Alabama farmers losing immigrant labor, see produce rotting in the fields (al.com)

[eppur_se_muova]

{al.com is an umbrella web site for several papers in the state. Similar stories ran in the Huntsville Times and Birmingham news, with similar titles -- see http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=5013817&mesg_id=5013817 }

By Challen Stephens, The Huntsville Times

Regardless of how a federal judge rules this week, Alabama's new immigration law has already delivered "unintended consequences" across the state, said Agriculture Commissioner John McMillan.

The picking of blueberries, tomatoes and squash largely requires hand labor, McMillan said Monday, and the work is no longer getting done.

McMillan said he recently visited a farmer who has 75 acres of squash in north Jackson County.

"It was just rotting in the fields because he had half the labor," McMillan told The Huntsville Times editorial board. "That's a fact. What I'm telling you is what I've seen."

In June, the new Republican majority in Montgomery passed a sweeping 72-page act that is widely considered the toughest crackdown on illegal immigration in the country. The act not only allows local police to detain people suspected of being in the country illegally, the law also makes it a crime for illegal immigrants to look for work in Alabama.
***
more: http://blog.al.com/breaking/2011/09/alabama_farmers_losing_immigra.html




So ... "unintended consequences" have reared their ugly heads ... gosh, how could anyone ever have predicted this?

July '11 http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4942039&mesg_id=4942039

June '11 http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=1347372&mesg_id=1347372

June '11 http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/06/georgias-harsh-immigration-law-costs-millions-in-unharvested-crops/240774/

June '11 http://www.npr.org/2011/06/23/137369275/ga-s-new-immigration-law-sparks-farmers-fears

Oct '07 http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=2000216&mesg_id=2000216

Oct '07 http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1999617&mesg_id=1999617

April '07 http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=3230127&mesg_id=3230127

March '07 http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9108462




ON EDIT: Feel free to add other links, preferably with DATES !

[NightWatcher]

1. Go ask the Georgians who lost their farms... Hey but you kicked the Mezcans out, right?

Dumbasses. Your hate cost you your farm. Now don't you dare ask for any government help to subsidize your hatred and stupidity.

[Luminous Animal]

4. Farmers, for the most part, were against this bill. So were the agri-corporations

and the building industry.

[saras]

31. WTF? Who was FOR it?

If ag AND the building industry AND progressives are against it, who the hell was left? Just the Tea Party? It's hard to believe that neither ag nor building are that big a force there.

[emilyg]

2. Hire Americans.

[nolabear]

6. You forgot the rotfl smilie.

Or you haven't been paying attention. I'm not sure which.

[DonCoquixote]

15. and what will you pay them?

As farming is below minimum wage.

[kath]

16. If it paid a decent wage, Americans would be more than happy to do it.

High school and college students used to do such work (for decent pay) 30-40 yrs ago, and unemployed people would be happy to do so today.

This paying sub-minimum wage bullshit has got to stop.

[DonCoquixote]

25. and with what will you buy the food

which will get expensive, which means that food, especially healthy food, will be FURTHER out of reach. Sorry to sound snippy, but I am one of those diabetics that some "leftish" types yell at for not eating organic, at which point I ask them how much organic produce food stamps gets you.

[A HERETIC I AM]

33. Actually, no it isn't.

It's generally "Piece work" wages, just like most truck drivers make, for that matter.

Most pickers of produce are paid by either the pound or the bag or the bushel or whatever. They aren't generally paid by the hour.

The faster you are, the more you make.

I have watched workers in strawberry fields do their work. They RUN.


The idea that farm work is below minimum wage is absurd. It doesn't pay $50,000 a year, but it isn't $3.50 an hour, either. It is however, in many cases, "stoop labor". Damned few Americans have any idea how difficult doing that sort of thing for 8 to 10 hours a day really is.

[aquart]

18. Unfortunately, hard stoop labor has been so demeaned we think we're above it.

In the old old days, whole communities gathered to bring in the harvest and then they celebrated. But we don't think it's god's blessing or any miracle to have food to eat.

Nobody in any state should have free time until the harvest is in. This is our FOOD.

[RKP5637]

3. As soon as I heard this I wondered WTF. It was a completely stupid move, bully

the people that make your farms workable. I swear, there is a virus eating brains.

