Details of the Reid plan:

[Tennessee Gal]

Details Of The $2.7 Trillion Senate Democratic Package:

$1.2 Trillion in Discretionary Spending Cuts. The $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts include both defense and non-defense spending. Before Speaker Boehner broke off talks with the White House on Friday, he had already agreed to $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts.

$100 Billion in Mandatory Savings. The proposal includes $100 billion in mandatory savings that were negotiated by Democrats and Republicans participating in the negotiations led by Vice President Biden. These savings will not impact Medicare, Medicaid, or Social Security benefits in any way. The mandatory savings will include:

$40 billion in Program Integrity Savings. The proposal saves $40 billion by reducing fraud and abuse in mandatory programs. This includes: Continuing Disability Reviews and SSI redeterminations, Internal Revenue Service tax enforcement, health care fraud and abuse control, and Unemployment Insurance improper payment reviews.

$30 Billion In Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac Reforms.
$15 Billion In Spectrum Sales
$10 -15 Billion In Agricultural Reforms
Higher Education Program Reforms Whose Savings Go To Sustain The Pell Grant Program

$1 Trillion in Savings From Winding Down the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan will save $1 trillion. Paul Ryan’s budget also included this savings in its deficit reduction calculation, which was supported by 235 House Republicans and 40 Senate Republicans.

$400 Billion in Interest Savings. The package includes $400 billion in interest savings, $220 billion from the discretionary spending cuts and $180 billion from winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Both the Ryan budget and the House Cut, Cap and Balance plan similarly included interest savings in their total calculation.

Establishes Joint Congressional Committee to Find Future Savings. In addition to $2.7 trillion in concrete savings, the Senate package will establish a joint, bipartisan committee, made up of 12 members, to present options for future deficit reduction. The committee’s recommendations will be guaranteed an up-or-down Senate vote, without amendments, by the end of 2011.


http://www.businessinsider.com/reid-introduces-democratic-deficit-plan-2011-7

[DCBob]

1. What's the beef with some here on DU about this plan??

I dont get it.

[Warren Stupidity]

3. super-senate is crap of the first order.

[Tennessee Gal]

5. A bipartisan committee is now a super-senate?

Get real.

[Warren Stupidity]

11. This 'committee' would be empowered to issue 'recommendations'

that would in fact be legislation that cannot be amended and must be subjected to a simple majority vote.

You do not have a problem with that?

[DCBob]

8. why?? Isnt the goal of the super senate simply to get around the extremists?

Isnt that good??

corrected subject.

[Tennessee Gal]

10. The goal is present the Senate with options for reducing spending.

[Warren Stupidity]

34. dictate to, not present.

no amendments, no filibuster.

and the cuts will be to ss and medicare as that is the only way they can get through the senate.

[Tennessee Gal]

36. Since the Senate gets to vote up or down, they have the option of

passing it or not and right now the Senate is controlled by Democrats. And you are assuming where the cuts will come from. You don't know.

[Tennessee Gal]

4. That is why I posted the details.

Better to have the facts than to guess at what it includes or get angry over things that are not in it.

[Name removed]

44. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mmonk]

12. We understand economics and what constitutes bad government.

[Tennessee Gal]

16. No one said you didn't. nt

[mmonk]

26. The question was what the beef was with the plan.

I gave a reply.

[leveymg]

15. You know, $700 billion in domestic program cuts might not seem like a lot of money to you, but . . .

and then there's those little SuperCongress cuts in SS/Med that's supposed to get a vote by the end of the year. We're just going to go through this all over again because Obama insisted upon the Catfood Commish, then the conservative Dems in the Senate revived it, now we're stuck with it.

All this to pay for Bush's tax cuts, which are left intact.

What's not to like?

[Warren Stupidity]

19. oh it is only until the end of 2011 - so don't worry be happy.

what could possibly go wrong?

With this in place we will have to rely on the tealoons over in the house to obstruct this crap.

