The speech "brouhaha."

[nadinbrzezinski]

I know that for some folks there is absolutely NOTHING the President could ever do that would be wrong. I know that... so I guess this is not for you. But for the rest of us this can be broken into several things.

1.- Amateur hour at the WH? I mean there is no way they did not know there was a Republican Debate... and if they did not... well then somebody deserves a swift kick. If they knew... well then that would have been the kind of in your face TRUMAN would have done... so changing the day means it is still amateur hour.

2.- The Speaker has a history of showing DISRESPECT to this President. The jury is still out whether this is because Obama is a Democrat, or Black... or both... regardless he has a history of doing that... and this is just one more of those matters. I guess if you are a democrat and especially a minority one, all you should do at the WH is be a servant... and yes, that level of racism is now quite obvious..

3.- Yes, to people who pay half attention to these things it makes him, yet again, look weak. This is the process.

POTUS I'd like to do x.
RNC no, you don't
POTUS Ok, will do it your way, and we will call it compromise.

Rinse, repeat. Why this president looks weak to the rest of us. Suffice it to say, not all of them post at DU... or for that matter watch (insert media here) as much as some of us do. But they exist, and to discount the optics of this is just plain out stupid.

Will he win reelection? Perhaps... but if he does indeed lose it... this is one of the reasons. People do not see him as a strong leader, and shit like this don't help. It is the OPTICS people and anyway... this is quite unprecedented in the history of this country.

According to that historian using the Keys... yes he will... but he is still weak. And if he does... well I do hope the Dems retake the house and give Boehneer a swift kick in the you know what... and read the election as MOVE LEFT YOUNG MAN.

There are the keys according to Prof Lichmann

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/08/19/570738/-The-Keys-to-the-Presidency-

[warrior1]

1. The President

again won this one.

His speech will be after the dog and pony show on Wed, and before the game of Thurs.

No one will care what happened this week.

I can guarantee you that. American have a very short attention span.

[nadinbrzezinski]

3. Yup he won, like every other confrontation...

This is what is now running on US Papers from US Cartoonists

?48

Deny the optics of this and other events all you want.

[ThomWV]

7. That is the very problem that makes it even worse

You're right, 10 days from now no one will remember the specifics, that this speech date and time interfered with this or that game or debate or something. No one will remember its specifics at all. But what they will remember is that once again Obama got pushed around by the Republicans. It will be sort of foggy, they won't remember the specifics, but that overall feeling that he is weak will just have been reinforced once again.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Exactly

:thumbsup:

[Dawgs]

11. +++++++++++++++. n/t

[Nuclear Unicorn]

19. Worse than that

They'll remember he got pushed around and then when the speech, the one that was supposedly soooo important it required a joint session AND a national kerfluffle turned out to be not worth remembering.

The president better do better than "Go big!" He needs to go HUGHMONGOUS! (spelling intended, it's an innerwebz thing)

[polmaven]

2. As opposed to

those folks for whom there is nothing the president could ever do that would be right?

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. The FEMA response was textbook

for that I applaud the President of the US...

Next...

[polmaven]

18. well,

I really can't do a "next" because that might mean posting the dreaded :hide:Liiissst:hide:.

[nadinbrzezinski]

26. You can post the list

he's done some things that are right. I just used the MOST RECENT example... but on this one, they blew it.

[muffin1]

5. K&R nt

[JohnnyLib2]

6. The #1 above resonates with me.

Shoot self in foot ???

Rec.

[Fresh_Start]

9. I agree with all of your points.

To ignore what you are calling the OPTICS is foolish and naive.
The OPTICS are what put Bush in office and kept him in office.
There is plenty of information out there about voters which says that appearances matter: not just physical appearance but appearance of leadership. And President Obama is not looking like a leader.

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. At times I wonder if this in on purpose

the way they ran that campaign is not reflected in how they run the WH... it is two different people.

[Fresh_Start]

14. I'm not believing the BS about multi-dimensional chess

nor should you.

