your pillow while the rest of us celebrate

[pipi_k]

26. Celebrate what?

One guy has experienced an apparent cure.

Yeah...it's cool to celebrate his good fortune.


But for people to claim that one guy who lives three years with no return of AIDS has been "cured" is, at this point, nothing but wishful thinking.

[sakabatou]

27. This is why I said it needs to be studied

[LanternWaste]

54. if it is not a cure, what is it?

if it is not a cure, what (with both precision of language and relevance to context) is it?

[Taverner]

57. It's a possible cure, but the Cassandra Police want you to be miserable

[pipi_k]

77. Now you get it....

It's a POSSIBLE cure.

Everyone is encouraged by this.

But until there are further studies, it's nowhere near reality. It is not, at this time, a definite cure.

[Warren DeMontague]

19. Good News!

Seriously. Good News.

[pipi_k]

20. Where are you seeing that AIDS has been cured?

The only thing I can find is an online article saying that a man may have been cured of AIDS.


And that the blood transplant he had three years ago appeared to have cured him of AIDS.


Maybe it's just that his AIDS was cured, and AIDS itself...in everyone...has not been?

[Taverner]

22. Aw jeez, stickler police here

No, AIDS was not technically cured, but the Virus that causes it, the HIV virus, was in all likelihood eliminated from one patient in Berlin.

Sorry if that doesn't fit your standards for glee.

[Taverner]

24. Let me add your pillow is a nice place to cry while the rest of us celebrate

[pipi_k]

25. You call it being a "stickler"....

I call it being truthful.

Why would any responsible person want to give possibly false hope to AIDS victims or their friends/family?

Because the title of this thread is "We have cured AIDS"

No. we have NOT cured AIDS.


We haven't even found a "cure" for Cancer, in spite of the fact that a whole lot of people are surviving. All that's happening is that some people are surviving and some are not.


If this procedure is done on a respectable number of people, all of whom die of other causes, then yes...in all likelihood, we probably HAVE cured AIDS.


When that happens, believe me, I will be gleeful.

Until then, I'm very happy for the man who appears to have been "cured" of AIDS.


I'm really sorry you felt the need to be snotty to me just for pointing out the obvious here...

:shrug:

[madmax]

29. Hope is the best thing to have when

one is faced with a death sentence such as AID's, Cancer and the rest.

Don't crush HOPE.

[pipi_k]

36. So it's crushing hope...

to use caution?

I think that the truth...that it's a possible cure for AIDS... would be hope enough until a large number of AIDS victims have the same results.

Then, and only then, would it be responsible to say that we have finally found a legitimate cure for AIDS.

[madmax]

40. Man, you're such a bummer. nt

[pipi_k]

42. Yeah, the truth sucks, doesn't it?

I honestly don't know how people manage to equate "Potential cure" with "definitive, unequivocal, determinate, authoritative CURE!!!!"


They're not even the same.


bummer.

[Taverner]

87. They cured it in one person - that is a cure

It only worked for one person, but it was enough to say 'patient cured'

Yeah, lots of work ahead of us, but it was cured in one person

Anyone who wants to feel bad about that is free to leave the room

[Taverner]

85. Don't listen to the Cassandras - they won't be happy until you're sufficiently sad and frustrated

It goes along with being a Cassandra.

Debbie Downer isn't happy until EVERYBODY'S miserable

Yes, we cured HIV in one guy. Awesome. Let's celebrate and then find a way to cure the other million or so.

Now more than ever, donate to the funds

[La Lioness Priyanka]

43. i am sorry tav, but i think your phrasing of this is irresponsible

and thankfully this level of irresponsibility is just contained within du. what if the msm starting sprouting "aids is cured" in the same way you are? people work their asses of to prevent hiv infections, when it comes to new about hiv/aids you have to be responsible in how you dispense this news.

the way you are currently going on, is HIGHLY irresponsible

[pipi_k]

44. I agree, and for this reason...

if the MSM were to run around spouting off the same thing, it might cause some very naive people to engage in some very dangerous behaviors...such as failing to use protection or being less discriminating in their choice of sexual partners.

