If the worst happens and an (R) wins the White House

[Motown_Johnny]

He/She will:

[TwilightGardener]

1. They'll do some of the same stuff Obama is doing, because it's different when you

are President and are suddenly responsible for governing.

[MADem]

5. Probably the most accurate assessment. nt

[TwilightGardener]

6. But it'll be OK, because he's a GOPer--and Dems will cooperate instead of

obstructing like the GOP does now.

[libinnyandia]

39. Fox GOP

If the Dems tried to block even the least little bit Fox News would call them traitors.

[TheWraith]

14. That assumes the Republicans have any kind of sense of responsibility.

Democrats feel responsibility to govern. Republicans point and laugh.

[DataException]

19. Exactly!

Just look at the way Obama has governed - in many cases, it was Bush II....

[TwilightGardener]

23. Nope.

Nice try, though.

[FarLeftFist]

2. Follow through. They're deranged cultists.

[sakabatou]

3. Probably destroy the entire middle and low class

Creating global wars and putting the Earth to shit.

[Luminous Animal]

4. Democrats will be anti-war again and pro-4th & 5th Amendments.

[krabigirl]

33. +1,000,000

[slackmaster]

7. Order a pizza

To be delivered.

[rpannier]

8. Depends on who wins

Not all of them are saying the same things
There are differences between Cain and Huntsman, Bachmann and Romney, Perry and Paul

[MadMaddie]

11. They all consistently support the 1% and the utter destruction

of all manufacturing jobs, any support systems for the middle class and the poor.

[Exultant Democracy]

9. bomb the shit out of Iran?

[BlueIris]

10. Iran war.

Which will destroy the planet a lot sooner than it will destroy the economy.

[appleannie1]

12. I think they will pick and choose and do some of both options.

[Historic NY]

13. Thermal nuclear attack on all entitlements.

[TheKentuckian]

15. Other: Yes.

[defendandprotect]

16. We have a HUGE liberal voting bloc -- this is a liberal nation -- let's elect a liberal -- !!!

[kctim]

24. Click Click Click

There's no place like home.
There's no place like home.
There's no place like home.

[defendandprotect]

26. Interesting -- is Obama "the Wizard" --- ????

[kctim]

30. Nope

But even believing him to be one, is a lot more realistic than this being a liberal nation with a HUGE liberal voting bloc.

[defendandprotect]

34. This is a liberal nation ... and the proof of it is that all media has to be controlled by RW ...

every iota of truth is a threat to their myths --

Every bit of what RW has done over last 30-40 years is a Hollywood Sound Stage set --


from GOPs/NRA which was radicalized and used to target not only liberals and moderates

in the Dem Party, but liberals and moderates in their own party!

from GOP's/"Pro-life" murderers financed by white militia groups -- and based on

protesters hired from methadone clinics --

from GOP's/Goebbels' stype press, under control of the same families and corporations

who gave us Hitler and the Nazis --

and GOP's/Christian Coalition -- which was given start up funding by the GOP and

Dobson's group was funded by Richard Scaife -- and Bauer's group by other RW wealthy elites.

and the current GOP/T-baggers -- also funded by Koch Bros.


On and on --

Meanwhile, we also had Koch Bros. funded DLC which infiltrated and influenced the Dem Party

for more than 20 years -- moving the party and its agenda to the right -- and its candidates --

even its presidential candidates!


Today the Koch Bros. have passed control over to the Third Way which now controls the party --

if you want more info on that, let me know.


Meanwhile, Noam Chomsky, for one, has often spoken about the reality of a liberal America --

check out some of his comments. Elites obviously have to know what they're up against and

do regular polling.

We also have our own polls --

80% of Americans want an end to the wars ---

74% -- 83% of Catholics --- want government run health care -- including abortion for CHOICE.

90% and more want a Swedish style economic system --


Who are you going to believe -- Limbaugh or Chomsky?


:evilgrin:


Also look at the huge numbers of OWS in the streets -- those are liberals -- we have a huge

liberal voting bloc!