Governing is very different from campaigning.
They knew how to campaign but not how to govern.
Campaigning is far easier: just look at how easily Bachmann says she'll get the country back on track.
Unfortunately campaigning for reelection after you've haven't lived up to your campaign is going to be a lot harder than the first time around. There is no magic, its not historic, and his opponents will contrast all of his prior promises with his lack of execution. Plus when the economy is this bad and people are so without hope, reelection becomes a long shot anyway

[theoldman]

10. How many people will watch the Republican Debate?

Not very many. How many people will watch the ball game? Very many. The way I see it the Republicans won this fight. I guess we will know next Friday when everyone on both sides congratulates themselves.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. Everybody will congratulate themselves anyway

[Romulox]

15. The President's people are TERRIBLE at PR and politics.

I don't blame the President for this scheduling foul-up, I blame his staff--they are terrible at PR and managing political expectations. But on the other hand, they aren't terribly competent technicians, either (see our dismal economy, e.g.)

So what ARE they good at? :shrug:

[renate]

29. I agree--they're really dreadful

Did everyone who worked on his campaign disappear? They seemed invincible at the time.

I still really like President Obama, I think he's doing his very best considering the hand he was dealt and the Congress he's dealing with, and I don't blame him for this scheduling thing (I doubt it was his own personal and unilateral decision to ask Boehner permission for something that it would be so easy to say "bite me" to), but he was the one who got turned down, not the PR team. I'm so used to being upset by the media's reactions to everything he does that it's pretty much a reflex by now. I hope his jobs speech is amazing but considering the past performances of his PR people I'm already prepared to be let down.

[Bragi]

33. They apparently skipped Political Communications 101

I think this speech event has been a botch job from the outset.

If a President wants to make an economic speech, then what they have to do is to prepare it, send out a notice to give the media prep time, and go do the speech.

DO NOT, however, announce weeks ahead of time on the heels of an ass-kicking by your opponents (the debt ceiling fiasco) that in a month or so you will be delivering a really, really important speech about a very, very urgent topic.

And especially DO NOT, as the event approaches, announce a date for your super-urgent speech only to find out it was a stupid choice, only to be forced by your political opponents to change it to suit their needs.

I mean really folks, this is indefensible incompetence. The OP is quite correct.

[Overseas]

16. I don't know... What if Republicans held a debate and nobody watched?

They could have had an excuse-- the president deliberately stole our audience!

Now they have nothing to say if no one watches because all of them are just too crazy to bother with.

[vi5]

17. Making it worse...it's a speech about JOBS....

Yes, the speech will probably be more of the nothing we've come to expect on that front.

But again, the optics of it are that the President is again giving in on something related to jobs/the economy, in the interest of Republican political posturing.

End of story. What is normally done or what he can or can't do or any of it is all irrelevant.

He picked a fight, ostensibly to put them on the spot about jobs and then he backed down when they called his bluff.

So yeah, it's bad that he caved. But he's done that before and will do it again. But it's worse that he caved yet again on something that he SHOULD be viewing as the most important thing in the country right now.

[nadinbrzezinski]

24. Yup, absolutely

[Logical]

20. GREAT POST! Most of the DUers do not get it. It comes down to this....

1. Either they picked the date because they did no research and did not know about the debate.
2. They picked the date because they wanted the fight and then chickened out.

Either reason makes them look like fools!

[Proud Public Servant]

21. On your first point

I don't think scheduling the speech to conflict with the debate was a mistake, and I don't think (as some do) that it was some kind of nth-dimensional chess move that resulted in a more coveted timeslot (as someone who works in Washington, an occasionally with the WH, I'm convinced that no one in this town is that clever or that subtle, except maybe some folks over at Langley).

I really do think that this was the WH attempt to be ballsy, Truman- or LBJ-style. Which makes the resulting capitulation all that much more dispiriting.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. Yup... they really need to learn how to play hardball

[Parker CA]

22. Another unfortunate result is that a 7:30 PM EST start time will decrease West Coast viewership

an enormous amount. For such a vital issue, I would've imagined this timing issue would've been sorted out weeks ago.