Their thinking being, well what the hell...even if I get AIDS...it can be cured.


Not good at all.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

46. i am cautiously optimistic but unless we can actually cure all infected people

this is not the sort of news that should be discusses so flippantly

literally lives are at stake here.

[Taverner]

53. What? You think my celebration is going to stop people from wearing condoms????

What shit are you smoking because I want some

[La Lioness Priyanka]

63. dude, i am not the one with the addictions. so lay off me or implying that i am smoking

anything.

i don't think you understand how difficult it is to convince msm under 30, to consistently wear condoms, so yes, i think if people like you started a misinformation campaign, as you are already doing, it would be detrimental to keeping my community safe.

[Taverner]

67. Um, did you read where I used to teach HIV prevention?

Or did your already painted picture of me being an irresponsible pot smoker decide to leave that out

F U

[La Lioness Priyanka]

69. yeah i read it. do you currently do any hiv prevention amongst msm under 30?

[pipi_k]

73. Of course nobody is going to do that!

But the title of this thread misrepresents reality.

The reality is that a potential cure has been found.

Not absolute. Potential.

Celebrate the potential all you want, but it's irresponsible to claim that a definitive CURE has been found.

If the MSM were to make a claim like that, then it would be just as irresponsible and dangerous, as well.

Because naive people might base their sexual behavior on what they heard on TV, making this whole tragedy of AIDS even worse.

It's bad enough as it is what with the MSM calling it a potential cure, because there are tons of people out there...just like here at DU...who see it as a. cure.

It is NOT a cure. It IS a potential cure.

[Taverner]

88. A cure for one person is a cure

As in 'patient cured'

It didn't potentially cure this guy, it cured him. No more HIV in his body. None. Zip. Zilch.

Thus, we have a cure. One we can now work to cure the other millions who need it.

Lots of work ahead of us, but when you leg heals and they take off the cast they don't call it a 'potential healing'

When you take antibiotics to get rid of a bug, you weren't 'potentially cured'

[underseasurveyor]

28. seems so many are reluctant to realize

What fucking awesome and amazing news this is.
Yes Taverner we finally found a cure for HIV :hug:

I can only imagine the people that have this disease how they must be feeling:bounce: Real hope at last.

[madmax]

30. Next the Big C

:bounce: :party: :bounce:


:hug:

[LisaL]

31. In one man using stem cells from a genetically special person.

Seems like far away from this treatment being available to the masses.

[underseasurveyor]

33. That where these things begin.. with one person.

Then two people, then three and so on and so.
No one is saying that those with HIV can pop into the doctors office tomorrow and be cured but geez today a man was told he was cured of a horrible disease that was going to shorten his life and risk anyone he came in intimate contact with.

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. Why not feel at least a tiny bit of joy and hope for those that suffer with HIV instead of this gloomy down-playing because it's not available to the masses. There was no cure yesterday and today there is.. essentially.

[pipi_k]

37. He's cured...

for now.

I've known lots of people with a certain chronic condition who thought they were "cured" after undergoing some treatment or another. Sometime later they returned (to a particular support group) decidedly UNcured.

And all these people had free and easy access to most of the things that were touted as being "cures".


Nobody is downplaying this because it's unavailable to the masses, although that's a valid concern.

If this "cure" isn't readily available to John Doe down the street, then for him it just may as well not exist at all. I mean, isn't that the truth? How encouraging and hopeful is it for people who need a cure NOW...not three or five years (or more) down the road...


It also needs more than just one person to have been "cured". It needs a whole lot of people, all of whom continue to show no sign of HIV five or ten years later.


I'll admit it's nothing short of amazing, how they did this. But one person...only three years later...using a method that requires a very specific type of donor... I just think it's a bit premature to declare that the whole world should rejoice because we have "found a cure!!"