And the message is that they know that Obama is Wall Street --

and that the Dem Party isn't going to fix anything!

That's why they are in the streets!

[kctim]

35. Wow, you are like the lefts version of Alex Jones

Especially in that you have to fall back on some evil RW media brainwashing conspiracy, as "proof."

I will stick with the verifiable "proof," if that is ok.

The polls?
99.9% of people do not want war. Wanting an end to something so evil is hardly just a liberal position.
74% may SAY government run health care sounds like a good idea, but less than half of that 74% are willing to pay for it. How much does someone really want something if they are unwilling to support it?
90% may SAY a Swedish style economic system sounds good, but just how much do they know about it? What they would have to give up? How it would change their lifestyle? etc...

Thousands of liberal protesters hardly means there is some huge liberal voting bloc. Especially in a nation of 300+ million. Their message won't mean jack until they get the support of the people. Despite this message from thousands, tens of millions will still show their support for the Democratic Party by re-electing President Obama and other Dems in 2012.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but OWS is NOT some kind of HUGE movement, nor is the US a liberal nation.

[defendandprotect]

36. Wow -- !! You can't tell the difference between Noam Chomsky and Alex Jones? ROFL

And you think it's a "RW" rumor that we have a press controlled by corporations? ROFL

Try Al Gore -- this summer/Rolling Stone -- spends 6 pages describing our RW press --

and makes clear that "Congress is controlled by the oil and coal industries" --

Sure -- this is conspiracy-free-America -- !! ROFL


Unfortunately, the RW does support war -- it's a elite preoccupation with warprofittering --

and warmongering -- behind which is imperialism and things like the Patriot Act.


Don't know where you've gotten your distorted ideas re MEDICARE4ALL -- this liberal nation has

been fighting for it for decades -- and been betrayed over and again by the Clintons and by

Obama.

We have a Pentagon which can't locate $2.3 TRILLION or is it $3.4 TRILLION?

And which wasted $30-$60 BILLION in Afghanistan/Iraq -- but we can't afford MEDICARE4ALL!????

Not to mention Obama renewing tax cuts for rich for $120 BILLION and then turning around and

borrowing the money at higher interest rates to cover the tax cuts!!

ROFL


Thousands of liberal protesters hardly means there is some huge liberal voting bloc. Especially in a nation of 300+ million.

And the voters who voted for Obama in '08 and gave him a huge mandate were obviously also RW

voters -- ??? ROFL


Obama is in trouble except with elites that he is rounding up $$$$$$$$$$$ from --

What we should be asking these politicans every time we see them is ...

"Who are you selling yourself to today, President Obama?"

Or Sen. Schumer -- or Rep. X -- !!



Hey, if the RW and GOP have convinced you that this is a RW nation -- go forward in peace!

ROFL


but maybe this will help you ...

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2011/10/25/obama_losing_his_base.html


ahem ... presumably because Obama isn't far enough to the Right -- !! ROFL

[kctim]

37. You compared the chom to limbaugh

I don't care what either of their OPINIONS are, so I opted to stick with FACTS and pass on them.

The comparison to Jones was for your theory that some evil RW media conspiracy was brainwashing people into RW drones instead of the true liberals everybody should be. Pretty much the same song and dance that comes from the liberal media meme.

IF the nation were a liberal nation, then yes, it would have been fighting for it for 'decades.' The way they would have been fighting for it would have been at the voting booth. They do that by electing liberal or progressive representatives who would support a President in giving them "Medicare4all." That has NOT happened now, has it?
The simple FACT of the matter is that President Obama and Clinton did NOT betray anybody, the American people just do NOT support it, yet.
You see, there is a process that must be followed. A President can't just say he wants it and make it so. A state can't vote for it and make it the rule of the land. ALL states and their people have a say in something like this and right now, they have said NO.
So, as you can see by the FACTS, while liberals may have been fighting for it for decades, the majority of people have not.

Oh, and IF you look at the ENTIRE poll where I believe you got your 74% support number from, you will find that, I believe 42% of that 74%, were not willing to pay for 'Medicare4all' in order to have it. Of course, if the poll YOU got your number from is distorted, perhaps you should think twice before using it.