[Luminous Animal]

7. Farmers were against the bill as well as the suits in agri-corporations.

[mmonk]

5. Elections have consequences.

[Rageneau]

8. Nose...Face...Snip!

[provis99]

9. so they'd rather their fields rotted than pay fair wages to Americans.

why am I supposed to feel sorry for these greedy farmers?

[former9thward]

13. If they paid "fair wages" to Americans food prices would skyrocket

and you would be the first to complain about the greedy grocery store owners.

[Honeycombe8]

34. That's what I would normally think, too. Maybe those farmers shouldn't be in business...

if they can't pay fair wages to Americans.

But because I come from a long line of farmers, I know a little something about farming. Just a little. Like, they're not "greedy." Farmers actually charge very little for their goods. It's the distributors and others that make the moolah. Farmers, except for conglomerates, are small businesses that run on a shoestring budget. They also have years where they make little or nothing (imagine if you worked for a year, and then found out you wouldn't get paid for that whole year), because of drought or disease or floods.

Many (most?) of the small farmers have already gone out of business in America, leaving farming to the big conglomerates.

So I would guess that many can't afford to pay what it would take to hire an American to hand pick fields of squash. They're letting the squash rot because that's cheaper than hiring Americans to pick it.

But then I wonder...if a business can't afford to pay Americans a fair wage, is it really a viable business? Alabama is a poor state, and those farmers probably have small farms, so they can't compete with teh big California and other state farms that produce lots more on a bigger scale, and still have the use of illegal immigrants who will work for low wages.

[tsuki]

10. I have been hearing that teachers are going to laid off due to lack of

students, and the chicken processing plants will now have to pay minimum wage, give breaks, provide workers' comp and pay overtime.

[dkf]

11. I'm surprised the unemployment rate in Alabama must be zero.

[Luminous Animal]

14. Agriculture doesn't want to hire citizen workers. They would find themselves at

risk for reported labor law violations. Illegal sub minimum wage and illegal working conditions (no overtime, no water, no bathroom breaks, etc.).

[Ikonoklast]

22. No, Alabamans refuse to work fo free.

If it cost more to drive to a place of employment than one can make after working there for twelve hours, a prudent person would cut their losses pre-emptively by not working to lose money.

But, I'm sure you already know that.

You are so precious.

[TxVietVet]

12. Just like Georgia, the conservanazi crackers will learn the hard way.

As far as those that hire cheap illegal alien labor, too bad. You did it out of greed. Not willing to pay a living wage to Americans to pick your product. You probably backed the conservanazis that passed these laws. The farmers and the conservanazis will both get what they deserve. Bad karma.

[aquart]

17. Gosh, weren't they clever.

WTF aren't the high school kids being bussed in to pick those crops? This is our nation's food. WE're the ones responsible for it, not Mexico.

And if the kids are too delicate, CALL IN THE NATIONAL GUARD. You don't leave food to rot unless your brain is rotted first.

[Ikonoklast]

24. This is an example of Capitalism at work.

There is work that needs to be done, yet the farm owner refuse to pay a market wage in order to get his crops harvested as his source of cheap labor has disappeared.

Wages need to rise, or no one will do the work.

This is Capitalism, this is how it works, yet only the owners have reaped any rewards from the previous wage/labor imbalance before.

Oh, and as far as that food rotting in the field, and prices rising, well, that's tough shit; that, too, is Capitalism at work.

American citizens get fat on cheap food harvested on the breaking backs of grossly underpaid illegal immigrant labor.

Why are you calling for Socialist remedies to save Capitalism?

[Jim Warren]

19. Blueberries in AL in October

sure, goes well with the CoC fairy tale.

[Politicalboi]

20. We can all laugh at these yahoos

But WE will all pay for this with higher prices at the stores, or shortages. I think the pickers would be paid more since the demand is up. They should pay the unemployed who would want to do this, while also getting their full benefits. Gives some a chance to get caught up quicker if they choose to do the work. There should also be a work your taxes off program. Like community service, but if you owe $2,000 or less you can clean a highway, or pick crops, work in a senior hospital.

