What I'm hearing the President SAY...(MD Town Hall)

[brooklynite]

Need to protect Medicare.

Cut Military spending.

Eliminate tax breaks for the wealthy.

We can pass a balanced plan.


But of course, speculation and anonymous reports might be more accurate...

[cyberpj]

1. I know. but it's hard not to think he's back in campaign mode -saying what he knows we want to hear

ya know?

[gateley]

20. But in this instance, with the debt ceiling/deal looming and

in our faces, he's got to act now, no time lag between "I'm going to" and what actually transpires down the road.

[Bandit]

47. All he has to do is follow the Constitution and just raise it.

The Constitution says we can not choose to default...If Congress won't raise the debt ceiling then Obama MUST..

[piratefish08]

51. He said that was NOT an option. His lawyers didn't like the idea.

pesky lawyers.

[cyberpj]

78. Yeah... Why didn't he just put someone in place who would judicate according to his needs, you know,

like Bush.

[gateley]

53. It's obvious he doesn't want to, and no previous President has

had to, but I wonder if that's what he will ultimately do if no deal is reached. And THEN passed by Congress! Tempus fugit, Mr. President!

We'll know soon enough. All of our "should do's" don't get it done. We have to wait and see, and it's driving me crazy. And I venture to guess I'm not the only one. :7

[cyberpj]

79. I'm starting to wonder if he might really do that now that Boner walked out. I also believe it

could be a set up. So this is going to be riveting now.

[CakeGrrl]

34. Then what good would it be for him to be in "campaign mode" if

he was only going to turn around and completely trash this buildup?

Why would he go further on the record saying this in front of the American people if his intent just prior to campaign season is to send the country to hell in a handbasket?

THAT wouldn't make sense, would it?

[Lorien]

44. He's playing his role in the Good Cop/ Bad Cop routine again. It makes perfect

sense in that context.

[Chorophyll]

65. I have to interrupt these proceedings to admire your Moon avatar.

Also, I agree with you. It's hard to know what to think at this point.

(Maybe the Moon knows...)

[cyberpj]

80. Thanks! Are you a fan of The Mighty Boosh? But I thought I changed it yesterday to

my "Cake or Death" sign (in tribute to Eddie Izzard).
When I look that's what I see.
(?)

Hmmmm...

[Chorophyll]

81. I'm a huge Boosh fan, and your avatar looks like the Moon to me.

Weird. Maybe the heat is affecting the DU servers. ;)

...and having said that, once I hit refresh it turned into Cake or Death. So you're all set.

[cyberpj]

83. COOL! I've had that avatar for many months and you're the first Boosh fan I've found!

It IS a capture of Vince as the cream covered moon but I JUST decided to take it down because no one 'got' it.

Doesn't it figure?

So for now, I'll just leave you with a chuckle:

Old Gregg: What do you think of me?
Howard Moon: I don't rightly know, Sir.
Old Gregg: Make an assessment!

[Chorophyll]

84. I think you're a nice... m-modern gentleman?

We'll have to take this off-thread at some point, obviously.

Old Gregg. Some say he's half-man, half-fish. Others say it's more of a 70-30 split. Whatever the percentage, he's one fishy bastard.

[cyberpj]

85. Nah... We can leave it here

and just know that we're both around.

Until we meet again...

:hi:

[Chorophyll]

88. I wasn't Old Gregging on you or anything.

:D Later! :hi:

[readmoreoften]

87. Go back to the moon!

Tony and his paper castle.

[joeybee12]

2. Well, I'm reading what he said in USA Today about how he will

cut medicare and social security....believe what you want to hear.

[lamp_shade]

19. Bullshit! Go back and read it again, will ya? He said NOTHING in that article about cutting

medicare and social security. He said "I'm willing to take on the rising costs of health care programs like Medicare and Medicaid, so we can meet our obligations to an aging population."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/forum/2011-07-21-obama-debt-ceiling-debate_n.htm

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[jtown1123]

31. And what about this sentence?

Some of these cuts would eliminate wasteful spending, weapons we don't need, or fraud and abuse in our health care system. Still, some of the cuts would target worthwhile programs that do a lot of good for our country. They're cuts that some people in my own party aren't too happy about, and frankly, I wouldn't make them if we didn't have so much debt.

[Dawgs]

35. You missed the most important sentence.

"Still, some of the cuts would target worthwhile programs that do a lot of good for our country. They're cuts that some people in my own party aren't too happy about, and frankly, I wouldn't make them if we didn't have so much debt."

[Lorien]

42. SS adds nothing to the debt and he knows it

IF he were a Democrat he would say as much.

[WinkyDink]

36. " I'm willing to cut spending on domestic programs to the lowest level in half a century."

Is this AMBIGUOUS to you??

[Voice for Peace]

3. thank you! nt

[WI_DEM]

Let's see what he works out with Boehner and see if it matches his rhetoric

[tridim]

12. Boner's reaction is your measuring stick?

That's just nuts.

[WI_DEM]

15. No, you don't get what I meant. Let's see what plan Obama works out with Boehner

and see if it really protects Medicare, social Security and has Tax increases. Let's see if it matches what he is saying today.