"And the voters who voted for Obama in '08 and gave him a huge mandate were obviously also RW voters -- ???"

Um, no. They were primarily moderate Democrats and independents, NOT members of some HUGE liberal voting bloc.

The simple fact of the matter is that we are NOT a liberal nation or a conservative nation. We are a pretty moderate nation. Elections and elected representatives show that.
If you don't like that reality, then change it. Prove we are a liberal nation and get liberals elected ALL around the country and get liberal legislation passed. Shouldn't be hard, seeing how you believe we are a liberal nation, now should it.
Hell, you can even start in my area. LOL!

[defendandprotect]

43. Eh ... no ---

You compared the chom to limbaugh

Who are you going to believe -- Limbaugh or Chomsky?

Oh, dear -- OK, let me explain this to you --

What that statement meant was that Limbaugh and Chomsky are OPPOSITES!! :eyes:


Not that anything you say is clear, but are you elaborating on RW press to say that

RW propagdna doesn't work? Like "Welfare Queen" or "Quotas" re Affirmative Action?

Or maybe you want to dismiss the entire Nazi era and its anti-semitic propaganda?

Or the Hammer of Witches as meaningless? ROFL


IF the nation were a liberal nation, then yes, it would have been fighting for it for 'decades.' The way they would have been fighting for it would have been at the voting booth. They do that by electing liberal or progressive representatives who would support a President in giving them "Medicare4all." That has NOT happened now, has it?

Eh ... maybe you missed it ... but the nation voted for Obama who they expected to move positively

on MEDICARE4ALL and not in back room deals with Big Pharma and the Health Care industry to trample

it! Perhaps you also don't know that Obama's #1 guy, Koch Bros./DLC Rahm Emmanuel "crowed" about

the fact that Obama had "preserved the private health care industry" and how "grateful" they should

be to him!???



Meanwhile, evidently you're not being disingenuous so I won't put you on ignore --

however, what you are saying isn't worth bothering with -- so you will be ignored.


Good luck on finding some "facts" some day --


Bye --

[kctim]

45. "so you will be ignored"

But of course. Much easier to ignore facts than face them, isn't it. Sad. Pitiful. And quite expected.

Just for fun though.
NO, I did not say RW propaganda does not work, but rather that LW propaganda is just as prevelant, so it is best to stick with facts.

"Eh ... maybe you missed it ... but the nation voted for Obama who they expected to move positively on MEDICARE4ALL and not in back room deals with Big Pharma and the Health Care industry to trample it!

You really have a problem with reading and comprehension, don't you.
First of all, 63+ million people voted for President Obama because PART of his campaign was to REFORM OUR HEALTH CARE SYSTEM, not to create a Medicare4all system overnight.
Second: Even if President Obama had promised to give everybody a Medicare4all system, he can NOT do it by himself. AS I SAID BEFORE, he needs the support of the people to do such a thing and the only way available for people to show such support is to give him a liberal or progressive House and Senate. That did NOT happen. In fact, it went the opposite way he needed it to go.

To make it as clear as possible for you: IF we were a liberal nation, the people would give the President a liberal Congress so he could pass liberal legislation.
Excuses like the 'evil right wing media' and the 'evil New World Order Bilderberg' groups controlling everybodys minds are nothing but cop outs for those who refuse to acknowledge the facts.

It's pretty sad that you give up so easily. Especially for something you "say" you believe to be true. I CAN look at the facts and admit when I am wrong. I won't, however, take opinions as facts.
Bring the facts and change my mind.

[defendandprotect]

46. If you're that unhappy, I won't ignore you ... !!

Just for fun though.
NO, I did not say RW propaganda does not work, but rather that LW propaganda is just as prevelant, so it is best to stick with facts.

Just for fun ... try re-reading what you are saying in that comment.

Where is the liberal press? We don't even have responses by our Democratic Party -- it remains

SILENT in face of RW propaganda.