[Tennessee Gal]

23. This is a Senate committee. Nothing to do with the House.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[leveymg]

35. Unfortunately, that "best hope" is like the hope that Berlin would be saved from the Russians

because the entire Red Army could be expected to drink themselves to death before entering the city.

Quick - Heinz and Gerhardt, brew some more moonshine. Pile the cases on the main roads leading from the East. Schnell.

Last trench humor.

[Tennessee Gal]

37. I am not cheerleading. Nor am I negative.

I am just trying to understand before I jump to unfounded conclusions, which is happening all too frequently here on DU recently.

[Bluenorthwest]

57. A 'joint committe' is comprised of Members of the House and the

Senate in equal numbers, as well as members of both Parties in equal number. The House most certainly does have to do with it, as half the committee members will be from the House, that's 6, and of those, 3 will be House Republicans.
So you are not correct at all.

[Tennessee Gal]

20. What SuperCongress cuts in SS/Med?

What are you talking about?

[leveymg]

30. The same ones that were floated in the WH trial balloon proposals 3-4 weeks ago.

Rejiggering the way that COLAs are calculated, hundreds of billions in cuts in Medicare/aid. We remember, even if some have tactical amnesia.

Basically, the Catfood Commish II.

[Tennessee Gal]

38. You are assuming. nt

[leveymg]

39. I'll buy the whole bar a drink if I'm wrong.

Wanna make a side bet?

Where else are they gonna cut?

[Tennessee Gal]

40. You could be right. You could be wrong. Nobody knows.

I don't bet.

[Bluenorthwest]

59. Good call, not betting. You say the House has nothing to do

with a committee that will have 6 House Members sitting on it, 3 House Republicans. Which 3 House Republicans do you trust, which would you desire to sit on that Committee?

[Tennessee Gal]

60. I thought the committee would be only Senators. I could be wrong.

[Bluenorthwest]

62. 'could be'? What do YOU think the word 'joint' means in

'joint Congressional Committee'? You say you 'thought' but you mean you assumed and did not bother to check before stating that the House is not involved. You took up that talking point to serve your agenda, without regard to voracity. You are telling others they are 'assuming' things, but then you so casually allow yourself to do the same thing.
Joint. Both Houses. Half and Half. 6 on the Committee will be from the House. 3 of them will be Republicans. Which 3 do you trust with this, since you are so in favor of this Joint Committee?

[Bluenorthwest]

65. 30 seconds this took to find....

Definitions for 'joint committee' http://www.answers.com/topic/joint-committee

[Tennessee Gal]

71. Well, excuse me!

It is a joint committee, but only the Senate votes up or down on their recommendations.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

29. That 12-pack of gangbangers right there - the last item listed in the OP?

That's my problem with it.

[DCBob]

45. You could look at that way but others see it as the only solution to deadlocked congress.

[MadHound]

42. Let's start with the fact that it is inherently unfair, and a roll back on the President's and Dem's

Plan for a "balanced approach". So much for balance, this plan has no increase in tax revenue, it is all cuts.

But principle aside, this plan includes massive cuts in discretionary spending, the largest in history. In a fragile economy these cuts will send the economy back into a tailspin. I don't know about you, but I'd prefer not to follow that route.

[DCBob]

43. but a debt downgrade could damage our economy even more... no?

this plan should be enough to keep our AAA rating intact.. for now.

[MadHound]

47. But we don't have to resort to such a plan.

That's the kicker. I imagine that as crunch time comes, at 11pm on Monday night, with no plan in place, some Dem could introduce a clean bill to raise the debt ceiling and it would gain the support of enough sane 'Pugs in the House and Senate to pass.

If all else fails, Obama could invoke the 14th amendment solution which would indeed provoke a Constitutional crisis, but that is far better than either the bad deal that we're getting offered or defaulting. I suspect that the corporately friendly Supreme Court would find such a solution Constitutional and thus, problem solved.