[SugarShack]

33. Let's see ...let's see....let's seee. Have you not seen enough???

[polmaven]

69. Well, since no deal has been reached yet,

no....I have not seen enough. Enough will be the ACTUAL final deal.

[Enrique]

4. Obama says a lot of things n/t

[Hell Hath No Fury]

5. What he says and what he means/does are often two differant things.

After three years I have learned the devil is in the details with this man.

[FreakinDJ]

6. He just called out the TeaFarty in Congress

for being the obstructionist

[Maru Kitteh]

7. That's what I heard! nt

[WinkyDink]

8. USA Today. Check his own words, re: cuts.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1546164

[gateley]

18. I'm aware of the situation he's in (as far as I can understand

anything looking in from the outside), and agree that we probably have to tweak things that we don't want to have to touch, but I honestly believe that SS/Medicare/Medicaid do NOT have to be included!

[jtown1123]

32. All credible economists that aren't shills for WAll St. say we can't cut these programs

it will devastate our economy...

[EFerrari]

39. He fabricated the situation he's in. This is a fake crisis

manufactured to ram through the recommendation of the anti-Social Security, anti-Medicare cat food commission.

[jtown1123]

41. If he was really on our side, he would keep saying "there is no crisis"

[gateley]

52. He wouldn't be on "my" side - I do think we're facing a crisis.

I don't need to look any further than the prices of gas, food, clothing, the number of people who are unemployed, homeless, hurting. The bottom line on our paychecks. I think there IS a crisis, that we're on the verge of losing the America some of us remember.

[jtown1123]

54. of course there is a jobs crisis...debt crisis? you've got to be kidding me

[gateley]

60. I'll check out those links you gave me before I respond, but

(I can't stop myself) if there weren't a debt crises, would the credit raters be looking at downgrading our rating?

[jtown1123]

63. Those same credit rating agenices gave subprime junk triple A ratings

which caused the mortgage and 401(k) crisis. They really can't be trusted. All you need to see is that other countries have no problem buying our bonds. Debt crisis is a manufactured ploy to cut vital programs.

http://www.cepr.net/index.php/blogs/beat-the-press/credit-rating-agencies-that-rated-subprime-junk-as-investment-grade-warn-us-over-downgrade

[EFerrari]

74. Obama has shown no inclination to deal with that real crisis. n/t

[EFerrari]

73. Yep.

[gateley]

50. I can't agree with that. This isn't the first time we've been faced with

this situation, it seems to be almost a given that a President will raise the debt limit. If not raising it wouldn't be a problem (a la Bachmann) then an earlier President would surely have let us default, don't you think?

And again, I don't understand how he could think that touching any of the Big Three would benefit ANYBODY. It will piss off voters, Dem and Rep, it won't do anything to really address our debt. And I still believe he's basically a good person who DOES care. He, more than almost anybody else in DC understands the importance of Medicare and SS -- and other social programs. It just seems like a lose/lose which is why I'm so baffled that ANY of them are even considering this.

[jtown1123]

56. Hey I really respect your opinion and think you are pretty rational/reasonable

did you read this thread? http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1540315

It pretty much explains where Obama's priorities are when it comes to entitlements. Is he a bad person? Of course not. Does he think he's doing the right thing? Yes. Is it the right thing for our country and for Democrats? No, I cannot agree there.

Here's a pretty good Politico piece from '09 on Obama wanting to trim entitlements: http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=5D876B1F-18FE-70B2-A8D7E6CD29DF7FFF

[gateley]

59. Thanks -- I'll check these out, maybe educate myself a little.

I'd sure like to UNDERSTAND! :hi:

[jtown1123]

61. As do I

It brings me no pleasure to read these. I campaigned, donated and voted for Obama. I should have done more research into his ideas on economic policy before I was so enthusiastic, but I, like so many others, was hungry for change.

[EFerrari]

72. The debt ceiling has nothing to do with our social programs.

An economist laid it out on Amy's show this morning and I put the link here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1548371&mesg_id=1548467

[jtown1123]

75. Rec. If we cut these programs, we'll plunge further into recession I'm afraid.

[EFerrari]

77. Absolutely we will. Taking spending money out of the economy. n/t

[myrna minx]

58. He chose to accept the right wing framing of this made up crisis - it's unforgivable. n/t

[gateley]

9. But I didn't like the vague "I'm going to make cuts I normally

wouldn't be willing to".

I hope he gets some pointed questions. I know he can't give answers about a deal that hasn't even gelled yet, but maybe "What EXACTLY are you looking at in regard to Medicare/SS?"

[CleanGreenFuture]

10. Bookmarked. We'll see if any of that happens.

[Mz Pip]

11. which is why I'm not believing

any rumors. I will be very pissed if the budget contains spending cuts to Medicare and SS along with tax cuts for the rich and corporations. But until that actually happens I'll table my outrage.

[gateley]

23. I was going to say he needs to come out and flatly state that, but

because of the fighting with the Republicans, realistically maybe he shouldn't.

[Mz Pip]

27. It's starting to become

an exercise in reading tea leaves. Everyone seems to have their own insight into what Obama really means.

