Let me explain to you young folk why this SS battle is so important.

[Raven]

While, as a senior, I don't enjoy having a bullseye on my back, my real concern is my children (I include my wonderful DIL) and their children. I have saved for my retirement factoring in my SS benefits. The government sends me a statement every year telling me what I can expect. They do that so I can plan. My savings will allow me to lead a modestly comfortable life in my old age and have money left at the end for my kids and their kids. It may not be a lot of money but it is what I will leave them in addition to memories. I suspect that this is what most middle class seniors are doing. We are not throwing wild extravagant parties or jet setting around the world. We are living quietly, trying to keep our health, volunteering, cutting coupons and hoping to not become a burden on our children. BURDEN ON OUR CHILDREN...there is where this battle really is. If Barak Obama bargains away my SS benefits and messes with my Medicare he will not only screwing me, he will be screwing my kids and, in turn, their kids. The pain will last for generations.

[Faryn Balyncd]

1. K and R

[Harry Callahan]

2. Us youngn's have always known that we will never see a dime from SS.

[sabrina 1]

6. That's only true if the fund is raided. There is enough money in the

fund right now, for the OP's children and for people who are now contributing. The fund has been used as a piggy bank for wars and bailouts for Wall St. Gamblers, and what's happening now is they do not want to have to pay it back.

Anyone who helps them get away with NOT paying it back, cannot call themselves a Democrat.

There are many ways to get that money paid. One is, was I should say, to end the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy. Those ten years of tax cuts cost this country more than 2 trillion dollars. Two more years of them, with no strings attached, such as creating jobs eg, will only add to the deficit.

Creating jobs is the single most important way to ensure that SS will survive well into the future WITH a surplus.

Raising the cap on SS is another way. Why this is so difficult to do, is a mystery.

They want us to think that there will be no SS for us, but that is NOT true, it is a rightwing lie.

The ONLY way that will happen is if WE let them do it.

They've been using that scare tactic for decades, and it has yet to come true. Because there was the Democratic Party to protect it.

It is up to Demcorats again, to fight off Republicans who are doing what they've always done, unsuccessfully.

[spin]

14. The fund already has been raided ...

“The Debt The Government Owes Itself For Raiding Social Security”
By James SchaeferPublished: August 18, 2010 at 6:48 PM

***snip***

Government’s “raiding” of Social Security means that American taxpayers will pay twice to provide the same benefits: first, as FICA taxes paid on earnings, then later as taxes to pay off the $2.5 trillion in Treasury Bonds in the Social Security trust fund.

You and other future taxpayers are going to have to pay tomorrow for the Social Security of tomorrow. The “FICA” you’ve paid to date was really just income tax, used to pay for long-forgotten “government programs”.

Those Social Security trust funds were supposed to be held — literally — “in trust” for America’s citizens. The raiding of that trust fund violates a fiduciary responsibility.
http://weelectedyou.org/2010/08/the-debt-government-owes-itself-for-raiding-social-security/

Remember Al Gore's "lock box"?

Remember Al Gore's Lock Box? Well, It's Baaa-ack!!
Reported by Marie Therese - October 17, 2007

When Al Gore was running for President in 2000, one of the linchpins of his campaign was that he would take the entitlement trust funds and put them in a "lock box," thus preventing Congress from raiding the funds to pay for its pet projects at the expense of future generations. He was routinely ridiculed by the vast right wing noise machine for this idea. With his defeat, the idea of protecting the trust fund went out the window and as we all know, the Republican Congress treated it like a free lunch, eating away at our future in order to avoid raising taxes on the wealthy. Well, now that the damage has been done and the piper has to be paid, click here to see who's rediscovered the "lock box" just in time to make it an issue for the Democrats?

Jim Angle, FOX News' chief Washington correspondent (and the man in the click-through picture above), gave a report on Monday, October 15, 2007, on Special Report that listed all the reasons Al Gore gave in 2000 about the why we needed a "lock box." Gore foresaw the problem and had committed himself to stopping the practicing of borrowing from the trust fund. For this he paid a price by being vilified and derided by the conservative media.

In the past six years, the war in Iraq, a Republican Congress that reduced taxes on the wealthy while dispensing largesse like a drunken sailor and a President who never vetoed a spending bill have bankrupted social security (as Jim Angle admits above). That will leave it to the Democrats to clean up the mess and the baby boomers to pay the price in lowered benefits, a longer wait for their checks and higher taxes for everyone - except the very rich who will move to Dubai so they can't be taxed.
http://www.newshounds.us/2007/10/17/remember_al_gores_lock_box_well_its_baaaack.php

[sabrina 1]

15. Yes, it has but with the understanding and with a guarantee

that it would be paid back. They have now revealed their intentions of not paying it back. And that is simply not acceptable.

[spin]

16. I guess that proves that you can always trust your government ...

as it has your best interests at heart. :sarcasm:

[Harry Callahan]

19. If you believe those receivables are collectible, you have made your leaders smile.

[sabrina 1]

21. If you think this bs you are spouting is going to influence most

people here, you need to know, you are not talking to people who are uninformed.

And, so you know, that is the old Heritage Foundation talking point meant to deceive people. I use more credible sources to understand this issue, I suggest you do the same.

Welcome to DU btw.

[Harry Callahan]

26. Except in the real world, accounting matters.

Illicit bookkeeping eventually catches up those who practice it. Just ask the people of Greece.

[sabrina 1]

28. What you just said is that the US Government is defaulting on

its debt to the American People. The SS fund was invested in US Treasury Bonds. That investment was guaranteed by the full faith and credit of the US Government. If they default on that debt, which they are attempting to do without saying that, their other creditors, China eg, will wonder 'are we next'?