Try convincing someone who needs a cure now that he should rejoice... For him, this is absolutely meaningless.... :(

[underseasurveyor]

39. I can't agree that it's meaningless because it hasn't been done before.

And now.... finally after what, 30 years.. the first HIV positive person is cured.
Personally I find that milestone nothing short of spectacular and even though it will take more time before "the cure " is available to the many this is the first time that anyone can say HIV has been cured. Real achievement, real hope, and finally a light at the end of a dark tunnel for anyone affected with the disease.

Think about it.... this is the first time you or I can say, HIV/AIDS has been cured.:bounce:

[pipi_k]

41. It has not been "cured"

even the researchers involved in the whole thing aren't claiming that.

They're using caution in saying it's a possible cure, and even then, they've said that it might only have been a cure for that particular man.

Also, and this is very important...

for someone who needs life-saving treatment right now, this is indeed meaningless.


Quite a few people have been "cured" of things without even having treatment...just out of the blue. Or maybe they, or their friends and family prayed really really hard. And lo and behold...

Whatever they had is gone!

So if some random guy claimed that he had been cured of AIDS (and his doctors confirmed it) three years ago merely by praying, would people be running around saying a CURE!!! had been found?

I'll bet the same people calling this a "cure" would probably ridicule the idea of someone praying his disease away even if all other things were equal. Given the danger, complexity, and limited availability of this recent "cure", a person might just as well turn to prayer at this point.

Maybe in a few years the results will back up the "AIDS CURED!!!" claims...but not now. Right now it's only a potential cure.

[underseasurveyor]

49. Doctors believe that an HIV positive man has been cured of the disease

by using stemcells......

Now you or I in the history of this disease have never ever been able to utter those words before. THAT in and of itself is stunning. At least I would have thought so.

Now again no one is saying that the cure will be on the shelves tomorrow but a breakthrough and a milestone has been reached. How can you not think that it's not amazing? Instead you're getting far too ahead of yourself and acting like it's no big deal and it doesn't really matter now because it's still going to take years and on and on.

And wouldn't you say a "potential" cure is better than none? You've never been able to say that before either.

So much debby downer syndrome around here. Take a positive thing and then look for and focus soley on the negatives. I see this breakthrough as a positive... you see the negative.

[pipi_k]

76. First two words in your post title...

"Doctors believe..."


Where does it say "Doctors know"? Nowhere.


I can believe little green men exist. Does that make it fact? Only in my own mind.

OTOH, I know that little brown men exist. That's a fact.

And that's the difference.


Belief vs fact.

[underseasurveyor]

78. yea i know that.

That's how the article put it. But it doesn't, or shouldn't, detract from the breakthrough that appears to be for all intensive purposes a cure for this horrid disease.

What prevents you from feeling at least a tiny bit of joy and hope?

[pipi_k]

79. Why are those of us who are connected to the reality of this

being accused of not being able to feel "a tiny bit of joy and hope"?


Of course we feel joy and hope.


We're just not running around declaring that a definitive and solid cure for AIDS has been found.

One guy. "Cured" by accident, using a method that could have killed him, and is not so easy to do because of the variables involved.


celebrate the potential, by all means. But don't call it a "cure".

[underseasurveyor]

80. Re-read Taverner's OP

See the obvious joy, celebration, hope and relief Tav. expresses that the door has been cracked open. The article does say that this Berlin guy has been cured of HIV/AIDS. It says that. Aside from all the variables this person has been declared cured. That is amazing. So how is it that I am disconnected from the reality of this?

Now let's cut through the crap here. You and I have no idea what Taverner's experiences in life are. This obviously means a great deal to a lot of people and rather than offer a tiny bit of positive anything toward the OP in support regardless of how you see it you'd rather be right and tear down a moment instead of offering Tav some joy. Sad that you couldn't put your own egotistical, righteous, you know for a fact "it's not a cure" aside and for one minute offer up some support... even if that support is followed by your reality. Sad.

