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I detest the Blue Dogs and think they undermine our party. BUT

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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:44 PM
Original message
I detest the Blue Dogs and think they undermine our party. BUT
I have to admit that Giffords wasn't even on my political radar until this happened.
I live in a very conservative area and walked blocks, worked booth and manned phone lines for my State Rep this last election cycle.
A conservative Democrat--would be considered a Blue Dog--however, knowing the guy and the work that he has done, I knew he was representing ALL of his constituents and not just me. He wasn't malicious--he just wasn't as liberal or progressive as I was.
I like him personally.
Now, getting to sit back and see how thoughtful and careful that Giffords was on her issues and how she took time to listen to the people she represented--maybe I will not broadbrush ALL the Blue Dogs anymore.
I hope that I can learn for myself from this to look at each personal critically and understand WHY they would vote on certain issues the way they do and not just summarily categorize someone until I know who and what they are.
This is my mea culpa. I will try to do better in this regard.
However, it doesn't extend to the rw. They are all evil bastards.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
1. The only thing that seems blue-dog about her is her gun-control stance.
Edited on Mon Jan-10-11 12:46 PM by JVS
Zell Miller she ain't.
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:51 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. There is more to her centrism
- Pro gun
- Pro military
- Supported 1070 (AZ immigration bill)
- Voted against Pelosi as minority lead
- Member of the Blue Dog Caucus

She also:
- Pro gay rights
- Voted to repeal DADT
- Pro choice
- Voted with the President on Health Care Reform

She is pretty much a typical southwest Democrat and representative of her district.
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obxhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. I've read in several places she was against 1070.
Edited on Mon Jan-10-11 01:19 PM by obxhead
She was for reform, but against 1070. At least that's what I have read in several places.

http://giffords.house.gov/2010/07/us-rep-gabrielle-giffords-statement-on-the-federal-challenge-to-arizonas-immigration-law.shtml


I am disappointed with the federal lawsuit against SB 1070 for the same reason I was disappointed when this bill became law: Neither will do anything to make Arizona’s border communities more secure.

Both the law and the lawsuit challenging the law are unnecessary distractions. Arizonans want our nation to control its borders and bring a halt to the violence, smugglers and drugs that threaten our way of life.

To fully appreciate the seriousness of what Arizonans are up against, President Obama should come to the border. The president should spend an afternoon with the ranchers of Cochise County and the retirees of Green Valley so he can see for himself that what we need are Border Patrol agents on the border, not lawyers in court.

Federal lawyers arguing with state lawyers will do nothing to strengthen border security or to fix our broken immigration laws.

The supreme irony of the lawsuit is its premise that SB 1070 intrudes on the federal government’s responsibility to enforce immigration laws. Had the federal government taken that responsibility seriously in the past, neither today’s lawsuit nor the state law that prompted it would be necessary.

I am pleased that Attorney General Eric Holder has acknowledged Arizonans’ frustrations with illegal immigration. But addressing our concerns means the federal government must do its job and secure our border with Mexico.

http://giffords.house.gov/2010/04/us-rep-gabrielle-giffords-statement-on-arizonas-new-immigration-law-and-the-need-to-secure-our-borde.shtml

Arizona is now known around the world for enacting an extreme immigration law in response to the federal government’s failure to act. This law does nothing to secure our border. My hope is that the events that have unfolded in Phoenix recently are a wake-up call to Washington politicians who for too long have refused to take seriously their responsibility to address the crisis on our border.

The people of Arizona are angry and so am I. Southern Arizona, in particular, has paid a heavy price because of drug smuggling and illegal immigration. But even with the changes enacted by the Legislature Thursday night, this law will do nothing to make the communities I represent safer from smugglers and the dangerous spill-over effects of border violence.

In the face of mounting criticism – including serious questions raised by prominent Republicans such as Jeb Bush, Lindsey Graham and Tom Tancredo – the Legislature hastily modified some aspects of the bill that Gov. Jan Brewer signed into law last week. These changes, however, fail to address the concerns of local law enforcement officials about the cost and practicality of enforcing this policy. The changes also do nothing to address the concerns that the law could jeopardize the rights of American citizens. In addition, the potentially devastating impact this law could have on Arizona’s economy just as we are beginning to emerge from the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression is a reality that must be avoided at all costs.