Not to mention the simple fact that in a bit over a month when the budget continuance runs out, we're going to be facing this same hostage taking situation again, much as we faced it last April, and last December. If we don't stand up to these idiot Teabaggers soon, we'll simply die a death by a thousand cuts as they create hostage situation after situation. It would be better to call their bluff now, stand up to them and beat them into the ground now rather than later. If we had stood up to them over the tax cut extension in December and beaten them senseless, we wouldn't be here now.

[DCBob]

49. you dont play chicken with maniacs.. too risky.

[MadHound]

50. When you have a backstop like the 14th Amendment, the risk is all in their court,

Unless Obama doesn't have the courage to take up that option.

[DCBob]

52. I am sure he has the courage but his legal advisor's have told him its illegal..at this point.

you may be right and it may come down to that but that is not the preferable solution.. at the moment.

[kenny blankenship]

54. You are capitulating to maniacs which GUARANTEES they will attack AGAIN.

[DCBob]

64. not capitulate.. you just have to outsmart them.

[Mass]

48. Committee that cannot be amended or filibustered? You wonder what is wrong.

If they can find 51 people to cut SS, it will be done, and with people like Lieberman and Nelson or McCaskill, that is easy to do.

[DCBob]

51. "a majority of a single vote is as sacred as if unanimous."

-- TJ.

[Mass]

53. Good. So say bye bye to social security as we know it.

And it will be even easier because Senators and Congresspeople will be able to hide behind the commission and say "We had to do it. We cannot amend it".

[DCBob]

69. That wont happen. Very few in congress want to demolish social security.

Get real.

[Mass]

72. Get real too. The GOP wants to change entitlements. And it is not to improve it.

Or are you accusing some of our congressmen and senators (democrats, I mean) to be liars when they say the GOP is after the entitlements?

[grahamhgreen]

67. 1) We need the itemized list of this: $1.2 Trillion in Discretionary Spending Cuts

2) Cuts without re-taxing the rich is a Republican plan.

[Warren Stupidity]

2. Catfood commission. We would then have 12 person senate.

This is bullshit.

[erodriguez]

7. Exactly wait until we have a republican majority or a bunch of Blue dog DLCers

and Blammo. There goes SS or medicare without being able to stop it.

[Tennessee Gal]

13. The committee only exists until the end of 2011.

Is there an election this year that will establish a republican majority that I am unaware of?

[erodriguez]

21. We seem to be getting conflicting information

There is no expiration date from the info I got here

http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/61238228

as reported here

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/29/harry-reid-debt-ceiling-bill-mcconnell-cbo_n_913839.html

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[erodriguez]

32. Huh? WTF are you talking about?

[Warren Stupidity]

33. if the super senate extends beyond this term it is even more craven.

sorry if that last post was ambiguous.

[EFerrari]

27. We don't need a body even LESS responsive to voters

to be making policy.

[Tennessee Gal]

9. A committee is not a senate. nt

[Warren Stupidity]

14. In this case it is exactly that: a super senate.

The junior senate would only be allowed to vote their bills up or down, no amendments, no filibuster, majority vote win.

[Tennessee Gal]

18. And which Party has the majority in the Senate?

Democrats.

[Warren Stupidity]

22. Glad you asked: Plutocrats.

your turn.

[kenny blankenship]

66. The same party that turned a Public Option into a Individual Mandate

The Senate is the bastion of elite, corporate power regardless of which party is in control. But you can expect it to get worse with Republicans and they will be back.

[DCBob]

25. and what's wrong with a simple up or down vote?

I hate the filibuster and the hundreds of tacked on unrelated amendments. Congress would operate much better without them... imo.

[Bluenorthwest]

55. But first, make a diffrerent 'Congress' out of bits of the real one

to write the law, run it by the actual Congress for an 'up or down vote'. It is that 'we decided to draw up another form of government' routine that stinks to the heavens. Americans will despise those who set it up. Because it is wrong.

[leveymg]

6. It's the same as the Compromise measure - virtually unchanged from last week.

This is the Compromise as posted at Baucus' website on 07/26: http://baucus.senate.gov/?p=press_release&id=601

What Does the Long-Term Senate Compromise Do?