[pipi_k]

81. The title of the OP...

plus everything that followed points squarely in the direction of "WE HAVE CURED AIDS!!!"


I can sit here and offer support and joy and every other positive thing for this ONE man who has APPARENTLY been "cured" of AIDS.

What the OP's past experience is doesn't have anything to do with looking at the reality.

This
is
not
a
cure


One man underwent dangerous, and potentially deadly, treatment, enabled only by the fact that one of a small percentage of HIV immune humans donated a part of his immune system after being judged to be a suitable donor.


He is free of HIV. For now.

I'm thrilled for him...I really am. And I hope the treatment was successful. And I hope that more tests are done and more humans have the same results.

Until that happens, this is NOT a cure. It's merely a discovery with lots of great potential.

[underseasurveyor]

94. Not surprised you missed it yet again.

I don't know why you take such joy on taking a big smelly dump on someone celebrating a milestone and a major breakthrough for humankind. A person, a fellow DUer that for whatever his personal reasons was overjoyed when he heard a man, a human being was cured of his HIV. Obviously the potential ramifications of this escapes you.

There was a time on DU when we supported one another even when we disagreed and we could discuss rationally the finer points instead of simply shitting all over someones post just because they have to be right about everything. As if you are any sort of expert. No different than the pundits sitting on TV expounding about things they don't know jack-diddly about. But they, like you, are sure they do. You must be so proud. Remind me that next time you have a positive or good news OP, if that's possible for you, to come crap all over your parade.

The old DU was a great place and we learned from each other. Before your time.

[derby378]

32. Suck it, stem-cell opponents!

We have a cure. Not merely an induced remission, but an honest-to-Betsy cure. This is a great day for humanity.

[stuntcat]

75. :)

:D

[David Zephyr]

34. K&R.

Too many funerals, too many broken hearts, too many memories that eat at me still.

I want to believe this news.

And, Taverner, it was only in one patient, but I'm with you because all change starts with only one person.

K&R.

[bluestateguy]

35. It's a very positive development

But don't the results need to be replicated in repeated numbers of patients before we can waive the victory flag?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

38. no we didn't. we had one case which may have been a cure.

i want to be optimistic, but really science doesnt work off one case.

we didn't cure aids yet. we may have a chance to find a cure. a higher chance than we did last year.

[Taverner]

47. Why such a Cassandra?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

48. because i work in this community tav. and i resent your flippant attitude

and your inability to understand why this discourse is extremely irresponsible.

[Taverner]

51. Jeez - I worked in this community too

I did HIV prevention in Thailand for 2 years

It used to be thought that a cure was impossible, and the best hope would be put into a vaccine.

I am not being flippant, I AM FUCKING OVERJOYED and if you can't step back and realize that - ok, one person was able to get rid of the HIV virus - but this is a first. Yes there is a lot of work to be done, but I am sick of you and all the goddamn Cassandras out there saying "no time for joy, these are not the droids you are looking for, etc"

If you want to sulk, go do it into your pillow please. Because there are those of us here who want to celebrate.

[Taverner]

52. BTW who's side are you really on LP?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

55. wtf is that supposed to mean?

[Taverner]

56. It means what it means

Why are you so upset that I am celebrating this?

I'm sorry, I have a brain, so that "people will stop using condoms" is recognized for the bullshit it is

[La Lioness Priyanka]

58. because i believe you are being irresponsible. and people do stop using condoms

its why the hiv rates are not really falling

[Taverner]

64. People aren't wearing condoms because Abstinence only ed doesn't work

It has nothing to do with advances in medicine and you know it

Just go mope in a corner, will ya?

