If the the House digs in... screw 'em

[LuckyTheDog]

If the House shoots down any and all tax increases, then I say SCREW 'EM.

Obama should take Clinton's advice and just raise the debt ceiling and let the courts make the next move. And if the Supreme Court rules against him, Obama should pull and Andrew Jackson and invite the justices to enforce their ruling.

We cannot allow the world economy to go into the crapper to satisfy teabagger notions of ideological purity.

The Congress made the appropriations. They can't refuse to pay for them now.

[The Magistrate]

1. Hear Hear, Sir

[sharp_stick]

2. That would make for some interesting politics

over the next few years.

[spanone]

3. k&r...

[Jazz Ambassador]

4. I'm torn

On the one hand, yeah. Screw 'em.

On the other hand, Obama invoking the 14th amendment will give the GOP exactly what it wants, in 3 ways.

• First, and most obviously, it puts the entire responsibility for raising the debt ceiling on Obama; this will satisfy Wall Street and the teabaggers while throwing gasoline on the flames of their base's Obama hatred.
  
  
• Second, it will allow both Romney and Bachman to turn the deficit ceiling and accompanying increase in debt into the centerpiece issue of 2012, and Obama's only answer -- "hey, I had to do it for our own good" -- won't compete with their, "we tried to keep him from plunging us further into debt, but he just can't stop himself!"
  
  
  
• Third, if he does raise it unilaterally, the House will impeach him. They're already talking about it. And while it will have even less merit than the Clinton impeachment, and will go nowhere with the Dems in charge of the Senate, it certainly won't help him as we head into election season (plus, we have to sit through another impeachment farce).

So I'm torn. I've secretly suspected for a while that the 14th amendment option is exactly what the non-teabagger GOP wants him to do; it plays right into their hands.

[badtoworse]

6. I agree with you, except that...

If he is impeached for refusing to implement a SCOTUS ruling, I believe the Senate would convict him.

[LuckyTheDog]

7. A default would lead to an existential crisis

Seriously. A default easily could end up damaging this country to the point where it comes apart. I think we already are closer to that than anybody wants to face.

In these kinds of situations, presidents need to act boldly -- the way Lincoln did during the Civil War and Roosevelt did after Pearl Harbor. Preserving the union is the first duty of the president. Everything else is details.

[Jazz Ambassador]

9. I agree, but

It seems so, so likely to make Obama a 1-term president and leaves us under the thumb of President Romney/Perry/whoever come 1/2013. I just can't decide if defaulting is actually worse than that.

[EFerrari]

5. I like it. n/t

[kentuck]

8. I like that idea!

Are you advising the PResident?

[deacon]

10. K + R

[Buns_of_Fire]

11. I heard recently (on Rachel, I think) that he can't really invoke the 14th until it's an emergency.

But if it goes that far, it'd be too late anyway -- things would already have started sliding downhill (if they haven't already).

Hell, do it NOW and let the courts sort it out. Unfortunately, the President doesn't seem to be given to "in your face" moves against the nutbaggers in congress.

We are SO screwed...