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David Gregory said this morning that Medicare and Social Security contribute to debt

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alp227 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:02 PM
Original message
David Gregory said this morning that Medicare and Social Security contribute to debt
But I thought that Social Security didn't have a damn thing to do with the deficit, so how could SS contribute to the debt? Gregory mentioned this while Senator Claire McCaskill (D-Mo.) today:

MR. GREGORY: Senator McCaskill, you were in your office yesterday. We have pictures of you on the phone talking to constituents. And you sent a tweet out in the day that caught my eye. "Just spent a couple of hours answering the phones in my office. Dominant message: Don't cut Social Security or Medicare, and compromise." And yet, the big fight we know right now is over the enforcement mechanism, again, more Washington talk. What it means is you cut a certain amount up front to raise the debt ceiling, and then there's a second stage of cuts that come; and there is this committee that tries to agree on those cuts. And if you don't do it over this 10-year span, something forces Congress' hand. So how do you not put Social Security benefits or Medicare benefits into that potential enforcement mechanism when they're what are driving the debt?

SEN. CLAIRE McCASKILL (D-MO): Well, I think you have to have a lot of faith that the American people are going to continue to weigh in. And, and here's the bottom line, this fight has not been about nothing. This hasn't just been political theater. There's a philosophical difference here on the Hill between the Democratic Party and the Republican Party. And it's pretty simple: They have voted to keep giving taxpayer checks to big oil while they voted to convert the Medicare system to vouchers. Now, that doesn't compute for us. How can you be more willing to push money, public money, to the most profitable corporations in the history of the world at the same time you're willing to dismantle Medicare? So that's really the fight here. So if they're not willing to look at--and, you know, John and I agree that we can do tax reform and--but we can generate some revenues there by leveling the playing field, by lowering tax rates for businesses and individuals, but let's get away from the situation where the people who have power in Washington don't have to pay any taxes.


Gregory earlier asked White House adviser David Plouffe about possible SS/Medicare cuts:

MR. GREGORY: I want to be clear on what the president would accept. In terms of cuts, in the first state or the second stage, in other words, that--what's called in Washington a trigger, which means that whatever forces Congress' hands if they don't continue to cut government spending, something would happen. We know the president is open to tax increases automatically. Would he also accept a deal that would cut Social Security benefits or Medicare benefits if Congress doesn't act?

MR. PLOUFFE: Well, first of all, when you say open to tax increases, let's remember what the president's for: closing tax loopholes; making sure that millionaires and billionaires, large corporations, through tax reform contribute. What you see the Republican Party largely wanting to do is ask senior citizens, college students, the middle class to pay all the freight here. And people are outraged by that. Everyone's going to have to do their part here. So, in deficit reduction--and again, this next stage, the first stage is going to be some domestic spending cuts in Defense and non-Defense, that both parties largely can come to agreement on. Not easy, but a first stage. Second stage is going to be a discussion in Congress about things like tax reform and entitlement reform. Our view is things like Social Security and Medicaid, you know, they can't be part of the solution here unless you've got a balanced package that includes tax reform.


So is Gregory accurate in his assertion about SS contributing to the debt or is he advancing right-wing talking points? Please attack the idea if he's wrong.
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sasha031 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
1. he is a lying piece of shit, one could only hope no one watches him
he has destroyed that program
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. A lying sack of shit who is also full of shit imo
:patriot:
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WCGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #1
11. He's fucking lazy, for starters....
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Ruby the Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. Contributing? I see "Driving" (as in the main cause)
The stupidity in this country as to how government functions (and how Social Security is funded) astounds me.

I have an idea - lets make sure that any additional cuts to education focus their first dollar efforts on dismantling whatever is left of History and Civics. That should help...
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PoliticAverse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:08 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. Right that's why Obama says SS isn't "the driving force" behind the deficits. n/t
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Ruby the Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. Then he needs to back off the Rushpublican talking points and use "Contribute"
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PoliticAverse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:06 PM
Response to Original message
3. It does contribute. The interest paid to the SS trust fund securities come from the general fund...
Edited on Sun Jul-31-11 04:10 PM by PoliticAverse
and all general fund expenditures can be seen as contributing to the deficit since reducing any such expenditure
would reduce the deficit.