The rest of us "Irresponsible" people plan to party and have a good time.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

68. actually you are wrong. abstinence only ed, doesnt continue on post high school

there has been a spike in hiv rates in the last few years, because its no longer a deadly disease. hiv, is a very very difficult balancing act already, without false beliefs about cures

[Bucky]

60. Man, that question is WAY off base.

Priyanka is giving you a bit of common sense. I think you should say "thank you" rather than casting aspersions on someone you clearly do not know.

[Taverner]

65. Thank you for making bullshit accusations? Hardly

You guys can go mope in the corner now that your favorite disease is getting its ASS kicked

As for me, I'm fucking celebrating

[closeupready]

62. That is SERIOUSLY uncalled-for, esp..if you know ANYTHING about LP.

And I do (as do many other members here) and I think you owe her an apology for implying that, in some way, she is not as hopeful as one can reasonably be about this.

[Taverner]

66. Nope

My question still stands: why is she against us being happy

[closeupready]

70. No, that question is NOT fair. She posted yesterday to the thread in LBN that this is good news.

She has NEVER stated she doesn't want anyone to be happy about this.

[Taverner]

83. Yes. She. Has.

Go read the thread if you disagree

She's mad we're happy, she's mad we think this will lead to a widespread cure, she's mad because we aren't suffering.

Puritanism - the nagging fear that someone, somewhere, might be enjoying themselves.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

91. get over your fucking self. nt

[frustrated_lefty]

72. Here is the problem:

And I'm saying this after having spent a dozen years of my life working in an AIDS research lab. After you run around screaming at every passerby "we've cured AIDS," when it comes to funding research in the area the question becomes "why fund it? It's already been cured." There's already entirely too much political influence in the funding of research, and we really don't need any more knuckle dragging republican congress critters objecting to much needed funding.

While I do think this is a very positive development, and it IS indeed cause for joy, it is also somewhat irresponsible to exaggerate the results.

[Taverner]

84. Aw geez - that's the slippery slope fallacy

Check it out sometime

And there is nothing untrue in my statement

HIV was cured. In one guy.

Now we have to find a way to make it work for everyone.

Big job ahead, but if you don't think this is cause for celebration, then leave the rest of us, who see this as a HUGEHUGEHUGE milestone alone.

[Bucky]

59. I admire your hope, but your perspective might need some fine tuning

Good science depends on replicating results. The unique circumstances involved in this one case seems to not offer much hope for replication.

[Taverner]

89. Even if it only works for 2.5% of the population, that's reason to cheer

I have no idea why so many are so angry at me for rejoicing

[closeupready]

61. It's a very, very, very hopeful development!

I certainly hope they can find a way to cure it in everyone who has HIV. :hi:

[Lucian]

71. Not quite.

One man may have been cured (he may still have an undetectable amount of HIV in his body yet), and he may have had the right mutation of HIV with the right combination of treatment.

We have a long way to go before it's called a cure.

[KansasVoter]

74. Please don't react like this. Unless you know 100% it is true!

[Taverner]

82. What? The news story, widely reported, isn't true?

Look, I know they only cured one guy, and it was complicated, took bone marrow and stem cells, but it was sucessful.

I have never seen such a puritanical reaction as I have with you tearbags.

OK, I'll change my tune

Boo! Scientists were able to cure one guy of HIV - - we love HIV! It should be added to the endangered species list...

[nadinbrzezinski]

86. Good but this was in a civilized place like Germany

the good ol' US of A will not pay attention to this since it did not happen here. And I wish I was kidding.

[SHRED]

90. Now let's work on HCV

[KoKo]

92. Taverner ...if this works out...it's indeed a VERY WONDERFUL THING...

So many have waited so long and had so much hope that a Cure for AID's would be forthcoming.

It's indeed wonderful news in these dark times. It's the RAINBOW in the SKY!

It's GOOD...and makes all of us feel better for this news! :hug: to all.......

[MzShellG]

93. What about Magic Johnson?

Didnt he proclaim to be cured of aids? Whats the deal with him?