Passage of this law is a stark reminder that securing our border is a responsibility that the federal government must confront with the full extent of its resources.

(more at link, including actions she calls for)
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Hello_Kitty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. It's not accurate to say she supported SB1070.
What she said was that she understood why Arizonans supported it because of Federal inaction on the border. You have to understand that she represented a lot of Arizona's border and undocumented immigrants streaming across it and often onto people's private property is causing discontent in those communities. That said, Gabby was critical of the law because she felt it was un-Constitutional and did nothing to secure the border.
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bushisanidiot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. Blue Dogs represent conservative districts and we should be thankful for them
otherwise the repukes would have more control in the house and senate.

they have to represent the people in their district or they will lose their seat to other party.

i really don't understand why people don't get that.
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I have no problem with that
What I have a problem is when they gang up to force a vote their way.
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Liberal_Stalwart71 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. Though she is a Blue Dog (I actually think she's more moderate than a Blue Dog)...
...she seemed very reasonable on the issues of immigration and civil rights. In fact, she seemed quite center-left on gay rights and not as rabid as her Blue Dog brethren on the issue of immigration.
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:55 PM
Response to Original message
6. Why should you use the word "detest?"
Why not say I vehemently disagree with Blue Dogs? Why does it have to be such charged language?
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. There has been worse here on DU, even since the shooting
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 12:59 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. And for some, it has been carry on as usual.
Sad to say.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 01:04 PM
Response to Original message
9. She calls herself a Bluedog but seems just plain centrist.
I will oppose the Bluedogs as I do any political adversary. I do that because they represent Republican views which are not my own. I do not condone any violent acts on others, their property, or otherwise but reserve the right to oppose anyone politically. Blue dogs helped give us war, protection for torturers, Reaganomics, charter schools, etc.
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 01:29 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. She doesn't just call herself a Bluedog, she is one
BTW, did you know that of the 26 remaining Blue Dogs in the House, 19 supported DADT repeal, while only 6 voted against (one didn't vote).

So at least in that instance, the majority of Blue Dogs represented Democratic views that I presume are your own.

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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. I made no claim I disagree with them on everything. I'm aware what she calls herself.
But she is no Heath Shuler for instance. The things I cited are enough for me to oppose them politically.
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dmallind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-10-11 01:18 PM
Response to Original message
12. Again the idiotic misuse of the term "Blue Dog" is rife on DU
Edited on Mon Jan-10-11 01:20 PM by dmallind
You can't SEEM to be a Blue Dog. You can't be "more of a centrist really" as if they were both potential but differing positions on a spectrum. The Blue Dogs are a defined group with listed membership. Giffords IS one. She is a member of the coalition. It's as much a binary condition as being a member of Congress. You cannot "be considered" a Congressperson or seem to be one. It's either a or not a.

For reference here is the current list.

Jason Altmire (PA-4)
Joe Baca (CA-43)
John Barrow (GA-12)
Sanford Bishop (GA-2)
Dan Boren (OK-2)
Leonard Boswell (IA-3)
Dennis Cardoza (CA-18)
Ben Chandler (KY-6)
Jim Cooper (TN-5)
Jim Costa (CA-20)
Henry Cuellar (TX-28)
Joe Donnelly (IN-2)
Gabrielle Giffords (AZ-8)
Jane Harman (CA-36)
Tim Holden (PA-17)
Jim Matheson (UT-2)
Mike McIntyre (NC-7)
Mike Michaud (ME-2)
Collin Peterson (MN-7)
Mike Ross (AR-4)
Loretta Sanchez (CA-47)
Adam Schiff (CA-29)
Kurt Schrader (OR-5)
David Scott (GA-13)
Heath Shuler (NC-11), Blue Dog Whip
Mike Thompson (CA-1)


NOBODY else is one. It's not a catch-all term meaning "a Dem less ideologically pure than me or one I dislike". That does not a BD make. Everybody listed IS one, whether you love them or loathe them.

Posted as general response not aimed at any individual - more wilful common ignorance of much of DU on this topic.
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