But it's not really 'the driving force' - which implies it is the major contributor.

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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #3
27. So does the debt to China. Why did Gregory not mention that?
Is China also 'contributing' to the deficit? Since we're out of money, any interest due to any of our creditors can't be paid. Does that make them responsible for the deficit?
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RKP5637 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:07 PM
Response to Original message
4. Gregory = LOL IMO. Can't stand him or meet the press now. Anything he
says I take as having little validity. IMO he's a RW shill.

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tularetom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. SS not only doesn't contribute to the debt, it is the largest creditor
The SS holds more government debt than any individual, financial institution, or foreign government or central bank.

The government has been borrowing money from SS for decades and securing that debt with government bonds.

SS is solvent now and for the foreseeable future but the SS trust fund is one of the creditors that will get stiffed if the government is allowed to default on its debt.

As usual gregory has his head up his ass. The real tragedy is that neither McCaskill nor Plouffe called him on it.
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nenagh Donating Member (657 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #6
14. Curious about people's reaction to David Plouffe...
talking with David Gregory...

I thought he seemed a bit naive... maybe I'm just a lot older than he is...
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senseandsensibility Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. Bingo about McCaskill and Plouffe
In fact, Gregory just followed his script and his performance is not even worth commenting on at this point. The fact that he was not corrected by his two Dem guests is the real disgrace. I don't think it was an oversight, either.
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sabrina 1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:11 PM
Original message
He's lying, which is no surprise coming from him.
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abq e streeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
7. More typical BS from Dances With Rove
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Dawson Leery Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:14 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. +1
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FlyByNight Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
12. More vulgar lies from the "centrist/balanced" "press"
Goddamn, what a mendacious whore. This from someone who probably won't need any of the Big 3 in the near or far future.

Fuck him.
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ljm2002 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:21 PM
Response to Original message
13. He is wrong...
...Social Security is not driving the debt. Until President Obama agreed to a payroll tax holiday last year, it never contributed one. thin. dime. to the deficit. It is 100% self-funded. Reagan put into effect a larger payroll tax, to account for the baby boomer's looming retirement. It is 100% funded through 2036 -- i.e. for the next 25 years -- even under the pessimistic economic growth numbers that were used to make the calculations. How many other government programs can say they are 100% funded, without any changes, for the next 25 years???

The real issue is that our politicians have chosen to borrow from the Social Security trust fund for their wars and tax cuts for the rich, therefore depleting the coffers. Now they don't want to pay it back. It's that simple. The "full faith and credit of the United States of America" apparently doesn't mean as much when it is directed towards its own citizens.

I don't know about Medicare, except that there are cost issues related to health costs in general and the unfunded prescription drug plan in particular.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #13
25. Pay it back out of what?
If it's not driving the debt, if it's self funded, there should be no problem if it suddenly needed to spend $500 billion. Where would it get the money?

Ah. The general fund, that's where. But even then, it wouldn't increase the debt or deficit, would it?

Well, no, it wouldn't. And yes it would. Because all the debt now held by the SSA would suddenly be issued in T-bills or T-notes. In other words, the debt would be external.


As for "choosing" to borrow, the alternative was to have a couple trillion dollars in a bank account held by the SSA. Where do you put the money? In banks? In bonds? In the stock market? Do you buy up Milwaukee? Banks fail, bonds and stocks depreciate and appreciate, their bankers go belly-up, urban blight happens. So Congress, in its wisdom (probably (D) Congress, at that) stipulated that the SSA must use the safest investment around--special issue T-notes.

However, if you notice that it's the *questions* that merge SS and Medicare so completely. The *responses* typically say "Medicare," and that's the real issue. Most of the time with SS it's a cash flow problem or a question of trying to level out the inevitable benefits reduction when the trust fund's exhausted; there's also an inkling that they'd like to keep borrowing from it. With Medicare, it's a sizeable hole in the budget that's going to just keep on sucking and sucking.

Yes, there's the claim that Medicare is self-funded, as well. It's not. Medicare part A has some dedicated revenue streams, so it's wholly self-funded for the time being. Medicare B/D is the big money suck. I keep saying that for some people the alphabet stops at "A".
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ljm2002 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 06:57 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Social Security is not driving the debt.
Period.