All of those "a source close to the White House" rumors that get tossed out like they are factual news are either speculation or tactics to stir up the pot so the 24 hour cable guys will have something to blather about.

I'll wait and see what the final proposal is.

[gateley]

38. Me, too. I keep saying we won't know until we know, but I

always get caught up in the drama which is pointless. I become enraged and consumed by something which oftentimes never occurs!

Just yesterday, the NYT referencing "a source close to the negotiations" so I think "well, they must KNOW, maybe s/he was told to say that!" but not 10 minutes later Carney was saying the NYT piece was wrong wrong wrong.

We, as humans, seem to run with the negative and when we hear something that MIGHT transpire we charge on down that path imagining the ramifications. At least THIS human does, far too often. :7

I just really wish they'd get this done so we can either breath a sigh of relief or engage in justifiable outrage! :hi:

[CTyankee]

70. I agree. Can't wait for this to be over.

But I'm not getting into these DU squabbles because, like you, I feel it's rather a waste of time and energy. There'll be plenty of time for comment after something concrete emerges...

[WinkyDink]

45. See Post #9.

[thereismore]

13. His op-ed says the same things. He is not going to allow cuts without revenue. nt

[Lorien]

40. cuts aren't at all necessary and the "revenue" MIGHT come in a years time

when the GOP can find a good enough reason to back peddle on that part of the deal.

Any cuts to social programs will end his Presidency. There are no proposed cuts to military spending; the WH certainly has not proposed any.

[WinkyDink]

48. Unless "the revenue" REPLACES "the cuts," THIS IS CRUEL.

[thereismore]

64. Yes. But somebody voted the repigs into Congress in 2010, and there are consequences.

A lot of people did not vote. There are consequences for that too. Obama is trying to respect the elections of 2010, even though the repigs in Congress do not represent America. I am very frustrated by that, but I understand at some level.

[Donnachaidh]

14. he gives good talk

it's what happens AFTER the cameras are turned off and the doors are closed that worries me -- and should worry everyone else.

[JoePhilly]

55. I thought DU wanted more "bully pulpit"??

Then when he does that ... oh well ... its a good talk, pretty words ... so on.

[Ignis]

67. ...For the right cause, FFS!

Why the hell would any Democrat applaud the use of the bully pulpit to frame the SS debate using the GOP's terms and agenda?

:argh:

[elleng]

16. Thanks!

:thumbsup:

[flamingdem]

17. Someone asking a question called the teaparty in the house "houligans" LOL nt

[EFerrari]

21. Yeah, it's too bad he doesn't govern from the stump. n/t

[blindpig]

24. Talk is cheap and has gotten considerably cheaper

What about SS, he is the guy who put in on the table?

The cuts to the military are primarily on the 'human' side and it is past and current service members who will feel that pain. Procurement is unabated, imperial war still runs amok.

Tax breaks? Mebbe but unlikely and if so surely inconsequential. Bipartisanship is the cover for many sins.

Yes the plan will be balanced on the back of the working class.

When history is our guide we need not speculate.

[mmonk]

25. Might be credible if he left off balanced plan.

[hobbit709]

26. It's like the patter of any decent stage magician.

Watch what he does is the crux of the matter.

[bigwillq]

28. So get it done.

Do it. No excuses.

[obxhead]

29. I hear what the history of the Obama Presidency tells me.

His speeches say one thing, but his actions say another.

I was taught to view a man by his actions, not what he says.

[jtown1123]

30. If protecting Medicare means raising the eligibility age, he is a liar.

Oh, any talk of Social Security? Crickets...

[Lorien]

37. Say one thing, do the opposite. Lather, rinse, repeat as often as necessary

to maintain power.

[Doctor_J]

43. What does "Protect Medicare" mean? And what about SS?

But cutting benefits? Raising the eligibilty age? If he is going to insist on preserving/expanding them, why the fuck won't he say that?

[WinkyDink]

46. No details until he stands at the podium with Boehner and a done deal. PERIOD.

[jtown1123]

57. He won't say because we won't like the answer. Make sure you read this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1540315

[divvy]

49. Citation please ..... show us the proof.

Otherwise, this only a speculative and anonymous report.

[kenny blankenship]

62. He frequently refers to "preserving" & "strengthening" social programs in connection w CUTTING them

This is a lot like how we were "saving" villages in Vietnam.

[Ganja Ninja]

66. Sounds like he's been coached by Frank Luntz. n/t

[LWolf]

68. When he takes credit for the "hard decisions"

that serve Republicans, let me know how well, in the end, any of those supposed goals worked out.

[Blecht]

71. Yes, what he says

is soooo fucking much more important than what he does.

[blkmusclmachine]

76. Say one thing, and then do the exact opposite.

Typical M.O. for the WH.

[freshwest]

82. Oh yeah, but what the RW owned media says is soo much sexier, you know?

[readmoreoften]

86. Sounds like you're hearing what you want to hear.

[rbnyc]

89. I also heard the president say...

...regarding health care reform: "If mandates were the solution, we could solve homelessness­ by mandating everyone buy a house" and that any plan he signs must include a public option.