Where is it that you think LW "propaganda" is even being spoken?

Do you actually think there is a liberal press?

Where?


Re health care -- evidently you have a crystal ball which tells you exactly what every American

thinks! ROFL

Rather, Obama made back room deals with Big Pharma and the private H/C industry and trampled the

will of the people. You should read Rahm Emmanuel "crowing" about how "grateful" business should

be to Obama for all he's done for them -- including "preserving the private H/C industry" -- !!


You want support of the people? Look in the streets. They are not there to support Obama.

They are there to tell you that capitalism is over. That the two party duopoly is over.

They are in the streets because corporate/elite $$$$$$$$$ has bought our government and our

candidates and made government dysfunctional. Endless reports on that in polls recently.

Have you read none of it?


Let me put it this way around for you ...

If this WAS NOT a liberal nation, then we wouldn't have had more than 50 years of out in the

open RW political violence and stolen elections!

Assassinations which took our liberal president and our people's government --

and our liberal leadership.


Nor would we have a Goebbels' style press -- based on "Operation Mockingbird" over last decadees!

If you don't know what "Operation Mockingbird" is -- there's a link below.


Now show us the liberal control of the press -- !!





* Operation Mockingbird


United States Government Conspiracy Projects #2- Operation Mockingbird was a CIA project created to control the domestic and foreign media. They bribed well-known writers and journalists to write CIA slanted propaganda. The goal was primarily to bribe writers to write about the dangers of communism and suppress any left wing political writing. In 1976 George H.W. Bush the new director of the CIA announced that this activity will stop but they would welcome the voluntary unpaid cooperation of
writers.

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/377134/us_government_conspiracies_operation.html?cat=4

here's another report on it --

http://www.truthistreason.net/operation-mockingbird-government-control-of-mainstream-media

and you'll find many other sources via Church Committee and Operation Mockingbird on internet.




Or maybe you think that CBS and the NY Times are part of the liberal press?

I'd imagine that given the polls on how many think our government is "dysfunctional" --

i.e., the "two party duopoly" -- that the numbers agreeing with OWS are probably much higher.



Poll: More agree than disagree with Occupy Wall Street goals

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/poll-more-agree-disagree-occupy-wall-street-goals-141203055.html

[Motown_Johnny]

42. Even if this nation were liberal (which is arguable) the electoral collage isn't

Voters in low population states have more voting power then those in high population states. This skews results toward conservatives, since the low population states tend to vote more conservative.



I know the knee jerk reaction is to do away with the electoral collage and go strictly with a popular vote for president. I will assume some adjustment must also be made to the Senate since all states get 2 Senators regardless of population.


This is a political impossibility. You will never get enough states voting to reduce their own impact on our electoral system to ratify a constitutional amendment, and that is what would be necessary to make the changes previously mentioned.




We just don't have the power to elect a true liberal and not accepting that fact does more harm than good.

[defendandprotect]

44. That this is a liberal nation isn't "arguable" ---

Voters in low population states have more voting power then those in high population states. This skews results toward conservatives, since the low population states tend to vote more conservative.

As you saw in 2000 -- and as the RECOUNT by journalists clearly showed -- Gore not only won the

popular vote, he won the Electroral Vote, as well -- no matter how the votes are counted!

What happened in 2000 was a steal by computer -- and not only the voting computers.

The first "steal" that took place was based on the LARGE computers used by MSM since the mid-1960's.

And which gave them new powers to predict and call elections, and predict and call winners and losers

of races -- and to predict and call the Electoral College vote!

That's where the first steal by Jon Ellis/Fox News went down in RECALLING the state of Florida

from Gore. Later it was CALLED for W.



The Electoral College vote is simply another way to manipulate state votes and final outcomes.

And, I agree we should get rid of it.

And, I think states are already moving to SPLIT the votes making the Electoral College less of

a threat. But you can count on the fact that the RW will continue to steal elections any way

they can -- and they will continue with RW political violence which we've had more than 50 years

of out in the open.


We just don't have the power to elect a true liberal and not accepting that fact does more harm than good.

