**************Official Obama Speech Thread #2********************

[steve2470]

http://www.c-span.org/Live-Video/C-SPAN/

thread number one is here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=186999&mesg_id=186999

[Ptah]

1. Some pictures from UMC today:

[malaise]

6. Thanks for those

Touching

[Crystal Clarity]

9. Thanks for the pics Ptah

Love the bottom one especially

[Taverner]

10. I love this one

Yes, we don't have to descend into this

[Kali]

129. thanks

:yourock: :hug:

[gateley]

2. K&R! nt

[rocktivity]

3. They weren't booing

They were saying Jan BREWWWWWWWWWWW-ER!

:eyes:
rocktivity

[gateley]

5. Probably not the time or place, but I sure wouldn't have applauded. nt

[SoCalDem]

55. I don't understand the pep-rally-ish nature

Just because it's being held in a college field-house, does not make it a pep rally/ sporting event.

I am always uncomfortable when people do this.. I guess I was raised to believe that decorum is important..

Putting myself in the place of Christina's parents, I would have been horrified to hear people cheering when her death was mentioned:cry:

[aquart]

112. They were cheering her life, not her death.

[gateley]

120. I think I would have been moved by the applause - it was a tribute to her. How

else could they show that they cared?

It's interesting that some people here are thinking this is just fine as is (me, for one) and others, like you, aren't comfortable with it. I'm learning we each have very personal and pretty strong feelings about how a gathering like this should go.

As I posted elsewhere, I'm sure the intent was good - what they felt was best in this horrific tragedy.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. This has all the feelings of a very Southwestern Wake

or Irish Wake...

It ain't gonna play well in RW machine land... alas even if everybody was bawling their eyes off, and quiet like a church mouse, would it play well in RW land.

[redwitch]

8. It sure is noisy!

I was a little surprised, it is not a tradition I am familiar with.

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. I've gone to a few wakes

the only think not flowing here is copious amounts of alcohol.

I wonder if the Tamales and other rich foods are somewhere in the order of business though.

[bdamomma]

60. yea me too, used to something like this being a solemn event

[boston bean]

11. It don't play well for me. I think it's awful. Truly awful

Brewer mentions the death of Christina Green and they scream yell and applaud.

I'm sorry it aint right.

This is a memorial, not a campaign rally.

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. It is a memorial

they are celebrating a life.

Been exposed to many traditions myself... and a combo of this and a traditional Jewish Shiva seems to me the best.

[boston bean]

20. When someone says we lost a nine year old girl, there is no need

for anyone to scream, whistle or applaud.

it is totally inappropriate.

[nadinbrzezinski]

Welcome to other cultures and other ways of dealing with loss

This is a great view into a while different micro culture in the US.

[boston bean]

38. I never seen anyone cheering and clapping the mention of a young girl shot down

at a memorial service. Sorry!

[nadinbrzezinski]

48. I have

but then again people were celebrating that young life too... she was five... she got caught in the cross fire... she was the daughter of one of my medics.

They were cheering in the church no-less, the family was.

It was explained the same way I have tried to explain this to you that day... I was completely out of my element.

[boston bean]

54. President Obama has a very important speech to deliver and he doesn't need

the cheering, and thunderous applause.

It is truly off the mark.

[nadinbrzezinski]

65. Well East Coast Mores will not work in the South West

Sorry.

[boston bean]

76. no need to be sorry. i know i am correct that one should not cheer upon when

a young girls death is being mentioned.

[nadinbrzezinski]

95. In your culture you are very correct

this is not your culture. Try to remember that.

[boston bean]

100. What culture is this exactly? And you know nothing about my culture.

[nadinbrzezinski]

104. I already told you this is common all over the South west

I am not seeing something alien to me. And now POTUS, quick on his feet, has joined in.

[boston bean]

106. So in the southwest it is completely normal to cheer upon the mention of a

young girls death?

