I have a nuanced opinion of Steve Jobs

[Taverner]

I actually had the (dis)pleasure to work for Mr Jobs. I was at one meeting where he drove a man to tears after screaming at him. I was at another meeting where he was the most friendly person in the world. He had a temper that would change on a moment's notice. The word at Apple was "if you see Steve in an elevator, wait for the next one." He was famous for looking at an employee, then their badge, and then asking "So...what do you do for me?" If you answered incorrectly, you were fired that day, or so the legend goes.

At the same time, he did save Apple. When he came back, Apple had some success with this new iMac, but for the most part they were becoming has beens. OS8 and 9 were jokes, and their sweet spot, education and art, were dropping their products in droves. The merger of NeXT and Apple was what saved the Mac, and it was a genius move. The old OS was terrible, always crashed, and was snail compared to the versions of Linux and Windows out at the time. Within two years of OS X, this all changed.

Of course, part of what made Apple profits during this time was Steve's move of manufacturing from Elk Grove, CA to China, being yet another nail in the coffin of American Manufacturing.

He donated to a lot of Dems, and was personally progressive. But he ran Apple like a robber baron. Layoffs were common, and Apple was notorious for paying employees less than market value because they had the "privilege" of working for Apple.

Not that any of this would matter to the Apple fanboys and fangirls. For them, they might as well have been working for Merlin the Magician. IN their eyes, Apple could do no wrong. Every gadget was a huge innovation in their eyes, even though Apple never really "invented" anything. They just knew how to market it.

Steve was a Vegan, and a big advocate for animal rights, health, and freedom of speech. Apple did not have a "porn police" department like other tech companies, which regularly spy on what sites the employees go to. Nope, all he cared about was leaks - he wanted to own the message. Porn, hey, if it floats your boat and you get your work done, more power to you. Not all of you agree with that, but I see it as a trust relationship.

At the same time, Jobs fought unions, and never let them in Apple. Even the security, which was outsourced, was non-union.

When dealing with Capitalists, and Mr Jobs was most definitely that, you have to take a nuanced view. Was he Jay Gould? The guy who famously said "I can always get one half of the working class to kill the other." No, he wasn't. But a capitalist values capital above all else. Grow or die. Capital is the only resource worth having to a capitalist. Everything else is overhead.

But then again, one of the most famous Communists, Friedrich Engels, was a partner at a mill. That's about as capitalist as you can get.

So...in conclusion...there is no conclusion. People are enigmas sometimes. And sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

[Selatius]

1. I like your view of him. You don't hide over the warts and imperfections.

But given what you've said of him, I'd tell you that he wouldn't be my kind of company. If you think Steve Jobs had a bad temper, you've never met Michael Eisner.

[FSogol]

3. Too bad he filled his analysis of Jobs with a bunch of insults against DUers. n/t

:popcorn:

[Taverner]

5. I'll take it out - but the lock step mentality amongst some is sickening

[Selatius]

10. Well, some people take brand loyalty very seriously.

If that's what they want to do, far be it from me to stop them from indulging in their habits. For me, I try to take whatever works regardless of brand. I mean, if I wanted something with good graphics editing capability, Apple is the way to go. In other areas, I may opt for PCs.

[Auggie]

2. Great post

[closeupready]

4. Where's the nuance in that?

Seems pretty clear he was no liberal at all. To the contrary.

[Taverner]

6. I guess that depends on how you define "liberal"

I wouldn't call him a liberal, but I wouldn't call him a conservative either.

Can you be both a liberal and a capitalist?

I don't know the answer to that...

[closeupready]

8. You can be both a liberal and a capitalist, yes. But from your description,

it seems certain that he was an authoritarian, isn't it? Or would you say that's not so?

Because you can't be a liberal and an authoritarian, IMO.

[Taverner]

11. He was, yes. But at the same time - he did let employee innovation flourish. Sometimes.

I remember the project that had a codename I forget, but we all called "Secret Squirrel." It was what became mac.com, an early attempt at social networking, offline backups and webmail. He just gave out a few very vague instructions, hired a bunch of contractors, and let them run with it. In the end he was pleased, and the contractors all got huge bonuses.

Also, the invention of the Mac was more or less run by the group. Jobs knew what he wanted, but he trusted his employees to find a way to get there. Once again, vague instruction and employee led. How else would one of the sounds be called "sosumi?" (so sue me)

[Selatius]

12. Even if he weren't authoritarian, something can be said to out-sourcing manufacturing to China.

I wouldn't say that's a liberal position at any rate.

[Taverner]

13. Especially when there was a perfectly fine workforce in Elk Grove

And these guys and gals were pure pros. That place should have been a designated landmark, IMO, if only because of the workers.

[geardaddy]

7. That's a great well-balanced post.

Thank you.

[hifiguy]

9. Well said, Taverner.

People have a tendency to be complex critters.

[The Second Stone]

14. I would not have wanted to work for Apple

or Mr. Jobs because everyone I knew who met him, from grade school teachers on, said he was a very difficult person. (In respect for his death this week, I'll call it "difficult".) I am saddened that he died too young and undoubtedly in a very painful fashion. He changed the world in a positive way, but only for those people not near him.

[Taverner]

16. Yes - there were downsides to being there

Especially not being an Applefan

I bought a Mac when I was there, a G4 and dammit if that thing isn't still running. I just don't use it.

Main system is a PC running Windows 7, secondary a laptop running Ubuntu Linux

[Whisp]

15. Thanks, good post.

I've known and heard about many bosses with Jobs' personality. Many employees ended up with nervous breakdowns working under that kind of tyranny of humiliation and beat downs.

I don't care if he invented the cure for the cold - he sounds like a horrible two faced person. Nice on the TV and an asshole to his 'family'.

[Edweird]

17. Jobs was good at what he did. I prefer windows but I don't deify Bill Gates.

Apple does seem to have a bit of a 'cult' thing going, that's for sure.