Keep in mind that voters in '08 thought they were electing a liberal president --

However, very quickly Obama removed the mask to reveal that he is a corporate president.

That's why people are in the streets now -- they undersdtand that the Dems are not going to fix

anything and that the two parties are colluding together. In fact, they have been colluding

since 1978 on tax breaks for the rich. As reported by Wm. Greider in "Who Will Tell The People?"

the Democrats -- then in FULL power -- colluded with the Republicans to break the tax code for

the benefit of the rich. This was long before Reagan -- and, again, while Dems were in FULL power!


OWS also understands that capitalism is finished -- we simply have yet to bury it!


Perhaps you also don't know that for more than 20 years the Koch Bros. funded the DLC which

infiltrated and influenced the Dem Party, its agenda and its candidates, including its presidential

candidates?

Currently, the Third Way is controlling the party -- and its policy is to "ignore the base of the

party" and that "populist and populism debates/discussions are the equivalent of Karl Rove

propaganda of extremism" -- ???

That's according to Jonathan Cowan, Pres. Third Way -- which is the same as the DLC -- just a

name change.

So the Dem party has been co-opted by the RW over more than a 20 year party --

The actual question is, what is left of the Dem Party?

Meanwhile, of course, if this were a RW nation, it wouldn't be necessary for elites/corporations

to pre-bribe and pre-own our members of Congress and our candidates!

Would it?

[Motown_Johnny]

48. you lost me at the first line again....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_election_recount


^snip^


The media reported the results of the study during the week after November 12, 2001. The results of the study showed that had the limited county by county recounts requested by the Gore team been completed, Bush would still have been the winner of the election.






I'm sorry to say this but between the JFK assassination stuff on a previous post and this pure falsehood I just can't bother to read the remainder of your post. Your "no matter how the votes are counted" statement is simply wrong.

[defendandprotect]

49. Wait ... you're in denial that the recount concluded that Gore Won in 2000 ... ????

and that that is true "no matter how the votes are counted" -- ???????????

And you're also ignoring the GOP - sponsored fascist rally -- organized btw by our now

Chief Justice John Roberts! -- to stop the vote counting in Miami-Dade County of 120,000

or more votes NEVER BEFORE COUNTED which was a near-violent protest and which was totally

uninterferred with by Florida police or Election officials--!! But they did manage to STOP

the recount which was mandated by the Florida State Supreme Court!


At the time the Supremes stopped the recount, Bush was down to a 34 vote lead in Florida!

That's just in case you were wondering why the Gang of 5 stopped it!! ROFL


I'd get you some further help but I doubt you'd accept it -- eventually you'll probably fall

over it in the dark!

Don't worry about not reading my post -- I'm usually reponding not only for the poster but for

anyone else who cares to read it -- the important thing is that you have been replied to if any

one is interested!



ROFL

[Motown_Johnny]

50. No, I am saying that the media recount did not find what you claimed

and that although it is possible for some methods of counting to have Gore win, not all of them do (as you claimed).

[saras]

17. Attempt to follow through on campaign promises, but be too stupid to succeed

[MrSlayer]

18. If they get the White House they probably keep the House and take the Senate.

Then it's good bye Social Security, good bye Medicare, Medicade, Public Education, regulations, tax revenue and hello to more wars, more poverty, more unemployment etc. It's an ugly thought.

[defendandprotect]

27. Wait -- remember when Obama had a mandate -- ? When Dems controlled presidency, House and Senate???

Nothing happened if you recall -- except Obama resurrecting the GOP from the ashes.

So I'm sure that will also be true of the Repugs -- ROFL!!


Meanwhile, let's aim to simply control the House -- after all, from there the

Repugs have controlled EVERYTHING, including our president -- !!! ROFL!!



Pitiful

[newspeak]

29. oh and don't forget

have the corporate media repeatedly tell the plebes that if they can't find a job it is their own fault, those seniors are going to die anyway so let's hasten it, and the poor deserve to starve because they are lazy gits and that women are like children and they don't know what's good for them so the government owns their bodies.

also, corporations are worthier people than the plebes so they have the right to poison the air, food and water as long as they can make a profit doing so.

