Can buying "union only" hurt startups like Tesla Motors?

[RandySF]

Last time I was back in Detroit, I told a group of friends from the local Democratic organization about the electric cars being designed by Tesla Motors here in the Bay Area. When I quipped about buying one, one friend who is chair of a local Democratic club said "You should buy a car built by union labor". I was stunned a moment not only by the outright rebuke, but also by his robotic tone. I shrugged and we moved to other topics. Since then I thought about what he said. I agree that we should support union labor when at all possible. But Tesla is still a startup and a long way from hiring a full union workforce (though I certainly hope they do so in the future), and I wonder if the sentiment expressed by my friend prevents such startups from ever competing with the Big Three companies of Ford, GM and Chrysler.

[Drale]

1. Aren't Tesla's hand built and super expensive? /nt

[RandySF]

2. They are for now

As I mentioned, it's a startup.

[Drale]

3. Yeah I'm sure the people who build the cars are payed well

and treated well so is there a need for a Union. Or at least from what I know about the company that seems to be what they are about. Is it really necessary to have a Union for sakes of saying that your a Union worker, if you not being treated terribly?

EDIT: I'm not anti-Union, I'm just a realist.

[gateley]

7. Their Roadster is upwards of $100K, but I think their Sedan (which

hasn't seen the light of day, yet) might be comparable in price to the Volt (which won't be "economy", either).

[Doctor Hurt]

4. Don't let anyone control your mind

even if their intentions are good.

[gateley]

5. If I had the $$$, I'd buy a Tesla. I'd like to support it because

they forged ahead with their vision when everyone else was still yammering about hybrids being the future.

Although I wish they had union labor, I'd feel okay buying because it's truly an American company.

Plus, with the cost, I don't think their market will put a dent into Detroit (although I think the Volt may be comparable in $$ to Tesla's sedan). And anyway, Tesla can't churn them out at the rate the auto behemoths can.

But not to worry, union workers - I can't afford Tesla, and probably can't afford any of yours, either.

[Rabrrrrrr]

6. I don't worry about union with high-end, expensive, handmade craftsman-type stuff.

Union for shit that's knocked off an assembly line at breakneck speed, but handmade artisanal stuff doesn't quite need it.

That said, I have no idea how Tesla pays its workers, and as a car company it is definitely more than an artist-collective cranking out art; probably sits in that gray area, though I have a feeling that it is a company that pays its people a pretty good wage.

[Name removed]

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[liberal N proud]

8. I wish I could afford a Tesla

The sedan is going to be an awesome vehicle.

To answer your question, yes it hurts them, but then they could employ union workers if they want that group. I don't think that is what they were aiming for.

[Starry Messenger]

9. The last I heard, they were in talks to rehire the laid-off union NUMMI plant workers.

That was over a year ago. Did that not happen? I can't find a link more recent than this one: http://green.autoblog.com/2010/05/25/musk-says-hiring-ex-nummi-workers-is-top-priority-for-tesla/

[Book Lover]

11. I found a few

From last October: http://articles.sfgate.com/2010-10-02/business/24108248_1_tesla-factory-nummi-factory-nummi-employees

From February: http://www.bizjournals.com/sanfrancisco/blog/2011/02/tesla-is-not-the-new-nummi.html?page=2

[Starry Messenger]

13. Thank you!

I just found this one too. Sounds like they are quite a bit smaller than the NUMMI operation. I can't quite tell who got hired. The last notice on the UAW website said that they were in talks.

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/business&id=7748874

Some of the equipment will be replaced with newer equipment, but one thing is clear -- the Tesla plant when it finally goes in production two years from now will be occupying only about five to 10 percent of the original NUMMI plant.

"This plant was really the one we always hoped we could get but really didn't think we could ever afford," Tesla Motors Founder and CEO Elon Musk said.

The $42 million purchase was helped by a loan from the dept. of energy designed to promote green tech.

Given that they got a loan from the Department of Energy, I wouldn't quite class them as a "start-up". I hope they remember that and are hiring union. Elon Musk is hardly some kid starting out of his garage either.

[LiberalAndProud]

10. Why can't startups be union?

Wouldn't it be possible to work with the UAW to make it possible to compete? Unions have made huge concessions to the Big Three in the past to try to keep them afloat.

[leveymg]

12. Ideally, Tesla workers would own the company and their union dues would help their less fortunate

brothers and sisters who have to work for public companies like the Big Three. Should be the same way with Toyota, BMW and KIA, as well.

One Big Union. No bosses.

[Omaha Steve]

14. Toyota is bank rolling Tesla

Union wages with the UAW are way down. Given those two thoughts, why can't Tesla be unionized?

[Brickbat]

15. Tesla is hardly a "startup." And ETA...

You can always look at buying from one company as "hurting" a different company. But many different things go into a purchase decision, of course. For me, labor does come first. For many other people, it doesn't. It sounds like it did for the person you were talking to. For you, maybe it doesn't.

[RandySF]

16. You could be right

But I often feel that there is a concerted effort on the Left and the Right in Detroit to protect the Big Three at all costs.

[Brickbat]

17. Well geez, can you blame 'em?

I don't.

[RandySF]

20. By all means, I want to see Tesla unionized

And I have good reason to believe it will be if it gets off the ground. It's in the best interests of workers AND consumers to see an American-based alternative to the Big Three, who spend their entire existences snuffing out competition instead of making themselves better than the competition. If I were the UAW, I would see a new company as an opportunity to expand its membership, and I was surprised that my friend did not see it that way.

[aikoaiko]

19. Sometimes the choice is for the greater good.

Buying a Tesla now is in my mind the greater good.

[FLAprogressive]

21. You really should buy a car built by union labor. Screw scab automakers.

[Fearless]

22. You should buy only cars made by American union labor.

It clothes our children and feeds our elderly. It is our only way to balance a system that wants to make as much money for itself and give out as little as it can in paychecks. If everyone only bought union made cars, the auto industry would change pretty quick to keep up. (Like SW Airlines flying WWII Vets to DC to see their memorial only weeks after the baggage fiasco.) It's a tall order, but all journeys begin with the first step.