[nadinbrzezinski]

111. Yes, in some quarters

People celebrate a life, not mourn a death.

It is an alien way for you I guess. But yes, people tell stories, they tell jokes.. they share memories, they share food, they cheer a life... except at the actual gravesite.

[boston bean]

115. Hey don't think we yankees don't eulogize and probably toss in a joke or two

but what does not happen is cheering and thunderous applause when someone mentions the death of a child.

The death of a child. The loss of a child.

[nadinbrzezinski]

119. It was shocking to me the first time too

her name was alicia, she was the five year old daughter of one of my medics. I went to the funeral for obvious reasons. Then they went to church... and the cheering was off putting... so the Padre took me to the side and explained it after he saw this Jew seating there in SHOCK! I'd never seen anything like that either.

I leaned a lot about Alicia that day... her favorite color was pink. Her favorite toy was a smurf... her favorite things to do in school was to draw. She was an angel and she died in the cross fire.

I missed the wake the previous night. I was told I missed on good mole, and tequila and tamales.

[Abq_Sarah]

135. No, it's not

I live in the Southwest and I've been to plenty of memorials and have yet to hear anyone "cheering" a young person who died, particularly if it was in a violent manner.

[ChazII]

110. A big Arizona thank you, nadinbrzezinski

Those folks at McHale center are not cheering because folks were murdered. I appreciate your remarks in this thread. The criticism of my fellow Arizonans is rubbing me the wrong way. Thanks for understanding what is really happening in Tucson.

[boston bean]

118. They are completely inappropriate in the applause

especially when Jan Brewer mentioned the loss and murder of a child.

[nadinbrzezinski]

121. You welcome

:hug:

[timber84]

18. It's more of a Pep Rally than a memorial feel to me.

Sorry, just my opinion. The speakers are fine it's the crowd. The hooting and hollering should not be.

[gateley]

19. I think they were honoring Christina Green. It's not church, it's a gathering for

healing. So I'm one of the ones who feel it's appropriate.

[boston bean]

28. I am one who feels it completely inappropriate.

It feels like people are happy to be there to cheer on popular and important politicians.

It is truly making me sick to my stomach.

[gateley]

I posted in another thread that after my parents' funerals, the parties after

were very healing for me. Lots of laughter, noise, and it meant so much to me that others cared so much about the people I loved more than anybody in the world. So maybe I'm coming from that person perspective. You're not the only one who doesn't feel it's appropriate as I'm sure you've seen. So like every other topic, we have differing opinions.

Regardless, I think the intent was good and an attempt to do what was right.

[seabeyond]

29. i am not watching, but listening, sounds like trying to rise above the horror. connect, unite,

welcome, come together. after all the division, maybe an exagerated effort to show we are one....

[gateley]

128. I think that's a good observation. I agree. nt

[monmouth]

36. I have it on mute waiting for the President. It's appalling...n/t

[RichGirl]

37. Are you so dense....

They cheered for a little girl who was an incredible person...for her life not her death.

[boston bean]

43. This is a total embarassment and I am sure it is for President Obama.

The cheering and whistling and thunderous applause is appalling!

[DURHAM D]

72. You are everywhere complaining.

Why don't you stop watching and/or just be quiet.

You are not the arbiter of all things appropriate. When someone is sick or loses a loved one or a traumatic event happens in their town how they grieve or respond is up to them and we are not to judge.

[boston bean]

124. I'm not complaining. I am appalled. I never said i was an arbiter of anything

i know it is wrong to cheer and clap when the death of a child is mentioned.

Do I think they were cheering her death, no.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

73. I lived in Tucson for ten years. The funerals and memorials there are

no different than anywhere else in the country.

[Catherina]

114. It's not only awful, it's horrifying.. +1 in absolute sadness n/t

[Danmel]

7. Why is brewer wearing that bright blue jacket?

Reminds me of moonstruck - "some day you'll die & i will come to your funeral wearing a red dress"

[nadinbrzezinski]

23. Don't go to a funeral in Hawaii then

the bright mumus (traditional dresses) and Hawaiian shirts. will surely shock you.