[uppityperson]

23. unrec for your first sentence.

Yes, I am getting very intolerant of people insulting others here, of claiming things like this dichotomous thinking stuff.

ed to add that I am also going to let people know why I unrec. You may disagree, but I figure you deserve to know my thinking. Is the civil thing to do rather than simply unrec and move on.

[pintobean]

25. The sky is blue

Edit: I did the same thing for the same reason. It's a pattern.

[nadinbrzezinski]

27. Go for it... in fact, do me a favor

UNREC every post I post ok. Please do. It really don't matter. But reality is, we have a true believer problem in the US in BOTH PARTIES... read on that book, oldie but goodie.

[uppityperson]

31. Nadin, I hope you read why.

As here you go again. You know me better than that, or should by now.

[nadinbrzezinski]

36. It is not an insult to point to the TRUE BELIEVER

problem in the US... but if you feel it is... I will keep pointing this and other issues, so go ahed, and keep doing it. I really do not give a shit at this point.

I expect PAINFUL TRUTHS, and true believes and cult of personalities are one of them, to be recced down to - brazillion at this point, In fact I expect to be unrecced on principle at this point.

It is a damn bully tactic, but when the bullies don't really matter, it really maters little.

By the way the cult of personality and true believer is NOT limited to the DEMOCRATS... it is on both sides, and it is a franking problem,

[uppityperson]

37. Who on DU is a "TRUE BELIEVER" that "defends everything Obama does"?

THAT is my point. Since you advised me to automatically unrec everything you write, how can you call this a "damn bully tactic"? I understand your frustration as you do get unrec'd automatically by some, as we all do. I am simply trying to tell you why I am.

[nadinbrzezinski]

38. Oh my god... if you have missed this

then we truly part company... but we have a few. you are asking me to do a call out, against the rules... I will not do that... forget it. You want to get this thread locked?

But if you have missed that we truly part company.

Yes there are people who defend everything they do... and there are people who are critical of everything they do, and then there are the rest of us... trapped in between the warring camps.

And yes at this point I do not care why people unrec. I got fans who WILL do that just because I posted it... period...

That is the way it is...

Internet forii are that way... and I cannot help if those people will continue to do that. And if you want to unrec for POINTING OUT that we have a true believer problem, use it... I don't give a shit. Yes, I got to that point in life. I expect anything I post, ANYTHING to be unrecced, period... that is the way it is. If a post gets to the greatest page or not, matters little to me... if people want to unrec to -brazillion go for it... I slightly object to thread hijacks though. But since they will now do that, who gives a shit?

[uppityperson]

39. I have seen people bashing everything, I have seen people being critical

of many things. I have not seen anyone supporting "everything Obama does". (got your pm)

I hope you realize that I read your posts because I usually like what you write and agree with you.

[uppityperson]

40. got it, thanks, will look

[Logical]

30. People here defend everything Obama does! That is what he meant!

[uppityperson]

34. Hence my "dichotomous thinking" statement.

I have not seen people here defending everything Obama does, but see more people doing the opposite. I see people criticizing what he does, all over the place.

I see people doing the dichotomous thinking thing. And "he" is a "she".

[joeybee12]

32. KNR...pretty obvious how incompetent this White House is...nt

[elocs]

35. I posted about amateur hour at the WH. Why would they knowingly pick that date?

It makes it seem like they were being "in your face" to the Republican bullies, standing up to them, then backing down when the bully tells them to change the date.

Anyone at DU who can successfully spin that as a win for Obama and the White House, your talents are wasted here. Your should be working nationally for the Democratic Party.

[Broderick]

41. My personal opinion is that it is a big to do about nothing.

A scheduling conflict arose, and it's been settled. Let's move on and hopefully his speech will bring some hope and relief to the suffering going on out there.