You can argue all you want about how to pay it back, but it's not DRIVING the debt. The things that BORROWED from the trust are driving the debt: off-the-books wars, unfunded Medicare Part D programs, and tax cuts for the rich.

THOSE things are what created the shortfall, and THAT is where the cuts should be made. Cut the military budget ("defense" is a misnomer, it hasn't been about defense for a long, long time); scrap Medicare Part D and get rid of the STUPID rule that says the government can't bargain on prices (have you ever before, I mean ever, heard of a government hamstringing itself in that way? me neither); and let the damned Bush tax cuts expire.

Those measures right there would clean up the debt problem right quick. Then fund public works programs to rebuild our decaying infrastructure, build a high-speed rail network, and have a major push for green energy sources. People will be back to work and paying taxes, and this too will help the budget not to mention turning our country around in the right direction again.

It's not hard to figure out, it's just hard to fight the monied interests who would rather we all hate each other, force women to have babies they don't want, make sure the middle class is ravaged, let the poor die quickly, and rain death and destruction on disobedient nations around the globe.
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Kennah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:29 PM
Response to Original message
15. Yet more evidence of our librul media
:sarcasm:
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flamingdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:30 PM
Response to Original message
16. Thune, lying pos, good he's not running for president
because he has the looks, and the icky lines.
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DesertFlower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
17. he doesn't know WTF he's talking about.
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
19. He's willing to push the corporate meme to keep
his job. The plan is to repeat the BIG LIE over and over again until people believe it and they are starting to believe this. Social Security has a surplus until 2034. Medicare could use some help in getting rid of the privatization schemes in Medicare Part C and Medicare Part D. That would require dumping the insurance companies. Of course you don't see that on the table. Both programs run separately from the General Fund, which is what this is all about. It's a stealth plan to steal all that money sitting there for the corporations and the rich fat cats to steal, just like they already stole the Clinton surplus.
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HysteryDiagnosis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
20. They can screw with my S.S. when they give back what I put in WITH INTEREST. I don't
think that is gonna happen though.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:39 PM
Response to Original message
21. Advancing rightwing talking points. It doesn't contibute to deficits and
cannot by law do so.
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HockeyMom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:43 PM
Response to Original message
22. Privatize your Social Security
If I had some broker come to me and say, let talk about "investing" your a part of your SS money in the market, I would tell them to get out of my face. In fact, I have had brokers call me, at 62 years old, trying to get me to switch my Pension to a 403B. I hung up on them. They called again. I told them, "Don't you dare call me again, or I will bring you up on harassment charges."
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Found this in Harper's Index (March 2005)
Year that the Social Security trustees in 1994 projected the program would no longer be able to pay out full benefits: 2029

Year projected by the trustees in 2004: 2042


Amount to which a San Diego defense analyst's payments to Social Security had appreciated when he retired in 1994: $261,372

Amount to which he calculated they would have grown if he had invested in a Dow Jones index fund instead: $248,166
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CanonRay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 04:44 PM
Response to Original message
23. Lying, paid off sack of shit.
That is all.
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Yo_Mama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-31-11 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
28. Yes, he is
Medicare & Social Security are both part of gross government debt and adding to the annual deficit.

If you go to this link, here are the (updated each business day) figures for our US government debt:
http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

Note that there are two parts. Total government debt is currently 14.3 trillion (actually higher, it will pop up about 500 billion after the debt limit is reached). But that total comes in two hunks. The first is debt held by the public. That is our current debt "out there", and that total is really now over 10 trillion. All the rest of it is "intragovernmental", and that total includes the Medicare and Social Security trust funds.

As the trust funds are accessed, all that happens is that debt goes out of that bucket and into the debt held by the public bucket. But on a cash flow basis, the impact is pretty big. Everything in that intragovernmental bucket theoretically gets interest, but actually the interest goes back to the government. Once you take 100 billion out of the SS/Medicare trust funds to cover this year's expenses, not only did the annual deficit increase by that 100 billion, but next year the US government has to pay interest to someone who bought treasuries for the 100 billion of new borrowing.

So sorry, but Gregory is correct.

Other items in that big intragovernmental bucket include federal retiree pensions, highway funds, etc.

There is no separate source of funds for Medicare and Social Security. The "trust funds" are just debt that the government owes to itself.
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