I am so damn glad that I have been exposed to many traditions.

but this will not play well in RW land... then again, nothing would.

[handmade34]

35. don't be so quick to judge

I wore a red suit to my husband's funeral... and he would have been delighted!!

[blaze]

52. You made me smile!!!

Thanks for this post!

And thanks to your husband's life!! :)

[cynatnite]

12. Where's McStupid...I mean McCain? n/t

[gateley]

24. Row behind Obama, to his right - to our left. nt

[jillan]

13. Omg - listen to the cheers for Janet!! We miss you they are screaming.

[muntrv]

15. Napolitano is getting a bigger ovation than Brewer.

[TheWebHead]

16. this is a trainwreck

I can't believe how much inappropriate cheering is going on. I'm not sure what one does about it. I think the post game of this will be that having it at a university was not a good idea... It's all looking very Wellstone-esque

[Ptah]

22. "post game'?

:wtf:

[Skidmore]

30. No it is not.

There is much healing to be done in that community, lives to be celebrated, and hope to be given. Whatever this community deems necessary to accomplish this is fine with me.

[jillan]

33. You have no idea how much Janet Napolitano is missed in our state.

[Gold Metal Flake]

34. The Republicans were the ones who had a problem with the Wellstone memorial.

[gateley]

39. Let people express themselves however they need to. Those who have passed

on won't mind. I know when my parents died the parties after their funerals (loud! noisy! full of laughter!) were very healing for me. I'm hoping this is for those who have lost love ones. It means the world to know other people care about the person/people you loved.

[kestrel91316]

21. Does Jan Brewer ALWAYS sound drunk?? Seriously.

And she sounds like a carpetbagger from points east. Weird accent.

[Control-Z]

26. Yes. n/t

[Cleita]

113. Can't you tell from the "whiskey voice"? eom

[Forkboy]

25. This whole thing makes me glad I'm not that into party politics anymore.

[derby378]

31. Hey there! How ya doin'?

:hi:

[Forkboy]

49. About as well as Eeyore!

:D

:hi:

[spanone]

27. i don't like holder & napolitano doing the scripture thingy.....

[gateley]

42. Agree. nt

[Danmel]

32. This is bizarre

No one there seems sad at all. Weird weird weird.

[tallahasseedem]

44. I think it's a great release for a city...

gripped by devastation.

[bdamomma]

91. true they have been in shock or in mourning since this happened.

everyone has their own mourning beliefs and how they deal with emotional pain.

[handmade34]

45. no

not necessarily... a memorium is a celebration and often is joyous and full of life

[monmouth]

46. Pres. looks very uncomfortable, bet he can't wait for his speech is over,

and get out of there.

[RichGirl]

62. He needs to invite this crowd to the SOTU!

[nadinbrzezinski]

70. Now that would be a sight

[Flubadubya]

40. I understand the predilection to "religious" themes here...

but I really just want to hear Obama. :(

[ladym55]

41. About the cheering ...

This is being held at a state university in a hall FILLED with students. They aren't always the most appropriate folks on the planet, and I speak as someone who has worked on a college campus for more than 20 years. They don't KNOW that one doesn't cheer at an event such as this. They are used to cheering at EVERYTHING they attend.

They are students, acting like students. It seems jarring to us, but it's what they do.

[timber84]

53. Completely understand that fact. Still doesn't sit well under the mantle of a

Memorial Service for me to hear hooting cheering and whistling. Completely inappropriate IMHO.

[ladym55]

78. I understand how you feel

I have attended SO many events and cringed over the years when the students have behaved ... well, like students. We have not done a good job of training our young people to know when and how to be appropriate. I have also lectured, nagged, and heaven help me SAT with my students at public events in attempt to do a little etiquette training.