[Douglas Carpenter]

20. if Mitt were to win I think he is such a chameleon he will attempt to do on the right more or less

what President Obama has tried to do on the left. Just how the right-wing base and blogosphere react to it would be quite interesting. But then again I though George W. would be more moderate that he turned out being and may have gone down that path but for September 11 - which greatly empowered the radical wing of the right-wing Republican Party.

[Thegonagle]

38. I thought GWB would be more moderate, too. But my mom pointed out

that all of the "knowledgeable and experienced" people he was appointing to his administration were relics of the cold war era. She said "he is going to start a war."

That was well before September 11, 2001.

As they say, a mother always knows best.

[Katashi_itto]

21. It's actually pretty likely. Course if an R makes the WH expect real revolution

about six months into the famine. Just after the collapse of fiat money.

Course fiat money may collapse in 9-11 months anyway so whose counting.

[JoePhilly]

22. They'll continue to destroy the economy and use that as an excuse to kill SS and medicare, and ....

They'll get to replace 2 or 3 supreme court members, overturn roe V wade, and make all abortions illegal, no exceptions.

They will repeal every aspect of Obamacare.

They will return Prayer to the schools by eliminating the Dept of ed. and creationism will be taught in science classes.

They will outlaw gay marriage.

They will invade Iran.

They will eliminate the EPA.

They'll be drilling for oil in your front yard, and on your favorite beaches.

They'll be chanting "Frack baby Frack".

Then in year two ...

[Marr]

25. I'm regularly told that a president is powerless without huge majorities in both houses of Congress.

[defendandprotect]

28. And from what we've heard, Obama not only had a mandate in '08 ....

and the GOP was finished -- but many say that the popular vote was so huge

that we should have had something like 24 more Reps in the House, at the least.


From there, Obama proceded to throw away his mandate -- and resurrect the GOP

from the ashes -- !!


Compromising with the Repugs until what we have is rule by Republicans!


We have people in the streets because they recognize that the Dems are not going to

fix any of the problems -- the two-party duopoly is finished -- as is capitalism and

Wall Street.


Computers may put more pro-corporate presidents in office, but the public understands

what's going on.

[Zorra]

31. Other. They will be even more anti-democratic and destructive than Bush,

because they can pile more evil right on top of his legacy.

[krabigirl]

32. They will do pretty much what Obama is doing now, just slightly worse.

[JuniperLea]

40. Destroy OUR economy...

By taking the REST of our measly 'wealth' away.

[Johonny]

41. It is really hard to know

Obviously Obama has proposed plenty of conservative economic policies that Republicans have flat out rejected. It could be they will 180 and embrace these ideas once the president is a conservative. On the other hand the house Republicans could become even more teabagger dense. In which case even these policies are too liberal. A conservative administration could be hamstrung into only bad ideas. The difference however is Republican presidents are not afraid to use executive power (even unconstitutionally) and dare congress to stop them. Thus you might find the next administration running the country and policy despite a totally dysfunctional congress. You saw a lot of this in the Bush administration. However the Bush administration was itself dysfunctional and for some agencies literally no one was in charge. As a conservative legislature and president fight over power and base and simply can't get simple policy done. I think the country could really Hoover if a Republican wins. It is really hard to know exactly what will happen, on the other hand it is generally safe to assume the administration will be bad for the poor, bad for the middle class, bad for the overall long term economy, bad for the deficit and horrible at foreign policy. Why? because that basically the legacy of the last 30 years of Republican presidents.

[workinclasszero]

47. Mittens, Perry, Cain, Bachmann or Newt

Will totally destroy whats left of the middle class. Kill social security, kill medicare, kill food stamps, kill unemployment insurance.

Get rid of child labor laws, kill the EPA and get rid of all environmental laws. Kill the NLRB. Kill the Dept of Education.

They will almost immediately start a war with Iran, if President Obama doesn't beat them to it anyway. All thats just for openers folks.