The long-term solution, unveiled in the Senate yesterday includes $2.7 trillion agreed upon cuts, and allows the U.S. to continue to meet its obligations through 2012. The Senate compromise keeps the promise to seniors and military retires, and does not cut Medicare or Social Security or raise taxes.

* $1.2 Trillion in Discretionary Spending Cuts. The $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts include both defense and non-defense spending. It does not cut Medicare or Social Security.
* $100 Billion in Mandatory Savings. Again these savings keep the promise to seniors and military retirees and do not cut Medicare and Social Security benefits. Savings include:
o $40 billion in cutting out fraud, waste and abuse in programs like unemployment insurance.
o $15 Billion In Spectrum Sales. This provision would save money by allowing the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) to auction portions of the radio spectrum.
o $11 Billion In Agricultural Reforms. Baucus fought hard to ensure the ag cuts in this proposal were less than the $48 billion in Farm Bill cuts proposed in the House.
o Higher Education Program Reforms Whose Savings Go To Sustain The Pell Grant Program. The proposal fills a shortfall in the Pell program for fiscal years 2012 and 2013, to maintain the current maximum Pell level of $5,550.
* $1 Trillion in Savings From Winding Down the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan to focus on fighting terrorism and strengthening America, not nation building overseas.
* $400 Billion in Interest Savings. By cutting spending, this package reduces the U.S. deficits, and reducing our deficits reduces the interest the federal government must pay on our debt each year.
* Establishes Joint Congressional Committee to Find Future Savings. In addition to $2.7 trillion in concrete savings, the Senate package will establish a joint, bipartisan committee, made up of 12 members, to present options for future deficit reduction. The committee's recommendations will be guaranteed an up-or-down Senate vote, without amendments, by the end of 2011.

Contact: Kate Downen 406-224-5056/Jenny Donohue 202-224-4515/Kathy Weber 406-657-5915

# # #

For more information on Health Care Reform visit: http://finance.senate.gov


montana seal

[MannyGoldstein]

17. Who appoints the commission?

If Obama has an important role, then he and the Republicans will stock it with crazies hell-bent on stealing entitlements, just like the Catfood Commission.

[Leopolds Ghost]

28. "Winding down" the Iraq war: Because "ENDING" the war would imply we shouldn't be there

And would also suggest we won't be there permanently which is exactly the objective of the center-right.

[DLnyc]

41. Bottom line: Raising taxes on the rich and large corporations

has dropped out of sight.

The one meaningful popular means of cutting the deficit is not even worthy of discussion, apparently.

All we are seeing is different ways to cut our services in order to pay for tax cuts for the super-wealthy and for those corporations that are large and cynical enough to manipulate the system into feeding themselves while the rest of us starve.

Best government money can buy.

[emulatorloo]

58. The republican house will not vote to raise taxes. We've seen that clearly demonstrated

These past several weeks.

The only way we will get revenue increases is if we take back the House in 2012 election and get a solid majority in the Senate

[grahamhgreen]

68. Nor will Obama, as illustrated in Dec, when all we had to do was nothing and the

Bush tax cuts would have expired.

So, what you're saying did not happen when your conditions were met.

[Mass]

46. $1.2 T on unspecified cuts and a committee that cannot be filibustered or amended

It may be the best we can get, but it is not good.

[classof56]

56. Hey, thanks for posting this.

Lots of discussion here, but nice to have the details of Sen. Reid's plan along with the link to read in more depth later. Last night I saw two repub reps in a row say the Senate has come up with NO plan. Said that several times. Guess Reid's doesn't count in their bizarro world. Anyway, thanks, TG, for posting and for your responses in the thread.

Tired Old Cynic

[Tennessee Gal]

61. Yes, that "no plan" lie is bugging the crap out of me. nt

[Bluebear]

63. Thank you. This plan stinks.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

70. What's his guaranteed end date for "winding down the wars"?