[pampango]

21. I bet those farmers don't want comprehensive immigration reform, though, since

that would dry up the supply of easily exploitable labor. That's also one of the main reasons that the CPC and organized labor are in favor of comprehensive reform instead of 'attrition through enforcement'.

Those farmers are opposed to teabagger-inspired enforcement laws and to union/CPC-inspired comprehensive reform.

[Trekologer]

30. That's exactly correct

They talk a big game but when it comes down to it, don't actually want the laws passed. Instead they want the workers to be afraid of doing anything but whatever the exploiting employer wants them to do, keep them in line, and working for much lower than they should be. Unfortunately for them, the nutjobs got into power and did what they weren't supposed to do: passed laws that actually kept the exploited workers away.

The only course of action is to repeal the law or for the exploiting employers to pay a fair wage to legal workers.

[Blue_Tires]

23. So no more dirt-cheap pool of easily exploited workers?

my heart bleeds...Let the farmers actually provide a safe workplace and decent wage for a change...

[Zoeisright]

26. Good. About time people started seeing consequences

of their actions.

[DonCoquixote]

27. Farmers

Look, I live in a Red state where the most reliable foot soldiers for the right wing are farmers. These are not the boutique organic farmers like the ones you see at whole foods, but people who work like dogs. Sadly, these are the people who are hard right, even though they have been screwed the hardest.

I had one of them point out the "fact" (sarcasm flag up, major barf alert) that "if Slavery were allowed to continue, we would not need to import Mexicans in here, and most Blacks would be better off instead of getting ruined in those Northern cities." There was a time I actively thought Farmers were EVIL, because of sentiments like this.

All the same, the American farmer is the reason we do not know hunger as badly as many nations do, and they have often done their job while being pounded with the one-two punch by corporations on the right and Federal governments on the left. If you do not know why Monsanto is evil, you do NOT read DU, on the other hand, check out out a film called "Farmegeddon" to see how the same government that SHOULD be helping small farms KILLS them. Like it or not, we have to learn to get those folks talking to us, because they do produce the food.

[BrendaBrick]

28. One small solution might be

for them to advertise to the local consumers (maybe even certain small businesses) to 'pick their own' rather than have it just rot for right now.

[JoeyT]

29. God I despise right wingers.

We had no problem hiring people to pick our blueberries. Of course we also paid a decent wage and didn't treat our employees like shit, so I'm sure that helped.

The problem isn't a labor shortage, it's a surplus of "I'm not going to share the profits from MY farm with any dirtbag employees!" attitude.

Paying shit wages is icing on the cake. Picker cost is one of the lower costs associated with running a farm. They want workers they can abuse. I don't like the new law, but I will NOT support Republicans having easy to abuse employees for the sake of cheap lettuce. The most common complaint I've heard from the farm owners that were forced to hire Americans against their will is that they expect two breaks and lunch. Breaks and lunch while working in 100+ degree heat for 10 hours! The fucking nerve! How spoiled can you get?

"Jobs Americans won't do" is also a right wing talking point. Everyone here knows someone that works at a job far more miserable than field work. Would they do it for 3 bucks an hour while Boss Hog shouts into their ear about what a piece of shit they are and threatens them with violence he's all too willing to follow up on? Probably not. Should liberals/progressives support Boss Hog being able to do that? That's up to you.

[saras]

32. Organic farmers don't have any trouble paying employees well

...and they are supposedly less competitive than conventional farming, and shouldn't be able to afford it.

[Honeycombe8]

35. I bet organic farmers use illegal immigrants, too. They all do. That's what the problem is....

Alabama farmers can't raise their prices, in order to hire Americans at higher wages, because they are competing with the farmers in other states who still are able to hire illegals at lower wages.

It is cheaper for the AL farmers to let their squash rot than to hire Americans at higher wages. It will probably put some out of business.

There was a time in America when NONE of the workers were illegals. In order for the enforcement of hiring illegal workers to work, it would have to be national, I think. It won't work on a state by state basis, for the same reason that we can't compete with the outsourcing of our jobs to third world countries.

CA farms use illegals extensivly and quite openly. I would guess some other states do, too. AL has to compete with those farms.

BTW, farmers don't get that much for their crops. It's the distributors & others who do well. And some years, don't forget, a farmer will lose his crop to drought or flood or disease.

I don't know the answer.