I suspect that many classes at the University of Arizona tomorrow will include comments from faculty about the concept of how one is SUPPOSED to act an event like this one.

[Dappleganger]

92. Then you would really have been upset...

at the memorial we went to of a very young man named Austin, who was taken too soon from this world after a 2-yr. battle with brain cancer. There were thousands at the event which consisted of a lot of noise...er, celebration...of that man's life.

Wait, can you hear the kids cheering about Gabby opening her eyes for the first time? It's beautiful! :)

[cynatnite]

56. Agreed...classes are still in session. n/t

[kimi]

57. Yes, I agree

These are young people who will be leading this country in the future. Decorum is something learned with time.

I have no doubt that those there will carry this ceremony with them forever.

[aquart]

101. After this, it will be what we all do.

This isn't just a memorial. It's also a celebration of courage and survival and skill.

[H2O Man]

47. Interesting.

I find the rituals that human beings participate in fascinating. As ugly as Saturday was, this appears an important ritual to me. I am glad to see President Obama.

[RagAss]

51. Well said.

[spanone]

93. well said, i think it is cathartic for tucson

[Thrill]

50. Look at McCain making faces at Obama when he should be bowing

[justiceischeap]

58. The look on his face says it all, "I hate that man!" (eom)

[monmouth]

59. Wow. How telling is that? Cindy looks very tired, poor woman...n/t

[Mariana]

90. Can you imagine what she's going through, being married to him?

From all accounts, he was always a miserable, hateful, vicious SOB. I bet he's much, much worse since he lost that election.

[AspenRose]

68. Evil, evil man.

x(

[Renew Deal]

131. McCain is so jealous.

It's nuts. Justice O'Connor has gotten older but she looks good.

[nadinbrzezinski]

61. Ok here on this thread we are seeing a conflict of cultures

and what is appropriate or not.

Some cultures demand that you are silent, wear black and play a quiet role... others demand that you cheer for the departed, hold a great feast...

A few demand you wear white... others that you wear black. A few that you tear your clothes and pour ashes on your heads and wear sackcloth...

What you are seeing is something that is very specific to the South West... the first time I went to a funeral where I heard cheering I had the same horrified reaction. Sackcloth, tearing my cloths and all that... personally I prefer to celebrate a life, even in a loud way... with food, plenty of it. and for those who like it drink... but that is just me.

Oh and the right will make hay of this regardless.

[Uzybone]

69. +10000

[tallahasseedem]

71. I believe in a celebration of life and

a release of emotions in the face of the harsh reality of what has just happened.

Some don't get it, I guess.

[RagAss]

74. Thank You...this thread needs perspective very badly.

[rocktivity]

79. No, I think it's purely political

The Repubs are trying to sanitize this service, trying to drown out the reason why it's necessary with positivity and applause.

:headbang:
rocktivity

[AspenRose]

82. Yep

[cynatnite]

83. And not all funerals are held on a college campus...

I think what we're seeing is understandable. There are a lot of students in the audience and they're not known for being appropriate 100% of the time...fortunately :)

[nadinbrzezinski]

84. Well there is that too

[derby378]

94. There were a lot of tears at my wife's funeral, but she always insisted...

...that she wanted people to laugh during her funeral as well. Since I delivered the eulogy, I made sure to get in at least one good laugh on her behalf. I like to think she appreciated that. We were all a sobbing mess at the end, though.

[boston bean]

97. She might have wanted them laughing, but not cheering and applauding, I suppose.

[nadinbrzezinski]

99. My husband wants an irish wake

you know the difference between a wake and wedding right? One less drunk Irishman.

[derby378]

108. Okay, I'm giggling now

Good one. :hi:

[kimi]

109. Totally agree

There is solemnity, there is celebration.

It's a memorial, for cryin out loud. Which a lot of people are doing. Death AND life. Life.