The American people's SS fund investment in Treasury Bonds makes the American people creditors of the US Govt. Just like every other creditor. Illicit bookkeeping at this level is a major crime. A crime NOT committed by the American people.

Rather than attempt to steal more from their creditors/investors, the American people, they will have to start prosecuting the illicit bookkeepers and then they will have to start tightening THEIR belts which they can do by ending their wars and raising taxes on the wealthy and raising the cap on SS amongst other things. What they CANNOT do is force their creditors to pay THEIR debt. That is simply so stupid and so ludicrous it is hard to believe they are even contemplating it, let alone talking out loud about it.

Maybe it's time for the American people to take the Federal Govt. to court to retrieve their money and let the court work out a budget for them starting with cutting the Pentagon budget in half. Their party is over, and no, we the people are not going to pick up their tab.

[Harry Callahan]

30. "What they CANNOT do is force their creditors to pay THEIR debt."

What type of return would an investor enjoy if he or she had to ante up the cost of the investment not once, but twice?

Under unified budgeting, this is essentially what American workers, who are the investors, are required to do. The workers transfer funds in the form of Social Security taxes to the SS trust fund. The SS trust fund then transfers these funds to the Congress, who spend it to buy votes. However, Congress refuses to combine these activities with the general fund, treating them as an off-balance sheet liability.

The CBO reports show that Social Security has $2.6 trillion of assets; however, these assets predominately consist of receivables (T-bonds) from the general fund. However, these receivables aren't collectible unless additional taxes are imposed on the same workers who invested in the SS fund in the first place. In the private sector, people go to jail for employing these types of accounting methods.

Congress must repeal the unified budget act to prevent further looting of the SS trust fund and to report budget deficits correctly. Then they need to find a way of fairly generating $2.6 trillion over the next few years to pay back the American workers.

If they don't, some day soon, this scheme will come crashing down. If you don't believe me, ask the people of Greece.

[Big Blue Marble]

11. If you really mean that, you have fallen for

right wing propaganda designed to divide the younger electorate from the the elders.

If social security and medicare are not here to help sustain your parents, who will? Are you ready
to keep your parents out of the gutter? Raven is right; the hardships fall across the board on all generations
if these programs are unraveled.

[Harry Callahan]

20. I am not arguing that these programs aren't needed...

I'm simply acknowledging the mathematical facts of reality.

[sabrina 1]

22. No, you are arguing for the

theft of the American people's money, and of course, that is simply not acceptable. Nor has it ever been no matter how long it has been tried, and it has been, over and over again.

This will be a fight that no politician is going to want to take on. Unless they don't mind losing their jobs.

[Big Blue Marble]

25. The math that matters is that this is an attempt at the biggest heist in history.

We, the wage earners, have paid in trillions into a trust fund that is to be there for us.
the powers that be have borrowed from this fund to feed their interests without paying taxes.
Now they do not want to pay the money they owe. Imagine how that would work for you if decided
you did not want to pay your debts.

Social Security remains in reasonably good shape for decades if the trust fund is restored. That is, unless Obama and Congress
continue to drain it with reduced FICA taxes. A little tweaking such as raising the cap will insure its long term viability.

The problem with Medicare and Medicaid is is not the programs; it is the health care system that is bankrupting us one
way or another. Go peddle your "facts" elsewhere please.

[hughee99]

13. I 100% agree. I expect that I will pay in my entire life, and

will be "means tested" out by the time I get old enough to collect. At that point, even though I'm retired, I expect I'll be paying some sort of SS related tax on my private retirement investments.

[spin]

17. I'm sure the government is eying all the money in those 401k and IRA accounts ...

and planning ways to get their grubby little paws on that money.

[hughee99]

18. It's too big a pile of money for them not to go after at some point. n/t

[Harry Callahan]

23. Indeed, that is why Congress is contemplating legislation that is intended

to make it more difficult for people to borrow from their 401ks.

They want to ensure that their "take" is as large as it can possibly be.

[blm]

3. Right. On.

^^^^^^^^

[Poll_Blind]

4. Yep.

:thumbsup:

PB

[elehhhhna]

5. might i add that we movin in with they ass when we broke.

[slipslidingaway]

7. knr nt

[eridani]

8. Not to mention that our grandchildren will be trying to pay off massive student loans

--with McJob wages, and with periodic stretches of unemployment being the new normal. How are they supposed to save enough for their retirement without SocSec and Medicare?

[WinkyDink]

9. To be young and have no secure: job; pension; healthcare; S.S.; Medicare. NOW IS THEIR FIGHT.

[Cleita]

10. Exactly Raven. If people factored in what it would

cost them to take care of an aged parent and their medical needs on top of raising children and giving them a start in life, they would be out in the streets today screaming bloody murder.

[BlueIris]

12. This youngun understands why it's important. But I'm not most younguns.

Without being rude to seniors who DID plan, or to those who COULDN'T, let me just say that the enormous amount of time I spend taking care of my parents already will be multiplied by 1,000 if they and others don't get to use SS as a padding. In many ways, my parents already compromise my quality of life. I don't want to wind up losing any more of it, and no senior should have to dump that crap on their kids because the government screwed up. For younguns who don't realize this...I pity you.

[WillyT]

24. HUGE K & R !!! - Thank You !!!

:yourock:

:kick:

[TheKentuckian]

27. How these simple and apparent points aren't seen as easily as the mid-day sun on a clear day I don't

understand.

The idea of letting thieving fucks get away with our decades of investment should make a middle schooler enraged in Hulk like fashion.
I swear some cannot see beyond their own noses.

[Rhiannon12866]

29. Thank you for expressing this so well and so clearly, Raven!

I'm just sorry that I'm too late to recommend your post... :thumbsup: :hi: :kick: