So in AZ a person with mental illness can own a firearm?

[itsrobert]

And maybe an arsenal. Is that in the Second Amendment too?

[dkf]

1. If undiagnosed, I guess so.

[slackmaster]

2. A person who has been adjudicated as mentally incompentent can't own a firearm in any state

An adjudication by a court of law is required, as it should be.

[blueamy66]

3. Shit, anyone here in AZ

can own a firearm.

It's ridiculous....but we gotta keep those illegals outta our state, dontchaknow?

[Statistical]

33. Completely false statement. AZ is part of United States and thus federal law applies.

Convicted felons, persons with pending charges, mentally adjudicated persons, persons with domestic violence charge, persons not a legal citizen or resident, persons under age of 18, and other are prohibited from owning/purchasing firearms by federal law.

This applies equally to every state and territory of the United States.

[blueamy66]

43. Uh, okay

you keep thinking that way....

How do you breathe with your head in the sand?

on edit: I said "own", not legally buy.....

[aquart]

4. At what point was his medical care good enough to diagnose him?

We are ASSUMING mental illness from his rants and his behavior, but when was he formally diagnosed by a medical professional?

Neither Congress nor our state legislatures believe in dealing with mental health issues.

[ceile]

16. +1

No real diagnosis or help. Put them in jail or on the streets.

[Statistical]

34. +1000. As bad as our physical health system is in this country, the mental health system is 10x

worse.

We need comprehensive mental health reform. Open, free, and public access. We need ability to professionals to more easily and electronically share information/records. We need system in place to catch dangerous persons and block them in NICS. Of course all that takes real work and real money. Passing another stupid and ineffective gun control law is far easier and worth more political points.

[CreekDog]

37. Well the governor of Arizona sought to eliminate the limited guarantee of mental health benefits

I don't know if she succeeded.

[Jamastiene]

45. I have yet to see any links to any sources that have documents

proving he was mentally ill. Most everybody just jumped to the conclusion that he must be mentally ill and it stuck. Now, it is stated as fact, when no links proving it have turned up.

[ZombieHorde]

5. You can not always tell what diseases someone has just by looking at them. nt

[itsrobert]

9. The Armed Forces rejected him for some reason

?

[ZombieHorde]

35. May been because of drug use...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x4690035

[valerief]

6. Ever see a tea party rally? That should answer your question. nt

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

7. Can even be GOVERNOR!!!!!!!!!!

[Kingofalldems]

8. Here they come

:popcorn:

[Tippy]

10. How many will admit the suffer from Mental Ilness?

That is the reason for a complet background check. and somtimes it doesen't show up then.

[AsahinaKimi]

11. Makes you wonder about Sharron Angle...

Does she own a gun? Is she mentally ill?

[aikoaiko]

12. The Federal Law on this issue has gotten more inclusive since the VA TEch shooting

See question 11 f

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473.pdf

Democrats and the NRA worked to improve the reporting mechanisms for people with mental illness. But even the mentally ill still have a right to privacy and due process before denying civil liberties.

[jody]

23. aikoaiko, has federal law gotten more inclusive or has a federal form added interpretation? n/t

[aikoaiko]

26. as I understand it, the NICS Imrpovement Amendments Act of 2007 clarified the definitions & reports

....So that more people who should be caught by NICS actually are. Its still basically mental adjudication and involuntary commitment but see questions 11f.

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473.pdf

Form 4473 used to read as:

"Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective or have you been committed to a mental institution?"

Now it clarifies:

"Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective (which includes a determination by a court, board, commission or other lawful authority that you are a danger to yourself or others or are incompetent to manage your own affairs) or have you been committed to a mental institution?"

[jody]

27. Thanks, I reread 18 USC 922 and did not recognize those changes. n/t

[HockeyMom]

13. Does Arizona require a background check to own a gun?

From a licenses dealer? How about gun shows or private dealers? If no background check is required, how would anyone know if a potential gun owner is a felon or has a mental illness? Honor system?

[RamboLiberal]

18. Yes from a licensed dealer

Murderer bought from Sportsman's Warehouse so he filled out ATF form & had an instant check phoned in.

[aikoaiko]

19. Yes from licensed dealers.

Yes from licensed dealers at gun shows.

There are no legal private dealers (this is a federal crime).

Someone selling from private collections doesn't need to do a background check in AZ.

[oneshooter]

20. Did you go thru a background check at WallMart when you bought your gun? n/t

[HockeyMom]

21. No, I sent my BiPolar daughter

They found out. lol

[Statistical]

29. Federal law requires a background check (which includes dangerous mentally ill persons) for any sale

from a dealer to any person in any state.

[HockeyMom]

39. Dealer?

But what about private dealers, or gun shows?

[RamboLiberal]

14. In most states in this country - not just Arizona

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473.pdf

"Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective (which includes having been adjudicated incompetent to manage your own affairs) or have you ever been committed to a mental institution?"

[Statistical]

30. Actually as a clarification it applies to ALL states and territories in the US. n/t

[Lucian]

15. I wonder if Arizona realizes the Wild West ended in 1920.

It seems that's what they want to go back to.

[Statistical]

31. AZ is no different than any state in this respect. n/t

[jody]

17. Please read and understand 18 USC 922 particularly passages stating "has not been adjudicated as a

mental defective or been committed to a mental institution".

Glad to help you learn about laws that apply to RKBA. :hi:

[muriel_volestrangler]

36. 'Adjudicated' meaning it must be done by an official body, not just a psychiatrist, then

Someone can have been diagnosed with a mental illness by a psychiatrist, and be under treatment for it, but still able to purchase firearms?

[jody]

41. That's my understanding. n/t

[HockeyMom]

40. What my BiPolar daughter has been told in the state of NY

She was hospitalized, treated by a doctor, and on meds. No lawyer has ever been involved because she was admitted and treated voluntarily. She works in Security and has been told she CANNOT carry a gun. She cannot join the police force or join the military because she has a RECORD of her hospitalization for a mental health condition, follow up care, and has been on meds for over 5 years. She has done research on this because she wanted to join the police force. She is bared from anything involving guns because of her mental health diagnosis.

Maybe this is not the case in other states, but apparently it is in the state of NY.

[jody]

42. I cited fed law only, don't know about NY. Perhaps someone else will clarify. n/t

[Heidi]

22. If a person hasn't been legally adjudicated dangerous or incompetent,

what's the problem?

Your line of thinking reinforces some antiquated stereotypes about mental illness.

[smoogatz]

24. I think that the problem is that only a very small percentage

of psychotic people are ever adjudicated dangerous or incompetent--in some states it's dang near impossible, in fact, unless they start foaming at the mouth in front of the judge. I think we might be better served if we got rid of the criminal background checks and screened potential gun owners for psychosis, instead. I'd rather have sane criminals walking around with guns than delusional psychotics, any day.

[Statistical]

32. Well that would be foolish. Your chance of being victim of violent crime is far higher than

your likelihood to be in a mass shooting from a mentally ill person.

The obvious solution is an overhaul and increased funding for our public mental health system.

[Jamastiene]

44. Thank you.

[TheCowsCameHome]

25. Evidently so. n/t

[Statistical]

28. Someone undiagnosed? Of course they can and in any state. No state prohibits undiagnosed persons.

I mean without a diagnosis how exactly would you ID them. It isn't likely mentally ill people have giant M on their forehead.

Of course if he had been found mentally ill and a danger to himself or others he would have been prohibited from purchasing a weapon in AZ or in any state by federal law.

Our mental health system is in shambles. We need a real and comprehensive public mental health system.

[GSLevel9]

38. or if no evidence existed that he WAS mentally ill at the time of the purchase. nt

[old mark]

46. If a person has no violent felony in their background, and have never been diagnosed

with or treated for a mental disease, their backgrouned check will be positive.
He evidently never sought any treatment-he probably does not believe he has the problem-he thinks it is everyone else.


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