Perspective. If you ain't there, stop knocking it.

[fishwax]

117. "oh and the right will make hay of this regardless"

pretty much guaranteed. :grr:

[guitar man]

122. Exactly

Anybody who has ever attended a New Orleans musician's funeral can attest to that. :hi:

[nadinbrzezinski]

125. I'll raise you a Hawaiian Funeral

Good food, good music, we don't drink! But been told good drink.

Or a Mexican Wake...

[X_Digger]

130. The back of my head would have been smacked if I'd hooted like that at a memorial. n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

133. When I was a kid mine would as well

but fortunately I have left that unique bubble.

Hell, when I went to shivas I was always saddened by the church mice... (bad analogy). When my aunt died, we rebells started, with my cousin, having a tad more of a celebration and talking of her and her life. The locals were shocked at first. Then they joined.

[Mortos]

63. I can't watch this. The cheering and clapping is rubbing me the wrong way

It is completely inappropriate in my opinion.

[boston bean]

81. I am pulling my hair out!

[Still a Democrat]

64. The atmosphere is uncomfortable at best

The clapping and cheering is inappropriate, to say the least. Our president is trying to do the right thing, but it's coming off all wrong.

[boston bean]

67. Obama wants them to shut the fuck up!

[Ruby the Liberal]

66. This is a bit nerve wracking.

I appreciate that sub-cultures may face tragedy in different ways. I can appreciate the clapping in memory of those lost, but the cat calls and yelling is just too offputting.

[Mortos]

80. and the wolf whistling...

[RichGirl]

86. There kids...

It's a college. If they wanted a solumn event they would have done it in a church. You can't have a place the size of a sport stadium full of people and not expect it to be noisy.

[Still a Democrat]

103. Okay - I've changed my mind -

the applause for the heroes seems appropriate now in some way.

I reserve the right to change it again!

[Danmel]

75. I wish the President would ask the crowd to not applaud

He could remind them that this is not a celebration & not a rally. The university presidents remarks were not appropriate either. He should have just introduced him. Everyone knows
who he is and why he is there.

[Thrill]

77. Those College Students are just way too happy

to see the President. You know all those people aren't there for a memorial service

[cynatnite]

87. It's an event...

I'm not surprised by the reactions we're seeing.

[jillan]

85. Oh please - they are honoring the victims with their clapping. This is NOT a funeral.

[Joe the Revelator]

88. The applause has gotten better since the President began speaking.

Power of the office.

[golddigger]

89. Had to turn it off. It was making my stomach flip flop.

[Pathwalker]

102. You're missing the group hug!

[malaise]

105. Gabby opened her eyes for the first time after the visit from the President

and a delegation from Congress.
Great speech about those where were killed, hurt or who helped.

[Beaverhausen]

96. Dig at Palin? You betcha!!!

[Darkhawk32]

98. Seeing Sen. Kyl in the audience makes me so angry... n/t

[mopinko]

107. i'm such a sucker for this hero shit.

i suppose it is a flaw in my character, but the eyes always leak when is see this stuff.

[kimi]

116. Not a flaw at all!

My eyes are leaking too. But I'm also :)

[anAustralianobserver]

123. I think a lot of the cheering is about overcoming the fear and confusion. I've never seen anything

like it before but it's a beautiful thing and I'm glad I could tune into it.

[AsahinaKimi]

126. Awesome

:cry:

[anAustralianobserver]

127. thread #3 started

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x187845

[Hobo]

132. Here in Tucson, it's been a rough few days

The sadness has been overwhelming and the city (people) needed to exhale. We wanted to cheer and clap to start to blow out the bad air we have holding in since Saturday. You good folks or most of you haven't been here. There has been a pall over the city. Trying to be civil here, but to you who said it inappropriate, let me say this:


STFU


Hobo

:beer:

[ChazII]

134. +1000

from a fellow Arizonan.:hug: